NCAA Baseball Transfer Portal

[Travelingdawg]

Everybody is focused on Montgomery, but he's not the only big dog we got a shot at. Not close.

I?m listening 👂.

[Activated Alpha]

These past two years have jaded me from my internal optimism. I'm going to predict he goes with LSU

[AlSwearengen]

This is probably coming from the area of gene’s page, but it sounds like vandy is our main competition for Montgomery at this point. I say at this point b/c I have a feeling that this nil portal recruiting business is going to have more swings than hs football recruiting.

The thing that concerns me about vandy is, it is similar education wise to Stanford and Corbin was the first to offer Montgomery in hs. The Corbin angle makes me very nervous.

[WSOPdawg]

This is probably coming from the area of gene’s page, but it sounds like vandy is our main competition for Montgomery at this point. I say at this point b/c I have a feeling that this nil portal recruiting business is going to have more swings than hs football recruiting.

The thing that concerns me about vandy is, it is similar education wise to Stanford and Corbin was the first to offer Montgomery in hs. The Corbin angle makes me very nervous.

But then he'd have to wear the ugliest baseball uniform in the history of baseball... and ALL of their uni's are ugly.

[BrunswickDawg]

But then he'd have to wear the ugliest baseball uniform in the history of baseball... and ALL of their uni's are ugly.

And be called a "Vandy Boy". Has to be the worst nickname in all of sports

[Dawg496]

It?s not ?similar to? Stanford education wise. Well maybe to a layman but.. it?s like State football being similar to Alabama football.

Also I?m biased as a Stanford MBA but also **** vandy.

[confucius say]

Everybody is focused on Montgomery, but he's not the only big dog we got a shot at. Not close.

True story. But I feel better about Montgomery than burns or Holman.

[AlSwearengen]

True story. But I feel better about Montgomery than burns or Holman.

That’s disconcerting. An ace is worth 2 stud outfielders, especially in our situation.

[The Federalist Engineer]

This is probably coming from the area of gene’s page, but it sounds like vandy is our main competition for Montgomery at this point. I say at this point b/c I have a feeling that this nil portal recruiting business is going to have more swings than hs football recruiting.

The thing that concerns me about vandy is, it is similar education wise to Stanford and Corbin was the first to offer Montgomery in hs. The Corbin angle makes me very nervous.

Go look for yourself, the Vandy players don't have majors for the most part. The ones that do, major in "American Studies". That means they watch movies all day. It's MLB or serve food at Starbucks for Vandy kids.

[Homedawg]

HOPEFULLY with him being a first or second rounder next yr he will not be so concerned about a huge NIL deal for his one yr pit stop. And hopefully he will want to play for his home state school with his former high school teammate.
We will know soon enough.

Hell yeah he's gonna get a big nil deal. Why would you even hope that.

[BigDawg81]

He is on the no contact list fwiw

[PMDawg]

It?s not ?similar to? Stanford education wise. Well maybe to a layman but.. it?s like State football being similar to Alabama football.

Also I?m biased as a Stanford MBA but also **** vandy.

Stanford in person undergrad > Vandy in person undergrad > Stanford (or any) online degree

[KOdawg1]

Everybody is focused on Montgomery, but he's not the only big dog we got a shot at. Not close.

Burns?

[WSOPdawg]

He is on the no contact list fwiw

meaning?

[BigDawg81]

meaning? meaning that schools cannot contact him. Usually means that the player already knows where they are going.

[Saltydog]

With the help from all of the posters, I?m going to try my best to keep you informed with the transfer portal.
UCLA RHP
Kelly Austin
https://twitter.com/KendallRogers/status/1662122528540704770

Take it fwiw but the Montgomery tweet is no longer available, so there's that.....

[Dawg496]

Stanford in person undergrad > Vandy in person undergrad > Stanford (or any) online degree



MBA does not equal online degree just FYI

[WSOPdawg]

meaning that schools cannot contact him. Usually means that the player already knows where they are going.

cool, here's hoping its in the favor of the M over S

[PMDawg]

MBA does not equal online degree just FYI

Didn't say it did. I just have a general disdain for the money grab that is the online degree scam. I have two grad degrees from online programs. One from State, one from a "more prestigious" university. My company basically paid to get letters behind my work signature. I was disgusted by how bad the MSU program was, and the other one was worse. I'm just jaded.

I have a coworker with an online grad degree from MIT. I'd bet a paycheck he couldn't pass a freshman level class on their campus.

[The Federalist Engineer]

Didn't say it did. I just have a general disdain for the money grab that is the online degree scam. I have two grad degrees from online programs. One from State, one from a "more prestigious" university. My company basically paid to get letters behind my work signature. I was disgusted by how bad the MSU program was, and the other one was worse. I'm just jaded.

I have a coworker with an online grad degree from MIT. I'd bet a paycheck he couldn't pass a freshman level class on their campus.

Shhh...

Almost all degrees are on-line now. Professors playing the COVID card to the max and claim their life is in danger. The new malingerer Ace-Card to play is the "Mental Health" card. I am too troubled by "XYZ Anxiety" so I need to live in Maui or I will "self harm". These dudes are smart, clearly smarter than me. I still show up to work. Hopefully MSU professors are the exceptions. Corporate C-Suite Executives are the same, I used to have a General Patton guy as my COO. He personally authorized me to keep a loaded Glock in my desk in case of an active shooter. The new guy, only met him personally once.

The MBA kids at work (Vandy, UVA, and Ivy) tell me that professors make most of the classes primarily on-line but many kids still live in the collegiate community to get the college life and networking. One of the Vandy kids (a Navy Grad and former Sub Officer) was pissed that his professor was living in Colorado posting his ski habits while being too "scared" to teach in Nashville. One blonde girl from Columbia U that was going to U of Chicago for MBA says that all her classes are on-line option. If you go to class, it's just a movie theater. She was super COVID scared at work, even ate with a mask on, took a bite, and then masked while chewing. But she was mad because she likes the Chicago nightlife and did not want to live with her parents in Suburban jersey. She showed me her club pictures in Chicago, no mask and barely a dress.

[BeardoMSU]

Hmmm...

https://twitter.com/alarry21/status/1679154313904508928?t=7S3CjymELiuf648cDjOhkQ&s=19

[confucius say]

Take it fwiw but the Montgomery tweet is no longer available, so there's that.....

What tweet?

[Saltydog]

What tweet?

The tweet that was posted here yesterday indicating Montgomery was in the portal.....It was showing "unavailable" late yesterday afternoon......Not sure if it was taken down or not but it was not accessible..........

[Saltydog]

Doesn't bode well for us. . . . . .Holman visiting LSU next week. . . . .

https://twitter.com/MatthewBrune_/status/1678896567959404549

[Cooterpoot]

LSU is about to add another transfer pitcher.

[DEDawg]

Who is Karson Ligon? He is in.

[Cooterpoot]

Who is Karson Ligon? He is in.

Miami pitcher who will be our Sat/Sun guy. Now we're waiting on Holman. We'll know what we've got in a couple weeks.

[Todd4State]

Miami pitcher who will be our Sat/Sun guy. Now we're waiting on Holman. We'll know what we've got in a couple weeks.

It's nut cutting time.

[the_real_MSU_is_us]

Who is Karson Ligon? He is in.

10 starts, 50IP, 4.5 ERA. I think he was just a Fr. Pretty solid starter as long as he's not pressed into being thr Friday guy. Very solid pickup imo. Still need to win on Holman and Montgomery though

[BeardoMSU]

Welp, cross him off the list...

https://twitter.com/KendallRogers/status/1679318733234249728?t=Ku822oCjUnpAmfPvJDn8bg&s=19

[Coach34]

He was never really on any legit list. Good grab for Wake

[The Federalist Engineer]

He is on the no contact list fwiw

[QUOTE=BeardoMSU;1528551]Welp, cross him off the list...

Now he is neutral to our Hoover hopes. Won't be helping any SEC teams MSU plays. Shows the value of a good pitching coach with a buzz.

[BeardoMSU]

He was never really on any legit list. Good grab for Wake

Cool. I only posted bc he was mentioned previously by some folks.

[Really Clark?]

He was never really on any legit list. Good grab for Wake

Yeah, it was a long shot for him.

[BeardoMSU]

Official for KC. Good luck to him.

https://twitter.com/The_BPCsj/status/1679307516721725440?t=eCdMpuDCWWdZnEyfCfQAFg&s=19

[TNDawg35]

I don’t know if I have seen this or not, but is Gartman gone?

[The Federalist Engineer]

I don’t know if I have seen this or not, but is Gartman gone?

TJ is what folks here are saying. So not playing anymore.

[The Federalist Engineer]

Who did this? Pretty good work.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/F0x26M4X0AETxz8?format=jpg&name=900x900

[BigDawg81]

[QUOTE=BeardoMSU;1528551]Welp, cross him off the list...

Now he is neutral to our Hoover hopes. Won't be helping any SEC teams MSU plays. Shows the value of a good pitching coach with a buzz.
Montgomery was the one that I was referring too

[Pancho]

Can NIL combined with pulling in some additional arm talent save Lemo's job next year?

[TheLostDawg]

Can NIL combined with pulling in some additional arm talent save Lemo's job next year?

I think that it can. Lemonis is like Orgeron. Need top coaches and players. I hope that he let his friendship with fox blind him in seeing that Fox was not elevating our pitchers and it just all went down from there. If you look at our fielding when we played for the championship, they played as a team. Weren't fighting for balls. Weren't making a lot, if any, errors. You get a team like that then Lemonis can climb out of this. We looked better after Foxhall left at pitching.
That being said, was it his relationship that blinded him? Can he evaluate players and coaches? Can he nip bad apples and help players get through whatever it is before a cancer grows. That is to be seen and why it was a risk keeping him. We better hope that it works out because otherwise we'll be filing the roster with transfers to remain competitive the next few years, which we probably will have to do at least one year due to sucking two years in a row.

[The Federalist Engineer]

Can NIL combined with pulling in some additional arm talent save Lemo's job next year?

Yes

(1) Right now, Parker is worth 4 SEC wins with no other improvements.
(2) With all the positional improvements, keeping Nixon, and keeping Larry - that's another 2 wins. He's at 15-15 and would make a regional.

IF he gets

(a) Montgomery
(b) Get another two marquee arms: Holman, Snead, Sellinger (sp?), or Molina

Then he is hosting with 17+ SEC wins and would be competitive in any regional.

[the_real_MSU_is_us]

Yes

(1) Right now, Parker is worth 4 SEC wins with no other improvements.
(2) With all the positional improvements, keeping Nixon, and keeping Larry - that's another 2 wins. He's at 15-15 and would make a regional.

IF he gets

(a) Montgomery
(b) Get another two marquee arms: Holman, Snead, Sellinger (sp?), or Molina

Then he is hosting with 17+ SEC wins and would be competitive in any regional.

I'm pretty negative on Lemo and I agree with this. And if he does host a regional he deserves another season.

[Quaoarsking]

Yes

(1) Right now, Parker is worth 4 SEC wins with no other improvements.
(2) With all the positional improvements, keeping Nixon, and keeping Larry - that's another 2 wins. He's at 15-15 and would make a regional.

IF he gets

(a) Montgomery
(b) Get another two marquee arms: Holman, Snead, Sellinger (sp?), or Molina

Then he is hosting with 17+ SEC wins and would be competitive in any regional.

Can you show your work on how we add X more wins with these players?

[NWADAWG]

I'm pretty negative on Lemo and I agree with this. And if he does host a regional he deserves another season.

I'm not against Lemonis. I'm against sucking. If he figures out a way to make us really good again, he can stay for as long as that lasts and I'll be happy. If he sucks again, bye.

[Coach34]

Can you show your work on how we add X more wins with these players?

If we can cut walks by 25% we would easily add 5 more wins

[LibraryDawg]

Any insider info on where Montgomery stands?

[Quaoarsking]

If we can cut walks by 25% we would easily add 5 more wins

Why 5 instead of 3 or 6 or 10? You're just making up an assertion. I want you to use advanced statistics and prove it if you're going to throw numbers around.

Same goes for the other guy who claimed Parker is a 4 WAR player (the equivalent of an MLB player being worth 21.6 WAR), or that Larry is a 2 WAR player.

[The Federalist Engineer]

Can you show your work on how we add X more wins with these players?

https://i.makeagif.com/media/7-18-2021/riicWb.gif

Holding our batting to the same middle of the pack. Not giving them more success versus Friday Aces. Still getting aggravated sodomy from Vandy in Week-2. But giving MSU the 10th best ERA in the conference at 6.83 versus +9.00. MSU wins 16 games and loses 14 SEC games. That even starting the season 1-5 and losing 6 of 7 down a different stretch with Tennessee, Arkansas, and LSU. At 16 and 14, MSU would likely have hosted.

Giving MSU the 12th best ERA, all else constant. Same record, too many non-competitive games but you are in the 15-to-16 win range. Even still having the worst ERA in the conference, but almost matching the 13th worst, MSU would have won 14 or so games. Made a regional.

Now, with hitting. MSU was mid pack hitting at 266 but 10th in runs scored in the conference. About 10 fewer runs than the average team. MSU has been mid-pack for years in this stat. But without E5 (easy out), the Captain (toothless and slow), Foreskin (non-factor) you can start talking about change. Yes, ledbetter is a loss and an amazing player. The three bad hitters were also 50% of the DPs. MSU was worst in the conference in DPs. So, with Kohler at 3B, Hines at 1B, Cupp/Mershon at SS, and Hujsak hopefully matching Clark. I see about 0.20 more runs, still mid-pack. If you can get Montgomery, i think this team can at least be the 8th best team in the conference for runs, that 0.5 more runs per game. You are in the +17 range for wins. Even a shitty Auburn team that MSU could have swept won 17 games. So there is that.

[Coach34]

https://i.makeagif.com/media/7-18-2021/riicWb.gif

Holding our batting to the same middle of the pack. Not giving them more success versus Friday Aces. Still getting aggravated sodomy from Vandy in Week-2. But giving MSU the 10th best ERA in the conference at 6.83 versus +9.00. MSU wins 16 games and loses 14 SEC games. That even starting the season 1-5 and losing 6 of 7 down a different stretch with Tennessee, Arkansas, and LSU. At 16 and 14, MSU would likely have hosted.

Giving MSU the 12th best ERA, all else constant. Same record, too many non-competitive games but you are in the 15-to-16 win range. Even still having the worst ERA in the conference, but almost matching the 13th worst, MSU would have won 14 or so games. Made a regional.

