Braves

[msstate7]

I don't doubt that one bit. Loyalty has been one of Bobby's calling cards.

Let me ask you this...who do you think could have managed the braves to a +.500 record to this point in the season?

Considering fredi has done it, I'd say lots. I just don't think fredi is very good in close games. This team plays a ton of close games in which managerial mistakes are magnified.

[msstate7]

Moylan pitched another scoreless inning tonight.

If I were hart, I'd have moylan, carpenter, and Ryan Kelly come up tonight. Flip a coin on who goes down. Hopefully those guys can get us to vizcaino and mckirahan in July

[msstate7]

Brave poster that watched Pittsburgh's TV broadcast...

I have been watching the braves on TV for 36 yrs and last night was 1st time I have ever heard the other teams announcer's question the moves by the braves manager . they all but blamed Fredi for losing the game .and they called his decisions horrible more then once

[trob115]

People are finally waking up on Fredi. I will never be a fan of his after leaving kimbrel in the pen against the Dodgers in the playoffs.

[shoeless joe]

Considering fredi has done it, I'd say lots. I just don't think fredi is very good in close games. This team plays a ton of close games in which managerial mistakes are magnified.

So there are lots of folks that could manage a team with a +5 bullpen ERA to a record above .500????? I think you're letting your fredi hate blind you there. And for the record fredi has the team below .500.

This is so much like the Cohen debate it's almost comical. I do agree that some of his moves are head scratchers...but if the pen was halfway decent the team would be on top of the division.

[shoeless joe]

People are finally waking up on Fredi. I will never be a fan of his after leaving kimbrel in the pen against the Dodgers in the playoffs.

What about when bobby pulled kimbrel to bring in Dunn against the giants to face Aubrey huff? That move was just as egregious AND cost us that series. Then on top of that he lets Lowe talk him into leaving him in the game and that back fires. Remember bobby is in the HOF.

No I'm not saying fredi is comparable to bobby. I'm saying all managers make decisions that don't work...whoever the next guy is will as well. There is so much more than goes into managing than on field decision making, and those other parts of the job are what I question about fredi more than anything...and are the reason I wouldn't care either way if a change was made.

[msstate7]

So there are lots of folks that could manage a team with a +5 bullpen ERA to a record above .500????? I think you're letting your fredi hate blind you there. And for the record fredi has the team below .500.

This is so much like the Cohen debate it's almost comical. I do agree that some of his moves are head scratchers...but if the pen was halfway decent the team would be on top of the division.

But the pen isn't decent, so fredi has to manage it better.

Last night's questionable moves...

6th inning cunniff got first 2 batters easily, yet fredi pulls him for avilan. Avilan gives up single and hr. If it was 7th inning, I'd understand it more bc you have Johnson for 8th. By pulling cunniff in 6th, you really have no one to go to 7th.

In the 8th, fredi leaves Cahill in despite 5 hits and 3 runs. Fredi essentially gave up, but the team didn't. We scored 3 more runs.

These moves follow wed's debacle where fredi ph's for a guy that's 5 for last 6 and then leaves a total defensive liability in that cost us asap on what should've been an easy catch.

Then before that fredi really messed up the sf finale by letting Teheran hit with ff on bench and then bringing in veal. Oh and avilan wasn't available bc fredi brought in avilan on Friday with a 4-run lead for 1 out with no runners on

This is all in less than a week.

Hart seems like a smart guy, so I say there's about a 20% chance that fredi is back next season

[msstate7]

As much as I like Perez, I think we should move him to pen and call up wisler

[trob115]

As you pointed out, bobby was a great regular season manager, not postseason. Fredi hasn't demonstrated that he's capapable of either.

It seems like a routine basis Fredi is making extremely questionable decisions. I know that he's not been dealt a great hand with the bullpen, but every move is that much more important without a reliable pen , thus magnifying every decision that isn't made. I just think it's inevitable that a managerial move will be made.

[msstate7]

3-game losing streak... We desperately need Teheran to be the old Teheran tonight.

[BoomBoom]

Go back and read my post. The "decision" I'm talking about is who/whether to pinch hit with a lead. Who/whether to make a defensive replacement. Bringing in a bad pitcher in a tough spot when you have a better option would absolutely be on fredi. Which is why I questioned one such move in the San Fran series. Fredi's issue is he doesn't have any choice when it comes to the pen. Other than grilli they all suck and are inconsistent. So take your hypothetical bull shit that has nothing to do with what I was talking about somewhere else.

you don't make a pen decision assuming your bullpen is infallible, so i have no idea what you are blathering about. subbing Gomes out for a better defensive OF is either smart or dumb. everyone, except Fredi, agrees it is smart. yet here you are pissed that people criticize him for continuously repeating that mistake.

and then you say something else stupid. a bad pen can be managed into being mediocre or horrible. Fredi manages it to horrible. he DOES have a choice when it comes to the pen. he can use his closer earlier in the game, he chooses not to. he could not trot out his only leftie for a random out at the end of the 6th with no one on. he chose not to. did you see his quote after the game? something like he's "trying to find a series that works". he flat out stated he is trying to remake a flowchart, this guy in the 6th, this guy in the 7th, etc. and this isn't new, he ALWAYS tries to manage the bullpen that way. who the hell tries to manage a bullpen that way? who the hell WANTS a manager that thinks a bullpen should be managed that way?!! who the hell DEFENDS keeping a manager that wants to manage a bullpen that way?

[msstate7]

Fredi making a questionable move before the game even starts tonight. He's starting uribe at 2b. Uribe has played 2b (4 years and many lbs ago). Ciriaco had 2 hits including a double and played solid defense last night at 2b.

So we have major defensive question marks at 3b (Johnson), 2b (uribe), and lf (Gomes) for a pitcher (teheran) that's been struggling. I hope this works out, but I have major concerns

[msstate7]

10 prospects ready to play in the big leagues
http://fansided.com/2015/06/05/mlb-10-prospects-ready-play-big-leagues/

Peraza - 6th
Wisler - 2nd

[msstate7]

@mlbbowman
Right-handed reliever David Aardsma has signed a Minor League deal w/ the Braves. He'll join Triple-A Gwinnett tomorrow.

[msstate7]

Teheran hitting 93 in 1st inning. Apparently Julio's velocity problems have been him throwing 2-seamer too much.

[War Machine Dawg]

Teheran hitting 93 in 1st inning. Apparently Julio's velocity problems have been him throwing 2-seamer too much.

Whoever suggested he use a 2-seamer should be shot. He's a strikeout pitcher with power stuff. Don't reinvent the wheel. Let him be who he is.

[msstate7]

Whoever suggested he use a 2-seamer should be shot. He's a strikeout pitcher with power stuff. Don't reinvent the wheel. Let him be who he is.

Definetely looks like the old Teheran so far. Would be extremely pleased if he keeps this up

[msstate7]

Teheran looks great thru 3. If he's back, this could be a good team assuming we sure up the pen some

[msstate7]

Maybin now hitting .286 with 26 rbi's and player great defense. Is this guy finally living up to his billing as a young player?

With Maybin (28), Mallex smith (AA), and now peraza (AAA) playing cf, cf is becoming a position of strength

[msstate7]

I was ready to come on here and say that fredi did a good job tonight, but...

Teheran had sit 12 down in a row, but gave up 2 seeing eye singles with 1 out and fredi pulls him... Johnson gives up both runs. Teheran still had good velocity. It was just bad luck on balls finding holes. All of the 12 outs in a row were on the infield... Teheran could've got the DP. Oh well, let's win this

[msstate7]

@grantmcauley
I wouldn't say Julio Teheran was too happy about leaving, and now the score. #Braves

[msstate7]

Bottom 8th with runner on 1st and Gomes up. Gomes is hitting .176 against rhp. Peterson, AJ, terdo and Cunningham all available. Fox announcers questioning letting Gomes bat. Gomes k's of course

[msstate7]

Bethancourt with walk off hr. 3 hits tonight with 2 rbi's. Great night kid. Please start em tomorrow fredi

[msstate7]

?@mlbbowman
Bethancourt said Seitzer told him to look for a slider or cutter away. #Seitzed

[KB21]

I was ready to come on here and say that fredi did a good job tonight, but...

Teheran had sit 12 down in a row, but gave up 2 seeing eye singles with 1 out and fredi pulls him... Johnson gives up both runs. Teheran still had good velocity. It was just bad luck on balls finding holes. All of the 12 outs in a row were on the infield... Teheran could've got the DP. Oh well, let's win this

I agree. I think he should have left Teheran in and let him work through that. The bullpen is too much of an adventure, and Julio was only a shade over 100 pitches at that point. I think Teheran was also kind of shocked that Fredi was going to the pen in that situation.

The Braves are fortunate that Bethancourt decided to hit his first MLB HR, an opposite field shot at that, to win the game in walk off fashion. If the Braves had not scored, there is no doubt that that would have lost with them using both Grilli and Johnson by that point.

[KB21]

You know, there are times where Christian Bethancourt flashes the ability that excited the scouts when he was coming up through the system. He has never done anything consistently, but he is very athletic and has a quick bat. His career has been one where he takes a while to get adjusted to a level. This is still a 23 year old prospect at this point.

[shoeless joe]

you don't make a pen decision assuming your bullpen is infallible, so i have no idea what you are blathering about. subbing Gomes out for a better defensive OF is either smart or dumb. everyone, except Fredi, agrees it is smart. yet here you are pissed that people criticize him for continuously repeating that mistake.

and then you say something else stupid. a bad pen can be managed into being mediocre or horrible. Fredi manages it to horrible. he DOES have a choice when it comes to the pen. he can use his closer earlier in the game, he chooses not to. he could not trot out his only leftie for a random out at the end of the 6th with no one on. he chose not to. did you see his quote after the game? something like he's "trying to find a series that works". he flat out stated he is trying to remake a flowchart, this guy in the 6th, this guy in the 7th, etc. and this isn't new, he ALWAYS tries to manage the bullpen that way. who the hell tries to manage a bullpen that way? who the hell WANTS a manager that thinks a bullpen should be managed that way?!! who the hell DEFENDS keeping a manager that wants to manage a bullpen that way?

Not real sure what you're even saying other than you think fredi sucks. I'm not going to defend fredi, although I've somehow been labeled as his defender, I will say that he has only 1 reliable option in the pen. I will also say that I've heard folks complain about him over using pen guys early, and now people bitch when he mixes it up. So I've come to this conclusion...folks who want fredi gone are going to pick apart every decision even when it's not ultimately on him...which is the case with the pen. AGAIN I will say that I don't think a change would be a bad thing IF a better replacement is lined up, but let's only blame fredi for what's on him. A shittastic bullpen with no good option to get consistent 7th-8th inning outs isn't on him.

Don't be a blind follower...

[msstate7]

Banuelos tonight...
7.0 ip 3 h 0 er 3 bb 7 k

He hasn't given up more than 1 er in his last 7 starts. With him on an innings limit, should we call him up to pitch out of the pen?

[KB21]

Banuelos tonight...
7.0 ip 3 h 0 er 3 bb 7 k

He hasn't given up more than 1 er in his last 7 starts. With him on an innings limit, should we call him up to pitch out of the pen?

I wouldn't. I would let him continue to start at AAA and shut him down when he hits his innings limit. Let him compete for the 5th starter's spot in spring training next year or try to convert him into a lefty reliever.

Right now, going into next season, I think Shelby Miller, Julio Teheran, Mike Foltynewicz, and Alex Wood are givens. Manny Banuelos, Matt Wisler, and Williams Perez are the main guys for the 5th spot. Of course, Mike Minor will be back if he isn't traded this off season.

[msstate7]

@BravesReddit
Manny Banuelos moved to 5-0 after a 7IP 3H 3BB 7K performance. He's given up 4 ER in his last 7 starts combined.

[msstate7]

@BravesReddit
Manny Banuelos (@ManBanuelos) last 7 starts: 4-0 0.92 ERA, 1.144 WHIP.

[msstate7]

I wouldn't. I would let him continue to start at AAA and shut him down when he hits his innings limit. Let him compete for the 5th starter's spot in spring training next year or try to convert him into a lefty reliever.

Right now, going into next season, I think Shelby Miller, Julio Teheran, Mike Foltynewicz, and Alex Wood are givens. Manny Banuelos, Matt Wisler, and Williams Perez are the main guys for the 5th spot. Of course, Mike Minor will be back if he isn't traded this off season.

That 5th starter battle will be very interesting next season. Our staff could be very, very good next season.


Oh and I wouldn't say folty is a lock. Folty could end up in pen. Not sure if fried will be ready to go by ST or not, but he could be a factor. Ready to see where Jenkins is by then too

[BoomBoom]

Not real sure what you're even saying other than you think fredi sucks. I'm not going to defend fredi, although I've somehow been labeled as his defender, I will say that he has only 1 reliable option in the pen. I will also say that I've heard folks complain about him over using pen guys early, and now people bitch when he mixes it up. So I've come to this conclusion...folks who want fredi gone are going to pick apart every decision even when it's not ultimately on him...which is the case with the pen. AGAIN I will say that I don't think a change would be a bad thing IF a better replacement is lined up, but let's only blame fredi for what's on him. A shittastic bullpen with no good option to get consistent 7th-8th inning outs isn't on him.

