Basketball

[engie]

First, I didn't call for Stan's removal. Second, it's 100% not the same thing at all. Stans was winning and Ray is not.

Not very good at reading are you?

Last, don't act like you are some kind of God fan and everybody is beneath you. You're not.

Thanks for the projection, but I'm not "acting" like anything.

[engie]

What a short memory you have. Seems not to long ago Florida was winning National titles and we competed with them consistently. Don't tell me we shouldn't be competing because I do agree the league is not near as good now but it isn't going to matter because we aren't going to sign Newman and even if we do, a one year fix won't fix this mess.

Where did anyone say we shouldn't be competing? You day 1 Ray-detractors pull your own counterpoints out of thin air in order to try to justify your more overtly ridiculous positions...

Yeah -- We competed with Florida great. That was a decade ago. And the decade before that, we were in New York with a chance to win a title. So what point are you trying to make with that?

Contrary to your apparent belief -- we will thrive with a better league. Rising tides lift all boats. The SEC has some bad losses, but also some pretty good wins so far this year.

[Political Hack]

Where did anyone say we shouldn't be competing? You day 1 Ray-detractors pull your own counterpoints out of thin air in order to try to justify your more overtly ridiculous positions...

Yeah -- We competed with Florida great. That was a decade ago. And the decade before that, we were in New York with a chance to win a title. So what point are you trying to make with that?

Contrary to your apparent belief -- we will thrive with a better league. Rising tides lift all boats. The SEC has some bad losses, but also some pretty good wins so far this year.

I think he's tryig to say that we're not a very good basketball program anymore even though we used to be.

[engie]

I think he's tryig to say that we're not a very good basketball program anymore even though we used to be.

No one needs that. It's obvious, and him beating that drum nonstop doesn't help anything or fix anything. It's what happens in a rebuild. Took Cohen into his 3rd GOOD year(5th overall) before the people really came back as well.

We were 67th in average paid attendance last year. We were 77th in 2010. We averaged 3 fewer(paid) last year than we did in 2010 with a stacked roster that was supposed to make the NCAA tournament(bb attendance down across the country obviously).
http://fs.ncaa.org/Docs/stats/m_bask...ttend/2014.pdf
http://fs.ncaa.org/Docs/stats/m_bask...ttend/2010.pdf

It's time that we get start winning games and putting butts back in seats. No one is arguing otherwise. Everyone remembers when we were good -- and EVERYONE wants to get back there. So, again, what is the point?

[CadaverDawg]

No one needs that. It's obvious, and him beating that drum nonstop doesn't help anything or fix anything. It's what happens in a rebuild. Took Cohen into his 3rd GOOD year(5th overall) before the people really came back as well.

We were 67th in average paid attendance last year. We were 77th in 2010. We averaged 3 fewer(paid) last year than we did in 2010 with a stacked roster that was supposed to make the NCAA tournament(bb attendance down across the country obviously).
http://fs.ncaa.org/Docs/stats/m_bask...ttend/2014.pdf
http://fs.ncaa.org/Docs/stats/m_bask...ttend/2010.pdf

It's time that we get start winning games and putting butts back in seats. No one is arguing otherwise. Everyone remembers when we were good -- and EVERYONE wants to get back there. So, again, what is the point?

Not debating anything you're saying, but people don't put Ray in the same boat as Cohen because Cohen was a proven winner. There were still some morons calling for his head in year 3, but most people knew he would win if given time. People don't know that with Ray, and it's not looking very likely at all. Hell, even Mullen had won before as an assistant. Ray wasn't really even a winner as an assistant if I remember correctly.

Plus, basketball and baseball have more tradition when it come to winning at a National level (prior to this year's football team), so people tend to not be as patient when it comes to those 2 sports as they are with football where just getting to a bowl was considered "winning" up until 5 years ago.

So I guess that's why I can see both sides of this debate/argument.

[engie]

Not debating anything you're saying, but people don't put Ray in the same boat as Cohen because Cohen was a proven winner. There were still some morons calling for his head in year 3, but most people knew he would win if given time. People don't know that with Ray, and it's not looking very likely at all. Hell, even Mullen had won before as an assistant. Ray wasn't really even a winner as an assistant if I remember correctly.

Plus, basketball and baseball have more tradition when it come to winning at a National level (prior to this year's football team), so people tend to not be as patient when it comes to those 2 sports as they are with football where just getting to a bowl was considered "winning" up until 5 years ago.

So I guess that's why I can see both sides of this debate/argument.

What is both sides? I don't even understand why it's an argument. Honestly. It shouldn't be -- if people weren't pushing agendas and grinding axes beyond the reality of the situation.

Anyone that thought we were going to win big in years 1 and 2 with Ray's "inheritance" were morons. I thought we should have been better in year 2 and was mildly disappointed(same way I felt with Cohen at the time BTW). I thought the hire was underwhelming(very different from how we all felt about Cohen up front), but once the ink is on the page, that doesn't make a shit anymore. Go back and read the pages surrounding the link I posted. Just leave it in threaded view and hover a few pages. It was more than "one or two morons" calling for Cohen's head. Alot more. Hell, you can turn that whole third year, which ended up being our 2nd best season in over a decade at the time, into a case study of "how not to handle tribulations midseason fresh off a total rebuild". My thing is -- once Ray's contract was signed, he gets his fair chance. This year is his fair chance. Just because he faces tribulations early season doesn't actually tell us any more than Cohen's 4-10 SEC stretch in year 3 did. This year eventually unites the fanbase either way, and from there what has to happen either way becomes clear. Or at least I hope it does. Arguing about this nonstop sucks worse than the team itself sucking.

[Dawg61]

Hey Engie we all understand that you want more time from everyone before they critic Ray. That isn't going to happen. It'd be appreciated by everyone if you'd stop leaving Moby Dick sized novels in the basketball threads. It's full blown retarded as you like to say. Nobody reads more than two sentences of your posts so you're just wasting everyone's time. Thanks.

[MadDawg]

http://sixpackspeak.yuku.com/forums/...0#.VI3e9ivF-So

Feel free to scroll through a dozen pages each way and check out the prevailing thoughts on our baseball team at that time.

I'm not saying Ray = Cohen. I'm saying that impulsive "big picture" thoughts after bad performances/after a rebuild during the middle of the season are a bad idea. There's SO much gold from those couple of pages given the benefit of our hindsight now that should speak to people's ability to call a bad performance a bad performance without wanting to fire coaches midseason. But I already know that those who don't get it won't....

Calling for coaches to be fired mid-season is just stupid, isn't it Engie.

[MadDawg]

Coach: Don't act like you are some kind of God fan and everybody is beneath you.

engie: I'm not "acting".

GOLD

[Political Hack]

Win? When?