We are not lighting it up in recruiting

Imagine thinking we are just taking kids to fill spots less than a week after the spring game. Imagine being that idiotic. I wanna laugh at this foolishness but it's actually too damn sad to even muster up a giggle.

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Originally Posted by Cowbell

You aren't gonna immediately clean it up in recruiting in 3 months time at a non-blue blood. Ain't happening. These guys did well to finish recruiting for this past cycle and you think you guys could give them the benefit of the doubt after less than 90 days of them been together.

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But see that's the problem. The talking points that the media went with was that this staff was going to immediately come in and "lock down the state" because of all their recruiting connections. That was completely false and you could see it from a mile away. These guys were pushed by boosters and Brad Peterson. It's that simple. Doesn't mean their bad coaches or bad recruiters. They're not great recruiters right now, but they may be ok in time. I'm not going to judge position groups in a spring game, although they were underwhelming. The issue that most people, including myself, had was that we knew the reason this staff was hired and it wasn't what was fed to the fanbase. Just have a tad bit of honesty with things. Say we hired Will Friend because he's from Philadelphia and is career line coach in this league who's been on some good staffs. Ala Matt Luke. Just say we hired Chad Bumphis because he played here. If he was just another WR coach at Utah we wouldn't have given him a second look. Now David Turner actually has recruited good players in this state before, a couple of great players. But his best days as a position coach are well behind him. And David will keep us in the game with Beavers and Franklin. Not saying we'll get them, but he'll be able to stay around til the end.

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Originally Posted by 1bigdawg

Bumphis was the WR coach for the two time PAC champion. What is not impressive about that?

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He was the WRs coach for a team that was 85th and 50th in passing the past two years.

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Originally Posted by Cowbell

Let me speak slowly here. Rankings change. He was unranked then a 2 star when we offered him. That changed when everyone found out about him.

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Well and thanks to Dan and John we kept him hidden for as long as we did. We convinced him not to camp at multiple places that summer. I'm still not sure how they did that, but they pulled it off. If it wasn't for the MS/AL and the Under Armour AA game no one would've known about Chris.

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Originally Posted by KB21

Recruiting would be better right now had Arnett kept most of the previous staff.

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No s*** Sherlock. You really went out on a limb there. But you don't keep a staff for a recruiting class. Arnett didn't want to run the Pure Air Raid, which no one does, and so he moved on. He's the one making millions a year and it will be his ass we fire if his way fails. Now as I've now told you no less than 100 times in two months either get on board or get off the message boards and go support your best friend Steve Spurrier Jr at Tulsa.

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Originally Posted by the_real_MSU_is_us

I questioned several of our hires. Bumphis doesn't have an impressive college coaching resume, but I was told he'll help with MS kids. Friend was hated by TN and Auburn fans, but I was told he'll recruit well in state. Hughes was kept for his in state recruiting. We rehired Peterson who has instate ties.not saying any particular hire is bad, just that it's a LOT of MS recruiting logic

Like, how much MS coverage do you need before you get diminishing returns? If a kid doesn't want to come to State, having more State coaches recruit him won't change that. If a HS has no SEC caliber players, having 2 coaches pour over their game film vs 1 won't help us.

The recruiting foundation should be MS, I 100% agree with that. We HAVE to find our diamonds in the rough and get on them before they blow up. But we also HAVE to bring intakent from out of state. And if we can't bring in out of state guys AND we can't win the top instate kids, well that's a disaster.

All that said, its too early to call the staff out. It's not looking good and many insiders are alluding to bad rumors, but let's see who signs in December before we call out anyone.

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I thought we were under way building a national brand. I travel and always have something MSU related on. For the past 3 years, I had more people talk MSU Football than ever. I also felt like our skill positions were always picking up. I never had a concern with quality WRs, RB, and QBs.


It feels like somebody said, "we are going to focus on local talent and have to develop them" and we reversed our plan. Like I said, It's a wait an see.