Don't be a blind follower...

I've praised Fredi for his personnel managment for years, while criticizing his bullpen management. he is who he is, so i don't know why you feel compelled to defend his horrible bullpen management. good bullpen or bad bullpen, he makes horrible bullpen management decisions. your compulsion to pass off his horrible decisions as the fault of a bad pen is just poor analysis. it's more obvious now that he doesn't have an ace bullpen to cover for his poor matchup decisions, but he has always made these mistakes.

but please, explain to me why a 'shitastic bullpen' can afford to hold its closer until the 9th in ALL cases. or can afford to blow its only leftie in the 6th inning with 2 outs and no one on. i'm anxious to hear why those decisions are the fault of the bullpen, and not the manager.

[msstate7]

Need a big game from wood today to get back to .500. Would love to see bethancourt build on last night. I'm really hoping he can hit enough to take over catching

[shoeless joe]

I've praised Fredi for his personnel managment for years, while criticizing his bullpen management. he is who he is, so i don't know why you feel compelled to defend his horrible bullpen management. good bullpen or bad bullpen, he makes horrible bullpen management decisions. your compulsion to pass off his horrible decisions as the fault of a bad pen is just poor analysis. it's more obvious now that he doesn't have an ace bullpen to cover for his poor matchup decisions, but he has always made these mistakes.

but please, explain to me why a 'shitastic bullpen' can afford to hold its closer until the 9th in ALL cases. or can afford to blow its only leftie in the 6th inning with 2 outs and no one on. i'm anxious to hear why those decisions are the fault of the bullpen, and not the manager.

I've never said his decisions weren't bad. My point has always been that all managers make decisions that are questionable...if the players make the plays then it's seen as a good move but when everyone that's brought in sucks it's easy to question those moves. I also agree that his timing of when certain guys are used can raise some eyebrows. I do disagree about using the closer early, in this instance, because who would he bring in later? Grilli literally is the only guy that is reliable to do his job.

So once again...even with Fredi's poor decision making this year a good pen would have this team in 1st place. That is a fact. That's my point. I have no hidden agenda. I've been clear since about halfway thru last season how I've felt. When fredi makes a stupid move THAT COSTS A WIN I've criticized him...but when the pen can't hold a 3-4 run lead no matter who he runs out there then I don't see how that's on him.

I'll ask you the same question I asked earlier...what manager would have a team above .500 with a +5 bullpen ERA?

[msstate7]

http://m.braves.mlb.com/news/article/129004100/braves-sign-david-aardsma-to-minor-league-deal

How different will this bullpen look in a week? Could see aardsma, carpenter (old one), and moylan.

How different will it be this time next month? Mckirahan and vizcaino set to return. Read on Braves' board that both are looking very good in extended spring training. Ryan Kelly and carpenter (young one) could be called up by then also.

I think we're gonna figure this pen out. Certainly not predicting a shut you completely down after 6 type, but certainly better than this 5+ era

[msstate7]

12:29 PM
@Braves
Kelly Johnson is set to begin an injury rehabilitation assignment on Monday, June 8, @GwinnettBraves

[msstate7]

12:49 PM
?@ChrisCotillo
Source: #Braves signing Dana Eveland. Likely minor-league deal.

Braves To Sign Dana Eveland
http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2015/06/braves-to-sign-dana-eveland.html

[msstate7]

@KevinMcAlpin
Down on the Farm: Since allowing 9 ER in 5.2 IP on 5/1, @TyrellJenkins14 has posted a 1.42 ERA in his last 6 GS (6 ER/38 IP) w/the @mbraves

[msstate7]

Wood is a good pitcher, but he lost some respect from me today. Their pitcher plunks our best 2 players (ff and Simmons) and how does wood respond? By walking him. It's 1 out and no one on... Throw your best fastball and hit him in the hip. Grow a pair Alex

[msstate7]

Then after cole almost hits Peterson, we still do nothing Coles next ab. We're a very soft team

[msstate7]

3:23 PM
gondeee ?@gondeee 13m13 minutes ago
Under Bobby Cox, Wood never would have gotten tossed, because Cox would have interceded long before that & gotten run. C'mon Fredi!

[msstate7]

Really pissed we didn't start bethancourt today. AJ hasn't got around on cole's fastball yet today. They've stole on him and he had an awful at bat after a leadoff double. 0-3

Bethancourt certainly isn't a slugger, but he had a great night last night and certainly has the bat speed to catch up to cole's fastball.

[msstate7]

Fredi did call for the bean on mccutchen, but of course cunniff missed him. I can't help but laugh

[msstate7]

Really pissed we didn't start bethancourt today. AJ hasn't got around on cole's fastball yet today. They've stole on him and he had an awful at bat after a leadoff double. 0-3

Bethancourt certainly isn't a slugger, but he had a great night last night and certainly has the bat speed to catch up to cole's fastball.

0-4 and hasn't even made good contact all day. Way to give your young catcher some confidence, fredi. Sit him after a 3-4 with 2 rbi's including a gw hr... Smh

[msstate7]

Aardsma K's 2 in a perfect 9th for Gwinnett

[msstate7]

Tough day today. There was a bright spot though. The bullpen pitched 4 scoreless innings and cunniff pitched 2 perfect innings with 2 k's.

Oh and cole is the best opposing pitcher I've seen this year. He was having control problems, but his stuff is top notch. Still wish wood wouldve hit him for getting ff and Simmons.

[KB21]

Tough day today. There was a bright spot though. The bullpen pitched 4 scoreless innings and cunniff pitched 2 perfect innings with 2 k's.

Oh and cole is the best opposing pitcher I've seen this year. He was having control problems, but his stuff is top notch. Still wish wood wouldve hit him for getting ff and Simmons.

I felt like the strike zone was not consistent for each pitcher. Wood was getting squeezed, and the ump seemed to widen Cole's strike zone considering that he didn't have great command today.

[KB21]

I'll also add this. Bobby Cox would have never let his pitcher get tossed. HE would have gotten tossed before his pitcher does. This is my biggest criticism of Fredi. He sits on his hands too much and doesn't protect his players. This is why players would run through a brick wall for Bobby. They know he is there for them.

Fredi says he didn't know the conversation had gotten heated. Well, Fredi. It's your job to know this. You have to have a finger on the pulse of the situation. Too often, Fredi has sat by and done nothing while his players are left to take the fall.

[Schultzy]

Since this thread has 16 thousand hits il add that I miss the old Dale Murphy, Bob Horner, Biff Pocaroba, Jerry Royster days.

I went to the NBC game of the week one Saturday BRaves hosting the Reds with Vin Scully and Joe Garagiola on hand for play by play.

Dave Parker hit a HR for the Reds and Pete Rose went 0 for 5 with five ground outs to the 2nd baseman, but I got to see him play. Dale Murphy hit a double off the roc field wall for an rbi.

Must've been 1985 or so.

[msstate7]

Since this thread has 16 thousand hits il add that I miss the old Dale Murphy, Bob Horner, Biff Pocaroba, Jerry Royster days.

I went to the NBC game of the week one Saturday BRaves hosting the Reds with Vin Scully and Joe Garagiola on hand for play by play.

Dave Parker hit a HR for the Reds and Pete Rose went 0 for 5 with five ground outs to the 2nd baseman, but I got to see him play. Dale Murphy hit a double off the roc field wall for an rbi.

Must've been 1985 or so.

I grew up watching those teams in the 80s and loved watching them play. This year's team is very fun to watch... Well until we have a late lead and we're depending on our bullpen

[BoomBoom]

I've never said his decisions weren't bad. My point has always been that all managers make decisions that are questionable...if the players make the plays then it's seen as a good move but when everyone that's brought in sucks it's easy to question those moves. I also agree that his timing of when certain guys are used can raise some eyebrows. I do disagree about using the closer early, in this instance, because who would he bring in later? Grilli literally is the only guy that is reliable to do his job.

So once again...even with Fredi's poor decision making this year a good pen would have this team in 1st place. That is a fact. That's my point. I have no hidden agenda. I've been clear since about halfway thru last season how I've felt. When fredi makes a stupid move THAT COSTS A WIN I've criticized him...but when the pen can't hold a 3-4 run lead no matter who he runs out there then I don't see how that's on him.

I'll ask you the same question I asked earlier...what manager would have a team above .500 with a +5 bullpen ERA?

yes, with a better pen they'd be above .500........they've done that in past years. and then blown it when it counted because their manager doesn't know how to take advantage of matchups.

yes, all managers make questionable decisions, and often get criticized either way. but SOME managers make decisions beyond that, unquestionably stupid moves. and when a manager is that bad, there's always those out there covering for them. He is the BJ Upton of managers, you're only embarrassing yourself by defending him.

and oh, you disagree about using the closer early. so you just have no idea how a bullpen is supposed to be managed. figures. explains everything.

[shoeless joe]

yes, with a better pen they'd be above .500........they've done that in past years. and then blown it when it counted because their manager doesn't know how to take advantage of matchups.

yes, all managers make questionable decisions, and often get criticized either way. but SOME managers make decisions beyond that, unquestionably stupid moves. and when a manager is that bad, there's always those out there covering for them. He is the BJ Upton of managers, you're only embarrassing yourself by defending him.

and oh, you disagree about using the closer early. so you just have no idea how a bullpen is supposed to be managed. figures. explains everything.

You say I am defending him, when I'm really ONLY defending his actions in regards to the pen...nothing else. And I'm really not defending him as much as I'm being realistic with placing blame. You have your mind made up on what you think and have a response ready without even reading my posts. I disagree a good bit with mstate7 but he typically has an informed, and sometimes emotional, response that brings pertinent information to the discussion. I would enjoy a good back and forth if you could do the same.

As far as how a bullpen is supposed to work:
Successful pens have sevrefal thing in common....defined roles being tops on the list. Also, having guys that can get any hitter out L or R. A situational lefty that can consistently retire righty''s can solidify any pen; a la venters, o'flaherty, or even one of the best the braves ever had at that in remlinger. And of course a solid closer is needed... Closer by committee never works long term. And even with that type set up one thing HAS to happen to ensure long term success: starters have to eat up innings and get outs. If the pen is covering 4 innings a nite then it's eventually going to wear down. I will be interested in your examples of a closer that comes in in the 6th or 7th

And for the thousandth time...I think there are a myriad of things to complain about when it comes to fredi, even his use of pitchers in previous years and post season. But this year the bullpen is not on him. He hasn't walked one hitter or hunt one slider all year...but yet they occurr every inning, it seems, when he goes to the pen for someone other than grilli. And even he had given up more runs than would be prefered.

[msstate7]

Cunniff's last 3 appearances...

Vs Arizona = 0.2 ip 0 h 0 bb 0 er 2 k
Vs Pitt = 0.2 ip 0 h 0 bb 0 er 1 k
Vs Pitt = 2.0 ip 0 h 0 bb 0 er 2 k

Maybe this kid is coming on.

I really think we'll see aardsma and moylan get promoted within the week. Who do you think gets sent down/cut?

[msstate7]

@DOBrienAJC
#Braves released LH Donnie Veal, who was DFA'd last week

Triple-A #Braves activated newly acquired LH Dana Eveland, and Kelly Johnson begins rehab assignment at Gwinnett tonight.

[BoomBoom]

You say I am defending him, when I'm really ONLY defending his actions in regards to the pen...nothing else. And I'm really not defending him as much as I'm being realistic with placing blame. You have your mind made up on what you think and have a response ready without even reading my posts. I disagree a good bit with mstate7 but he typically has an informed, and sometimes emotional, response that brings pertinent information to the discussion. I would enjoy a good back and forth if you could do the same.

As far as how a bullpen is supposed to work:
Successful pens have sevrefal thing in common....defined roles being tops on the list. Also, having guys that can get any hitter out L or R. A situational lefty that can consistently retire righty''s can solidify any pen; a la venters, o'flaherty, or even one of the best the braves ever had at that in remlinger. And of course a solid closer is needed... Closer by committee never works long term. And even with that type set up one thing HAS to happen to ensure long term success: starters have to eat up innings and get outs. If the pen is covering 4 innings a nite then it's eventually going to wear down. I will be interested in your examples of a closer that comes in in the 6th or 7th

And for the thousandth time...I think there are a myriad of things to complain about when it comes to fredi, even his use of pitchers in previous years and post season. But this year the bullpen is not on him. He hasn't walked one hitter or hunt one slider all year...but yet they occurr every inning, it seems, when he goes to the pen for someone other than grilli. And even he had given up more runs than would be prefered.