Now, with hitting. MSU was mid pack hitting at 266 but 10th in runs scored in the conference. About 10 fewer runs than the average team. MSU has been mid-pack for years in this stat. But without E5 (easy out), the Captain (toothless and slow), Foreskin (non-factor) you can start talking about change. Yes, ledbetter is a loss and an amazing player. The three bad hitters were also 50% of the DPs. MSU was worst in the conference in DPs. So, with Kohler at 3B, Hines at 1B, Cupp/Mershon at SS, and Hujsak hopefully matching Clark. I see about 0.20 more runs, still mid-pack. If you can get Montgomery, i think this team can at least be the 8th best team in the conference for runs, that 0.5 more runs per game. You are in the +17 range for wins. Even a shitty Auburn team that MSU could have swept won 17 games. So there is that.

Q knows all this he is just being obtuse. 25% less walks would lower our ERA a good chunk- which obviously would have led to more wins. This isn’t rocket surgery

[Saltydog]

We don't necessarily need another SS. We're good there between Mershon and possibly Kupp, assuming Larry comes back.

[Quaoarsking]

Q knows all this he is just being obtuse. 25% less walks would lower our ERA a good chunk- which obviously would have led to more wins. This isn’t rocket surgery

There is a massive difference in saying "we probably would have won some more games if we'd cut down on the walks" and putting a definite number like "5 more wins" on it. The first is probably true, the second appears to just be pulled out of your ass. Again, I'm not even saying it's too high - maybe we would've gotten more than 5. I just don't like it when people pull numbers out of thin air and try to pass it off like a mathematical analysis. Stay qualitative only unless you're showing your work.

On top of that, your assertion is vague. Are you saying that we win 5 more if 25% of our walks turn into strikeouts, or just that 25% of them aren't walks and become a mixture of hits and outs of all types?

[bigbub50]

There is a massive difference in saying "we probably would have won some more games if we'd cut down on the walks" and putting a definite number like "5 more wins" on it. The first is probably true, the second appears to just be pulled out of your ass. Again, I'm not even saying it's too high - maybe we would've gotten more than 5. I just don't like it when people pull numbers out of thin air and try to pass it off like a mathematical analysis. Stay qualitative only unless you're showing your work.

On top of that, your assertion is vague. Are you saying that we win 5 more if 25% of our walks turn into strikeouts, or just that 25% of them aren't walks and become a mixture of hits and outs of all types?

Im guessing math and/or science was your favorite subject growing up??

[The Federalist Engineer]

There is a massive difference in saying "we probably would have won some more games if we'd cut down on the walks" and putting a definite number like "5 more wins" on it. The first is probably true, the second appears to just be pulled out of your ass. Again, I'm not even saying it's too high - maybe we would've gotten more than 5. I just don't like it when people pull numbers out of thin air and try to pass it off like a mathematical analysis. Stay qualitative only unless you're showing your work.

On top of that, your assertion is vague. Are you saying that we win 5 more if 25% of our walks turn into strikeouts, or just that 25% of them aren't walks and become a mixture of hits and outs of all types?

If you walk six per 9 innings and people hit 215 against you, you probably throw 6 innings and give up 2 or 3 runs per outing. Like a Cole Gordon, you can still have a nice career.

If you walk six per 9 innings and people hit 350 against you, then you are Enema, and you implode within an inning.

It's the WhIP equation that influences the total impact.

[TALL DAWG]

How about we lower our ERRORS while we are at it. That should be good for what 2-3 more conf wins. And, I pulled this from between my ears not my ass. 🤣

[Cooterpoot]

How about we lower our ERRORS while we are at it. That should be good for what 2-3 more conf wins. And, I pulled this from between my ears not my ass. ��

We eliminated a huge number of errors with two players gone. That's already been handled.

[Cowbell]

How about we lower our ERRORS while we are at it. That should be good for what 2-3 more conf wins. And, I pulled this from between my ears not my ass. 🤣

Errors magically decrease with less free passes as well

[CaptainObvious]

Errors compound free passes if they could have led to DPs or even just force outs. But even with all those errors, earned run averages were atrocious, especially in SEC play. Look at runs allowed per game instead of just ERA. Probably nearly another 1/2 run per game allowed. Not all our loses weee by 10 runs. We had several 1 run and 2 run losses. Eliminate errors and walks and there is your statistical proof. Unless or course you want to cut our opponents errors and walks out too. Then it is a wash.

[BigDawg81]

What?s the latest on Montgomery? Steve put an update up on the 247 board a few hours ago.

[Really Clark?]

Any insider info on where Montgomery stands?

I wouldn't trade our position with any other school right now.

[BeardoMSU]

I wouldn't trade our position with any other school right now.

Noice

[Commercecomet24]

I wouldn't trade our position with any other school right now.

This. Getting close to closing this one.

[the_real_MSU_is_us]

I've been very negative and will give my honest opinion and "show my work", if you will:

Defense: No doubt we improve at 3B because the Transfer has good stats. But SS? There's nothing to say Cupp will start or can play D in the SEC. He's highly rated but that's off potential, not day 1 polished abilities. Mershon was pretty bad at SS last year, will probably only be marginally better. Highfill got better as the year went on and will be better than last year's stats imply. Hines needs to work on his glove; there's a reason we kept putting Hancock over there. OF is pretty easy to play and I doubt we have much dropoff or improvement there. My bet overall: we go from an F to a C-. From 14th to say, 10th, give or take.

Offense: The 3B transfer is better than Alford for sure, but not a stud. Hit .300 vs much worse pitching than the SEC, lets be generous and say he hits .290 here. Lets assume marginal improvement for the returners: Highfill, Hines, Jordan, Mershon, Larry. The big losses are Clark (our best hitter in SEC play) and Ledbetter. I do NOT buy for one second that Hujesak -who was not a good hitter before State and hit .227 last year- will be able to replace either of those guys. Even assuming a 50 point jump and he's a downgrade. At the other OF spot, it's undeniable it's a "big Portal transfer or bust" situation. We either loose 40 points of hitting at that spot or we improve it by 10 if we get Montgomery. My Bet overall: We go from a C (9th in the SEC in scoring) to either a C+ (8th-7th) or a B (6th-5th) depending on transfers.

Pitching: Last year we sucked. We lost our 7 most reliable innings a weekend (Cade and Hunt), and we were about 10 innings short of pitching in the first place. So, 17 innings of pitching - 7 = 10 innings of solid arms returning between Dohm and Nixons 5 innings a weekend and Tappers 1 (if we're being generous to Tapper), and 4 total solid innings combined from Loo, Holcombe, Davis, Hardin, Siary a weekened. If your ERA is over 7, YOU ARE NOT PROVIDING SOLID INNINGS! Do these guys have the ability to turn into contributors? YES! But were they last year? NO! Yes they occasionally got through a clean inning, but more often they got shelled. To help us next year they have to be able to at least reliably give you something before getting shelled.

So, first up the returning solid guys (Dohm and Nixon and Tapper). Lets say they get a little better and are able to give us an extra inning each, 9 total. Next, we have the injured guys we get back: Loftin, Auger, and SImmons. Hard to judge. 2 haven't pitched in a while and the 3rd we've never seen vs SEC hitters. Lets say 2/3 turn out solid, 1 gives us 4 innings a weekend as a Sunday starter, the other 2 in relief. Not counting Pico Kohn because it sounds like his timetable is too late. That's 6 innings, we're up to 15. Then, the transfers: the Miami guys looks like he can give us 6 decent (ERA of 5ish) innings a weekend. Montgomery is touted as a 2 way player but he pitched 12 innings last year with an ERA of 15- he'd be irrelevant. Up to 21. We REALLY need Holman to join this group. For the most controversial group, the unreliable returners: Loo, Holcombe, Siary, Davis, Forsythe, Hardin. Siary had the best ERA of 7.07. DO these guys have talent? Yes. Did we upgrade at PC? 100% yes. Does it take more than 1 year of coaching to take a 8+ERA guy and turn him into a sub 5 ERA guy? Also yes. We just don't have much time to improve this group. For the sake of math lets say 3/6 take 2 steps forward and they give us 7 innings a weekend, the other 3 only take 1 step forward and remain useless.

We're up to 28 innings. Sounds ok right? Well, no. Not yet. We have midweeks, but also pitchers get injured. Last year we got lucky and only really lost Garman and Loftin, maybe 6 innings total of pitching. Year before we lost Simmons, Auger, Pico, and of course Sims. Probably 10-11 innings of our best pitching. Lets say '24 falls in the middle and we loose 8 innings of arms, that brings us to 20 innings of pitching and we still need to play in the midweek. We can really see how Holman's 6 innings of well above average pitching can make or break this staff.

Still, 20 or 26 innings of pitching (depending on Holman) is better than last year's 17 I estimated above. I also think Parker will be better than FOx at timing when to pull guys, go out to settle them down, and CALL PITCHES! My god Fox was awful at that. Probably lost .5 ERA in gameday coaching alone. So My complete guess is that our pitching goes from a F to either a C- (10th in the SEC) or a B- (7th), depending on Holman or alternative Friday starting transfer.

Overall? I bet we are a 2 seed somewhere. Loose in the regional because Lemo can't foster a culture of leadership among the players so they clam up under pressure.

[Cooterpoot]

I've been very negative and will give my honest opinion and "show my work", if you will:

Defense: No doubt we improve at 3B because the Transfer has good stats. But SS? There's nothing to say Cupp will start or can play D in the SEC. He's highly rated but that's off potential, not day 1 polished abilities. Mershon was pretty bad at SS last year, will probably only be marginally better. Highfill got better as the year went on and will be better than last year's stats imply. Hines needs to work on his glove; there's a reason we kept putting Hancock over there. OF is pretty easy to play and I doubt we have much dropoff or improvement there. My bet overall: we go from an F to a C-. From 14th to say, 10th, give or take.

Offense: The 3B transfer is better than Alford for sure, but not a stud. Hit .300 vs much worse pitching than the SEC, lets be generous and say he hits .290 here. Lets assume marginal improvement for the returners: Highfill, Hines, Jordan, Mershon, Larry. The big losses are Clark (our best hitter in SEC play) and Ledbetter. I do NOT buy for one second that Hujesak -who was not a good hitter before State and hit .227 last year- will be able to replace either of those guys. Even assuming a 50 point jump and he's a downgrade. At the other OF spot, it's undeniable it's a "big Portal transfer or bust" situation. We either loose 40 points of hitting at that spot or we improve it by 10 if we get Montgomery. My Bet overall: We go from a C (9th in the SEC in scoring) to either a C+ (8th-7th) or a B (6th-5th) depending on transfers.

Pitching: Last year we sucked. We lost our 7 most reliable innings a weekend (Cade and Hunt), and we were about 10 innings short of pitching in the first place. So, 17 innings of pitching - 7 = 10 innings of solid arms returning between Dohm and Nixons 5 innings a weekend and Tappers 1 (if we're being generous to Tapper), and 4 total solid innings combined from Loo, Holcombe, Davis, Hardin, Siary a weekened. If your ERA is over 7, YOU ARE NOT PROVIDING SOLID INNINGS! Do these guys have the ability to turn into contributors? YES! But were they last year? NO! Yes they occasionally got through a clean inning, but more often they got shelled. To help us next year they have to be able to at least reliably give you something before getting shelled.

So, first up the returning solid guys (Dohm and Nixon and Tapper). Lets say they get a little better and are able to give us an extra inning each, 9 total. Next, we have the injured guys we get back: Loftin, Auger, and SImmons. Hard to judge. 2 haven't pitched in a while and the 3rd we've never seen vs SEC hitters. Lets say 2/3 turn out solid, 1 gives us 4 innings a weekend as a Sunday starter, the other 2 in relief. Not counting Pico Kohn because it sounds like his timetable is too late. That's 6 innings, we're up to 15. Then, the transfers: the Miami guys looks like he can give us 6 decent (ERA of 5ish) innings a weekend. Montgomery is touted as a 2 way player but he pitched 12 innings last year with an ERA of 15- he'd be irrelevant. Up to 21. We REALLY need Holman to join this group. For the most controversial group, the unreliable returners: Loo, Holcombe, Siary, Davis, Forsythe, Hardin. Siary had the best ERA of 7.07. DO these guys have talent? Yes. Did we upgrade at PC? 100% yes. Does it take more than 1 year of coaching to take a 8+ERA guy and turn him into a sub 5 ERA guy? Also yes. We just don't have much time to improve this group. For the sake of math lets say 3/6 take 2 steps forward and they give us 7 innings a weekend, the other 3 only take 1 step forward and remain useless.

We're up to 28 innings. Sounds ok right? Well, no. Not yet. We have midweeks, but also pitchers get injured. Last year we got lucky and only really lost Garman and Loftin, maybe 6 innings total of pitching. Year before we lost Simmons, Auger, Pico, and of course Sims. Probably 10-11 innings of our best pitching. Lets say '24 falls in the middle and we loose 8 innings of arms, that brings us to 20 innings of pitching and we still need to play in the midweek. We can really see how Holman's 6 innings of well above average pitching can make or break this staff.

Still, 20 or 26 innings of pitching (depending on Holman) is better than last year's 17 I estimated above. I also think Parker will be better than FOx at timing when to pull guys, go out to settle them down, and CALL PITCHES! My god Fox was awful at that. Probably lost .5 ERA in gameday coaching alone. So My complete guess is that our pitching goes from a F to either a C- (10th in the SEC) or a B- (7th), depending on Holman or alternative Friday starting transfer.

Overall? I bet we are a 2 seed somewhere. Loose in the regional because Lemo can't foster a culture of leadership among the players so they clam up under pressure.

Mershon was good at SS. He got hit with some errors at 3B but was at almost .900 fielding anyway coming off injury. You have no idea about Cupp. Hines was coming off a back injury.
Montgomery will more than cover for Clark. Hujsak is hitting it in summer ball. Holman and Ligon are better at two spots than we had in rotation last year. It's lose, not loose.

[WSOPdawg]

Mershon was good at SS. He got hit with some errors at 3B but was at almost .900 fielding anyway coming off injury. You have no idea about Cupp. Hines was coming off a back injury.
Montgomery will more than cover for Clark. Hujsak is hitting it in summer ball. Holman and Ligon are better at two spots than we had in rotation last year. It's lose, not loose.

Lololol, thank you, Cooter. I was wondering if it was just me.

[Homedawg]

Cupp is really good defensively

[Coach34]

What?s the latest on Montgomery? Steve put an update up on the 247 board a few hours ago.