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Originally Posted by 1bigdawg

Bumphis was the WR coach for the two time PAC champion. What is not impressive about that?

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What did the passing game look like there? I know what I saw in the spring game was not great route running and catching. And here it is in a nut shell. Those guys are not freshmen. they are are vets.

Not being an arse, but.......

This time last year we had 3 commits who actually have now signed -
Malik Ellis (3 star); Ty Jones (3 Star), and Joseph Head (3 Star)

Y'all act like we've spent the past decade loading up on early 4 & 5 star recruits. We are exactly where we normally are this time of year. We will likely pick up 3-4 more over the next few weeks, then Summer camps start the flurry of commits.
But, I guess like clock work we have to freak out about something.

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Originally Posted by BlackSailsDawg

What did the passing game look like there? I know what I saw in the spring game was not great route running and catching. And here it is in a nut shell. Those guys are not freshmen. they are are vets.

Not being an arse, but.......

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It?s very clear to me. They hired a bunch of coaches from teams with crappy passing offenses.

I am not saying Arnett is not the right man for the job, but I still do not like the way the search went. I felt as though we should have hired an AD prior to making a head football coaching hire. Maybe Selmon would have thought Arnett was best, but I wish the Selmon hiring would have happened before the Arnett hiring. Arnett seems to have a mindset that fits Mississippi State though and that is important. His experience is the biggest concern and his ability to manage a SEC offense. These next few years will definitely be interesting to see how it plays out.

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Originally Posted by StarkVegasSteve

No s*** Sherlock. You really went out on a limb there. But you don't keep a staff for a recruiting class. Arnett didn't want to run the Pure Air Raid, which no one does, and so he moved on. He's the one making millions a year and it will be his ass we fire if his way fails. Now as I've now told you no less than 100 times in two months either get on board or get off the message boards and go support your best friend Steve Spurrier Jr at Tulsa.

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Yeah. I know. No other Leach protege has had success with their own version of Mike?s Air Raid. I mean Sonny Dykes, Dana Holgorsen, Lincoln Riley, Kliff Kingsbury, Sonny Cumbie, Seth Littrell, Graham Harrell?..I just don?t see why anyone would want to hire a former Leach offensive assistant to implement the Air Raid.

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Arnett seems to have a mindset that fits Mississippi State though and that is important.

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What does that even mean in the scheme of things?

This thread is sad and predictable... The air raid holdouts bitching and complaining like they've done on every football thread since Barbay was announced. Now they start the threads so they can whine. How bout this, we know how you feel KB, Todd and Black Sails... your points have been noted. Now get onboard or STFU. And this is coming from a huge Leach fan.

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Originally Posted by BrunswickDawg

This time last year we had 3 commits who actually have now signed -
Malik Ellis (3 star); Ty Jones (3 Star), and Joseph Head (3 Star)

Y'all act like we've spent the past decade loading up on early 4 & 5 star recruits. We are exactly where we normally are this time of year. We will likely pick up 3-4 more over the next few weeks, then Summer camps start the flurry of commits.
But, I guess like clock work we have to freak out about something.

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Well said as usual. But it's only 3 or 4 air-raid babies that are freaking out.

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Originally Posted by Todd4State

The whole point in hiring these guys from Mississippi was because they were supposed to immediately clean it up in recruiting.

At least that was what I was told.

I'm going to enjoy Will's last year because I think I see where this is ultimately headed after this year.

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Same.

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Originally Posted by KB21

Yeah. I know. No other Leach protege has had success with their own version of Mike?s Air Raid. I mean Sonny Dykes, Dana Holgorsen, Lincoln Riley, Kliff Kingsbury, Sonny Cumbie, Seth Littrell, Graham Harrell?..I just don?t see why anyone would want to hire a former Leach offensive assistant to implement the Air Raid.