I don't disagree with anything in your 2nd paragraph. But you went full retard in the 3rd. let's put it this way: managing the lineup and pen for good matchups is not dependent on resultant small sample size results. "it worked out" isn't a defense for bad managing, nor is "they all suck anyway". managing into a bad matchup is bad management, regardless of results. you don't seem to agree with that, and i have no idea why. you sound like a Croom defender saying that if players just made their blocks then the offense would work. bad management makes it HARDER for players to produce.

the "results" argument also ignores confidence and projection. putting players into poor matchups leads to poor results, which can hurt their confidence and cause overall poorer performance. as to projection, either Fredi or the entire team has a weird mix of ignoring recent results based on past performance (see Avilan last year), or ignoring past results and expected talent level for short term good results (often against inferior opposition) (see Cody Martin or Sugar Ray Merrimon). it's weird to be wrong on BOTH sides of that issue at the same time.

also, it's great to have a lefty that can get out righties, or so forth, but just wishing for that doesn't make it so. when you don't have guys that can do that, don't manage as if you have guys that can do that! that aint rocket science, but you seem to object to calling it bad management.

while the sabermetrics would say to occaisionally use a closer in the 6th, very few managers would do it as that part of the order (or the meat of the order if that's not up in the 6th) is guaranteed to come up again. that applies a little in the 7th too, but in some situations (say 2 outs, bases loaded, #1-3 hitter up) it would be preferrable, as the closer could close that inning and pitch the next, then someone else could face the bottom of the order in the 9th. maybe your closer blows the game, or maybe your other guy blows it in a much more favorable situation for him in the 9th. either way, it's the better matchup, which is the entire point of managing.

[Really Clark?]

Nice first pick. Very high upside LHP. Maybe we can get him signed.

[msstate7]

Nice first pick. Very high upside LHP. Maybe we can get him signed.

Saw this on Braves' board. Not sure if true, but poster usually knows what he's talking about...


Said he only gave his medical and only visited with atlanta. Was either atlanta or he was going to college. Said he's been throwing for weeks and looks great. Up to him when he makes it but thinks he's gonna go quickly. Said his back injury is the only reason he fell to Atl.

[msstate7]

Miller pulled with 95 pitches. Hope we don't regret not letting him pitch 8th. Questionable call, but CJ got hit

[msstate7]

Miller pulled with 95 pitches. Hope we don't regret not letting him pitch 8th. Questionable call, but CJ got hit

Here we go...

Sd with leadoff double on Johnson. This after 1st 2 were on base in 7th. Fredi shunned the bunt and double play.

[msstate7]

Here we go...

Sd with leadoff double on Johnson. This after 1st 2 were on base in 7th. Fredi shunned the bunt and double play.

Padres only plate 1. Need to score here

[msstate7]

Blown save by grilli. INCREDIBLELY stupid to not bunt in the bottom of the 7th with 1st 2 on and Maybin up. Get that bunt down and ff is up with 2nd and 3rd with 1 out. Fredi is just dumb

[msstate7]

I just can't believe fredi did these 2 moves...

1. Not letting miller go out for 8th

2. Not bunting with Maybin. If you bunt and they walk ff, so what? It's bases loaded with 1 out for markakis.

Miller was cruising. Fredi just thinks Johnson and grilli are lock down. Hey fredi, they aren't! Miller was the best option. Get grilli out there with 2-run lead bc he seems to give up 1 every appearance.

Yeah, I'm pissed at fredi again

[shoeless joe]

I just can't believe fredi did these 2 moves...

1. Not letting miller go out for 8th

2. Not bunting with Maybin. If you bunt and they walk ff, so what? It's bases loaded with 1 out for markakis.

Miller was cruising. Fredi just thinks Johnson and grilli are lock down. Hey fredi, they aren't! Miller was the best option. Get grilli out there with 2-run lead bc he seems to give up 1 every appearance.

Yeah, I'm pissed at fredi again

I got off the lake just in time to turn on the tv and see grilli throw the ball into center. I then got on here to see what fredi did wrong.

Based on what you're saying I would be pissed If I was miller. Knowing the struggles of the pen you gotta let your horse do his thing.

[msstate7]

I got off the lake just in time to turn on the tv and see grilli throw the ball into center. I then got on here to see what fredi did wrong.

Based on what you're saying I would be pissed If I was miller. Knowing the struggles of the pen you gotta let your horse do his thing.

Miller had 95 pitches and was rolling. No excuse to pull him for our pen. No excuse

[msstate7]

I got off the lake just in time to turn on the tv and see grilli throw the ball into center. I then got on here to see what fredi did wrong.

Based on what you're saying I would be pissed If I was miller. Knowing the struggles of the pen you gotta let your horse do his thing.

Haha.., you know I'll keep you posted on fredi.

[msstate7]

We've given up with Martin in the game. We'll see Kimbrel get the save and bj scored the tying run.

Cody Martin shouldn't be anywhere near an mlb team

[msstate7]

We've given up with Martin in the game. We'll see Kimbrel get the save and bj scored the tying run.

Cody Martin shouldn't be anywhere near an mlb team

Told ya. I've watched this team enough to know. Running Martin in the game should be a firable offense

[BoomBoom]

Miller had 95 pitches and was rolling. No excuse to pull him for our pen. No excuse

Flow chart Fredi strikes again. The sad thing is how predictable it is. Every season, no matter the personnel, he makes that move. No idea what he is doing.

[msstate7]

10:49 PM
@KevinMcAlpin
Cody Martin posted a 1.54 ERA (2 ER/11.2 IP) w/14 K over his first 10 appearances.

In 11 appearances since, 9.90 ERA (11 ER/10 IP) w/10 K

[msstate7]

If hart doesn't have Martin in Gwinnett tomorrow, im losing faith in him or either hart is purposely giving fredi rope to hang himself. Martin vs jup and kemp is just ridiculously stupid. Avilan is better option and to hell with righty lefty

[msstate7]

Moylan, aardsma, Ryan Kelly, and David carpenter are all better options than Cody Martin.

I'm willing to give cunniff and masset a few more opportunities, but Martin has to go and he has to go now

[msstate7]

Minter had Tommy John surgery

http://www.theeagle.com/aggie_sports/baseball/minter-to-have-tommy-john-surgery/article_cac8e0fa-c91d-11e4-8368-5320f18770d9.html

We love us some TJ arms

[BoomBoom]

Minter had Tommy John surgery

http://www.theeagle.com/aggie_sports/baseball/minter-to-have-tommy-john-surgery/article_cac8e0fa-c91d-11e4-8368-5320f18770d9.html

We love us some TJ arms

Strange pick. He was projected in like the 12th round.

[msstate7]

Strange pick. He was projected in like the 12th round.
Watching our pen must have put hart in full panic mode.

[msstate7]

@mlbbowman
Aardsma is set to become the 17th different reliever the #Braves have used this season. They used 15 relievers last year

Cody Martin gone.

[msstate7]

I'll go ahead and get started early today. Fredi is starting Gomes vs shields (rhp). Gomes numbers vs rhp...
.164 avg .197 obp

And then there's Gomes' defense. Give terdo a shot, fredi.

My prediction = 0-4 with 3 k's

[msstate7]

David O'Brien ?@DOBrienAJC 47m47 minutes ago
This is a sobering stat: #Braves have lost 7 games when leading after 6 innings. SEVEN.

[msstate7]

Top of the 2nd...

Double into left field corner by Padres scores runner from 1st. Gomes took forever to get to ball and then crashed into wall before he got the ball to cut off man. Padres score 1-0. Gomes already coming into play

[msstate7]

Another ball hit to left that Gomes can't get to. 3-0

[msstate7]

Gomes strikes out on ball that landed 2 foot in front of home plate with runner at 2b. Hey shoeless, come tell me how smart fredi is for doing things like starting Gomes vs a good rhp

[msstate7]

Gomes can't get to easy flyball. For those keeping score, that's 3 of the 4 Padres' runs that are directly attributed to Gomes' little league range. Way to be a complete f'n idiot, fredi

[msstate7]

Gomes with some redemption. Rbi single to tie it.

Still think gomes' defense is way to questionable to start him esp vs rhp, but he got a big hit. Good for him

[shoeless joe]

Gomes strikes out on ball that landed 2 foot in front of home plate with runner at 2b. Hey shoeless, come tell me how smart fredi is for doing things like starting Gomes vs a good rhp

Haven't watched a pitch tonite...just got back from our game.

Keep in mind my "defending", if you want to call it that, of fredi is based on the suckiness of the pen. I have admitted numerous times that his thought process in games is head scratching.

Not once have you seen me clamoring for him to keep his job, I just feel he catches heat for some things that he shouldn't.

[msstate7]

Haven't watched a pitch tonite...just got back from our game.

Keep in mind my "defending", if you want to call it that, of fredi is based on the suckiness of the pen. I have admitted numerous times that his thought process in games is head scratching.

Not once have you seen me clamoring for him to keep his job, I just feel he catches heat for some things that he shouldn't.

You love fredi, don't you? Haha

He catches grief for plenty he deserves too

[shoeless joe]

He catches grief for plenty he deserves too

No doubt.

I used to, mid 90s thru mid 2000s, watch or listen to every single game and my point of view at that time was a lot like yours. So I respect your passion and opinion. Since I've started my coaching career I don't get to watch near as much as I used to...but it has also allowed me to see things from a different view point. And I guess it is that that causes me to come off as a "coach defender", whether it be fredi or Cohen. I understand that SOMETIMES the obvious play to the fan isn't the rite play for your players in that specific situation. I also understand that when those decisions repeatedly don't work it rests at the foot of the head man. But nobody knows their players like a coach...nobody. And that fact plays big with me.

And as I type your boy comes thru with a missile! Grilli will have a shot a redemption it would appear.

[msstate7]

No doubt.

I used to, mid 90s thru mid 2000s, watch or listen to every single game and my point of view at that time was a lot like yours. So I respect your passion and opinion. Since I've started my coaching career I don't get to watch near as much as I used to...but it has also allowed me to see things from a different view point. And I guess it is that that causes me to come off as a "coach defender", whether it be fredi or Cohen. I understand that SOMETIMES the obvious play to the fan isn't the rite play for your players in that specific situation. I also understand that when those decisions repeatedly don't work it rests at the foot of the head man. But nobody knows their players like a coach...nobody. And that fact plays big with me.

And as I type your boy comes thru with a missile! Grilli will have a shot a redemption it would appear.

As a coach, I'll let you make it for taking up for your brethren.

I called terdo though, didn't I? Haha

[msstate7]

Very nice win. 3.1 scoreless innings from 5 different pitchers. Cunniff came in and got huge out. He's had 4 straight scoreless appearances. I really like cunniff and this he should get a look at the 8th inning.

2.5 out of 1st in east

[msstate7]

12:15 AM
@KevinMcAlpin
#Braves offense has scored at least five runs in a single inning eight times this season (most in the NL)

[msstate7]

Braxton Davidson (last 10 games)...

.333 avg (11-33) 6 bb 9 k

He's now up to...
.261 avg .402 obp .777 ops 4 hr 8 doubles


Hopefully he's figuring it out

[War Machine Dawg]

KJ activated from the DL and Terdo sent back to Gwinnett.

[msstate7]

Last night with a flyball pitcher fredi plays our worst outfielder (Gomes). Today with a sinkerball pitcher, fredi starts our worst infielder (Chris Johnson). I just don't get it...

[msstate7]

5:47 PM
@CarlosACollazo
Fredi didn't give specifics, but did say there have been internal conversations of bringing up a SP prospect to help in the bullpen. #Braves

[BoomBoom]

5:47 PM
@CarlosACollazo
Fredi didn't give specifics, but did say there have been internal conversations of bringing up a SP prospect to help in the bullpen. #Braves

would probably be Buenalos, since he's on a tight innings limit this year. might as well pitch out of the pen in Atlanta rather than Gwinnett.

[BoomBoom]

5:47 PM
@CarlosACollazo
Fredi didn't give specifics, but did say there have been internal conversations of bringing up a SP prospect to help in the bullpen. #Braves

they probably planned on moving Perez to long relief and calling up Wisler. but Perez is pitching too well to do that now i guess.

[msstate7]

would probably be Buenalos, since he's on a tight innings limit this year. might as well pitch out of the pen in Atlanta rather than Gwinnett.

I wouldn't mind this move, but I'd try to hold off a week or so. Hopefully cunniff keeps pitching well and aardsma can be effective. I would love to get by without prospects till mckirahan and vizcaino return.

[msstate7]

Some other options for bullpen...

Moylan (AAA) -- 0.00 era
Eveland (AAA) -- 1.44 era
Ryan Kelly (AAA) -- 0.00 era
David carpenter (AAA) -- 0.73 era
Carlos fisher (AAA) -- 1.50 era
Ryan weber (AAA) -- 1.86 era

Does the international league have any hitters or are these guys that good?


Banuelos -- 2.11 era
Wisler -- 3.52 era

Williams Perez -- 2.78 era in Atlanta

Perez isn't going anywhere if he keeps this up

[msstate7]

9:32 AM
@Braves
Roster move: #Braves purchase the contract of LHP Dana Eveland (@DanaEveland) from @GwinnettBraves & designate Trevor Cahill for assignment

[War Machine Dawg]

9:32 AM
@Braves
Roster move: #Braves purchase the contract of LHP Dana Eveland (@DanaEveland) from @GwinnettBraves & designate Trevor Cahill for assignment

Glad we traded for Cahill.*****

[msstate7]

Glad we traded for Cahill.*****

Didn't work out, but we've won many more trades than we lost

[War Machine Dawg]

Didn't work out, but we've won many more trades than we lost

The problem is that it was a completely needless trade. We had plenty of 5th starter options available without a guy who's proven garbage. There was literally no reason to trade for any bottom of the rotation starter. Granted, we didn't really give up much of anything for him, but if we're supposed to be all-in on the youth movement, keep the marginal prospects.