As others have said- we are in a good spot. He and Burns have buddied up and talked of playing together- but he and Hines have been buddies awhile and want to play together. We are working hard to make it happen. We land Monty and we have made the team better thru the portal and crootin. Then need the freshmen to grow up some and play to their talent as Sophs this Spring

[Coach34]

Cupp is really good defensively

Yeah Cupp can play D just needs to develop the bat. Fortunately he wont have alot of pressure as a true freshman and can spot start at SS and 3B.

[smootness]

https://i.makeagif.com/media/7-18-2021/riicWb.gif

Holding our batting to the same middle of the pack. Not giving them more success versus Friday Aces. Still getting aggravated sodomy from Vandy in Week-2. But giving MSU the 10th best ERA in the conference at 6.83 versus +9.00. MSU wins 16 games and loses 14 SEC games. That even starting the season 1-5 and losing 6 of 7 down a different stretch with Tennessee, Arkansas, and LSU. At 16 and 14, MSU would likely have hosted.

Giving MSU the 12th best ERA, all else constant. Same record, too many non-competitive games but you are in the 15-to-16 win range. Even still having the worst ERA in the conference, but almost matching the 13th worst, MSU would have won 14 or so games. Made a regional.

Now, with hitting. MSU was mid pack hitting at 266 but 10th in runs scored in the conference. About 10 fewer runs than the average team. MSU has been mid-pack for years in this stat. But without E5 (easy out), the Captain (toothless and slow), Foreskin (non-factor) you can start talking about change. Yes, ledbetter is a loss and an amazing player. The three bad hitters were also 50% of the DPs. MSU was worst in the conference in DPs. So, with Kohler at 3B, Hines at 1B, Cupp/Mershon at SS, and Hujsak hopefully matching Clark. I see about 0.20 more runs, still mid-pack. If you can get Montgomery, i think this team can at least be the 8th best team in the conference for runs, that 0.5 more runs per game. You are in the +17 range for wins. Even a shitty Auburn team that MSU could have swept won 17 games. So there is that.

I’m sorry, but this is all nonsense.

We scored the 10th most runs in the conference, and you think if we also give up the 10th fewest, we win 16 games? So better than average by being clearly worse than average at both?

The best predictor of future results is run differential, not wins. And what people fail to realize is that our win total was actually high given our run differential. We had the worst in the league, worse than OM and WAY worse than anyone not OM, Missouri and UGA included. If we played the year all over again, we were more likely to have fewer wins than more or even the same number.

If we magically gave up 2.5 fewer runs/game, we would have still had a RD of -28. That would have been 11th in the conference, evenly between Missouri and A&M. So you’re probably talking 12 wins, not 16.

You think we could have scored the 10th most runs, given up the most, and still won 14 games? That is just insane. This is the definition of homerism. Some are just not willing to see just how bad we were last year. We need to be vastly better, not just a little better here and there. We need an entire overhaul, we were beyond awful.

[The Federalist Engineer]

I’m sorry, but this is all nonsense.

We scored the 10th most runs in the conference, and you think if we also give up the 10th fewest, we win 16 games? So better than average by being clearly worse than average at both?

The best predictor of future results is run differential, not wins. And what people fail to realize is that our win total was actually high given our run differential. We had the worst in the league, worse than OM and WAY worse than anyone not OM, Missouri and UGA included. If we played the year all over again, we were more likely to have fewer wins than more or even the same number.

If we magically gave up 2.5 fewer runs/game, we would have still had a RD of -28. That would have been 11th in the conference, evenly between Missouri and A&M. So you’re probably talking 12 wins, not 16.

You think we could have scored the 10th most runs, given up the most, and still won 14 games? That is just insane. This is the definition of homerism. Some are just not willing to see just how bad we were last year. We need to be vastly better, not just a little better here and there. We need an entire overhaul, we were beyond awful.

Run Differential is numerology. After a certain point, it is more a proxy for a lack of depth or a strategic marshalling of forces.

You get beat 26 to 3, that has nothing to do with the next game. Florida beat LSU 24 to 4, that had zero to do with how game-3 is played. UF did not win the series 31-26 by Run Differential. Jack Leiter and Vandy beat MsState 8-2 in game-1, Lemonis kept arms fresh for Game-2 and Game-3. Pitching is an independent variable in baseball that other sports do not share.

MSU has been consistently mid-pack in hitting, even in 2022 with 9 wins, basically similar per game production to 2021 in a championship. To get back to decent, just need to pitch decently, that's the biggest issue, to at least making Hoover.

Also, it's rare for the SEC only stats to have the same "best" pitching and "best" hitting on the chart outside of Vandy with their Recruiting prowess and depth. Everybody else is playing with sharp A, B, and C options. This year the best hitting was Kentucky and the best pitching Alabama, neither was a player for SEC champ or making Omaha. 2023, LSU was above average hitting and about average pitching, champ, with an invincible ace. 2022 OM was below average hitting and average pitching, champ, getting hot at the end. 2021, MSU was average hitting (same hitting and fewer runs than this year) and 3rd in pitching, Champs.

[CaptainObvious]

Summary: everybody else got a lot better in 2022 & 2023, while MSU stayed relatively the same as they were in 2021 except in pitching. Pitching in 2022 was bad because of injuries.
Pitching in 2023 was bad because of bad coaching And injuries.

Simply improve pitching in 2024 and we at least catch up to everybody else in the middle and that will be Regional Level talent.

Can?t wait.

[Todd4State]

Summary: everybody else got a lot better in 2022 & 2023, while MSU stayed relatively the same as they were in 2021 except in pitching. Pitching in 2022 was bad because of injuries.
Pitching in 2023 was bad because of bad coaching And injuries.

Simply improve pitching in 2024 and we at least catch up to everybody else in the middle and that will be Regional Level talent.

Can?t wait.

Depends on what we land in the portal. If we get Montgomery he will help in the OF and potentially on the mound as well. As it is we've simply filled our holes for the most part outside of getting an elite Friday night starting pitcher. Of course, we're still working on the portal at this time.

Again- I don't think people really fathom just how bad we were on the mound. So a lot of fans have assumed that our pitchers just suck. It was really an issue of the pitchers being asked to pitch in a way a lot of them could not, leaving pitchers in way too long, and just not developing them as individual players. I'm not sure how we had a winning record- that's probably more of a testament to the talent we actually do have. Our pitching coach was essentially the equivalent of Peter Sirmon as a pitching coach. I think how we handled our staff may have contributed to some of the injuries we've had- not Tommy John- the ones where a guy is out for a couple of weeks here and there.

But if we get Montgomery to go along with Hines and Dakota and then add in a legit Friday night guy we're going to probably see a jump similar to what we saw from 2015 to 2016. And we could probably accomplish that by getting our team ERA on the season down to 5.00 which is not great. If Parker gets us in the 4's we're going to have a very good year. And that's really not a stretch at all.

[Todd4State]

Yeah Cupp can play D just needs to develop the bat. Fortunately he wont have alot of pressure as a true freshman and can spot start at SS and 3B.

This is going to sound crazy...

But in the fall and spring I would look to see if Cupp and Mershon could potentially play CF. Could be a good way to get both of them in the lineup at the same time and could potentially make us really good defensively if they can handle it.

Food for thought.

[the_real_MSU_is_us]

Lol I'm done with these homer takes. Ignore 3 years of college because of SUMMER BALL?? Amazing how our whole team battled injuries last year but you assume nobody will next year to make those individuals worse than they were this season. Montgomery would cover Clark, but who's covering Ledbetter?

I'm officially out yall want to see everyone through the most optimistic lense instead of what's likely to happen.

[99jc]

Lol I'm done with these homer takes. Ignore 3 years of college because of SUMMER BALL?? Amazing how our whole team battled injuries last year but you assume nobody will next year to make those individuals worse than they were this season. Montgomery would cover Clark, but who's covering Ledbetter?

I'm officially out yall want to see everyone through the most optimistic lense instead of what's likely to happen.

I hear ya! No way this team is improved unless we find 2 Paul Skenes.

[basedog]

I think we will be better, but how much is the question. I can't see us being in the top six or so in the Sec, mainly because we have a Coach who drove the train off the cliff. Recruiting slipped big time and it showed as did with coaching decisions on and off the field. I'm pulling for us to be as good as Todd and several others predicting, but the Sec is very tough every year and right now we are at the bottom. I'm in a wait and show me what you got mode!

[confucius say]

I've been telling you for over two months. And I stand by it. If something changes and I'm wrong then I'll own it.


What?s the latest on Montgomery? Steve put an update up on the 247 board a few hours ago.

I still feel the same

[CJDAWG85]

Dont know anything about Montgomery buddying up with Burns, but heard back on Memorial Day weekend that he is really good friends with Hines, Highfill, and Jordan and he wants to come home. He wants protection in front and behind him in the lineup and we have that with Hines and Jordan.

[Cooterpoot]

Lol I'm done with these homer takes. Ignore 3 years of college because of SUMMER BALL?? Amazing how our whole team battled injuries last year but you assume nobody will next year to make those individuals worse than they were this season. Montgomery would cover Clark, but who's covering Ledbetter?

I'm officially out yall want to see everyone through the most optimistic lense instead of what's likely to happen.

We battled injuries? Nah, that was year before last. Stone is the only big injury we had. He could've given us innings. We've got Jordan and Montgomery along with Hujsack/Chance. That's two early round draft guys in the OF. There's no fall off there. If you're worried about the OF with Montgomery out there, I don't know what to tell you. Pitching and 3B were a much bigger problem. Even C was a bigger issue. Pitching is still to be determined and that's what holds it all together. Got to get Holman, Molina, or someone like that. Ligon is better than what we had. Loftin needs to win the 3rd spot. That's pretty damn solid.

[confucius say]

We battled injuries? Nah, that was year before last. Stone is the only big injury we had. He could've given us innings. We've got Jordan and Montgomery along with Hujsack/Chance. That's two early round draft guys in the OF. There's no fall off there. If you're worried about the OF with Montgomery out there, I don't know what to tell you. Pitching and 3B were a much bigger problem. Even C was a bigger issue. Pitching is still to be determined and that's what holds it all together. Got to get Holman, Molina, or someone like that. Ligon is better than what we had. Loftin needs to win the 3rd spot. That's pretty damn solid.

I would add Augur as a guy that was hurt who could have given us innings.

And I think we need Loftin to grow into a legit Saturday guy. He has the stuff. Ligon stuff is more that of a Sunday guy to me.

If the culture piece is right, we will have a chance to be good again in 2024.

[BrunswickDawg]

We battled injuries? Nah, that was year before last. Stone is the only big injury we had. He could've given us innings. We've got Jordan and Montgomery along with Hujsack/Chance. That's two early round draft guys in the OF. There's no fall off there. If you're worried about the OF with Montgomery out there, I don't know what to tell you. Pitching and 3B were a much bigger problem. Even C was a bigger issue. Pitching is still to be determined and that's what holds it all together. Got to get Holman, Molina, or someone like that. Ligon is better than what we had. Loftin needs to win the 3rd spot. That's pretty damn solid.

We did battle injuries this past year. They were smaller, miss a start or 3 type injuries. Cade missed all of March; Gartman missed most of May; Nixon missed a week or two. I'm sure there were others that we knew less about. A lot of times the strain injuries are all about training (or lack there of) or poor mechanics not being adjusted. Missing time has a domino effect on the staff. Losing a guy to TJ hurts - but having a guy come up lame on a start day hurts just as much. How many weekends did we have a Friday start named and TBA filled in for the other 2 starts? That wasn't because Fox was being cagy, it's because we didn't know who would be available until the day of the game in many cases.

[The Federalist Engineer]

I hear ya! No way this team is improved unless we find 2 Paul Skenes.

People crack me up. Someone post that MSU will be 0-30 next year and show their "homework"

[Cooterpoot]

We did battle injuries this past year. They were smaller, miss a start or 3 type injuries. Cade missed all of March; Gartman missed most of May; Nixon missed a week or two. I'm sure there were others that we knew less about. A lot of times the strain injuries are all about training (or lack there of) or poor mechanics not being adjusted. Missing time has a domino effect on the staff. Losing a guy to TJ hurts - but having a guy come up lame on a start day hurts just as much. How many weekends did we have a Friday start named and TBA filled in for the other 2 starts? That wasn't because Fox was being cagy, it's because we didn't know who would be available until the day of the game in many cases.

We had no more injuries than the next school. We just sucked. LSU had more injuries than us and they won the whole damn thing. We've gotten rid of about 50% of our errors, we're about to possibly upgrade our pitching in a big way. Those things alone will get us in post season.
I'm no Lemonis fan, but he pulls that off, I'll give him props for getting big-time talent in here. It's in our best interests for him to turn this back around. If he doesn't, people know I'll blast his ass.

[the_real_MSU_is_us]

We battled injuries? Nah, that was year before last. Stone is the only big injury we had. He could've given us innings. We've got Jordan and Montgomery along with Hujsack/Chance. That's two early round draft guys in the OF. There's no fall off there. If you're worried about the OF with Montgomery out there, I don't know what to tell you. Pitching and 3B were a much bigger problem. Even C was a bigger issue. Pitching is still to be determined and that's what holds it all together. Got to get Holman, Molina, or someone like that. Ligon is better than what we had. Loftin needs to win the 3rd spot. That's pretty damn solid.

Loftin was our best Fr, gartman was honestly our 2nd best starter. Neither was pitching in SEC play.

Aren't you literally the person on the previous page of this thread who said Hines D would get better because his back was hurt last year? Somebody listed that, sorry if it wasn't you. That's mostly what I was referring too as being an overly "homer" take; every team in the history of any sport has had at least one "back tweak" to deal with, so to act like Hines getting that squared away will fix the D is ridiculous because next year it'll be Larry or Highfill ect that gets dinged up.

Overall we did get pretty lucky with injuries last year, will probably have more next year.

[confucius say]

Loftin was our best Fr, gartman was honestly our 2nd best starter. Neither was pitching in SEC play.

Aren't you literally the person on the previous page of this thread who said Hines D would get better because his back was hurt last year? Somebody listed that, sorry if it wasn't you. That's mostly what I was referring too as being an overly "homer" take; every team in the history of any sport has had at least one "back tweak" to deal with, so to act like Hines getting that squared away will fix the D is ridiculous because next year it'll be Larry or Highfill ect that gets dinged up.

Overall we did get pretty lucky with injuries last year, will probably have more next year.

