Imagine being so dense that you fall they these "kids" get to go to college for free for their efforts. Ask kids coming out of college that had no scholarship what it's like.Quote:
Originally Posted by chef dixon
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Imagine being so dense that you fall they these "kids" get to go to college for free for their efforts. Ask kids coming out of college that had no scholarship what it's like.Quote:
Originally Posted by chef dixon
What about kids who received grants or were on an academic scholarship? Why single out just athletes?Quote:
Originally Posted by RezDog7
What about students who use their college experience to get a paid internship? Should they give that money back to the school?
The crux of the issue: Are the players adults, or kids?
Kids don't get to make all decisions. Kids don't have full rights. Kids have to be parented by an authority figure with real discipline power. In that sense, NIL is AWFUL as it leads to the "parents" not being able to discipline without the "kid" leaving, and it leads to the "kids" having all this money to make dumb decisions. If you see a 14 year old with $400k spending cash, you'd think they're spoiled brats. If you saw a 14 year old threaten to change parents in an argument you'd say that kid will never learn their lesson. a 14 year old should be grateful for the life lessons (coaching) and allowance (college tuition) that they're already getting and wait their turn to make their own decisions.
However, if we think of college athletes as adults, NIL is just par for the course. "How can UCONN's coach do his job if his players have the right to leave???" I don't know, how does any boss manage his employees when Indeed has hundreds of jobs they can apply to on lunch break? You speak to them as adults and find non asshole ways to motivate them to do their job. Millions of managers all across the country are able to lead and train subordinates. And if a problem employee leaves because they don't want to change their behavior, you hire a replacement and hope they have a better attitude and are glad to be rid of the cancer. In that sense (Portal = job hunting and NIL= salary) coaches aren't asked to do anything that a manager hiring a 23 year old engineering grad isn't.
Are 18-23 year olds adults, or children? This is the moral difference about NIL. We all agree NIL is awful for the sport itself, but those who are morally outraged about it do so because they don't want "kids" getting uppidy
You can't coach anyone in anything with that type attitude - sports, career, whatever. The entitlement in our society is a big, big problem. What either makes is irrelevant. He is spot on.Quote:
Originally Posted by Maverick91
That is part of the issue. They are not adults. Adults work jobs (for a lifetime to make a living). That is not the college athlete. They have no responsibility in life - that is not an adult. College is to finish growing up and get an education so that later they can earn a living for a lifetime. Not to whine about not getting money for going to school for free. We are creating generations of entitled and spoiled people.Quote:
Originally Posted by the_real_MSU_is_us
Good post.Quote:
Originally Posted by the_real_MSU_is_us
I worked in Cali for a while. Became good friends with this bar owner. One night he and I left bar to run to his house and pick something up. He's telling me some of his business dealing and whatnot and on one of them I ask "Is that even legal?" He said, "Absolutely it is", so then I ask him if he feels alright doing that. He says "Hey man, I didn't create the system, I'm just learning how to survive in it".
The kids have learned how to "survive" in the system.
Something to Ponder ... All college coaches at State Universities are State employees. And HCs and OCs make millions .. for being a State employee. Other State employees don't make that kinda money. And there are strict rules for any outside compensation. It really has to be a whole other job legally. They don't do endorsements and it probably is illegal for them to do so (not sure about that just guessing).
And relative to Alumni Associations and whatnot paying the coaches and that being "legal" ... that's also like the insider trading Congress does and how all these PACs are formed (per laws passed by Congress) to really funnel money to the Govt or State reps. Same thing. They all, regardless of Party, come out a ton richer than when they went in.
It's ALL a racket LOL. The kids are just now figuring it out. IMO can't blame them or call them greedy. As the standard saying we were all indoctrinated with going back to late last century ... "Friendship is friendship BUT ... BUSINESS is BUSINESS".
And then there's the fact the govt can draft them and send them off to a foreign country to kill or be killed by other people. All before they can drink a beer.
It's a crazy world out there LOL.
High school sportsQuote:
Originally Posted by HancockCountyDog
Yep, and if a HS coach wanted to complain like Geno, I have no problem with it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Coach34
I never said kids had to give money back. And I don't care that athletes are getting paid. But help me understand why I have to pay them. I don't make a ****ing thing off them.Quote:
Originally Posted by Gutter Cobreh
You don’t.Quote:
Originally Posted by RezDog7
Now, if you want your team to win, you probably will need to pay. If you think that’s stupid, that is a reasonable opinion, just know that is the new world.
So do you want to spend more of your disposable income on MSU in order for MSU teams to have a better chance to win games? That is the question each of us must answer for ourselves.