[msstate7]

The problem is that it was a completely needless trade. We had plenty of 5th starter options available without a guy who's proven garbage. There was literally no reason to trade for any bottom of the rotation starter. Granted, we didn't really give up much of anything for him, but if we're supposed to be all-in on the youth movement, keep the marginal prospects.

I'm sure hart was hoping Cahill would turn it around and flip em

[War Machine Dawg]

Chris O'Dowd PED suspension is looming large. Bethancourt sucks ass, but we're probably stuck with him since there's no viable replacement in the system. His ass should be in Gwinnett tomorrow. He just blew the lead with his "great" D in the 8th. Passed ball and catcher's interference cost us 2 runs. Say what you will about our bullpen, but they should've gotten out of the inning at 4-2, 4-3 at worst.

[msstate7]

Chris O'Dowd PED suspension is looming large. Bethancourt sucks ass, but we're probably stuck with him since there's no viable replacement in the system. His ass should be in Gwinnett tomorrow. He just blew the lead with his "great" D in the 8th. Passed ball and catcher's interference cost us 2 runs. Say what you will about our bullpen, but they should've gotten out of the inning at 4-2, 4-3 at worst.

Yeah he was terrible. I hate that fredi waited till bases were loaded before bringing in eveland?!... You know the guy we just brought up today. Perfect time to break a guy in with bases loaded with 0 outs* Then fredi proceeded to burn 4 more bullpen arms over the next 4 batters. So cunniff gets stuck at the end going multiple innings on what was supposed to be his off day.

Bethancourt did make 2 dumb, dumb moves though

[msstate7]

Will Nieves is in AAA hitting around .260

[msstate7]

I can see I'm getting whiny, so I'm taking a break from the Atlanta Braves tomorrow. Bought be some miss Braves' tickets so I'm headed to pearl. Hopefully a break will calm me down soon. All roster moves are up to you guys till sat

[BoomBoom]

Yeah he was terrible. I hate that fredi waited till bases were loaded before bringing in eveland?!... You know the guy we just brought up today. Perfect time to break a guy in with bases loaded with 0 outs* Then fredi proceeded to burn 4 more bullpen arms over the next 4 batters. So cunniff gets stuck at the end going multiple innings on what was supposed to be his off day.

Bethancourt did make 2 dumb, dumb moves though

leaving the new lefty in against JUpton was amazingly dumb. if you don't want to burn your lefty there, don't bring him in! MUCH better off with a RH option against the podunk LH hitter than generic LH vs. JUpton. geez, way to not think ONE move ahead Fredi. the other manager was probably giggling the whole time.

[msstate7]

Managing the current Braves? bullpen seems to equate to attempting to consistently win Blacjack hands that consist of nothing but 7s and 8s. You might occasionally prove fortunate when holding at 16. But far too often, you?ll find yourself gambling on whether to hit on 14 or 15.

With this being said Braves manager Fredi Gonzalez has recently made some late-inning decisions that have simply enhanced the difficulty of managing this weak bullpen. The degree of difficulty has been enhance by some sub-par outings from starting pitchers. But the Braves also managed to lose Julio Teheran?s two most recent starts, arguably his two most impressive of the season.

We won?t delve into the decision to bring Donnie Veal into a Major League game, let alone a high-leverage situation, because the Braves ended up winning after he squandered a lead in San Francisco on May 31. But here?s look at some other recent late-inning decisions.

June 2: Instead of allowing Shelby Miller a chance to record the fifth inning?s final two outs with his pitch count at 100, Gonzalez called upon Cody Martin, who promptly retired the only two batters he faced. Then after the Braves produced a five-run sixth to claim a 6-4 lead, Gonzalez pinch hit for Martin with runners at second and third and two outs.

It?s understandable that you want to take advantage of the scoring opportunity and you don?t necessarily have a lot of faith in Martin, who had just been recalled from Gwinnett the previous day. But when working with a thin bullpen, do you really want to begin thinning it even further in the sixth inning?

Maybe Martin would have created the same damage that was incurred by Nick Masset and Brandon Cunniff, who combined to allow three runs before the conclusion of the seventh inning of that night?s loss. But given what exists in Atlanta?s pen, I?m not sure it is wise to begin eliminating options in the sixth inning.

June 3: Having already seen their four-run, fourth-inning lead shrink to two runs, the Braves removed Mike Foltynewicz with two outs in the sixth and then watched southpaw Luis Avilan retire left-handed hitter Ender Inciarte to end the inning. Left-handers have slashed .318/.348/.386 and right-handers have slashed .152/.235/.283 against Avilan.

But despite the fact that Avilan?s spot didn?t come up in the top of the seventh, he did not go back to the mound in the bottom half of the inning, when Arizona was due to send three right-handed sluggers ? A.J. Pollock, Paul Goldschmidt and Yasmany Tomas ? to the plate. Instead, Martin drew the assignment and promptly allowed two hits before handing the ball to Jim Johnson, who extended his recent woes in that day?s loss.

June 5 After Williams Perez lasted just five innings against the Pirates, Cunniff retired the first two batters he faced in the sixth and then handed the ball to Avilan because well you know despite what the stats say, you have to create lefty-on-lefty matchups. After once again thinning his bullpen in the sixth inning of a tied game, the Braves then watched Avilan walk left-handed hitter Gregory Polanco before allowing Starling Marte?s two-run homer.

Left-handed hitters have slashed .357/.419/.500 against Cunniff. But with two outs and none on in the sixth, it might have been wise to at least give him a chance to retire Polanco. If for no other reason, this might have allowed the Braves to avoid a two-inning appearance from Trevor Cahill, who allowed five hits and three runs in the eighth inning of that 10-8 loss to Pittsburgh.

June 6 and 11 Julio Teheran?s past two starts have been more impressive than any others he has completed this season. Yet, he has two no-decisions to show for his effort because of his inability to get through the eighth inning in a clean manner. Teheran allowed two straight one-out singles in the eighth inning of Saturday?s win over the Pirates and then watched Jim Johnson allow the two runners he inherited to score on a game-tying, two-run single.

Then on Thursday, Teheran limited the Padres to one run through seven innings before surrendering two hits and issuing a walk before exiting the eighth inning with the bases loaded.

The Braves then proceeded to go through four relievers to complete San Diego?s game-tying, three-run eighth inning, which was marred by a couple defensive blunders committed by Christian Bethancourt. This parade of relievers began with the entrance of left-hander Dana Eveland, who had been called up earlier in the day and had not pitched in the Majors since last season.

As soon as Eveland entered the game, the Padres popped Justin Upton off the bench. The Braves obviously knew Upton was available to pinch hit and would be used in this situation. But they stuck with Eveland, who threw one pitch that eluded Bethancourt and three others that missed the strike zone in the process of walking Upton.

Complicating matters on Thursday was the fact that Jim Johnson was unavailable because he had pitched each of the previous three days. So, maybe this was an instance where you were going to get burned any way you turned after giving this Atlanta bullpen the challenge of protecting a three-run lead with the bases loaded and none out in the eighth.

Gonzalez does not deserve to be blamed for all that has transpired as his bullpen has recently made a habit of squandering late-inning leads. He did not leave J.R. Graham unprotected in the Rule 5 Draft and he didn?t decide to deal David Hale for two catchers, who at this point have to be deemed disappointments. Nor did he give Arodys Vizcaino or Andrew McKirahan the performance-enhancing substances that led to their respective 80-game suspensions.

Gonzalez certainly wasn?t dealt a good hand with this year?s bullpen. But as things have gone bust far too often recently, you have to question the timing of when he has opted to hit on 16.

http://markbowman.mlblogs.com/2015/06/12/late-inning-decisions-have-enhanced-the-difficulty-of-managing-atlantas-bullpen/

[msstate7]

Peraza better learn cf bc Peterson isn't giving up 2b. He's hitting great and rated the 3rd best defensive 2b in mlb. If we think Mallex can man cf, it may be time to shop peraza for a 3b, lf, or catcher

[msstate7]

Time to send folty down. He's just been terrible lately.

@BravesReddit
So, since his 5/12 Foltynewicz has a 5.71 ERA & 1.477 WHIP

[msstate7]

Bethancourt and Gwinnett need to be on a midnight train to Georgia (Gwinnett).

Lavarnway or Nieves are better options catching right now.

[msstate7]

Unless Thurman becomes a great player, Houston might have got the best of us on the gattis trade. We now have a serious hole at catcher and I'm not sold on folty to say the least. Gattis' bat between FF and markakis would've made us a very good offensive team. Ruiz has yet to hit well at AA, but is picking it up

[msstate7]

I think we should revisit that lucroy trade. Trade folty, Bethancourt, and peraza for lucroy and a decent prospect

[msstate7]

@grantmcauley
Only team that has scored more than #Braves' 68 R this month is #BlueJays (88 R). Atlanta is 5-8, Toronto is 11-1 (11 G win streak) in June.


Wow

[War Machine Dawg]

I think we should revisit that lucroy trade. Trade folty, Bethancourt, and peraza for lucroy and a decent prospect

Unfortunately, the Brewers have seen enough of Bethancourt that they'll never go for that. We're essentially ****ed at C with O'Dowd being suspended. Nieves stint in the majors may have been worse than Bethancourt's so far.

[msstate7]

@Braves
Roster move: Braves have optioned C Christian Bethancourt to Gwinnett and have selected contract of C Ryan Lavarnway from @GwinnettBraves

[War Machine Dawg]

Hell. Yes!

Got the BR alert on my phone. To say I'm happy is an understatement. It was one thing for Bethancourt to not hit. He never really has at any level. But he was supposed to be a defensive freak of nature, and to say he's been bad defensively is an understatement. For me, that's inexcusable. Either he was way overhyped or he's a head case. Either way, bad for us.

And I know I've gone beyond beating the dead horse, but the Gattis trade was by far the most "WTF" move of the offseason by Hart. We gutted our lineup of a legit power bat and a pretty good defensive C who the pitchers liked. And it's not like Gattis had a massive contract, either. He was basically making league minimum with club control for several years. Not to mention he didn't have nearly the amount of tread off the tires that most older C prospects have because of the time away from baseball.

[msstate7]

Hell. Yes!

Got the BR alert on my phone. To say I'm happy is an understatement. It was one thing for Bethancourt to not hit. He never really has at any level. But he was supposed to be a defensive freak of nature, and to say he's been bad defensively is an understatement. For me, that's inexcusable. Either he was way overhyped or he's a head case. Either way, bad for us.

And I know I've gone beyond beating the dead horse, but the Gattis trade was by far the most "WTF" move of the offseason by Hart. We gutted our lineup of a legit power bat and a pretty good defensive C who the pitchers liked. And it's not like Gattis had a massive contract, either. He was basically making league minimum with club control for several years. Not to mention he didn't have nearly the amount of tread off the tires that most older C prospects have because of the time away from baseball.

I'm getting worried about that trade now. We have no catcher. If we don't get weiters, we might not have a catcher next season. Ruiz is struggling in AA, although hes picking it up some. I think folty is destined to be a reliever. Thurman may or may not work out.

[msstate7]

Cunningham to Gwinnett. Sugar ray recalled

[BoomBoom]

I'm getting worried about that trade now. We have no catcher. If we don't get weiters, we might not have a catcher next season. Ruiz is struggling in AA, although hes picking it up some. I think folty is destined to be a reliever. Thurman may or may not work out.

Folty will come along. he has shown the stuff and the makeup, just has to learn. takes most SP about 2-3 years in the show to put it all together.

i love Gattis, but that was a good trade. too risky to retain him with a questionable knee and back for a rebuilding year. we've been spoiled at C for awhile, we'll have to get used to defense-first backstops again. an OF that isn't terrible offensively is a must now though.

[CadaverDawg]

Excited to say that i will be at Fenway tomorrow night for the Braves/Red Sox game. My first ever trip to Fenway. Im up here on business, and our meeting finishes up right at game time so im planning to walk over. Getting to see my favorite team (Braves) vs my favorite AL team.

Any suggestions on things to buy, eat, see, take pics of, etc at Fenway? Its somewhat spur of the moment so i havent had time to prepare really.

[msstate7]

Excited to say that i will be at Fenway tomorrow night for the Braves/Red Sox game. My first ever trip to Fenway. Im up here on business, and our meeting finishes up right at game time so im planning to walk over. Getting to see my favorite team (Braves) vs my favorite AL team.

Any suggestions on things to buy, eat, see, take pics of, etc at Fenway? Its somewhat spur of the moment so i havent had time to prepare really.