Everybody has injuries. So we're not the only team that dealt with it.

But I disagree that we were lucky with injuries. Stone and augur missed the whole year. They were 2 of our top 5 arms when they went down.
Cade and Nixon were our best two and both missed a third of the year, maybe more.
That doesn't include Pico and Nate Williams missing the whole year, both of whom we thought would be bullpen guys.
Then Dohm and Gartman both missed multiple weeks.

[Todd4State]

Lol I'm done with these homer takes. Ignore 3 years of college because of SUMMER BALL?? Amazing how our whole team battled injuries last year but you assume nobody will next year to make those individuals worse than they were this season. Montgomery would cover Clark, but who's covering Ledbetter?

I'm officially out yall want to see everyone through the most optimistic lense instead of what's likely to happen.

Coming up with absurd takes about how we aren't really going to be better is worse at this point.

You do you but it sounds like you're awfully nervous that you're going to be wrong about Lemonis.

[the_real_MSU_is_us]

Everybody has injuries. So we're not the only team that dealt with it.

But I disagree that we were lucky with injuries. Stone and augur missed the whole year. They were 2 of our top 5 arms when they went down.
Cade and Nixon were our best two and both missed a third of the year, maybe more.
That doesn't include Pico and Nate Williams missing the whole year, both of whom we thought would be bullpen guys.
Then Dohm and Gartman both missed multiple weeks.

Pretty much every TJ surgery means that pitcher will miss the next season. Since so many pitching injuries are TJ, I don't count it as out of the ordinary for a guy to miss an entire season. LSU and Arky lost guys early last year/right before the season and they won't pitch next year either, for example.

We got lucky that our only TJ this season was Gartman, a veteran transfer that probably wasn't coming back anyway. Next year we probably get 1-2 TJs and another Loftin type non-TJ injury that still shuts him down all year. There's also ALWAYS multiple guys shut down a few weeks like you mention for Dohm and Nixon. It's just statistically what tends to happen.

In football we all recognize you need some depth because injuries happen, but in baseball we act like every injury is an anomaly that'll never happen again. Look around baseball- if you have a staff of guys throwing 92+ who did travel ball, there will be TJs. Stack depth accordingly before the season starts

[Cooterpoot]

Loftin was our best Fr, gartman was honestly our 2nd best starter. Neither was pitching in SEC play.

Aren't you literally the person on the previous page of this thread who said Hines D would get better because his back was hurt last year? Somebody listed that, sorry if it wasn't you. That's mostly what I was referring too as being an overly "homer" take; every team in the history of any sport has had at least one "back tweak" to deal with, so to act like Hines getting that squared away will fix the D is ridiculous because next year it'll be Larry or Highfill ect that gets dinged up.

Overall we did get pretty lucky with injuries last year, will probably have more next year.

Loftin did nothing in SEC play to say he was going to be great. He was our midweek guy. His walk numbers alone were poor. What was Gartman's ERA? Let's not pretend it was outstanding either. LSU lost pitchers. Had some other injuries too. They did fine. Plus, we took two of three from them at their place flipping around the rotation. This team had a terrible pitching coach problem. His talent evals were shaky and development poor. He's gone.
The staff got lazy. But if they can get the players to correct some things and not 17 around, we're close to being a pretty good club. I'd say top 20 for sure with Montgomery and Holman. Probably to 15. If the FR advance as they should, we could be top 10 going into SEC play.
If you want to say a rash of injuries will kill us, fine. That's the case for most teams. There's no negatives otherwise minus questions about the FR. We'll see on those.

[The Federalist Engineer]

By damn, the Best Catcher in the Nation is in the Portal.

Malcom Moore of Stanford a Freshman All American, PAC-12 Freshman of the Year, and future top-10 pick.

MSU has a catcher, a Freshman, a Madison Central guy that could help MSU land Braden Montgomery. So, we are probably not in the mix.

[Cooterpoot]

Moore is a stud but we're full at C now. Somebody must have gotten to him. That would be a big money grab like LSU or somebody if I was guessing. He's from Cali, so seems odd. Maybe he's trying to get more from Stanford.

[bigbub50]

Our (projected) returning Pitchers 2023 stats for comparison



Loftin- 26.1 innings, 3.08 era, 43 K's, 28 BB, .146 Opponents BA, 1.53 K/BB(mostly midweek competition)

Cijntje- 50 innings, 8.1 era, 63 K's, 34 BB, .238 Opponents BA, 1.85 K/BB

Holcombe- 36 innings, 8.25 era, 49 K's, 42 BB, .228 Opponents BA, 1.17 K/BB

Dohm- 42 innings, 4.07 era, 49 K's, 12 BB, .258 Opponents BA, 4.08 K/BB

Nixon- 20.1 innings, 2.66 era, 24 K's, 10 BB, .159 Opponents BA, 2.4 K/BB

Siary- 28 innings, 7.07 era, 28 K's, 12 BB, .299 Opponents BA, 2.33 K/BB

Davis- 22.2 innings, 9.13 era, 21 K's, 21 BB, .316 Opponents BA, 1.0 K/BB



2022

Auger- 20.2 innings, 3.05 era, 27 K's, 12 BB, .219 Opponents BA, 2.25 K/BB

Kohn- 36.2 innings, 4.91 era, 35 K's, 18 BB, .255 Opponents BA, 1.94 K/BB (may not return in 2023) (new 1 base coach?)



2021

Simmons- 24.1 innings, 4.81 era, 29 K's, 8 BB, .234 Opponents BA, 3.63 K/BB



K/BB= Strikeout to walk ratio

[CaptainObvious]

By damn, the Best Catcher in the Nation is in the Portal.

Malcom Moore of Stanford a Freshman All American, PAC-12 Freshman of the Year, and future top-10 pick.

MSU has a catcher, a Freshman, a Madison Central guy that could help MSU land Braden Montgomery. So, we are probably not in the mix.

Nah. Montgomery probably said let?s get the heck out of Satan?s playpen and go to God?s Country together! Starkvegas Baby!

[basedog]

Moore is a stud but we're full at C now. Somebody must have gotten to him. That would be a big money grab like LSU or somebody if I was guessing. He's from Cali, so seems odd. Maybe he's trying to get more from Stanford.

Coot, I was told by a friend who knows Lsu "connections", word is their NIL money "ain't what it use to be", seems some of the high dollar companies such as oil and gas aren't dishing out the money like last year. I suppose they can do what they always do and steal from a hospital.

[Cooterpoot]

Coot, I was told by a friend who knows Lsu "connections", word is their NIL money "ain't what it use to be", seems some of the high dollar companies such as oil and gas aren't dishing out the money like last year. I suppose they can do what they always do and steal from a hospital.

I'd heard they're not where they were last year. But they can get a couple players. I told some folks our money today is as good as anyone in the country. I haven't looked at the portal much lately outside of pitching. I know we're on a couple more arms. That's really all I'm worried about. I didn't notice Moore in the portal. He would be Tommy White/Skenes type of grab.

[confucius say]

Coot, I was told by a friend who knows Lsu "connections", word is their NIL money "ain't what it use to be", seems some of the high dollar companies such as oil and gas aren't dishing out the money like last year. I suppose they can do what they always do and steal from a hospital.

Maybe the bat company that gave them all the $ last year got pushback and quit

[Homedawg]

This is going to sound crazy...

But in the fall and spring I would look to see if Cupp and Mershon could potentially play CF. Could be a good way to get both of them in the lineup at the same time and could potentially make us really good defensively if they can handle it.

Food for thought.
Cupp is a big time ss. Mershon is more of a second baseman that can be ok at short. Cupp I can assure you didn't come here to play cf and he doesn't profile as an Of w his bar anyway.

[Coach34]

What bothers me is that some people around here dont understand the problem of putting people out there in situations they arent ready for makes them look worse than they really are.

1. Loo- SS who also pitched. Potential top 3 round guy as a SS- decided he wanted to become a pitcher full-time. Has tremendous arm talent but in no way was he ready to be an SEC SP as a true freshman. Our previous lack of recruiting forced him into a situation he just wasnt ready for and we got the expected results. I expect him to have a big jump in 24 now that he has that experience and should be ready for prime time. Will be a Top 5 round draft pick next summer

2. Holcombe- Country ass Bama Gump who went juco...has arm talent but needed a year to develop and get around 20 innings- instead got twice that. Walked 42 batters in 36 innings and that will almost assuredly improve in 24. Teams only hit .228 against him. Expect him to really improve in 24 and likely drafted in the Top 8 rounds

3. Bradley Loftin- 3.08 ERA as a Freshman almost entirely from midweek duty. Only gave up 13 hits in 26.1 innings of work while striking out 43. Problem was the walks with 28. Teams only hit .146 against him. Missed most of April and all of May with an elbow clean-up. Will be ready to go this Fall. Expect him to push for a weekend spot in the rotation. Another Top 5 round pick on the mound for us in 25.

4. Evan Siary- another true freshman that had to learn quickly. Showed flashes at times like a true freshman does and also got roughed up some as a true freshman usually does. Appeared to get tired down the stretch- giving up 9 of his 22 earned runs in 3 of his last 4 appearances. Expect him to be improved out of the pen in 24

Expecting these guys to make jumps is not unreasonable or "homerish" but actually is expected due to their talent. Throw in Simmons, Auger, Dohm, Nixon, Tapper, the Miami guy, and possibly one more transfer arm and our pitching should be very improved in 2024.

[Cooterpoot]

And you can add Highfill too. Never been a great bat but he's a great athlete that can be a great receiver/defender.

Then you've got Hujsak who had to adjust and is destroying it this summer.

Potential is high with this team. It's just potential but they've got fall to figure it all out. Just add the guys we need and let's roll.

[the_real_MSU_is_us]

"You can't reson someone out of a position they didn't reason themselves into". I get it, yall want us to be good again. But all I'm seeing is arguments saying "X situation COULD go good for us, therefore it WILL". like yeah Hujesak COULD be what he's showing right now, bit 3 months ago he couldn't hit. Seems more likely he's on a hot streak/is facing bad pitching vs he's suddenly turned into a stud.if he has, isn't that quite an entitement on Jake G? He hits .227 under his coaching and 2 weeks with a new coach turns him into a stud?

I also see the argument "well we COULD have no injuries next year, therefore you're being ridiculous for saying we will". I'm basing my argument onthis based on history.

"Loo/Holcombe/Loftin/Siary have the talent to be good, therefore they will". Well, every SEC team has talented guys that don't pan out. Many others that do pan out take more than 1 offseaon with a real PC. Most guys don't go from ERAS of 8+ to studs overnight. That's the statistical truth. I made a li g comment above where I counted out pitching and I was more than fair in assuming what improvements they'd make.

At the end of the day, our HC is the same guy that ran us off the rails, and our team is mostly the same roster that finished 13th last year. Is there potential? YES! Is it statistically likely all these breaks will go our way? NO.

all I know is a lot of crow will be eaten next season. I hope it's me, I really do.

[confucius say]

We've got to get the culture and chemistry piece right too.
Nobody talks about it, but we hired a new S&C guy in January.

[basedog]

Maybe the bat company that gave them all the $ last year got pushback and quit

Lots of companies especially in south La have cut cost and NIL giving to the Corndogs.

[confucius say]

"You can't reson someone out of a position they didn't reason themselves into". I get it, yall want us to be good again. But all I'm seeing is arguments saying "X situation COULD go good for us, therefore it WILL". like yeah Hujesak COULD be what he's showing right now, bit 3 months ago he couldn't hit. Seems more likely he's on a hot streak/is facing bad pitching vs he's suddenly turned into a stud.if he has, isn't that quite an entitement on Jake G? He hits .227 under his coaching and 2 weeks with a new coach turns him into a stud?

I also see the argument "well we COULD have no injuries next year, therefore you're being ridiculous for saying we will". I'm basing my argument onthis based on history.

"Loo/Holcombe/Loftin/Siary have the talent to be good, therefore they will". Well, every SEC team has talented guys that don't pan out. Many others that do pan out take more than 1 offseaon with a real PC. Most guys don't go from ERAS of 8+ to studs overnight. That's the statistical truth. I made a li g comment above where I counted out pitching and I was more than fair in assuming what improvements they'd make.

At the end of the day, our HC is the same guy that ran us off the rails, and our team is mostly the same roster that finished 23th last year. Is there potential? YES! Is it statistically likely all these breaks will go our way? NO.

all I know is a lot of crow will be eaten next season. I hope it's me, I really do.

I'll be surprised if we're not a 2 seed

[Cooterpoot]

We've got to get the culture and chemistry piece right too.
Nobody talks about it, but we hired a new S&C guy in January.

(This is all rehashing) The biggest problem was poor talent evals and no development. We really have signed subpar talent. Then, we blindly stuck with them and couldn't see they sucked. That's got to stop. It was lazy. Now they're feeling the urgency. But again, we all know that. So let's see what happens with this portsl class first and the season next. Then, we can all point fingers or high five.

[Coach34]

I also see the argument "well we COULD have no injuries next year, therefore you're being ridiculous for saying we will". I'm basing my argument onthis based on history.
"Loo/Holcombe/Loftin/Siary have the talent to be good, therefore they will". Well, every SEC team has talented guys that don't pan out.

.

Much higher percentage of guys panning out that struggle as Freshmen and then have great careers afterwards

[BrunswickDawg]

What bothers me is that some people around here dont understand the problem of putting people out there in situations they arent ready for makes them look worse than they really are.

1. Loo- SS who also pitched. Potential top 3 round guy as a SS- decided he wanted to become a pitcher full-time. Has tremendous arm talent but in no way was he ready to be an SEC SP as a true freshman. Our previous lack of recruiting forced him into a situation he just wasnt ready for and we got the expected results. I expect him to have a big jump in 24 now that he has that experience and should be ready for prime time. Will be a Top 5 round draft pick next summer

2. Holcombe- Country ass Bama Gump who went juco...has arm talent but needed a year to develop and get around 20 innings- instead got twice that. Walked 42 batters in 36 innings and that will almost assuredly improve in 24. Teams only hit .228 against him. Expect him to really improve in 24 and likely drafted in the Top 8 rounds

3. Bradley Loftin- 3.08 ERA as a Freshman almost entirely from midweek duty. Only gave up 13 hits in 26.1 innings of work while striking out 43. Problem was the walks with 28. Teams only hit .146 against him. Missed most of April and all of May with an elbow clean-up. Will be ready to go this Fall. Expect him to push for a weekend spot in the rotation. Another Top 5 round pick on the mound for us in 25.