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Kliff has been fired everywhere he's ever been. Sonny Cumbie just became a HC LAST year. Littrell was just fired. Harrell has never been a HC. And I love Dana and Sonny but Sonny was fired at Cal and got beat 65-7 by the same UGA team we only got beat by 26 by.

Lincoln and Art Briles are the only ones "The Air Raid" has worked for and their best teams run it 60/40. They're nothing like Leach. Hell Dana runs it more than that.

Has there ever been a year when folks weren't concerned about recruiting? I can't remember one and we always wind up with the same #20-30 ranked class. Hey at least we're consistent. The same stories, same rumors and same concerns are voiced on here every year, we could just put them on replay and it'd be the same. I used to get worked up about recruiting but I've passed that stage. Would I like us to have a top 5 class every year? You bet! But I'm also a realist. Zach is not gonna be outworked and we're going to be ok

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Originally Posted by BrunswickDawg

This time last year we had 3 commits who actually have now signed -
Malik Ellis (3 star); Ty Jones (3 Star), and Joseph Head (3 Star)

Y'all act like we've spent the past decade loading up on early 4 & 5 star recruits. We are exactly where we normally are this time of year. We will likely pick up 3-4 more over the next few weeks, then Summer camps start the flurry of commits.
But, I guess like clock work we have to freak out about something.

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You are one of the few rational minds left on here. Great post as usual, Bruns!

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Originally Posted by KB21

He was the WRs coach for a team that was 85th and 50th in passing the past two years.

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And they were 46th in yards per attempt, we were 111th. They were 17th in TD's passing while throwing it nearly 200 less times than we did. What was their passing efficiency ratings, since you like advanced stats as well?

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Originally Posted by BrunswickDawg

This time last year we had 3 commits who actually have now signed -
Malik Ellis (3 star); Ty Jones (3 Star), and Joseph Head (3 Star)

Y'all act like we've spent the past decade loading up on early 4 & 5 star recruits. We are exactly where we normally are this time of year. We will likely pick up 3-4 more over the next few weeks, then Summer camps start the flurry of commits.
But, I guess like clock work we have to freak out about something.

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So I don't think it's the fact we only have 3 or 4 commits and if the guys we had committed were in state guys I think people would have a little more patience. But the last two commits have been OOS projects. Combine that with this being one of the best in state classes in years and making no head way in it I understand the frustration.

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Originally Posted by PGHBulldogBG

I am not saying Arnett is not the right man for the job, but I still do not like the way the search went. I felt as though we should have hired an AD prior to making a head football coaching hire. Maybe Selmon would have thought Arnett was best, but I wish the Selmon hiring would have happened before the Arnett hiring. Arnett seems to have a mindset that fits Mississippi State though and that is important. His experience is the biggest concern and his ability to manage a SEC offense. These next few years will definitely be interesting to see how it plays out.

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We couldn't have for a number of reasons. Mainly the complaining about recruiting now would have been total nuclear melt down in Dec when we lost that class and scrambled to put one together for Feb. Mike's passing was tragic but it also came at a bad time as well. Secondly, Mike trusted Zach and was grooming him to take over a program, either here or hired away elsewhere if Mike was able to still coach for a number of years.

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Originally Posted by Commercecomet24

Has there ever been a year when folks weren't concerned about recruiting? I can't remember one and we always wind up with the same #20-30 ranked class. Hey at least we're consistent. The same stories, same rumors and same concerns are voiced on here every year, we could just put them on replay and it'd be the same. I used to get worked up about recruiting but I've past that stage. Would I like us to have a top 5 class every year? You bet! But I'm also a realist. Zach is not gonna be outworked and we're going to be ok

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You can have a top class by recruiting pure numbers. That does not mean recruiting well. It's not the Ranking so much as it is the skill positions needed to win. An example from last year is Michigan st who was ranked 23rd with only 16 recruits.

The difference in our recruiting lately has been at the skill positions needed.