Never been go can't suggest anything, but I'm extremely jealous. Have fun

[CadaverDawg]

Never been go can't suggest anything, but I'm extremely jealous. Have fun

Ive never been to a Braves game in Atlanta, and i grew up a HUGE Bravos fan. I bet you have me beat there, ha

[msstate7]

Ive never been to a Braves game in Atlanta, and i grew up a HUGE Bravos fan. I bet you have me beat there, ha

Yeah, just never a road game... much less Fenway

[Really Clark?]

Another good outing by Perez and another nice trade for Hart when we got Uribe. His avg has gone up and made us a little better defensively. The number of moves he made and so many look very good. Just shows what a really good GM can do. Exciting to see what this team will be for a few years. Obviously there are holes to shore up but you see pieces already coming into place. Solve catcher, LF, bullpen, and 3rd with money relief coming, these things can be solved over the next 1 1/2 years to be ready for new park. And think we contend next year anyway...depending on who is the manager.

[msstate7]

Another good outing by Perez and another nice trade for Hart when we got Uribe. His avg has gone up and made us a little better defensively. The number of moves he made and so many look very good. Just shows what a really good GM can do. Exciting to see what this team will be for a few years. Obviously there are holes to shore up but you see pieces already coming into place. Solve catcher, LF, bullpen, and 3rd with money relief coming, these things can be solved over the next 1 1/2 years to be ready for new park. And think we contend next year anyway...depending on who is the manager.

I'm ready to see what toscano can do in lf. Surely he'll be assigned to a minor league team soon.

Anxious to see if mckirahan and vizcaino will be guys we can depend on going into next year. Shae Simmons will be back season. I think folty will be in the pen next season along with one of banuelos or wisler with the other being a starter.

Catcher is the biggest question mark going into next season. We really need to sign weiters

[Really Clark?]

I'm ready to see what toscano can do in lf. Surely he'll be assigned to a minor league team soon.

Anxious to see if mckirahan and vizcaino will be guys we can depend on going into next year. Shae Simmons will be back season. I think folty will be in the pen next season along with one of banuelos or wisler with the other being a starter.

Catcher is the biggest question mark going into next season. We really need to sign weiters

Toscano isn't going to be a power guy though. My main hope with him is he can be good enough defensively because I think he can be high .200-.300 type of hitter.

I agree with you a good bit but let's don't jump the gun on Folty just yet. He has had some adjustment periods at different levels and he is still about where or ahead of guys like Smoltz were for their first 70 MLB innings and some of that was in Houston. I want to see where he is at several points through his first 200-250 innings. Now I'm not saying he won't go to the pen at some point but I don't give up just year on a top of the order guy at just 70 innings.

[msstate7]

Toscano isn't going to be a power guy though. My main hope with him is he can be good enough defensively because I think he can be high .200-.300 type of hitter.

I agree with you a good bit but let's don't jump the gun on Folty just yet. He has had some adjustment periods at different levels and he is still about where or ahead of guys like Smoltz were for their first 70 MLB innings and some of that was in Houston. I want to see where he is at several points through his first 200-250 innings. Now I'm not saying he won't go to the pen at some point but I don't give up just year on a top of the order guy at just 70 innings.

I'm not giving up on folty. I do think wisler will be a better pitcher though and banuelos is a lefty so that gives him an advantage. Not sure when fried will be cleared, but he could be a 2nd half option.

[Really Clark?]

I'm not giving up on folty. I do think wisler will be a better pitcher though and banuelos is a lefty so that gives him an advantage. Not sure when fried will be cleared, but he could be a 2nd half option.

They could be. But we have to consider with who we have now and what is waiting in the wings, some will be possibly moved in deals as well. There will still be several changes in our pitching rotation and pen over the next few years. And some may go back and forth until getting into the right fit.

[msstate7]

Teheran's era continue to rise. 4.98... Will he even be in our rotation in '17? Wood and miller are probably locks. Teheran, Perez, folty, wisler, Jenkins, banuelos, Jenkins, and fried will compete for other 3 spots. I have zero confidence in Teheran right now

[smootness]

I'm not giving up on folty. I do think wisler will be a better pitcher though and banuelos is a lefty so that gives him an advantage. Not sure when fried will be cleared, but he could be a 2nd half option.

You're strange sometimes haha. Banuelos is a far more likely bet to be in next year's bullpen than Folty. Folty has proven this year that he can be a starter if he continues to get his command under control (ha).

I do worry some about Teheran, but we'll see. I think next year's rotation will be Teheran, Wood, Miller, Folty, and Wisler unless we sign a SP.

I think Banuelos and Perez are good bullpen options that you can stretch out if you need to at some point. And Jenkins will be coming on.

[Really Clark?]

Try 5.07...I don't get to watch much with my schedule. What was his velocity today. Something is off

[msstate7]

You're strange sometimes haha. Banuelos is a far more likely bet to be in next year's bullpen than Folty. Folty has proven this year that he can be a starter if he continues to get his command under control (ha).

I do worry some about Teheran, but we'll see. I think next year's rotation will be Teheran, Wood, Miller, Folty, and Wisler unless we sign a SP.

I think Banuelos and Perez are good bullpen options that you can stretch out if you need to at some point. And Jenkins will be coming on.

It's hard for me to say Perez won't be a starter when his era starting is the best we have... Yes, his era as a starter is better than miller's. Banuelos was a very highly thought of prospect at one time and he's a lefty, so I wouldn't count him out. Banuelos has performed very well this year. I ultimately think fried will be the 2nd lefty in '17.

Next season rotation...
Teheran
Miller
Perez
Wood
Wisler

Folty
Avilan
Banuelos
Simmons
Vizcaino
And some FA's in pen

In '17, I expect Jenkins and fried to be kicking in the door on our rotation

[msstate7]

Try 5.07...I don't get to watch much with my schedule. What was his velocity today. Something is off
Listening to at bat app. No idea

[Really Clark?]

You're strange sometimes haha. Banuelos is a far more likely bet to be in nehxt year's bullpen than Folty. Folty has proven this year that he can be a starter if he continues to get his command under control (ha).

I do worry some about Teheran, but we'll see. I think next year's rotation will be Teheran, Wood, Miller, Folty, and Wisler unless we sign a SP.

I think Banuelos and Perez are good bullpen options that you can stretch out if you need to at some point. And Jenkins will be coming on.

I think it's too early to say on Perez. He keeps filling up the zone like he is and let's see what kind of adjustments he makes once the hitters get a book on him. If he stays effective I can him as a solid backend rotation guy. Get his walks back down. Obviously I think the numbers look like his era will go up but if he can keep it below 4-4.2 and eat innings like he does, he has value as a starter.

[msstate7]

Dustin pedroia and Hanley Ramirez didn't play today...

Boston collects 13 hits and 6 er with only 3 k's.

Teheran is terrible

[Really Clark?]

Went back and saw the clip of the double he gave up in the 6th and it was 92 mph. Not best location but 92. Marimon is not ready. Not close yet.

Uribe creeping up on .280 avg.

[smootness]

If Perez can get his walk rate down, he could be an option. But I see him as a 4 or 5 at best, and Folty's ceiling is an ace. It just makes no sense to put Folty in the bullpen for the sake of Williams Perez.

Perez's LOB% is abnormally high right now. He has gotten himself into trouble in most of his starts and has done a good job battling out of it for the most part. But that's a risky game and is likely to start biting him soon. I'm all for giving him chances as long as he's effective, I'm just making a prediction that I don't think he's a long-term option in the rotation.

Banuelos has been very good this year, but he has trouble pitching deep into games. Unless his velocity comes back to where it was pre-TJ, I think he's more likely a bullpen option than a starter.

I feel like people are putting Folty in the pen because his stuff would certainly be nasty there. But he easily has the most potential of our young arms as a starter as well, so we have to give him every opportunity to have success there first. And again, he has shown serious flashes this year of great stuff as a starter. He's been able to pitch effectively late into games several times, and an 8.3 K/9 rate with a BB/9 rate under 3 will do just fine. He's been hit pretty hard in several starts, but I think he can figure that out and make adjustments.

[msstate7]

Williams Perez starts have been vs TB (1st place), LAD (1st place), SF (2nd place), Pitt (2nd place), SD (4th place, but 32-35), NYM (1st place), and Boston (last place). His numbers...

36.0 ip 6 er 29 k 15 bb 1.50 era

If Perez can get his walks down, he could be very good. He's already pitching very well against very good competition. Just bc a guy doesn't light up the radar gun, it doesn't mean he can't be a big time pitcher. Perez is the new medlen. I hope he stays healthy and proves you all wrong. I love this kid. Folty goes out to the mound scared to challenge hitters with overpowering stuff... Not Williams. He comes right after guys and I love it

[Really Clark?]

If Perez can get his walk rate down, he could be an option. But I see him as a 4 or 5 at best, and Folty's ceiling is an ace. It just makes no sense to put Folty in the bullpen for the sake of Williams Perez.

Perez's LOB% is abnormally high right now. He has gotten himself into trouble in most of his starts and has done a good job battling out of it for the most part. But that's a risky game and is likely to start biting him soon. I'm all for giving him chances as long as he's effective, I'm just making a prediction that I don't think he's a long-term option in the rotation.

Banuelos has been very good this year, but he has trouble pitching deep into games. Unless his velocity comes back to where it was pre-TJ, I think he's more likely a bullpen option than a starter.

I feel like people are putting Folty in the pen because his stuff would certainly be nasty there. But he easily has the most potential of our young arms as a starter as well, so we have to give him every opportunity to have success there first. And again, he has shown serious flashes this year of great stuff as a starter. He's been able to pitch effectively late into games several times, and an 8.3 K/9 rate with a BB/9 rate under 3 will do just fine. He's been hit pretty hard in several starts, but I think he can figure that out and make adjustments.

Well I didn't say anything about Folty not being a starter. I agree he has top of rotation stuff. Just has to get it under control and challenge hitters better. While I agree that Perez numbers show that his numbers will adjust up, how much is what is unknown. Against good competition he has preformed very well and again if he stays effective I think it's going to be hard to get him out of the back end. Looks like a guy with a good motion that could have a long career. Either back end or reliever. But I love a guy that competes and gives you 200 innings a year as a back end guy.

[smootness]

Williams Perez starts have been vs TB (1st place), LAD (1st place), SF (2nd place), Pitt (2nd place), SD (4th place, but 32-35), NYM (1st place), and Boston (last place). His numbers...

36.0 ip 6 er 29 k 15 bb 1.50 era

If Perez can get his walks down, he could be very good. He's already pitching very well against very good competition. Just bc a guy doesn't light up the radar gun, it doesn't mean he can't be a big time pitcher. Perez is the new medlen. I hope he stays healthy and proves you all wrong. I love this kid. Folty goes out to the mound scared to challenge hitters with overpowering stuff... Not Williams. He comes right after guys and I love it

By all means, I hope Perez proves me wrong and becomes an ace. That wouldn't bother me a bit. I like him and I like the way he pitches...just making a prediction. By the same token, I guess I hope Folty proves you wrong as well.

But Folty's issue has been that he's getting too much of the plate and has been hit hard at times, not that he's being scared or nibbling on hitters. Similarly, Perez attacks but he also walks far more than Folty does. So I don't really see your opinion of the two.

Medley showed the ability to strike guys out all through the minors. He had very good stuff. Perez really doesn't. He has a good 2-seamer, but I think guys will square him up better once they see him some.

But again, I hope all our guys prove to be studs.

[msstate7]

By all means, I hope Perez proves me wrong and becomes an ace. That wouldn't bother me a bit. I like him and I like the way he pitches...just making a prediction. By the same token, I guess I hope Folty proves you wrong as well.

But Folty's issue has been that he's getting too much of the plate and has been hit hard at times, not that he's being scared or nibbling on hitters. Similarly, Perez attacks but he also walks far more than Folty does. So I don't really see your opinion of the two.

Medley showed the ability to strike guys out all through the minors. He had very good stuff. Perez really doesn't. He has a good 2-seamer, but I think guys will square him up better once they see him some.

But again, I hope all our guys prove to be studs.

Folty goes to his secondary pitches way too much. This is why I say he's scared. Folty, you can throw it 97-99... Use that more!

[msstate7]

@DOBrienAJC
#Braves Teheran: 0-3 with an 8.10 ERA in his past 7 road starts, with 56 hits and 11 homers allowed in 36 2/3 innings.

[smootness]

Folty goes to his secondary pitches way too much. This is why I say he's scared. Folty, you can throw it 97-99... Use that more!

I think you might be right, but that's an easy fix. Sometimes that just comes with time and a realization that your stuff is good enough.

[smootness]

Teheran needs to be sent down, no doubt. I'd call up Wisler.

[msstate7]

And I don't think Perez will be a top of the rotation guy for us. I do think he could be a very solid 4-5 though. He's pitching to our strength -- infield defense. Our infield defense could be the best in mlb. If we don't replace uribe with a plus defender next season, Perez could suffer the most in our rotation

[msstate7]

I really hate we don't have a catcher to work with all these young pitchers. AJ is decent...nothing more. I wish we had a big time defensive catcher that could help these young guys take it up a notch. We have to find a catcher before next season.