4. Evan Siary- another true freshman that had to learn quickly. Showed flashes at times like a true freshman does and also got roughed up some as a true freshman usually does. Appeared to get tired down the stretch- giving up 9 of his 22 earned runs in 3 of his last 4 appearances. Expect him to be improved out of the pen in 24

Expecting these guys to make jumps is not unreasonable or "homerish" but actually is expected due to their talent. Throw in Simmons, Auger, Dohm, Nixon, Tapper, the Miami guy, and possibly one more transfer arm and our pitching should be very improved in 2024.

I think that a major issue about the perception of this is that we were so deep in pitching from 2012-2021 that a lot of people have forgotten how easily injuries can derail a pitching staff. It seems that every year we had a key guy go down, but someone was able to step up and fill the gap. Even at our ebb when we had guys like Jake Mangum, Brant Blaylock and even Brent Rooker out on the mound we somehow found ways to win. That's some elite competitiveness, likely great coaching, and shear dumb luck gracing us for a decade. Well - the past 2 years have shown what injuries normally do to teams if they don't have those intangibles, and it sucks. I really do hope that Parker can right us on the coaching front, and these kids that have shown some talent can develop and buy us some time to get the depth back to where it was.

[Cooterpoot]

People also want to forget about the new pitch clock and the juiced ball. Pitching took a hit all over college baseball. Most people here were saying LSU pitching sucked outside of Skenes, but they got rolling in post season. Got a couple guys back, adjusted, and some guys made the jump. That's all it takes.

[the_real_MSU_is_us]

I'll be surprised if we're not a 2 seed

Probably will yeah. Top 5 fanbase, top 5 coaching salaries, top 5 in NIL, top 10 classes every year, top 1 in fan support, and we'll end up in the 17-32 range. And you know what? That's both good enough to keep Lemo another season, AND it's better than we'll be in '25. He aint it, or we wouldn't have finished 14th and 13th these past 2 seasons.

Should have fired him and brought in a better coach. We're extending the mediocrity 2, 3 more years and digging the program deeper into a hole.

[Cooterpoot]

Probably will yeah. Top 5 fanbase, top 5 coaching salaries, top 5 in NIL, top 10 classes every year, top 1 in fan support, and we'll end up in the 17-32 range. And you know what? That's both good enough to keep Lemo another season, AND it's better than we'll be in '25. He aint it, or we wouldn't have finished 14th and 13th these past 2 seasons.

Should have fired him and brought in a better coach. We're extending the mediocrity 2, 3 more years and digging the program deeper into a hole.

LOL

[Homedawg]

Much higher percentage of guys panning out that struggle as Freshmen and then have great careers afterwards

This^^ people either don't see it or don't want to believe it, more fr struggle than succeed. In all sports. JUst a fact. Look at kemp alderman, he couldn't hit a bull in the ass with a quilt as a fr. He was a pretty good hitter. Jake Mangum's are rare, very.

[Saltydog]

Probably will yeah. Top 5 fanbase, top 5 coaching salaries, top 5 in NIL, top 10 classes every year, top 1 in fan support, and we'll end up in the 17-32 range. And you know what? That's both good enough to keep Lemo another season, AND it's better than we'll be in '25. He aint it, or we wouldn't have finished 14th and 13th these past 2 seasons.

Should have fired him and brought in a better coach. We're extending the mediocrity 2, 3 more years and digging the program deeper into a hole.

We shall see but yeah, just from looking at the current roster I agree that '25 doesn't look stellar but a lot of things can change in two years. Of course with NIL and the portal things can change rather quickly but thus far we haven't shown the ability to go out and land enough of the big name transfers to turn a program around in a single year. We're not LSU, our program has to be built. Even if we have a decent '24, if '25 goes like the last two years we'd have to make a move.

[confucius say]

Probably will yeah. Top 5 fanbase, top 5 coaching salaries, top 5 in NIL, top 10 classes every year, top 1 in fan support, and we'll end up in the 17-32 range. And you know what? That's both good enough to keep Lemo another season, AND it's better than we'll be in '25. He aint it, or we wouldn't have finished 14th and 13th these past 2 seasons.

Should have fired him and brought in a better coach. We're extending the mediocrity 2, 3 more years and digging the program deeper into a hole.

2 seeds go to supers and Omaha every year.

We will see. If you're right and we're not a host or in a super, it's a failure like any other season where neither of those happen. If we do, then all the complaining a year before the season was for naught

[BigDawg81]

LSU landed an OF. That seems like it will State with Montgomery. I?m not sure how serious are LSU and Montgomery are with each other.

https://twitter.com/KendallRogers/status/1679946653212475393

[Todd4State]

Cupp is a big time ss. Mershon is more of a second baseman that can be ok at short. Cupp I can assure you didn't come here to play cf and he doesn't profile as an Of w his bar anyway.

I was thinking Mershon in CF and Cupp at SS to be honest with you.

[Coach34]

This^^ people either don't see it or don't want to believe it, more fr struggle than succeed. In all sports. JUst a fact. Look at kemp alderman, he couldn't hit a bull in the ass with a quilt as a fr. He was a pretty good hitter. Jake Mangum's are rare, very.

A guy named Hunter Renfroe batted .154 as a true freshman

[BeardoMSU]

A guy named Hunter Renfroe batted .154 as a true freshman

Still hatin'******

[confucius say]

A guy named Hunter Renfroe batted .154 as a true freshman

Rooker wasn't ready until his third year on campus as a Redshirt sophomore.
Frazier wasn't ready as a true freshman.
Stratton year 3.
Dakota Hudson year 3.
On and on.

Again, we should have a few guys make a jump

[Todd4State]

Rooker wasn't ready until his third year on campus as a Redshirt sophomore.
Frazier wasn't ready as a true freshman.
Stratton year 3.
Dakota Hudson year 3.
On and on.

Again, we should have a few guys make a jump

Ridiculous to believe that players get better.*****

[Leroy Jenkins]

Ridiculous to believe that players get better.*****

We need some of them to make a Jared Liebelt sized leap. I'm really optimistic about what Parker can do with the talent we have. There is no way (from a physical talent perspective) we are as bad as we've shown recently.

[smootness]

Coming up with absurd takes about how we aren't really going to be better is worse at this point.

You do you but it sounds like you're awfully nervous that you're going to be wrong about Lemonis.

There?s no strong reason as of right now to think, or certainly assume, we will be better. But the problem is, we do not just need to be better, we need to be WAAAY better.

[smootness]

A guy named Hunter Renfroe batted .154 as a true freshman

He also was not good as a sophomore.

[Coach34]

He also was not good as a sophomore.

But he did improve quite a bit:

• Hit .252 and ranked second on the team with 58 hits and 20 extra-base hits, including 16 doubles and four home runs • Set the school record with an SEC-leading 10 outfield assists

Dead bat and ball era also

[Commercecomet24]

This^^ people either don't see it or don't want to believe it, more fr struggle than succeed. In all sports. JUst a fact. Look at kemp alderman, he couldn't hit a bull in the ass with a quilt as a fr. He was a pretty good hitter. Jake Mangum's are rare, very.

100% ! Every level you go up in competition there?s an adjustment period to catch up with the speed of the game. Just the way it is!

[the_real_MSU_is_us]

Ridiculous to believe that players get better.*****

Quit being deliberately obtuse and intentionally misunderstanding what we're saying.

Some of us doubt we will get as big of jumps as we need from as many players as we need it from. That's it. Nobody is saying our returning players literally won't get better

[Cowbell]

I'm old enough to remember people on here claiming Hines was the same player this year as last...

[The Federalist Engineer]

We need some of them to make a Jared Liebelt sized leap. I'm really optimistic about what Parker can do with the talent we have. There is no way (from a physical talent perspective) we are as bad as we've shown recently.

Just going to say a super Trolly thing here...Foxhall in 2018 and 2019 was Muscara good. Players were getting better and MSU was leaping the SEC pitching rankings.

[Cooterpoot]

Just going to say a super Trolly thing here...Foxhall in 2018 and 2019 was Muscara good. Players were getting better and MSU was leaping the SEC pitching rankings.

Really? Because he wasn't even here in 2018.

[The Federalist Engineer]

Really? Because he wasn't even here in 2018.

You're right - hired in 2018 but not coaching until 2019.

That's when Leibelt made his leap. Small became a National Ace.

[The Federalist Engineer]

Nate Snead of Wichita State is going to Tennessee- that's the best Relief Pitcher in the portal, if you consider Chase Burns a Starter now.

Happened on June 28, so not just now

[The Federalist Engineer]

Jack Selinger the 100 MPH LHP from UNLV is a Marlin Signee

[the_real_MSU_is_us]

Nate Snead of Wichita State is going to Tennessee- that's the best Relief Pitcher in the portal, if you consider Chase Burns a Starter now.

Happened on June 28, so not just now


Tennessee definitely has the best Portal class this year. We have a shot at #2 if we land Holman and Montgomery. If we land 1 of those 2 we're like 5th after Wake and LSU and UF. If we land neither, that means all we got was a decent Saturday starter and a decent 3B and that's worse than most of the conference honestly.

[The Federalist Engineer]

Tennessee definitely has the best Portal class this year. We have a shot at #2 if we land Holman and Montgomery. If we land 1 of those 2 we're like 5th after Wake and LSU and UF. If we land neither, that means all we got was a decent Saturday starter and a decent 3B and that's worse than most of the conference honestly.

Tennessee seems on a mission. Would love to see it fail. But they are succeeding. Got the Clemson and NC State Freshman All Americans. Got a SoCon POY. The Witchita Gem. And still busy.

Peaking into other SEC schools, UT is basically drinking everybody's milkshake

[Coach34]

Tennessee definitely has the best Portal class this year. We have a shot at #2 if we land Holman and Montgomery. If we land 1 of those 2 we're like 5th after Wake and LSU and UF. If we land neither, that means all we got was a decent Saturday starter and a decent 3B and that's worse than most of the conference honestly.

Tenn and LSU lost alot of talent too tho

[the_real_MSU_is_us]

Tenn and LSU lost alot of talent too tho

They did. I'm just talking about the Portal class ranking

[BigDawg81]

Is it just me but watching Montgomery mom going off on Kendall Rogers kinda funny?

[confucius say]

Is it just me but watching Montgomery mom going off on Kendall Rogers kinda funny?

Not just you. It's entertaining.
He brought that on himself though.

[BeardoMSU]

What's the skinny?

[TNDawg35]

What's the skinny?

Pretty much that D1 baseball has been slobbing all over LSU nuts when they get a portal player and now that it looks like State has Montgomery, it’s all of a sudden a problem because of he is leaving Stanford.

She pretty much said in a nutshell if he would be going to LSU it wouldn’t be a problem, but because he is going home, it’s a problem…

[BeardoMSU]

Pretty much that D1 baseball has been slobbing all over LSU nuts when they get a portal player and now that it looks like State has Montgomery, it’s all of a sudden a problem because of he is leaving Stanford.

She pretty much said in a nutshell if he would be going to LSU it wouldn’t be a problem, but because he is going home, it’s a problem…

Oh...well that is something.

Thanks for laying it out, btw.

[Todd4State]

Not just you. It's entertaining.
He brought that on himself though.

He's getting what he deserved. Comes down to he's a pleaser and he said something stupid to PAC 12 homer Mike Rooney.

[CaptainObvious]

Pretty much that D1 baseball has been slobbing all over LSU nuts when they get a portal player and now that it looks like State has Montgomery, it’s all of a sudden a problem because of he is leaving Stanford.

She pretty much said in a nutshell if he would be going to LSU it wouldn’t be a problem, but because he is going home, it’s a problem…

I sure hope we are setting ourselves up for heartbreak over these guys. Lemonis IS still our coach after all. This ain?t Missouri, but he will still have to Show Me he can pull these guys.

[BigDawg81]

Oh...well that is something.

Thanks for laying it out, btw.
Mom is throwing it out there tonight. She is way smarter than me cause she is a doctor which makes this more interesting.
She is saying the the west coast isnt committed to baseball like the SEC. There are many reasons on why he is transferring.

[Todd4State]

Mom is throwing it out there tonight. She is way smarter than me cause she is a doctor which makes this more interesting.
She is saying the the west coast isnt committed to baseball like the SEC. There are many reasons on why he is transferring.

It isn't. USC was maybe the most dominant baseball program of all time in the 1970's and has produced I think more MLB players than any other school. They simply don't draw and a lot of it is because they have to compete with the Dodgers and Angels more than anything. Stanford has to compete with the Giants and A's. The PAC 12 is good because they have a lot of baseball talent out west but they simply don't have the fan support that the SEC does. Oregon and Oregon State draw the best if I had to guess- Oregon is more of a similar baseball environment to Mississippi and Louisiana. Even then they don't compare to the SEC although I wouldn't be surprised if they outdraw Mizzou.

The portal has really hurt the PAC 12 because a lot of their better upperclass players are doing what Montgomery is doing- play a couple of years "near home" and then transfer to a SEC school.

[Ari Gold]

Tennessee definitely has the best Portal class this year. We have a shot at #2 if we land Holman and Montgomery. If we land 1 of those 2 we're like 5th after Wake and LSU and UF. If we land neither, that means all we got was a decent Saturday starter and a decent 3B and that's worse than most of the conference honestly.

Tennessee also lost a top 5 draft pick in Burns .. possibly number 1 overall

[the_real_MSU_is_us]

Tennessee also lost a top 5 draft pick in Burns .. possibly number 1 overall

That's fair- I didn't think of viewing a Portal class in a "net" way where you take into account who you lost

[Cowbell]

That's fair- I didn't think of viewing a Portal class in a "net" way where you take into account who you lost

That's absolutely how it should be viewed. If we lost DJ and only got Montgomery, it would be pretty well neutral (debatable I know)

[basedog]

My sure Montgomery is self motivated, but playing at "home" in front of huge crowd will only enhance his motivation. Also it should motivate a lot of our players and make our lineup much better as well as put as back in the pack of being dangerous.
Now pitching is still a question mark although better with Parker as PC.

[BigDawg81]

My sure Montgomery is self motivated, but playing at "home" in front of huge crowd will only enhance his motivation. Also it should motivate a lot of our players and make our lineup much better as well as put as back in the pack of being dangerous.
Now pitching is still a question mark although better with Parker as PC.
It seems like the confidence of getting Montgomery is at a 9 out of 10 right now. If he doesn?t commit to State, it?s going to be a meltdown. Some people already suggest that he has already committed.