Right now, Arkansas has more 4 star players out of the state of Mississippi than we do including a LB

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Originally Posted by StarkVegasSteve

So I don't think it's the fact we only have 3 or 4 commits and if the guys we had committed were in state guys I think people would have a little more patience. But the last two commits have been OOS projects. Combine that with this being one of the best in state classes in years and making no head way in it I understand the frustration.

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And we are being out recruited in the state we were told would be locked down at the expense of a broader market. Like I said.. the hawgs have taken 2 of the top 10 players in our state.

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Originally Posted by Really Clark?

And they were 46th in yards per attempt, we were 111th. They were 17th in TD's passing while throwing it nearly 200 less times than we did. What was their passing efficiency ratings, since you like advanced stats as well?

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I'm not who you're responding too and I'm not looking up advanced stats. BUT, I look at the fanbases reaction to loosing a coach. Are they sad, happy, or neutral? Utah fans were neutral on Bump. Hands werent great, players didn't develop, and WR recruiting was the same under him vs before. They were fine to see him go.

TN fans were happy when Friend was fired, and Auburn fans were happy when he was fired. To me that's the worst hire we made. But in my opinion we could have also done better than Bump

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Originally Posted by Quaoarsking

I think many of us will remember that Jones was a 2-star for most of his HS senior season and didn't get bumped up to a 5-star until very late in the recruiting process.

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I believe when LSU and Bama both offered his stock skyrocketed. I remember people upset we were on to this un-ranked kid but people from his area were telling us no, this kid is a beast.

Long way to go until december. Lot of things can change. There is always a reason for concern in recruiting but why don't we give it a little more than April before the melt starts.

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Originally Posted by Commercecomet24

Long way to go until december. Lot of things can change. There is always a reason for concern in recruiting but why don't we give it a little more than April before the melt starts.

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The board has to complain about something at all times. The baseball team won so we can't talk about that. Men's and women's basketball did good enough to get a pass on the off-season. New AD hasn't messed up yet. Keenum hasn't had a Fallwell Jr scandal. Football has no on field results to pic apart yet. Spring scrimage has already been discussed. That leaves football recruiting

It's Newtons little known 4th law on motion- "a sports board shall always find something to worry about"

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Originally Posted by the_real_MSU_is_us

I'm not who you're responding too and I'm not looking up advanced stats. BUT, I look at the fanbases reaction to loosing a coach. Are they sad, happy, or neutral? Utah fans were neutral on Bump. Hands werent great, players didn't develop, and WR recruiting was the same under him vs before. They were fine to see him go.

TN fans were happy when Friend was fired, and Auburn fans were happy when he was fired. To me that's the worst hire we made. But in my opinion we could have also done better than Bump

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Eh, a lot of our fans hated to see Manny leave for Texas, Texas fans was glad he was fired (even though it was the program in total that was a problem), we had who didn't want Manny back then didn't want him to leave again...it's too subjective at times to me when it's really a program issue. Although Hev was a consistent albatross wherever he went...could still coach up an OL pretty dang good.

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Originally Posted by Commercecomet24

Long way to go until december. Lot of things can change. There is always a reason for concern in recruiting but why don't we give it a little more than April before the melt starts.

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And what good does it do to complain anyway? Unlikely coaches are looking here for advice.

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Originally Posted by the_real_MSU_is_us

The board has to complain about something at all times. The baseball team won so we can't talk about that. Men's and women's basketball did good enough to get a pass on the off-season. New AD hasn't messed up yet. Keenum hasn't had a Fallwell Jr scandal. Football has no on field results to pic apart yet. Spring scrimage has already been discussed. That leaves football recruiting

It's Newtons little known 4th law on motion- "a sports board shall always find something to worry about"

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Haha, too true!!

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Originally Posted by the_real_MSU_is_us

The board has to complain about something at all times. The baseball team won so we can't talk about that. Men's and women's basketball did good enough to get a pass on the off-season. New AD hasn't messed up yet. Keenum hasn't had a Fallwell Jr scandal. Football has no on field results to pic apart yet. Spring scrimage has already been discussed. That leaves football recruiting

It's Newtons little known 4th law on motion- "a sports board shall always find something to worry about"

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LOL, Yeah great post! It's like being a farmer, there's either to much rain or not enough, to much sun or not enough!