[smootness]

And I don't think Perez will be a top of the rotation guy for us. I do think he could be a very solid 4-5 though. He's pitching to our strength -- infield defense. Our infield defense could be the best in mlb. If we don't replace uribe with a plus defender next season, Perez could suffer the most in our rotation

Well, if that's your opinion of Perez, I think you have to put Folty in the rotation ahead of him.

[msstate7]

Well, if that's your opinion of Perez, I think you have to put Folty in the rotation ahead of him.

At what point do results matter more than potential?

I think folty will be a very good reliever. Out of the pen, he'll become more of a fastball-curve or fastball-slider guy. I hope I'm wrong, but I like fried, wisler, and Jenkins better long term as our starters.

[BoomBoom]

Folty goes to his secondary pitches way too much. This is why I say he's scared. Folty, you can throw it 97-99... Use that more!

from what i've seen (which is less than half his starts), he isn't locating his breaking stuff for strikes, so hitters are sitting on his fastball. he needs to get Ks with his breaking stuff to be an ace, and that won't happen until he can throw it for strikes at will.

[msstate7]

@CarrollRogers
#Braves optioned RH Mike Foltynewicz to Gwinnett and recalled IF Daniel Castro from Gwinnett. Castro hitting a combined .330 in AA and AAA.

@BravesReddit
Foltynewicz last 3 starts: 0-0 15.2IP 8.04 ERA. Opponents hitting .403/.434/.667



Just guessing, but I expect a starter to called up to start Friday.

[smootness]

At what point do results matter more than potential?

I think folty will be a very good reliever. Out of the pen, he'll become more of a fastball-curve or fastball-slider guy. I hope I'm wrong, but I like fried, wisler, and Jenkins better long term as our starters.

Certainly not in their first years in the majors.

Folty would be an insane reliever. But he has better stuff than anybody else in our farm system, and it's really not that close. We would be doing a disservice to the entire organization not to see if he can reach his potential as a starter. He can be moved to the pen at any point if it doesn't work out.

But I've seen enough from him this year to believe he can absolutely get there. He has elite velocity and seems to be adding some movement to his fastball, a plus curveball that he needs to continue to command better, and a developing slider that could be plus as well.

[msstate7]

Certainly not in their first years in the majors.

Folty would be an insane reliever. But he has better stuff than anybody else in our farm system, and it's really not that close. We would be doing a disservice to the entire organization not to see if he can reach his potential as a starter. He can be moved to the pen at any point if it doesn't work out.

But I've seen enough from him this year to believe he can absolutely get there. He has elite velocity and seems to be adding some movement to his fastball, a plus curveball that he needs to continue to command better, and a developing slider that could be plus as well.

Yeah, he has great stuff. Strasburg has the best stuff of any nat too and he's what their 4th best starter. Stuff is great, but it doesn't always equate to best pitcher. I hope he's the 2nd coming of smoltz, but I think he'll come closer to Kimbrel. I think he and shae Simmons will be a very formidable back end of our staff in '16-'17

[smootness]

Yeah, he has great stuff. Strasburg has the best stuff of any nat too and he's what their 4th best starter. Stuff is great, but it doesn't always equate to best pitcher. I hope he's the 2nd coming of smoltz, but I think he'll come closer to Kimbrel. I think he and shae Simmons will be a very formidable back end of our staff in '16-'17

?

Strasburg has battled injuries, especially this year. He still gave them 3 great years in a row in his first 3 from 2012-2014, to the tune of 11.8 WAR. No one would suggest putting Strasburg in the pen.

[msstate7]

?

Strasburg has battled injuries, especially this year. He still gave them 3 great years in a row in his first 3 from 2012-2014, to the tune of 11.8 WAR. No one would suggest putting Strasburg in the pen.

Strasburg >>>> folty

And even when Strasburg was pitching well the last few years, you could argue Zimmermann, Gonzales, and fister were better even though not the same stuff. My whole point was stuff alone doesn't make great pitchers. See Juan Jamie

[smootness]

Strasburg >>>> folty

And even when Strasburg was pitching well the last few years, you could argue Zimmermann, Gonzales, and fister were better even though not the same stuff. My whole point was stuff alone doesn't make great pitchers. See Juan Jamie

The Nats have a lot of great pitchers with great stuff. Strasburg is one of them.

I'm not arguing that Folty is great right now, or that he definitely will be. I'm just arguing that he can be, and has a better chance than Perez to be, so pulling the plug on him as a starter would be premature and short-sighted.

[msstate7]

The Nats have a lot of great pitchers with great stuff. Strasburg is one of them.

I'm not arguing that Folty is great right now, or that he definitely will be. I'm just arguing that he can be, and has a better chance than Perez to be, so pulling the plug on him as a starter would be premature and short-sighted.

In no way am I saying we should pull the plug on folty starting. We should try banuelos, folty, wisler, fried, Perez, Jenkins, hursh, and winkler as starters, but not all are gonna make it here as starters. By '17, I like these 5:

Miller
Wood
Fried
Jenkins
Teheran/wisler

I just think folty will get passed. I think folty is gonna blow people away out of the pen. When they move him, I think they'll cut him down to mostly 2 pitches and tell him to just air it out on fastball (no reason to hold back pitching 1 inning)

[msstate7]

Ciriaco has played for a banged up Simmons the last 2 days and played well. He's 5-8 with 3 rbi's and 2 doubles. I think he wants to stay up

[Really Clark?]

Ciriaco has hit well. Uribe swinging it good lately. Good night for Wood and as bad as the pen has been Masset has pitched well the last 7 games he has been in. Hopefully that trend continues.

[msstate7]

Ciriaco has hit well. Uribe swinging it good lately. Good night for Wood and as bad as the pen has been Masset has pitched well the last 7 games he has been in. Hopefully that trend continues.

Masset with 7 straight scoreless appearances.

Jim Johnson with 5 straight scoreless appearances.

Hopefully we've got our 7 (Masset), 8 (Johnson), and 9 (grilli) set now. Use avilan as lh specialist and cunniff as rh specialist if needed. Aardsma still has a 0.00 era after 4 appearances.

I think this pen could be decent if vizcaino and mckirahan perform well when they return.

[Really Clark?]

Masset with 7 straight scoreless appearances.

Jim Johnson with 5 straight scoreless appearances.

Hopefully we've got our 7 (Masset), 8 (Johnson), and 9 (grilli) set now. Use avilan as lh specialist and cunniff as rh specialist if needed. Aardsma still has a 0.00 era after 4 appearances.

I think this pen could be decent if vizcaino and mckirahan perform well when they return.

Hopefully it starts to settle. Nice NL play to plate another run. Gomes with a walk, Peterson sac bunt, single by Maybin. Now if Maybin has finally figured out how to hit with his defense, Hart will have some nice choices and pieces to put together some deals.

[BoomBoom]

Yeah, he has great stuff. Strasburg has the best stuff of any nat too and he's what their 4th best starter. Stuff is great, but it doesn't always equate to best pitcher. I hope he's the 2nd coming of smoltz, but I think he'll come closer to Kimbrel. I think he and shae Simmons will be a very formidable back end of our staff in '16-'17

guys with great stuff often take longer to learn to pitch rather than throw, due to getting results all the way thru the minors just off their stuff, unlike most pitchers. think Smoltz and Clemens.

[Really Clark?]

guys with great stuff often take longer to learn to pitch rather than throw, due to getting results all the way thru the minors just off their stuff, unlike most pitchers. think Smoltz and Clemens.

Until Smoltz got to AAA for a full season in the Braves organization he didn't get by with just stuff. His stuff got him promoted but he struggled at over 5 era at AA and his initial AAA bids were horrible. As were his K/9. Now Clemens blew right through but you could say his college career took care of a bunch of that. By the time both were 22 they were established and in control. Now I'm not saying Folty can't or won't get there, I think he will but he is behind the curve I those two and after just one year they were set in the majors. As far as his first 70 MLB innings, they look similar to Smoltz and hopefully next year he sticks like Smoltz did but Smoltz did not blow through the minors blowing people away.

[msstate7]

@DOBrienAJC
#Braves Freeman to miss Thurs with R wrist sprain. Got injection tonight, says hopes to play Fri

[smootness]

I think we still need bullpen help if we really want to try to be competitive this year. The guys we have are just too volatile. Honestly, the fact that we've had several consecutive scoreless appearances out of guys like Masset just makes me worried they're about to blow up.

Vizcaino and McKirihan will certainly help. I'd like to see Banuelos come up and pitch out of the bullpen later in the year, and we have some decent minor league options we can still try out.

And I've been saying all year that I want us to go ahead and move Hursh to the pen to see what we have there. I just don't think there's any way he makes it as a starter.

[msstate7]

Grant McAuley @grantmcauley
#Braves have optioned INF Daniel Castro back to @GwinnettBraves and recalled OF Eury Perez from Gwinnett.


Still no word on tomorrow's starter

[msstate7]

DOBrienAJC
#Braves will announce Friday starter later tonight. I'd expect it to be Wisler.

[msstate7]

@BravesReddit
In his 2015 debut Arodys Vizcaino has 2 strikeouts and a groundout through 1IP. 20 pitches (15 strikes)

[msstate7]

Theres hundreds of reasons why fredi should be fired, but not taking up for his players should enough of one. Why does fredi always sit on his butt when his players are taking issue with umps?

[msstate7]

@DOBrienAJC
Wisler to start Friday for #Braves

....

I'm excited. Really like this kid. He'll be matching up with a tough pitcher (deGrom) though

[msstate7]

Anyone else excited about wisler' debut tonight? I really am. I just don't like that he's facing deGrom. deGrom won't give up much and it'll be even more pressure on wisler. Hopefully we can get a couple early runs

[Really Clark?]

Wish I could watch it but may try and catch the late broadcast. His last start was not great but prior to the that he had been very good.

[msstate7]

Wish I could watch it but may try and catch the late broadcast. His last start was not great but prior to the that he had been very good.

Saying his last start wasn't great is a huge understatement.

3.2 ip 8 h 7 er 2 bb 0 k

His previous 7 starts though...

41.1 ip 39 h 9 er 6 bb 29 k 1.95 era

*the inning count for 7 starts is low bc rain washed out 1 start after 2.0 ip

[msstate7]

?@KevinMcAlpin
Meanwhile, with Gwinnett, Mike Foltynewicz has allowed 7 ER in 3 IP. Just gave up grand slam in 3rd, his second HR allowed tonight.

[msstate7]

Wisler's first start...
8.0 ip 6 h 1 er 0 bb 2 k

Fastball around 93. Very impressive debut. Hopefully he can keep it up.

[smootness]

Boomtown, population Jace Peterson.

And Wisler was sitting 94-95 in the first. Thanks, Padres!

[msstate7]

Boomtown, population Jace Peterson.

And Wisler was sitting 94-95 in the first. Thanks, Padres!

Smoot... Are you becoming a believer in my boy, jace?

[smootness]

Smoot... Are you becoming a believer in my boy, jace?

Haha I've been a believer for a while now. I always liked him, just saw him more as an Infante-type super utility guy. I didn't know his defense was going to be this good, and he keeps hitting. I'd be fine trading Peraza now.

[msstate7]

Haha I've been a believer for a while now. I always liked him, just saw him more as an Infante-type super utility guy. I didn't know his defense was going to be this good, and he keeps hitting. I'd be fine trading Peraza now.

What I'd love to happen is peraza pick up cf, lf, 2b, and maybe backup ss. That would allow him to play very regular and keep him.

[smootness]

What I'd love to happen is peraza pick up cf, lf, 2b, and maybe backup ss. That would allow him to play very regular and keep him.

I think he has more value to us as a trade piece, especially with Albies in the system.

I'll put it this way - if all we got in return for him in a trade was a good utility guy, I'd be pretty disappointed.

[msstate7]

Wow. Probably our biggest series of the year facing one of the best pitchers in mlb with FF and our rookie pitcher gives us 8 innings of 1 run ball. What a performance!

[msstate7]

I think he has more value to us as a trade piece, especially with Albies in the system.

I'll put it this way - if all we got in return for him in a trade was a good utility guy, I'd be pretty disappointed.

Good point. LF, 3b, or catcher is what he should be cashed in for

[Really Clark?]

Sounds like as much as we critize Fredi, he made a good descesion to keep Wisler in for the 8th. His numbers look good, did he pitch that well or getting great defense?

[msstate7]

Sounds like as much as we critize Fredi, he made a good descesion to keep Wisler in for the 8th. His numbers look good, did he pitch that well or getting great defense?

Having to watch At Bat live stats, so I couldn't tell you.

[msstate7]

@Braves
.@wisler233 went 8.0 innings w/no walks. No pitcher in Atlanta franchise history (since 1966) ever went as long in his debut w/no walks.

[smootness]

Sounds like as much as we critize Fredi, he made a good descesion to keep Wisler in for the 8th. His numbers look good, did he pitch that well or getting great defense?

He pitched really, really well. Commanded all of his pitches, 10 groundball outs. It was a good decision to leave him in, but it was a no-brainer. He had thrown 75-80 pitches through 7, finished with 88. It would have been dumb to take him out.