[basedog]

It seems like the confidence of getting Montgomery is at a 9 out of 10 right now. If he doesn?t commit to State, it?s going to be a meltdown. Some people already suggest that he has already committed.

I agree. Regardless I'm gonna pull for our program next spring. We need help and Montgomery would be a huge help.

[AlSwearengen]

It seems safe to say that Holman is target no. 1 for us. He is at Tenn Monday, lsu Tuesday, and State Wednesday. Someone told me that he is leaning pretty hard to lsu but the source of the info is fairly average on accuracy. At the same time though, lsu has a lot more to show a recruit right now and Lemonis isn’t in a good position to be going against Vitello and Johnson for a pitcher right now.

I’ve seen it mentioned that the kid from TT will probably end up at Ark. Are there any other staff ace types that we are in the game for? We really need a proven Friday type.

[BigDawg81]

It seems safe to say that Holman is target no. 1 for us. He is at Tenn Monday, lsu Tuesday, and State Wednesday. Someone told me that he is leaning pretty hard to lsu but the source of the info is fairly average on accuracy. At the same time though, lsu has a lot more to show a recruit right now and Lemonis isn’t in a good position to be going against Vitello and Johnson for a pitcher right now.

I’ve seen it mentioned that the kid from TT will probably end up at Ark. Are there any other staff ace types that we are in the game for? We really need a proven Friday type. Haven?t heard that at all. Holman has visited State once and he is visiting State again on his last visit. That says a lot .

[ZedFedder]

If, and I say if because they aren't officially in the boat yet, we get both Holman and Montgomery, you have to start feeling pretty good about next year. I think Parker can vastly improve Loo, Loftin, and Holcombe.

[Cooterpoot]

Haven?t heard that at all. Holman has visited State once and he is visiting State again on his last visit. That says a lot .

Seems to be some back and forth on the visit schedule. We'll see who gets last visit.

[BigDawg81]

Seems to be some back and forth on the visit schedule. We'll see who gets last visit.
Just heard that. It seems to be LSU now

[Cowbell]

Just heard that. It seems to be LSU now

Might as well cross him off

[Cowbell]

If we don't get another ace, Parker will have to work a miracle in the off-season

[Coach34]

Haven?t heard that at all. Holman has visited State once and he is visiting State again on his last visit. That says a lot .

It?s not looking good for us at the moment

[BigDawg81]

It?s not looking good for us at the momentYou could argue that Holman is more important than Montgomery

[DEDawg]

It?s not looking good for us at the moment

Is it just money at this point?

[AlSwearengen]

In the article that I read, he was talking about player development. I?d say Coach is right, not looking good for us. Right now, it?s looking like we are going to have to hope Parker can work miracles and really turn the current staff around and hope a couple of new guys perform better than expected.

Lemonis capitalized on the national title when it comes to classes that were 3 and 4 years out (if they stick with us), but failed miserably using the portal to bridge the gap. Now he has not only lost any momentum from us living in Omaha for a few years and winning a title, but has put us in a place of serious disadvantage.

[AlSwearengen]

Is it just money at this point?

Doesn’t sound like it. These guys are high draft types that aren’t short sighted. They want to be coached by coaches that are competent and that can help them progress.

If Parker can work miracles and turn our staff around and turn Loo and others into top draft choices, then we can get recruit’s attention when it comes to development. Until then, we are sucking hind tit in that department.

[the_real_MSU_is_us]

In the article that I read, he was talking about player development. I?d say Coach is right, not looking good for us. Right now, it?s looking like we are going to have to hope Parker can work miracles and really turn the current staff around and hope a couple of new guys perform better than expected.

Lemonis capitalized on the national title when it comes to classes that were 3 and 4 years out (if they stick with us), but failed miserably using the portal to bridge the gap. Now he has not only lost any momentum from us living in Omaha for a few years and winning a title, but has put us in a place of serious disadvantage.

Absolutely BS there was ever a "bridge" needed.

Cohen obviously knew how to recruit and left the program in great shape.

Cann came in , held the Cohen class together, and recruited 1 class of his own. He was billed as an elite recruiter and evaluator. Brought in some absolute STUDS.

Henderson took over for 4 months, after which all recruiting was handed to Lemonis. But sure, let's call it an entire year lost to recruitment for the sale of argument

Lemo was handed a well oiled machine by Cohen and Cann, and used it well for the first 3 seasons. Year 4 -when Lemos own HS recruits started rolling in- is when things fell off a cliff in talent and culture.

This is YEAR 5, and we want to say the team is in a bad spot due to the HS recruiting of the former coaches? Naw, that ain't going to fly

[confucius say]

Doesn?t sound like it. These guys are high draft types that aren?t short sighted. They want to be coached by coaches that are competent and that can help them progress.

If Parker can work miracles and turn our staff around and turn Loo and others into top draft choices, then we can get recruit?s attention when it comes to development. Until then, we are sucking hind tit in that department.

Has lsu hired a pitching coach? Yeskie?

[Coach34]

Is it just money at this point?

No

[the_real_MSU_is_us]

Has lsu hired a pitching coach? Yeskie?

They hired Yeski from A&M. A&M hired a giy from the mariners with a title like "pitching development coordinator". Not a coach, but in charge of evaluating, drafting, and development for the organization. Only 28

[Coach34]

Absolutely BS there was ever a "bridge" needed.

Cohen obviously knew how to recruit and left the program in great shape.

Cann came in , held the Cohen class together, and recruited 1 class of his own. He was billed as an elite recruiter and evaluator. Brought in some absolute STUDS.

Henderson took over for 4 months, after which all recruiting was handed to Lemonis. But sure, let's call it an entire year lost to recruitment for the sale of argument

Lemo was handed a well oiled machine by Cohen and Cann, and used it well for the first 3 seasons. Year 4 -when Lemos own HS recruits started rolling in- is when things fell off a cliff in talent and culture.

This is YEAR 5, and we want to say the team is in a bad spot due to the HS recruiting of the former coaches? Naw, that ain't going to fly

Our problem is simply lack of pitching. We are working hard to trot out the SEC’s best line-up in 2024. Our huge questions lie in the pitching department.

Ultimately the blame is on Lemon. No doubt. I think he messed up and left a lot of the pitching recruiting to Fox and Cheese. Didn’t focus on it as much as he should have. Our last 2 years on the mound have just been abysmal. His last chance to right the ship is now thru May. We’ll see what happens

[BeardoMSU]

Well this thread definitely took a turn...of the depressing variety...

[Coach34]

Well this thread definitely took a turn...of the depressing variety...

Well, while we are certainly a baseball blue blood- some people need to realize no matter who our coach is- if certain teams want certain players- we are going to lose most of those battles. The rest of the SEC prioritizing baseball also is simply making it harder for us than it used to be. Our best teams have always had a few stars with a bunch of blue-collars. I don’t see us having the crazy amounts of draft picks like LSU, Vandy, or Tenn having. LSU had 13 drafted, Tenn 8, Vandy 7.

No matter who coaches us- we aren’t going to have draft classes of 8-10 players

[the_real_MSU_is_us]

Our problem is simply lack of pitching. We are working hard to trot out the SEC?s best line-up in 2024. Our huge questions lie in the pitching department.

Ultimately the blame is on Lemon. No doubt. I think he messed up and left a lot of the pitching recruiting to Fox and Cheese. Didn?t focus on it as much as he should have. Our last 2 years on the mound have just been abysmal. His last chance to right the ship is now thru May. We?ll see what happens

If memory serves me, these past 2 years we've been 10th and 9th in runs scored. Of course everyone knows our defense was league worst last year.

How can you say we "just need pitching" when faced with these stats? Like yeah the lineup is looking good for '24 (and awful for 25) but Lemo still gets the blame for these past 2 lineups.

[Coach34]

We won the CWS being 8th or 9th in the SEC in runs scored. Our problem has been pitching and everybody knows it

[Cooterpoot]

Had we not pissed away that '21 championship by sitting on our lazy asses and we'd been competing, we could get anyone. We can handle the money rush. It's not just the money. Holman has a massive offer from us. But he seems to like Yeskie and LSU is winning. I'd say let's wait and see. It's not over. It's just a battle for the only legit arm available.

[BeardoMSU]

Well, while we are certainly a baseball blue blood- some people need to realize no matter who our coach is- if certain teams want certain players- we are going to lose most of those battles. The rest of the SEC prioritizing baseball also is simply making it harder for us than it used to be. Our best teams have always had a few stars with a bunch of blue-collars. I don’t see us having the crazy amounts of draft picks like LSU, Vandy, or Tenn having. LSU had 13 drafted, Tenn 8, Vandy 7.

No matter who coaches us- we aren’t going to have draft classes of 8-10 players

Very true.

[Todd4State]

Had we not pissed away that '21 championship by sitting on our lazy asses and we'd been competing, we could get anyone. We can handle the money rush. It's not just the money. Holman has a massive offer from us. But he seems to like Yeskie and LSU is winning. I'd say let's wait and see. It's not over. It's just a battle for the only legit arm available.

Not sure if this means anything or not but it appears to me as if he is taking his visits geographically. Cary, NC to Knoxville, Knoxville to Starkville, Starkville to Baton Rouge.

Maybe we can get him to visit again on the way home.

[The Federalist Engineer]

Had we not pissed away that '21 championship by sitting on our lazy asses and we'd been competing, we could get anyone. We can handle the money rush. It's not just the money. Holman has a massive offer from us. But he seems to like Yeskie and LSU is winning. I'd say let's wait and see. It's not over. It's just a battle for the only legit arm available.

When you are last place, recruiting is harder and more expensive. Should have been Portal Hunting this hard in 2021. Should have gotten the fat boy from Samford. But with a message of "open arms for top talent" many kids would have jumped to be the new Bednar, MacLeod, or replace Sims as the closer - in 2021.

But there will be a Holman and Skenes next year too. The best future recruiting in July 2024 is winning and having electric atmospheres at DNF in Spring 2024. Just being decent will do wonders for future portal work.

Plus, if Parker can cut team ERA 25 to 37% in one season, that's a great selling point too.

[BigDawg81]

Not sure if this means anything or not but it appears to me as if he is taking his visits geographically. Cary, NC to Knoxville, Knoxville to Starkville, Starkville to Baton Rouge.

Maybe we can get him to visit again on the way home.
I hear that Auburn is in the mix too. When he visits Tuesday, make him shut it down and don?t take those visits. Honestly, he is more important to this team than Montgomery.

[Really Clark?]

Tenn, Us, LSU and probably Auburn is Holoman's schedule for visits. LSU was behind other schools until they hired Yeski, that has put them in good position.

We are still on some other arms but they are below Holoman level. If we lose out on him, get the next best starter we can and bolster our pen with as much depth as possible. Circle back on Burns after / if we get Montgomery.

[Coach34]

I hear that Auburn is in the mix too. When he visits Tuesday, make him shut it down and don?t take those visits. Honestly, he is more important to this team than Montgomery.

I agree but I would guess we are running 3rd right now

[sack07]

One of the reasons Montgomery is in the portal is to find more opportunities on the mound.

[the_real_MSU_is_us]

We won the CWS being 8th or 9th in the SEC in runs scored. Our problem has been pitching and everybody knows it

No no no, you don't get to say we have a lot of talent and the only issue has been lack of pitching. Offense matters. Defense matters. Yes you can be middle of the pack in one if you elevate in the postseason and still win it all (see OM '22), but the total team talent matters too. The final 4 teams in Omaha were national seeds. Why? Because they had talent in their lineups and on the mound and you have to score runs AND pitch AND play D to win it all.

If you have talent in your lineup, the offense will produce. Just like if you have talent on the mound, the ERA will reflect that. You don't get to just say "10th placed offense and 14th placed defense are fine, we just need to improve on the mound because that was 14th".

I understand WHY you're saying that- so you can pin all blame on Fox. But Lemo has let every aspect of this team crumble and it's getting worse the more of his players we get to campus

[the_real_MSU_is_us]

One of the reasons Montgomery is in the portal is to find more opportunities on the mound.

I mean he pitched 12 innings and had an ERA of 15... he sounds like a reverse Zack Greinke

[Coach34]

No no no, you don't get to say we have a lot of talent and the only issue has been lack of pitching. Offense matters. Defense matters. Yes you can be middle of the pack in one if you elevate in the postseason and still win it all (see OM '22), but the total team talent matters too. The final 4 teams in Omaha were national seeds. Why? Because they had talent in their lineups and on the mound and you have to score runs AND pitch AND play D to win it all.

If you have talent in your lineup, the offense will produce. Just like if you have talent on the mound, the ERA will reflect that. You don't get to just say "10th placed offense and 14th placed defense are fine, we just need to improve on the mound because that was 14th".

I understand WHY you're saying that- so you can pin all blame on Fox. But Lemo has let every aspect of this team crumble and it's getting worse the more of his players we get to campus

We were tied for 5th in the SEC in fielding and 5th in BA in 2022- so why did we finish dead last in the conference?

[confucius say]

We were tied for 5th in the SEC in fielding and 5th in BA in 2022- so why did we finish dead last in the conference?

Bc we were last in pitching would be my guess.

We were middle of the pack offensively and won a national title. Baseball is about pitching. That's why state, Mississippi, and lsu won it - dominant pitching when it mattered.

It's also fair to say 2023 defense was an anomaly given our defense in 2019, 2021, and 2022. Just like 2022 defense for lsu was an anomaly when they finished last in fielding.

Fix the pitching and everything else will fall into place.

[The Federalist Engineer]

I mean he pitched 12 innings and had an ERA of 15... he sounds like a reverse Zack Greinke

We have Roster Cats without All American Hitting that only pitch, with poor numbers too.

But Montgomery actually pitched well in their Regional. 2 or 3 good innings versus Texas A&M. They desperately needed quality innings and they got it.

https://www.secsports.com/boxscore/baseball/401551131

[the_real_MSU_is_us]

We were tied for 5th in the SEC in fielding and 5th in BA in 2022- so why did we finish dead last in the conference?

Pitching was awful. But I love how you have to cherry pick a stat like BA because the overall offensive stat that does matter (scoring) isn't favorable to your case.

But lets take your point: We were decent on offense, good on defense, and so bad on the mound we finished 14th. So what did Lemo do? Lemo let the pitching somehow get worse, let the defense turn into the worst in the conference, and let the offense be sub average. After finishing 14th, Lemonis' way of fixing the team meant we finished 13th.