Have some rep!

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Originally Posted by the_real_MSU_is_us

I'm not who you're responding too and I'm not looking up advanced stats. BUT, I look at the fanbases reaction to loosing a coach. Are they sad, happy, or neutral? Utah fans were neutral on Bump. Hands werent great, players didn't develop, and WR recruiting was the same under him vs before.

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So, Utah goes to back to back Rose Bowls while Bump was there. Are they saying they did that inspite of a poor wr development and bad hands? They must have been truly exceptional in other areas.

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Originally Posted by Commercecomet24

LOL, Yeah great post! It's like being a farmer, there's either to much rain or not enough, to much sun or not enough!

Have some rep!

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Great analogy

Looking at the roster, we are going to have to hit the portal on the OL and DL anyway. We have a bunch of covid seniors on the OL and a bunch of experience on the DL as well that will graduate. We may be saving our money for those players, because we are going to need help there.

Also, where it the harm on taking some commits on out of state kids that might blow up after the summer and we have our foot in the door. If they don't pan out, we will tell a kid to look around. There is no downside.

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Originally Posted by StarkVegasSteve

So I don't think it's the fact we only have 3 or 4 commits and if the guys we had committed were in state guys I think people would have a little more patience. But the last two commits have been OOS projects. Combine that with this being one of the best in state classes in years and making no head way in it I understand the frustration.

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All five commits to date are offensive players also. MS class is loaded with very good defensive players. Anyone know how we stand with some of them at this point?

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Originally Posted by Goldendawg

All five commits to date are offensive players also. MS class is loaded with very good defensive players. Anyone know how we stand with some of them at this point?

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In the game with most of them. How in the game will remain to be seen. Waller seems to be the one we are most out on. I judge this by the fact that Rosebowl and Paul Jones are both trying to diminish him. Usually an OM tactic but I guess they are trying it out for their flock now.

We also have a first year HC (along with DC and new to us OC). You can't tell me that is not being pointed out by Nick, Hugh, Lane, Brian Kelly, Pittman, Jimbo, and that's just the West. SEC is a meat grinder in more ways than just on the field. Work hard and get our share Hail State!

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Originally Posted by Goldendawg

All five commits to date are offensive players also. MS class is loaded with very good defensive players. Anyone know how we stand with some of them at this point?

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Dozier is an LB

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Originally Posted by Tripp McNeely

Dozier is an LB

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My bad. Genespage, 24/7 has him listed as ATH and I forgot article said we were recruiting him as LB.

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Originally Posted by StarkVegasSteve

But see that's the problem. The talking points that the media went with was that this staff was going to immediately come in and "lock down the state" because of all their recruiting connections. That was completely false and you could see it from a mile away. These guys were pushed by boosters and Brad Peterson. It's that simple. Doesn't mean their bad coaches or bad recruiters. They're not great recruiters right now, but they may be ok in time. I'm not going to judge position groups in a spring game, although they were underwhelming. The issue that most people, including myself, had was that we knew the reason this staff was hired and it wasn't what was fed to the fanbase. Just have a tad bit of honesty with things. Say we hired Will Friend because he's from Philadelphia and is career line coach in this league who's been on some good staffs. Ala Matt Luke. Just say we hired Chad Bumphis because he played here. If he was just another WR coach at Utah we wouldn't have given him a second look. Now David Turner actually has recruited good players in this state before, a couple of great players. But his best days as a position coach are well behind him. And David will keep us in the game with Beavers and Franklin. Not saying we'll get them, but he'll be able to stay around til the end.

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Just an FYI, Cole Cubelic praised our OL play in the spring game on a podcast he did today and one of the announcers of the spring game called Friend one of the best OL coaches in the country.