He hit 94-95 with his fastball.

[Really Clark?]

He pitched really, really well. Commanded all of his pitches, 10 groundball outs. It was a good decision to leave him in, but it was a no-brainer. He had thrown 75-80 pitches through 7, finished with 88. It would have been dumb to take him out.

He hit 94-95 with his fastball.

Outstanding. Very low pitch count that deep. Especially for his debut. The book has been a good control guy and at 21, impressive night for him.

[War Machine Dawg]

Sounds like as much as we critize Fredi, he made a good descesion to keep Wisler in for the 8th. His numbers look good, did he pitch that well or getting great defense?

He was lights out. Almost nothing hit hard. Only needed 88 pitches to get through 8. Could've had the complete game, but I understand going with Grilli in a 1-run game in the 9th.

[BoomBoom]

I think he has more value to us as a trade piece, especially with Albies in the system.

I'll put it this way - if all we got in return for him in a trade was a good utility guy, I'd be pretty disappointed.

he has more value than you think as a CF, because then we could carry an extra OF on the bench and let Peraza be the backup SS, keeping us from having to carry some light-stick backup SS like we usually do.

Albies is 3-4 years away. maybe longer. Peraza is ready now. and we can platoon him at CF and 2B. give JP some starts at 3B too.

i'm fine with trading him if it fills a need, but i doubt we get a legit 3B or power hitter for him, so i'd rather keep him.

[msstate7]

@mbraves
Arodys Vizcaino has been transferred to @mbraves #MBraves to continue his ML rehab assignment. #Braves

[smootness]

he has more value than you think as a CF, because then we could carry an extra OF on the bench and let Peraza be the backup SS, keeping us from having to carry some light-stick backup SS like we usually do.

Albies is 3-4 years away. maybe longer. Peraza is ready now. and we can platoon him at CF and 2B. give JP some starts at 3B too.

i'm fine with trading him if it fills a need, but i doubt we get a legit 3B or power hitter for him, so i'd rather keep him.

Peraza isn't ready now, not as a CF. We don't know yet if he'll be able to play CF at all. And we now have Maybin and Mallex Smith there, so there's a logjam and somebody will have to go.

And Albies is likely 3 years away at most. I think he'll finish next year in AA with an outside chance to come up at some point in 2017. He's not some kind of long-term project.

I go with Simmons and Peterson up the middle while waiting on Albies, and I'm ok with Maybin now and Mallex as the future in CF. Peraza could be the centerpiece of a pretty good deal.

[BoomBoom]

Peraza isn't ready now, not as a CF. We don't know yet if he'll be able to play CF at all. And we now have Maybin and Mallex Smith there, so there's a logjam and somebody will have to go.

And Albies is likely 3 years away at most. I think he'll finish next year in AA with an outside chance to come up at some point in 2017. He's not some kind of long-term project.

I go with Simmons and Peterson up the middle while waiting on Albies, and I'm ok with Maybin now and Mallex as the future in CF. Peraza could be the centerpiece of a pretty good deal.

how is an 18 year old in A ball not a long term project?? it'll be 2 years before he's in AA, book it.

it's not really a logjam since there's platoon options there and JP can play 3B. and especially with Maybin only signed thru next year.

yes, if Peraza can be a centerpiece in a deal, then sure. but i doubt it. he doesn't walk and doesn't hit for any power, and those guys are never centerpieces.

[Really Clark?]

Personally I'm not sure Peraza alone would be enough to bring in what we really other than at the catcher position. But him with one of our good young arms that we are trying build a surplus of, then you have something.

Era. Although I personally think you hold him for a while longer unless someone blows your socks off with an offer. Be patient there is no rush. Staying put is sometimes the best move.

[msstate7]

Peraza, Bethancourt, and decent pitching prospect for Jonathan lucroy.

Lucroy is just what we need. He's a great, rh hitting catcher

[msstate7]

3 more hits tonight for Albies puts him THIRD in all of MiLB in hits....
He's also the THIRD youngest position player in full season ball....

[smootness]

how is an 18 year old in A ball not a long term project?? it'll be 2 years before he's in AA, book it.

it's not really a logjam since there's platoon options there and JP can play 3B. and especially with Maybin only signed thru next year.

yes, if Peraza can be a centerpiece in a deal, then sure. but i doubt it. he doesn't walk and doesn't hit for any power, and those guys are never centerpieces.

Because Albies is a different breed. He may be 18, but is absolutely killing A ball and will hit at any level. He will start next year at A+, no question, and unless he struggles there, I would predict a call-up to AA after 3-4 months.

Was Carlos Correa a long-term project when he was 18 in A-ball? Because he was there in 2013; it's now June of 2015 and he's starting at SS for the first-place Astros.

Peraza would not be great value at 3B. His defense might not carry as well there, and suddenly he would not be great offensively at the position.

[smootness]

Peraza, Bethancourt, and decent pitching prospect for Jonathan lucroy.

Lucroy is just what we need. He's a great, rh hitting catcher

That wouldn't get us Lucroy.

[msstate7]

That wouldn't get us Lucroy.

According to how "decent" the pitching prospect is. If "decent" is hursh, then no. If "decent" is Teheran, then it would get lucroy.

[cbrunt29]

Braves win 6-4. First series win in nearly a month.

[msstate7]

Bravo Braves. With FF out and using rookie SP's on back-to-back nights, the Braves take 1st 2 from what was the 1st place mets. This was our first series win in like a month. Hopefully Teheran can bounce back and complete the sweep tomorrow

[BoomBoom]

Because Albies is a different breed. He may be 18, but is absolutely killing A ball and will hit at any level. He will start next year at A+, no question, and unless he struggles there, I would predict a call-up to AA after 3-4 months.

Was Carlos Correa a long-term project when he was 18 in A-ball? Because he was there in 2013; it's now June of 2015 and he's starting at SS for the first-place Astros.

Peraza would not be great value at 3B. His defense might not carry as well there, and suddenly he would not be great offensively at the position.

Peraza aint in Correa's league. and i didn't say put Peraza at 3B some, I said Peterson.

[msstate7]

Ken_Rosenthal
Source: #Braves acquire RHP Touki Toussaint from #DBacks. Rest of trade not know. DBacks? No. 5 prospect, per Baseball America.

[msstate7]

11:45 PM
@DOBrienAJC
#Braves traded Gosselin for #Dbacks RH Bronson Arroyo and #Dbacks RH prospect Touki Toussaint, No. 16 pick in draft @Ken_Rosenthal had 1st

[msstate7]

@grantmcauley
Bronson Arroyo threw a bullpen session back on 6/2. No timetable for return yet, but expected back around the All-Star break. #Braves

[smootness]

Peraza aint in Correa's league. and i didn't say put Peraza at 3B some, I said Peterson.

I was comparing Correa to Albies. Allies may not be Correa, but he has a chance to similarly blow through the minors.

And sorry, Jose Peraza is a JP, too.

[smootness]

11:45 PM
@DOBrienAJC
#Braves traded Gosselin for #Dbacks RH Bronson Arroyo and #Dbacks RH prospect Touki Toussaint, No. 16 pick in draft @Ken_Rosenthal had 1st

This is amazing. Seriously unbelievable. The D-Backs are really, really stupid. We just did unspeakable things to them in this deal.

[KB21]

Wow! The Braves got Touki Touissant just to take on Bronson Arroyo's contract! Holy cow! Suddenly, pitching has become a strength in the system. Braves now have 5 top 100 prospects.

[smootness]

I'm seriously speechless over this deal. The Braves, in the last 3 weeks, have added probably the two HS pitchers with the most upside over the last two cycles and now have SEVEN former 1st round pitchers who are 24 or younger in the system.

The last 7 months have seen us add the following:
Shelby Miller
Cameron Maybin
Jace Peterson
Mike Foltynewicz
Matt Wisler
Manny Banuelos
Max Fried
Rio Ruiz
Mallex Smith
Dustin Peterson
Tyrell Jenkins
Ricardo Sanchez
Touki Touissant
Kolby Allard
Mike Soroka
Austin Riley

That is flat out ridiculous.

[msstate7]

Speaking of Sanchez... He's given up 1 er in his last 14 ip. Dropping his era from 8.79 to 4.76. Hopefully this kid is figuring it out.

[Todd4State]

11:45 PM
@DOBrienAJC
#Braves traded Gosselin for #Dbacks RH Bronson Arroyo and #Dbacks RH prospect Touki Toussaint, No. 16 pick in draft @Ken_Rosenthal had 1st

I can tell you right now that is going to go down as one of the worst trades in MLB history for the Diamondbacks.

[trob115]

So were the Dbacks just in a giving mood? We didn't give up anything and got back a prospect with huge upside.

[Really Clark?]

So were the Dbacks just in a giving mood? We didn't give up anything and got back a prospect with huge upside.

The kicker was the $10.1 MIL in salary we took on. They had to give us a good bit back in return for taking that on. Hart still fleeced them pretty well.

[War Machine Dawg]

Love getting Toussaint, but I don't see why we'd want Arroyo. Aging pitcher coming off TJ who's never been much more than league average. If we put him in the rotation, he's taking the spot of a young kid. Honestly, our rotation is dealing outside of Teheran. And when you look at the numbers, he's mostly been bad on the road. I'd attribute a lot of that to trying to throw the damn 2-seamer more. He's looked a lot better since going back to the way he pitched last year.

Unless it was really early in his career, I don't ever remember Arroyo coming out of the pen. Plus I think he'd probably fit best in a long relief, spot starter role. And once again, I see the same problem sticking him in the pen that we have sticking him in the rotation: He'd be taking the spot of a young pitcher who could use the development. Frankly, I'd rather call up Banuelos to use out of the pen. But it's been so bad, I guess we're willing to take a flyer on anyone we think could help us, even if they are ridiculously overpriced like Arroyo.

It just doesn't make sense for us to add Arroyo, but I guess that's why I'm not a GM.

[msstate7]

Love getting Toussaint, but I don't see why we'd want Arroyo. Aging pitcher coming off TJ who's never been much more than league average. If we put him in the rotation, he's taking the spot of a young kid. Honestly, our rotation is dealing outside of Teheran. And when you look at the numbers, he's mostly been bad on the road. I'd attribute a lot of that to trying to throw the damn 2-seamer more. He's looked a lot better since going back to the way he pitched last year.

Unless it was really early in his career, I don't ever remember Arroyo coming out of the pen. Plus I think he'd probably fit best in a long relief, spot starter role. And once again, I see the same problem sticking him in the pen that we have sticking him in the rotation: He'd be taking the spot of a young pitcher who could use the development. Frankly, I'd rather call up Banuelos to use out of the pen. But it's been so bad, I guess we're willing to take a flyer on anyone we think could help us, even if they are ridiculously overpriced like Arroyo.

It just doesn't make sense for us to add Arroyo, but I guess that's why I'm not a GM.

Taking on arroyo's salary is why we were able to get TT.

[War Machine Dawg]

Taking on arroyo's salary is why we were able to get TT.

Obviously. Just saying that I don't see how he fits this team. We still win the trade by 35 miles. Is Toussaint close to MLB ready? He may be the one to fill a bullpen spot.

[msstate7]

Obviously. Just saying that I don't see how he fits this team. We still win the trade by 35 miles. Is Toussaint close to MLB ready? He may be the one to fill a bullpen spot.

TT is only 19 and in A ball... I doubt he's close.

If our staff is established in August (arroyo's return), I think it's a strong possibility we cut em. Just guessing though

[shoeless joe]

Only guessing here but I wouldn't be surprised to see us use arroyo in the pen if our starters are dealing. He has shown the ability to get hot in stints and if they can catch lightning in a bottle for the last 2 months it would be icing on the cake.

[BoomBoom]

I was comparing Correa to Albies. Allies may not be Correa, but he has a chance to similarly blow through the minors.

And sorry, Jose Peraza is a JP, too.

ah, so he is. my bad.

predicting someone like Albies or even Correa will blow thru the minors is like predicting a prospect is the next Maddux. easier said than done. especially with how contracts work nowadays. why would you rush a top prospect up to the show just to lose him before his prime to FA?

[msstate7]

You guys still think I'm crazy for wanting ciriaco on the team? My boy!

[msstate7]

Oh and Teheran was outstanding. If he can figure out road starts, I'll feel a lot better about this staff

[msstate7]

?@grantmcauley
Pedro Ciriaco: Makes the opening day roster, then doesn't because of trade, and then comes up big when he finally gets his chance. #Braves

Ciriaco now hitting .304

[smootness]

Obviously. Just saying that I don't see how he fits this team. We still win the trade by 35 miles. Is Toussaint close to MLB ready? He may be the one to fill a bullpen spot.

We don't care about Arroyo. If he never pitches for us, it doesn't matter.

They wanted to get rid of his contract, so we gladly took it in order to get Toussaint. We want Toussaint, not Arroyo.

And no, Toussaint isn't close to ready and won't be for a while. This move wasn't made for this year. It was made because we got a guy with legit ace potential for money we had room for in the budget. We basically got him for free. You pull the trigger on anyone dumb enough to give you that every single day.