It's pretty clear we've got problems other than Fox, and Lemo doesn't know how to fix them.

[the_real_MSU_is_us]

We have Roster Cats without All American Hitting that only pitch, with poor numbers too.

But Montgomery actually pitched well in their Regional. 2 or 3 good innings versus Texas A&M. They desperately needed quality innings and they got it.

https://www.secsports.com/boxscore/baseball/401551131

Maybe he can I've only glaced at the stats. I saw Kendall Rogers say he throws 97 so he's got potential.

Either way, of he wants to both go to a big time program AND pitch, I'm not sure what better landing than us there is. He knows we were awful there and by now he can see we haven't brought in enough Portal arms to deny him opportunities

[Cooterpoot]

Pitching was awful. But I love how you have to cherry pick a stat like BA because the overall offensive stat that does matter (scoring) isn't favorable to your case.

But lets take your point: We were decent on offense, good on defense, and so bad on the mound we finished 14th. So what did Lemo do? Lemo let the pitching somehow get worse, let the defense turn into the worst in the conference, and let the offense be sub average. After finishing 14th, Lemonis' way of fixing the team meant we finished 13th.

It's pretty clear we've got problems other than Fox, and Lemo doesn't know how to fix them.

Run rule games will hurt scoring. We got run ruled what? 10 games? That's a lot of innings without ABs.
When you lead the world in walks, it puts your defense in a bad spot. Almost half our errors were two players.
We were 8th in fielding in '21. Not like we were great.

[the_real_MSU_is_us]

Bc we were last in pitching would be my guess.

We were middle of the pack offensively and won a national title. Baseball is about pitching. That's why state, Mississippi, and lsu won it - dominant pitching when it mattered.

It's also fair to say 2023 defense was an anomaly given our defense in 2019, 2021, and 2022. Just like 2022 defense for lsu was an anomaly when they finished last in fielding.

Fix the pitching and everything else will fall into place.

Odd how actual coaches disagree with you about offense. Of course it matters! MLB drafts position players and gives huge contracts to them. College coaches use NIL on position players. To say "baseball is about pitching" is to say "Jay Johnson was an idiot for using NIL to get Tommy White". It's to say "we shouldn't have bothered to upgrade Alford at 3B".

Pitching is super important, nobody is denying that. But to make a statement like "baseball is about pitching" is just... man it's ignorant. It's like saying 3 ppibt shooting in basketball doesn't matter if you play good defense. It's like saying your defensive line doesn't matter if you have good LBs. It's like saying you don't need to know how to manage money if you have a high income.

The TEAM has issues. The TEAM needs to be improved.

[Coach34]

Bc we were last in pitching would be my guess.

We were middle of the pack offensively and won a national title. Baseball is about pitching. That's why state, Mississippi, and lsu won it - dominant pitching when it mattered.

It's also fair to say 2023 defense was an anomaly given our defense in 2019, 2021, and 2022. Just like 2022 defense for lsu was an anomaly when they finished last in fielding.

Fix the pitching and everything else will fall into place.

Exactly


LSU was 12th in the SEC in fielding this season- turned out ok for them

[the_real_MSU_is_us]

Run rule games will hurt scoring. We got run ruled what? 10 games? That's a lot of innings without ABs.
When you lead the world in walks, it puts your defense in a bad spot. Almost half our errors were two players.
We were 8th in fielding in '21. Not like we were great.

Unreal how far some of yall with twist yourselves into a logic knot to pin all blame on Fox and say all is well. Getting blown the F out = a defense for the offense, wow.

And no, getting run ruled doesn't say what you think it does. Say you're a coach and your team's up 14-3. Do you put in your best reliever like you would in a close game? No. You bring in your 10+ ERA guy in case tomorrows game is close. Then if tomorrows game is a blowout too (in either direction) , you dont ride your good pitchers hard. Maybe just let them get some work in but not more than that. SO, I'd argue our offense saw worse pitching than SEC average due to those blowouts. Moreover, getting run ruled = less opportunities for errors. No, it's not true that Alford and Forsythe were the only issues on D. And even if they were, it's on Lemo for having those be the best we had available.

[Cowbell]

Turns out there were no secret portal guys. Just secret hopes. Lemon doing his best Cohen expression with the hype...what irony...

[Todd4State]

Exactly


LSU was 12th in the SEC in fielding this season- turned out ok for them

I have a personal saying. I've seen bad hitting and fielding teams win championships. I've never seen a bad pitching team win one.

[Todd4State]

Turns out there were no secret portal guys. Just secret hopes. Lemon doing his best Cohen expression with the hype...what irony...

Nah. The staff just wasn't talking to the media very much about it. Rumor is Lemonis wasn't real happy with some things that were leaked during the pitching coach search.

Holman and Montgomery have been names of interest for awhile now.

[The Federalist Engineer]

No no no, you don't get to say we have a lot of talent and the only issue has been lack of pitching. Offense matters. Defense matters. Yes you can be middle of the pack in one if you elevate in the postseason and still win it all (see OM '22), but the total team talent matters too. The final 4 teams in Omaha were national seeds. Why? Because they had talent in their lineups and on the mound and you have to score runs AND pitch AND play D to win it all.

If you have talent in your lineup, the offense will produce. Just like if you have talent on the mound, the ERA will reflect that. You don't get to just say "10th placed offense and 14th placed defense are fine, we just need to improve on the mound because that was 14th".

I understand WHY you're saying that- so you can pin all blame on Fox. But Lemo has let every aspect of this team crumble and it's getting worse the more of his players we get to campus

Lemons owns the Fox performance. Period. MsState7 was always right about that. He was just too expensive to fire or the AD did not want to do it. There is a rumor that buyout money was donated.

The good news is that Muscara is still a PC. I wonder if he is a candidate for MSU HC if he continues to excel and Lemons fails in 2024. That said, I think MSU competes for a hosted regional with Montgomery and two more quality portal arms (not factoring Holman that is being so competitively recruited.)

[The Federalist Engineer]

I have a personal saying. I've seen bad hitting and fielding teams win championships. I've never seen a bad pitching team win one.

Tommy Tanks was a 850 fielding guy but I never saw an error in Omaha. LSU rose to the occasion.

[SPMT]

I have a personal saying. I've seen bad hitting and fielding teams win championships. I've never seen a bad pitching team win one.

Memory tells me ucla beat us in 2013 with pitching. Lots of fly outs. And they

[the_real_MSU_is_us]

Tommy Tanks was a 850 fielding guy but I never saw an error in Omaha. LSU rose to the occasion.

Morgan making the best play I've ever seen a 1B make at any level is the only reason they beat Wake. Tanks hitting that extra inning HR was also a huge reason they beat Wake.

Pitching may be most important, but hitting and defense matter too.

[the_real_MSU_is_us]

I have a personal saying. I've seen bad hitting and fielding teams win championships. I've never seen a bad pitching team win one.

Ole Miss was 9th in ERA in conference only games in '22. In baseball teams can get hot, doesn't mean much. Being good in the regular season correlates strongly to being good in the postseason. That's true for subcategories like pitching, hitting, and defense.

[Todd4State]

Ole Miss was 9th in ERA in conference only games in '22. In baseball teams can get hot, doesn't mean much. Being good in the regular season correlates strongly to being good in the postseason. That's true for subcategories like pitching, hitting, and defense.

That's because you have to be good in the regular season to make the postseason. Ole Miss's pitching carried it in the postseason in 2022. I don't think there is much argument about that. Or there shouldn't be.

[the_real_MSU_is_us]

That's because you have to be good in the regular season to make the postseason. Ole Miss's pitching carried it in the postseason in 2022. I don't think there is much argument about that. Or there shouldn't be.

I can't believe I'm actually having to argue that offense and defense affect how good the team is.

Yes, you need pitching.

You also need to score 1+ run to win.

Ole Miss had great pitching in the postseason but they also scored runs.

Having a good offense = you'll score runs and the pitching doesn't have to be as good for you to win.

Playing good defense means your pitching doesn't have to be as good for you to win.

Pitching great takes pressure off the offense and means you can still win even if the offense struggles vs a great pitcher.

To say "pitching is all the matters" if the equivalent of saying in football "defense is all that matters, who cares what our QB play looks like", or of saying in basketball "defense? Nahbro just hit 3s at a high rate". And again, actual baseball coaches say you're wrong. They bend over backwards to recruit, develop, and Portal in good hitters. Because it matters

Listen to yourselves. You're so desperate to say "Fox was the only problem" that you're actually saying the quality of out lineup and defense has no affect on postseason success. That the equation "Wins = runs for us - runs allowed" is wrong because scoring doesn't matter.

Hell, C34 literally made a whole thread just to say our lineup will be good next year lol. Yall don't even believe that "pitching is all that matters", you're just willing to lie to win an argument

[the_real_MSU_is_us]

I have a personal saying. I've seen bad hitting and fielding teams win championships. I've never seen a bad pitching team win one.

I've never seen a team that can't score runs win won. Have you?

I've seen teams that couldn't hit in the regular season get hot in the postseason, and I've seen teams that couldn't pitch in the regular season become unhitable in the postseason (see LSU this year)

Remember when we played Auburn game 1 of the CWS? We only won because their 3B made an error in the 9th. Or when Arky was 1 out away from a NC and they let a pop fly fall between 3 players because nobody called for it? Or remember LSU vs Wake where Morgan threw the ball home while diving to tag out the would-of-been winning run? Almost like defense was important there too.

[CaptainObvious]

In college baseball where a 4.75 ERA is considered good, and more often than not, an unearned run is scored, averaging 6 runs per game is a must. What was State?s Average Runs per game in SEC play in 2023?
Runs per game in the 21 SEC losses?
Runs per game in the 9 SEC wins?

[TNDawg35]

I don’t give a shit how stout our offense is, when you come to bat in the 3rd inning and it’s 12-1, 9 times out of 10, your loosing that game…

[confucius say]

Odd how actual coaches disagree with you about offense. Of course it matters! MLB drafts position players and gives huge contracts to them. College coaches use NIL on position players. To say "baseball is about pitching" is to say "Jay Johnson was an idiot for using NIL to get Tommy White". It's to say "we shouldn't have bothered to upgrade Alford at 3B".

Pitching is super important, nobody is denying that. But to make a statement like "baseball is about pitching" is just... man it's ignorant. It's like saying 3 ppibt shooting in basketball doesn't matter if you play good defense. It's like saying your defensive line doesn't matter if you have good LBs. It's like saying you don't need to know how to manage money if you have a high income.

The TEAM has issues. The TEAM needs to be improved.

I didn't say it was only about pitching.
But it is primarily about pitching.

Every coach in America will tell you that pitching is the most important aspect of your club. Always has been, always will be.

[confucius say]

I can't believe I'm actually having to argue that offense and defense affect how good the team is.

Yes, you need pitching.

You also need to score 1+ run to win.

Ole Miss had great pitching in the postseason but they also scored runs.

Having a good offense = you'll score runs and the pitching doesn't have to be as good for you to win.

Playing good defense means your pitching doesn't have to be as good for you to win.

Pitching great takes pressure off the offense and means you can still win even if the offense struggles vs a great pitcher.

To say "pitching is all the matters" if the equivalent of saying in football "defense is all that matters, who cares what our QB play looks like", or of saying in basketball "defense? Nahbro just hit 3s at a high rate". And again, actual baseball coaches say you're wrong. They bend over backwards to recruit, develop, and Portal in good hitters. Because it matters

Listen to yourselves. You're so desperate to say "Fox was the only problem" that you're actually saying the quality of out lineup and defense has no affect on postseason success. That the equation "Wins = runs for us - runs allowed" is wrong because scoring doesn't matter.

Hell, C34 literally made a whole thread just to say our lineup will be good next year lol. Yall don't even believe that "pitching is all that matters", you're just willing to lie to win an argument

Who said "pitching is all that matters?"

What people are saying is that pitching is by far the most important part of baseball. It can be phrased differently, but that's what people are telling you. Baseball is about pitching. Nobody is telling you that it is the only part of the game that matters at all.

[Coach34]

I've never seen a team that can't score runs win won. Have you? .

Yes- UCLA 2013. Team BA of .250. Averaged 4.72 runs per game. Beat a team called Miss State for the title

But their team ERA of 2.55 carried them to a title

[BeardoMSU]

Amani officially coming back.

https://twitter.com/alarry21/status/1680953195760168961?s=20

[BigDawg81]

It feels like Nixon will sign a FA deal

[BrunswickDawg]

Amani officially coming back.

https://twitter.com/alarry21/status/1680953195760168961?s=20

I think this is an under-rated win. He could have an RJ Yeager like season this year - plus stealing 20 bases.

[confucius say]

Not many people thought Larry would be back last month.
That's like getting a solid portal addition.
Old wins

[Commercecomet24]

I didn't say it was only about pitching.
But it is primarily about pitching.

Every coach in America will tell you that pitching is the most important aspect of your club. Always has been, always will be.

I was talking to a college head coach about having enough pitching and he made this profound statement. He said "Yeah never heard anyone say we lost a series because we didn't have enough left fielders!"

And as Earl Weaver said "If you aint got pitching you ain't got squat!"

And yes you do have to have functional offense and defense but everything in this game starts on the mound.

[Saltydog]

Absolutely. Glad he's coming back. He had a decent year and I would expect him to be better next year.

[maroonmania]

I didn't say it was only about pitching.
But it is primarily about pitching.

Every coach in America will tell you that pitching is the most important aspect of your club. Always has been, always will be.

As Yogi Berra said "Good pitching always beats good hitting - and vice-versa." :)

[maroonmania]

It feels like Nixon will sign a FA deal

Seems like we can't win for losing on the pitching side. There goes our 2024 closer. Oh well.

[basedog]

I was talking to a college head coach about having enough pitching and he made this profound statement. He said "Yeah never heard anyone say we lost a series because we didn't have enough left fielders!"

And as Earl Weaver said "If you aint got pitching you ain't got squat!"

And yes you do have to have functional offense and defense but everything in this game starts on the mound.

Gotta build a decent pitching staff, they are harder to find than the everyday players.

Hope you are doing well on your recovery!

[Commercecomet24]

Gotta build a decent pitching staff, they are harder to find than the everyday players.

Hope you are doing well on your recovery!

Amen to that! Thanks, Base, I'm doing pretty good for an old man! I'm more annoyed than anything because my doctor has me limited in what i can do! Got a cast on left arm, boot on right leg so I'm about as good as a one legged dog. Honestly I feel blessed because if I hadn't been wearing my seat belt y'all would be singing my praises in the past tense, lol! I love all y'all and the tremendous outpouring of prayers and good thoughts! Now back to the baseball rants, lol!

