?????????????????????????????????????? Makes no sense. And a totally different topic.Quote:
Originally Posted by engie
Let it go bud.
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?????????????????????????????????????? Makes no sense. And a totally different topic.Quote:
Originally Posted by engie
Let it go bud.
I would think he would get some type of recognition for the players that were committed to Nutt when he left when freezus took over. Looks like it was 7 players, with Mathers, Walton, Hilton and Gross being the only real contributors at this point and I doubt any of those guys get drafted.Quote:
Originally Posted by engie
Im not sure any of those guys except for Mathers had any other options - Gross may had, but he was signing with the bears if they had hired Carrottop.
Normally when teams tank like the bears did in 2010 and 2011, this is what happens with the incoming coach - you get handed a pile of shit for a recruiting class.
For MSU in 2009, it was an odd situation, most of the studs committed back when we were riding high from the 2007 season and Croom was SEC coach of the year. Im not sure it gets remembered, but I thought we had a chance to completely dominate MS recruiting that year. We had a personable African American coach that ESPN and the media loved, and I figured we would win 8 games regardless. Then the shooting happens, we lose our starting All SEC LT and that was that. We learned that Croom really couldn't coach and we fired him one year removed from SEC coach of the year. That rarely happens, then again scoring 2 points in a game rarely happens as well.
So when Mullen showed up he was handed a recruiting class that wasn't your normal transition type class - hell look at 2004 when Sherrill left - He left Croom Roland Terry and Jeffrey Farr. He might as well of shit on the 50 yard line on his way out. That is the only two commits Croom inherited. The rest of the 2004 recruiting class committed after he got here.
You post stupidity giving Croom credit for some of Mullen's accomplishments. So, let us give him credit for his own accomplishments. Do you not see how that is interconnected?Quote:
Originally Posted by HoopsDawg
But I can TOTALLY understand why you wouldn't want to answer that question -- because it shoots your agenda to shit.
What is it with message board psycho's and "agenda"? I have no agenda, lol. Croom is where he belongs and that's coaching RB's with the Titans. This thread isn't about Croom. It's about the 2009 class and Croom deserves 90% of the credit for that class. You and some others have a hard time accepting that. That's a YOU problem.Quote:
Originally Posted by engie
What are we basing this off, players that were drafted from Croom's recruiting classes or players that were drafted while Croom was the coach. Personally, I don't think Croom should get credit for Jerious getting drafted, but that is just me, maybe he should.Quote:
Originally Posted by engie
Since Croom was only here 5 seasons, he only had two classes cycle through - the 2004 and 2005 signing classes. So we judge it on just those classes?
Mullen did a great job keeping that class together. Croom did a great job assembling the class. Can't it just be that? Can't both guys get credit. Why does it have to be one or the other. As usual the truth is probably somewhere in the middle.
This also shows how much recruiting has changed in the last 10 years. In 2004 when Croom took over, he was handed two commits from shitty players. In 2009, Mullen was handed a solid 14 commits. If Mullen left for another school - the next coach would probably be handed 18-20 commits that would all probably stick if the new coach wanted them too.
Look at Muschamp at Florida - he took over in 2010 - He only committed 5 guys after coming on board. The best coach so far that I have seen come in and kick ass in his first recruiting class was Gus at AU, and I highly doubt he did that without a lot of help from the AU alumni.
In 5 years, Croom had zero of his own recruits drafted. Zero. That's my point. How many of those guys actually get there on Croom-coached teams?Quote:
Originally Posted by HancockCountyDog
Plus 4 JUCO classes that should have been putting a significant percentage into the NFL.Quote:
Since Croom was only here 5 seasons, he only had two classes cycle through - the 2004 and 2005 signing classes. So we judge it on just those classes?
Is that not what my entire argument has been in favor of? I'm not the one that gave Croom full credit for the class and tried to downplay Mullen's role. I stated -- and stand by -- the fact that they both deserve roughly equal credit for the class on paper -- while Mullen gets ONE HUNDRED PERCENT credit for their collegiate production and NFL advancement.Quote:
Mullen did a great job keeping that class together. Croom did a great job assembling the class. Can't it just be that? Can't both guys get credit. Why does it have to be one or the other. As usual the truth is probably somewhere in the middle.
Not really -- it just shows the extent to which Jackie TOTALLY quit the day that he quit. Nevermind that Croom didn't think it necessary to immediately show up and get to recruiting when he was hired -- instead choosing to stay with his NFL team through the end of the season. He also left in-home and official visits on the shelf his first couple of years.Quote:
This also shows how much recruiting has changed in the last 10 years. In 2004 when Croom took over, he was handed two commits from shitty players. In 2009, Mullen was handed a solid 14 commits. If Mullen left for another school - the next coach would probably be handed 18-20 commits that would all probably stick if the new coach wanted them too.
Which makes Mullen adding 3 likely NFL drafted players in 2 months all the more impressive.Quote:
Look at Muschamp at Florida - he took over in 2010 - He only committed 5 guys after coming on board. The best coach so far that I have seen come in and kick ass in his first recruiting class was Gus at AU, and I highly doubt he did that without a lot of help from the AU alumni.
You have no agenda -- other than bitching about literally everything involving MSU -- while being MORE than happy to skew the shit out of things in order to diminish accomplishments of current MSU coaches.Quote:
Originally Posted by HoopsDawg
Your 90% shit just shows what a moron that you are. And that's a YOU problem.
He sure is damn near as insufferable at the Deshea stalker pervert, that much is certain.
Wait, so you are just talking about the 2004 and 2005 classes, right? Because, Antonio Johnson was drafted from 2005 class, Dixon was drafted and part of the 2006 class, KJ and Sherrod from 2007 class?Quote:
Originally Posted by engie
I mean, you are right, but talk about an unfair grading scale if you have to count that 2004 class - like I said, Sherrill left him two players Farr and Roland Terry. Now, 2005 class had some solid players - Pegeus, Chaney, Antonio, Fitzhugh - three of whom played in NFL, but I think his inability to understand recruiting is what cost him his job. He didn't really get that you had to start recruiting earlier and earlier. By 2007 he figured it out, but his failures in the 2005 and 2006 came back to bite him in the ass by the 2008 season.
TruthQuote:
Originally Posted by Coach34
No way in hell he comes to play in the croom coast offense.
I'm still disappointed to this day that he couldn't get past his issues, whatever they were. I remember watching him in the 2010 spring game and thinking that he'd be special for us.Quote:
Originally Posted by cubswillwinitonedaydawg
People forget that Croom screwed up the recruitment of Chris Garrett (yeah, I know) and Pat Patterson. Both ended up ultimately being busts, but Garrett might have been a serviceable back-up QB and Croom messing that up would be like Ole Miss screwing up the recruitment of Ryan Buchanan. Patterson would have fit our offense better and probably would have been a decent H-back for us.
But that was a good class other than the fact that we only had two o-linemen in it, and that hurt us down the road. Especially since Gabe was the only one that panned out.
...notable exceptions, all these players would disappear in big games.Quote:
Originally Posted by Where'sWaldo
I would say this is list of underachievers.