[War Machine Dawg]

Teheran was better than Harvey today. Absolutely nasty. Now the adventure begins. #BravesBullpen

[War Machine Dawg]

SWEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEP!!!!!!!!!!!

[msstate7]

Very nice sweep to get back to .500. This weekend our bullpen threw 6 innings -- all scoreless. 2 rookie pitchers and a struggling veteran took down NY's best

[starkvegasdawg]

Hard to believe this season is nearing the halfway point. And as hard as we have been on this team they are only two games out of first. Yes, I know we appear to be in a weak division. But 2 games out is two games out.

[msstate7]

Hard to believe this season is nearing the halfway point. And as hard as we have been on this team they are only two games out of first. Yes, I know we appear to be in a weak division. But 2 games out is two games out.

And that's with Teheran not living up to ace status (on road anyway), worst bullpen in mlb (getting much better lately though), and 2 rookies in the rotation (Perez and folty, now Perez and wisler).

It'll be interesting if we're this close this time next month if we become a buyer. There's no way I'd mortgage future for a rental piece, but if we can add someone who'll be here for a few years I'd be all over it

[msstate7]

@BravesReddit
While I'm at it..
Ozhaino Albies is hitting .387/.403/.467 in June for Rome


Davidson hit 6th hr today

[KB21]

@BravesReddit
While I'm at it..
Ozhaino Albies is hitting .387/.403/.467 in June for Rome


Davidson hit 6th hr today

Over his last 19 games, Davidson is hitting .323/.457/.492 with 2 HR, 5 2B, 14 BB, and 15 SO in about 65 at bats. His isolated power keeps climbing. He's starting to get a feel for things, and his power is starting to come. He has hit 6 HRs on the year now.

Also, RHP Max Povse got promoted to Carolina. He's a 2nd year guy out of UNC Greensboro. Atlanta drafted one of his teammates this year in Ryan Clark. Both are 6'6" + pitchers. The Rome pitching staff is now: Touki Touissant, Alec Grosser, Caleb Beech, Ricardo Sanchez, and Chad Sobotka.

[shoeless joe]

And that's with Teheran not living up to ace status (on road anyway), worst bullpen in mlb (getting much better lately though), and 2 rookies in the rotation (Perez and folty, now Perez and wisler).

It'll be interesting if we're this close this time next month if we become a buyer. There's no way I'd mortgage future for a rental piece, but if we can add someone who'll be here for a few years I'd be all over it

Dang...with all those hurdles to over come someone must be doing a hell of a job leading this team***

[msstate7]

Dang...with all those hurdles to over come someone must be doing a hell of a job leading this team***

Fredi did a good job yesterday. He PH ciriaco instead of his usual give away an out with Gomes vs rhp. With 2 outs in the 8th and runner on 2nd, fredi went with eveland. I wasn't crazy about that move bc the mets had Mayberry (rh) on the bench. Eveland k'd Mayberry though. Fredi did a good job yesterday... Doesn't make up for the ton of boneheaded decisions that cost us games before though.

[msstate7]

@MBravesRadio
Arodys Vizcaino in his first @MBraves rehab was easy 98-100 velocity. Gave up 2 doubles, 1
...
That was Saturday night. Vizcaino bounced yesterday...

1.0 ip 0 h 0 er 0 bb 2 k

[msstate7]

Over his last 19 games, Davidson is hitting .323/.457/.492 with 2 HR, 5 2B, 14 BB, and 15 SO in about 65 at bats. His isolated power keeps climbing. He's starting to get a feel for things, and his power is starting to come. He has hit 6 HRs on the year now.

Also, RHP Max Povse got promoted to Carolina. He's a 2nd year guy out of UNC Greensboro. Atlanta drafted one of his teammates this year in Ryan Clark. Both are 6'6" + pitchers. The Rome pitching staff is now: Touki Touissant, Alec Grosser, Caleb Beech, Ricardo Sanchez, and Chad Sobotka.

Povse yesterday...

7 ip 6 h 0 er 0 bb 4 k

[BrunswickDawg]

This is interesting
@DOBrienAJC: #Braves are 35-35 w/ 4.06 ERA, .259 batting avg. & 294 runs. Through 70 last season: 36-34 w/ 3.33 ERA, .244 BA & 253 runs.

[KB21]

This is interesting
@DOBrienAJC: #Braves are 35-35 w/ 4.06 ERA, .259 batting avg. & 294 runs. Through 70 last season: 36-34 w/ 3.33 ERA, .244 BA & 253 runs.

The difference in ERA can probably be tied to the bullpen. I think our starters have been better overall since last year. I like our younger starters. I think Foltyniewicz will be back up soon. He's just in a slump right now. I also think we have some pen help on the horizon with Manny Banuelos and possibly Aroydis Viscaino.

[smootness]

The difference in ERA can probably be tied to the bullpen. I think our starters have been better overall since last year. I like our younger starters. I think Foltyniewicz will be back up soon. He's just in a slump right now. I also think we have some pen help on the horizon with Manny Banuelos and possibly Aroydis Viscaino.

I think it's actually tied more to our starters. At this point in the season last year, you had gotten really good things from Teheran, Wood, Harang, Santana, and Floyd. Minor had hardly pitched and only started struggling later, and Santana's numbers also worsened later in the year.

But so far this year, Teheran has been bad, Folty overall was bad, and Stults and Cahill combined to be garbage earlier in the year. Sure, Miller's been fantastic, and Wood has been good (though not as good as last year), Perez has been good lately, but outside of that it's been rough.

While our bullpen has had issues, Grilli and Johnson are putting up great numbers, and Avilan and Masset are doing ok. Kimbrel, Varvaro, and Walden were great for us last year, but outside of that it was pretty average, and Avilan really struggled last year.

So while I think both the rotation and bullpen have probably been worse than last year, I think the rotation actually has the bigger gap. Hopefully Teheran gets it together and Wisler can be productive for us going forward.

[msstate7]

The difference in ERA can probably be tied to the bullpen. I think our starters have been better overall since last year. I like our younger starters. I think Foltyniewicz will be back up soon. He's just in a slump right now. I also think we have some pen help on the horizon with Manny Banuelos and possibly Aroydis Viscaino.

Folty will have a hard time getting back if wisler and Perez keep it up. Mckirahan and vizcaino will most likely get a shot in July. The rest of the pen is picking it up so we could be set for a while. Who knows though... The pen could collapse again and wisler only has 1 start under his belt

[msstate7]

@GwinnettBraves
ROSTER MOVE: RHP Jake Brigham has been promoted to Gwinnett from @mbraves.

RHP Kanekoa Texeira has been placed on the DL.

...

Brigham has been really good lately.

[msstate7]

Banuelos tonight...
9.0 ip 2 h 0 er 0 bb 5 k

Season era = 2.03

[msstate7]

Supposedly the Braves felt they needed to send folty down to motivate him. That isn't good. Lord please don't let him be another Bethancourt

http://mlb.com/r/article?ymd=20150622&content_id=132263058&vkey=news_atl&c_id=atl

[KB21]

Supposedly the Braves felt they needed to send folty down to motivate him. That isn't good. Lord please don't let him be another Bethancourt

http://mlb.com/r/article?ymd=20150622&content_id=132263058&vkey=news_atl&c_id=atl

Eh, I think they simply didn't let him battle through some issues on the mound like losing the feel for his secondary stuff. If Mark Bowman was asking around and someone mentioned that Folty did not show the sense of urgency he needed to show on a side throwing session, I'd bet dollars to donuts that it was Fredi who said it. That's my one big issue with him, even more than some of his moves that are criticized. He has a tendency to air dirt laundry to the public too much and will not come to the defense of his players. Similar to how he threw Alex Wood under the bus a week ago when Wood was tossed.

Of the young pitchers the Braves have, Folty has the best stuff. He sits 95-97 easy with movement, and when his secondary stuff is on, he is hard to hit. Most guys like him have command issues, and scouts feel he will end up being a 45 on the 20-80 scale with regards to his command. However, they feel his fastball is an 80 with a 60 curve ball. He was averaging 8.31 K/9 and only 2.34 BB/9 on the year. The fact that his ERA is over 5 and his FIP is 4.35 with an xFIP of 4.23, it suggests that he has been hurt some by the defense on this team.

In my opinion, the pitchers in the upper levels of the minors, including the ones that have gotten some time on the major league team would be rated like this:

1. Mike Foltynewicz
2. Matt Wisler
3. Tyrell Jenkins
4. Williams Perez
5. Manny Banuelos

[msstate7]

Eh, I think they simply didn't let him battle through some issues on the mound like losing the feel for his secondary stuff. If Mark Bowman was asking around and someone mentioned that Folty did not show the sense of urgency he needed to show on a side throwing session, I'd bet dollars to donuts that it was Fredi who said it. That's my one big issue with him, even more than some of his moves that are criticized. He has a tendency to air dirt laundry to the public too much and will not come to the defense of his players. Similar to how he threw Alex Wood under the bus a week ago when Wood was tossed.

Of the young pitchers the Braves have, Folty has the best stuff. He sits 95-97 easy with movement, and when his secondary stuff is on, he is hard to hit. Most guys like him have command issues, and scouts feel he will end up being a 45 on the 20-80 scale with regards to his command. However, they feel his fastball is an 80 with a 60 curve ball. He was averaging 8.31 K/9 and only 2.34 BB/9 on the year. The fact that his ERA is over 5 and his FIP is 4.35 with an xFIP of 4.23, it suggests that he has been hurt some by the defense on this team.

In my opinion, the pitchers in the upper levels of the minors, including the ones that have gotten some time on the major league team would be rated like this:

1. Mike Foltynewicz
2. Matt Wisler
3. Tyrell Jenkins
4. Williams Perez
5. Manny Banuelos

When you say he rates so highly on 2 pitches (fastball and curve), but struggles with overall command... That screams relief, right? I don't why I just don't see folty as a starter.

As for your rankings... On potentional, I'd go...

1. Folty
2. Jenkins
3. Fried
4. Wisler
5. Banuelos

As far as right now...

1. Perez
2. Wisler
3. Banuelos
4. Folty
5. Jenkins

[msstate7]

10:13 PM
@mlbbowman
The #Braves haven't made an official decision about Freeman, but it sounds like there's a strong possibility he'll be placed on the DL.

...

Well we're about to be sellers

[War Machine Dawg]

10:13 PM
@mlbbowman
The #Braves haven't made an official decision about Freeman, but it sounds like there's a strong possibility he'll be placed on the DL.

...

Well we're about to be sellers

There was never a chance we were going to be buyers. I'll be disappointed if we're sellers, though. Best bet is we stand pat, outside of maybe moving a couple of marginal pieces like Pierzynski and CJ. And I'd be a little surprised if we move Pierzynski just because we literally don't have another option behind the dish with Bethancourt sucking ass and O'Dowd being banned for PEDs.

[msstate7]

There was never a chance we were going to be buyers. I'll be disappointed if we're sellers, though. Best bet is we stand pat, outside of maybe moving a couple of marginal pieces like Pierzynski and CJ. And I'd be a little surprised if we move Pierzynski just because we literally don't have another option behind the dish with Bethancourt sucking ass and O'Dowd being banned for PEDs.

I thought we could've been buyers for a player like lucroy -- player that is under contract for a few years that addresses a weakness like catcher, lf, or relief pitching.

[msstate7]

@DOBrienAJC
#Braves Freeman's wrist injury called a contusion.

?@Braves
The Braves place Freddie Freeman on the 15-day DL, retroactive to 6/18, with a right wrist contusion and recall Joey Terdoslavich from GWI.


...

This sucks. Got 6 of next 9 vs nats. We are officially in the danger zone trying to stay in the nl east race

[msstate7]

Our offense is really gonna suffer without FF. In 5 games without FF, we've scored 12 runs (2.4 a game) with 6 in 1 game. We're 3-2 in those games, but I can't see that continuing without some offense. Right now we have no one that scares any pitcher. If someone or someones don't get hot, we'll be out of it by the time FF gets back. FF was a devastating injury. We've got 8 games vs the nats and pirates coming up. We have to find a way to go 4-4 at least to continue to be a fringe contender

[msstate7]

2:17 PM
@grantmcauley
Christian Bethancourt is hitting .370 (10-for-27) with 1HR, 4RBI, 4R since return to AAA. He has 1 passed ball in 58 innings caught. #Braves

[smootness]

I think there's definitely still hope for Bethancourt. I think there's a decent chance his offense continues to improve to the point where he can be an everyday catcher. And most of his defensive issues are about poor technique. He needs to have a fire lit under him and to put in the work to improve, but he can still get there.

[msstate7]

5:48 PM
@DOBrienAJC
#Braves promoted CF Mallex Smith to Triple-A after he hit .340 w/ .418 OBP, .830 OPS & 23 SB (6 CS) in 57 games at Double-A Mississippi
....

Congrats Mallex.

Interesting that we've been playing peraza in cf and we promote Mallex there. My guess is we're shopping peraza