[basedog]

Amen to that! Thanks, Base, I'm doing pretty good for an old man! I'm more annoyed than anything because my doctor has me limited in what i can do! Got a cast on left arm, boot on right leg so I'm about as good as a one legged dog. Honestly I feel blessed because if I hadn't been wearing my seat belt y'all would be singing my praises in the past tense, lol! I love all y'all and the tremendous outpouring of prayers and good thoughts! Now back to the baseball rants, lol!

Dang, well not too much longer and hopefully the cast come off, glad one on arm is on left side. U can at least sit and throw some fast balls to someone catching***. LOL. Glad u doing better.

[Coach34]

Amen to that! Thanks, Base, I'm doing pretty good for an old man! I'm more annoyed than anything because my doctor has me limited in what i can do! Got a cast on left arm, boot on right leg so I'm about as good as a one legged dog. Honestly I feel blessed because if I hadn't been wearing my seat belt y'all would be singing my praises in the past tense, lol! I love all y'all and the tremendous outpouring of prayers and good thoughts! Now back to the baseball rants, lol!

glad to hear you are healing. Keep on keepin on

[DownwardDawg]

Amen to that! Thanks, Base, I'm doing pretty good for an old man! I'm more annoyed than anything because my doctor has me limited in what i can do! Got a cast on left arm, boot on right leg so I'm about as good as a one legged dog. Honestly I feel blessed because if I hadn't been wearing my seat belt y'all would be singing my praises in the past tense, lol! I love all y'all and the tremendous outpouring of prayers and good thoughts! Now back to the baseball rants, lol!

Great to hear. I used to have a one legged dog! This made me remember her! Great lab!

[Commercecomet24]

glad to hear you are healing. Keep on keepin on

Thanks and glad you?re on the mend to brother. Wouldn?t have been the same around here without you!

[Commercecomet24]

Great to hear. I used to have a one legged dog! This made me remember her! Great lab!

Lol thanks man!

[State82]

Well, CC24, you are probably better on one leg than most of us old guys are on 2! Keep getting better!

[the_real_MSU_is_us]

Who said "pitching is all that matters?"

What people are saying is that pitching is by far the most important part of baseball. It can be phrased differently, but that's what people are telling you. Baseball is about pitching. Nobody is telling you that it is the only part of the game that matters at all.

C34 said "Our problem has been pitching and everyone knows it". Problem, singular. That's what got me pointing out the problems on offense and defense. Then Todd said "I've seen bad hitting and fielding teams win championships", implying it doesn't matter if we get better there. Then you said "baseball is about Pitching". You can pretend you meant "Pitching is more important than offense or defense", but that's neither what you said nor what makes sense in the conversation- all I was saying is we have problems off the mound. I never said offense was more important than pitching. At no point has Cooter, C34, you, or Todd even admitted we need to improve in the areas I point out.

Do we all agree the defense was crap, the offense has unperformed our recruiting rankings, and it would be good to improve in those areas? Can we at least agree on that and quit pretending the pitching was our only flaw these past 2 seasons?

[Cooterpoot]

C34 said "Our problem has been pitching and everyone knows it". Problem, singular. That's what got me pointing out the problems on offense and defense. Then Todd said "I've seen bad hitting and fielding teams win championships", implying it doesn't matter if we get better there. Then you said "baseball is about Pitching". You can pretend you meant "Pitching is more important than offense or defense", but that's neither what you said nor what makes sense in the conversation- all I was saying is we have problems off the mound. I never said offense was more important than pitching. At no point has Cooter, C34, you, or Todd even admitted we need to improve in the areas I point out.

Do we all agree the defense was crap, the offense has unperformed our recruiting rankings, and it would be good to improve in those areas? Can we at least agree on that and quit pretending the pitching was our only flaw these past 2 seasons?

We were a middle of the pack hitting team with 3 17ing FR starting. We got rid of our big error problems. We sign Montgomery, we upgraded RF. We already upgraded 3B. Got C depth. I figure we'll be a top 5 hitting team in the SEC. Defense will be fine. Pitching? That's the 17ing major question. I can't make it any clearer for you.

[the_real_MSU_is_us]

Yes- UCLA 2013. Team BA of .250. Averaged 4.72 runs per game. Beat a team called Miss State for the title

But their team ERA of 2.55 carried them to a title

Did UCLA win it all without scoring any runs? Amazing!

You're defining every score by the pitching. Say there was a 1-0 game. You'd say "wow what great pitching, but the winning team was just a little more consistent on the mound". Say we had a 3-2 game, you'd say "the team that scored 2 runs didn't pitch as good as the winning team". Say there was a 8-7 game. You'd say "the team that scored 7 really crapped the bed on the mound" . Under no circumstances would you credit the offense of the winning team for getting the runs, just blame/credit the pitchers. Of course by that framework pitching is all that matters.

Like you look at UCLA and say "they were a bad offensive team that had a low ERA, so they won it all because of pitching. OK, so lets look at LSU: Best offense in the SEC, 6th in ERA. So they won it all behind their offense, right? I mean that's the logic you just used for UCLA. Oh no, you don't admit LSU won because of their offense? You say "LSU had some arms step up in the postseason, that's why they won". And yeah, that's true! Every team that wins it all has some dues step up, or they would have gotten beat. But guess what? UCLA had some bats step up and score runs on serious pitching, but you don't extend the same credit to them. They shelled Ross Mitchell and Holder when nobody else did, for example, yet you act like their pitchers were all that suited up

And for the record, we lost of UCLA 3-1 in game 1. 2 of UCLA's runs were unearned because of an error. Defense matters

[the_real_MSU_is_us]

We were a middle of the pack hitting team with 3 17ing FR starting. We got rid of our big error problems. We sign Montgomery, we upgraded RF. We already upgraded 3B. Got C depth. I figure we'll be a top 5 hitting team in the SEC. Defense will be fine. Pitching? That's the 17ing major question. I can't make it any clearer for you.

Is this your way of saying "the problem is fixed, shut up" but without admitting I was correct in saying we've had more problems than just pitching?

There's this BS revisionist history going on that pretends our only problem has been pitching. I'd like the truth of these past 2 seasons to be publicly agreed upon so when we suck again next year we can all agree on firing Lemo

[Leroy Jenkins]

I'd like the truth of these past 2 seasons to be publicly agreed upon so when we suck again next year we can all agree on firing Lemo


If we suck again next year he'll be fired regardless of the reason.

[the_real_MSU_is_us]

If we suck again next year he'll be fired regardless of the reason.

Watch, there will be people coming out saying "we have to give Parker time to fix this staff". Especially if Selmon is still too scared to do his job and fire someone.

Remember, 2 months ago there was a not a single personon this board saying we should gove Lemo anoyther year. C34 called Lemonis "Lemonizick" all season, and Todd at one point this year advocated for firing Lemo and making Polk the interim. Only once the AD decided to keep Lemo did they flip to saying keeping Lemo is best for the program. I get it, we don't want to say our Athletic Director p*ussied out, but he did. And we don't want to say "were sacrificing another year or 2 of the baseball team to save on buyouts", but we are. I hope I'm made to look like an idiot next year, but I don't see how I can have faith in the same coach that tanked the program.

[NWADAWG]

Did UCLA win it all without scoring any runs? Amazing!

You're defining every score by the pitching. Say there was a 1-0 game. You'd say "wow what great pitching, but the winning team was just a little more consistent on the mound". Say we had a 3-2 game, you'd say "the team that scored 2 runs didn't pitch as good as the winning team". Say there was a 8-7 game. You'd say "the team that scored 7 really crapped the bed on the mound" . Under no circumstances would you credit the offense of the winning team for getting the runs, just blame/credit the pitchers. Of course by that framework pitching is all that matters.

Like you look at UCLA and say "they were a bad offensive team that had a low ERA, so they won it all because of pitching. OK, so lets look at LSU: Best offense in the SEC, 6th in ERA. So they won it all behind their offense, right? I mean that's the logic you just used for UCLA. Oh no, you don't admit LSU won because of their offense? You say "LSU had some arms step up in the postseason, that's why they won". And yeah, that's true! Every team that wins it all has some dues step up, or they would have gotten beat. But guess what? UCLA had some bats step up and score runs on serious pitching, but you don't extend the same credit to them. They shelled Ross Mitchell and Holder when nobody else did, for example, yet you act like their pitchers were all that suited up

And for the record, we lost of UCLA 3-1 in game 1. 2 of UCLA's runs were unearned because of an error. Defense matters

Here's the way I see it:

If you were taking a test that had 9 questions. The first 8 questions make up 50% of the total grade. Question 9 made up the other 50% of the total grade. Obviously #9 has the biggest impact on your overall grade. It's true that you can't just get #9 right and still pass. It's also true that you can't get all of the other questions right and miss #9 and still pass. #9 has to be right and then you have to add enough of the other questions. The more of #'s 1-8 you get right, the closer to an A you get.

By the way, question #9 is - "Do you have pitching?"

[the_real_MSU_is_us]

Here's the way I see it:

If you were taking a test that had 9 questions. The first 8 questions make up 50% of the total grade. Question 9 made up the other 50% of the total grade. Obviously #9 has the biggest impact on your overall grade. It's true that you can't just get #9 right and still pass. It's also true that you can't get all of the other questions right and miss #9 and still pass. #9 has to be right and then you have to add enough of the other questions. The more of #'s 1-8 you get right, the closer to an A you get.

By the way, question #9 is - "Do you have pitching?"

See this is a resonable take. I've never taken issues with the idea that pitching matters most. I've taken issue with 1) people who say our only problem last year was pitching, and when i point out our other flaws they follow up with some variation of "pitching is all that matters". That's theb2nd thing I take issue with, because questions 1-8 in your analogy DO matter.

If they had said "we had problems on offense and defense last year, but pitching affects the team more than those 2 and I believe we've already fixed the offense and defense going into next year" I literally wouldn't comment. But instead, they start by saying our only flaws last year were on the mound, and when forced to admit we sucked elsewhere they say "well that doesn't matter anyway".

[BigDawg81]

Holman is visiting today. It?s time to lock him up!

[Commercecomet24]

Well, CC24, you are probably better on one leg than most of us old guys are on 2! Keep getting better!

Thanks man! Appreciate it!

[TNDawg35]

Holman is visiting today. It?s time to lock him up!

This, make him an offer he can’t refuse and then get Montegomry and we are in BIG business. But there is no way you can let him visit LSU or even TN after us…

[Cooterpoot]

This, make him an offer he can’t refuse and then get Montegomry and we are in BIG business. But there is no way you can let him visit LSU or even TN after us…

He was at TN yesterday.

[TNDawg35]

He was at TN yesterday.

That’s why I said AFTER us. Make Jim’s shut it down today and not even go to LSU…

[AlSwearengen]

That’s why I said AFTER us. Make Jim’s shut it down today and not even go to LSU…

from what i have read, we are going to have to convince him in a big way that Parker can do a better job of developing him than Johnson/Yeskie can. I don't think money is going to do it.

maybe do some negative recruiting and point out a&m's pitching struggles last year.

I'm going to be surprised if we can pull him.

[Saltydog]

from what i have read, we are going to have to convince him in a big way that Parker can do a better job of developing him than Johnson/Yeskie can. I don't think money is going to do it.

maybe do some negative recruiting and point out a&m's pitching struggles last year.

I'm going to be surprised if we can pull him.

Agreed and there's no way he's not going to visit LSU. Our chances here are not good, IMO. I'll be shocked if we land him.

[BigDawg81]

from what i have read, we are going to have to convince him in a big way that Parker can do a better job of developing him than Johnson/Yeskie can. I don't think money is going to do it.

maybe do some negative recruiting and point out a&m's pitching struggles last year.

I'm going to be surprised if we can pull him.
It?s an uphill battle. If State can?t pull Holman then Lemonis is really depending a big jump from Loo, Loftin etc and hope the incoming transfers really hit. I don?t see this ending well for Lemonis without an Ace.

[Coach34]

Money is not the top issue with Holman. So there is no "offer he cant refuse". He's looking at what MLB will pay him and which PC/School will get him there.

I think we are in 3rd behind Tenn/LSU

[the_real_MSU_is_us]

We on any other pitchers after Holman?

[bigbub50]

Purdue?s Khal Stephen RHP is another name we?re on apparently.

[Coach34]

We on any other pitchers after Holman?

I think Rosey reported we are looking at Purdue's Friday guy

[AlSwearengen]

Money is not the top issue with Holman. So there is no "offer he cant refuse". He's looking at what MLB will pay him and which PC/School will get him there.

I think we are in 3rd behind Tenn/LSU

we don't really have anything to show him other than what Parker did for the SC pitching staff which is a small sample size. I think it would take Holman really hitting it off with Parker and something making him feel at home in S'ville to pull him. But, I imagine they have interacted a good bit and I think Holman has already been to S'ville, so.

[BigDawg81]

I think Rosey reported we are looking at Purdue's Friday guy
I guess that would be Khal

[basedog]

Maybe or maybe not we get him, but IF he wasn't interested, he wouldn't make the visit. We have a shot, let's hope we can seal the deal.

[Really Clark?]

Thanks man! Appreciate it!

Thought about you today, had a Mustang Burger from Berry's

[the_real_MSU_is_us]

I think Rosey reported we are looking at Purdue's Friday guy

Meh. 5.21 ERA vs big 10 hitting. 5.1 innings per start. I'd take him but more as a Sunday guy, the Miami giy we got is probably better honestly. ACC hitters are way better than what Purdue faced

[Cooterpoot]

I think Rosey reported we are looking at Purdue's Friday guy

Would be a waste of a scholarship. He's not good. We basically have everything riding on one pitcher. Which honestly, is another recruiting blunder but here we are. Get Holman, nobody cares. If not, woof.

[BigDawg81]

Would be a waste of a scholarship. He's not good. We basically have everything riding on one pitcher. Which honestly, is another recruiting blunder but here we are. Get Holman, nobody cares. If not, woof. yep, the Purdue pitcher has over a 5 ERA.

[Mjoelner34]

Just saw Nixon FA to the Yankees.

[Saltydog]

Just saw Nixon FA to the Yankees.

We literally can't catch a break. That's a huge loss.

[BigDawg81]

We literally can't catch a break. That's a huge loss.
It was said yesterday that he was going to sign a FA deal. Big a loss in a position of need.