If I knew the athlete I was helping fund plan to stay at MSU for four years. But currently, you can't assume that. Also, since the athletes are supposedly making the schools millions, why am I the one having to pay them?Quote:
Originally Posted by HancockCountyDog
Because those millions are paying for all the sports that don’t make money for our school. If each sport could keep the money and didn’t have to share, the football team would have everything and the tennis team would have to split an Uber to go to matches.Quote:
Originally Posted by RezDog7
I agree that "responsibility" is the true beginning of adulthood. Some kids with druggie parents have to become adults at 16 by taking on the responsibility of protecting their little siblings. Some grown 45 year olds are not truly adults if they live their life ignorant of the fact they affect the world around them.Quote:
Originally Posted by R2Dawg
BUT, this is a big BUT here... if a 21 year old goes to class, does homework, works out and plays a sport by your definition doesn't have "responsibility", then does a recent college grad who's not married and is working their first job? I don't see how a single guy with no kids has anymore responsibility, but you'd never say that a 24 year old working a 9-5 isn't an adult/shouldn't have the right to take a higher paying job elsewhere (which is what portal+NIL is). So why is the 21 year old a child but the 24 year old an adult? If anything, the athlete has a "responsibility" to a team which is generally stronger than the responsibility and employee feels for their company.
I mean hell, we let 19 year old non athletes transfer colleges if they want too, and if the new school was offering 5k more in scholarships we'd applaud that young student for being so financially minded. But if the 19 year old plays football and transfers schools to make 200k he's an immature jerk who should have been happy with what he was getting at the 1st school?
Morever, what is "earn a living for a lifetime"? Bud if I could get paid millions of dollars a year to do a job you can be damned sure I would, whether that job is a traditional 9-5 or playing a college sport. Any one of us would, who'd pass up the option to make bank for a bit?
It seems you're mad they get to skip the 9-5 grind -so to speak- and make ridiculous money young instead of slowly building after decades of work. And yeah life isn't fair, but I don't see people here crying about inheritances or trust funds. Those adults didn't "earn" that money either. At least an athlete has to stay on the team to get paid.
At the end of the day, I think most on here are just pissed that these spoiled "never had responsibility" college students are getting paid way more than we are and are destroying our favorite sports in the process. College athletics is dead because of athletes getting paid, so we lash out at the athletes. They make it pretty easy too, with all the dumb tweets and entitlement that some put on display.
Well, do you think Lebby will be here 4+ years? He might, but if he went 11-1 you'd expect an LSU or a Texas to throw $10m at him and him to take the payday. We all know we're paying the coaching staff 1 season at a time. And you're employer is paying you 1 paycheck at a time- they know at any moment you could turn in a 2 weeks notice.Quote:
Originally Posted by RezDog7
Well, we pay these kids 1 season at a time. I really wish we didn't have the 1 time transfer rule, but we do. Almost every player is a free agent every year. Instead of paying 1 athlete $ a year for 4 years you're paying 1 athlete $ each year for 4 years, and the recipient may be different each year. But you're still paying the same amount for the same years of play.
All that said, I really hate to say it... but ultimately, almost all of us would objectively be better off if we cut off the university, let State sports suck, and invested the savings for our family to benefit from. But we care about State sports and can't stomach them sucking, so we support the team financially. If you can turn off your care and save the money for your kids I can't honestly say you shouldn't. But if you want State to be ok NIL is necessary
Now THERE is where players actually aren't getting paid because it doesn't cost kids anything to go to a public HS. This whole college thing to me is a joke saying they weren't getting paid when a 4 year college scholarship is worth well over 6 figures PLUS they were getting stipends to pay for their other living expenses. They may not have been getting paid what some people want them to get paid but just ask anyone whose actually had to pay for their child's college education or students that have to take loans to pay for college and they will say they were getting paid. Also, these college players only have a built in fanbase because of playing for colleges that a ton of folks have connections to. If colleges tomorrow all dropped their sports programs because it was just too much of a hassle and all these players had to go play on a minor league team, how much revenue would that even bring in? Probably not a heck of a lot. These guys would be mostly irrelevant like most players playing in minor league sports.Quote:
Originally Posted by Coach34
One my biggest issues was that the NCAA was supposed to be a governing body to promote fair play and rules between the school so that one wouldn’t have a competitive edge over the other. Now that doesn’t mean under the table things didn’t used to happen, but if the ncaa did their job and punished everyone equally for breaking the rules, there could have been some semblance of competitive balance. Athletic budget sizes used to be the only thing that “legally” separated schools like us and Bama. At least it put the on the backs of the school to hire good ADs and coaches and to try to increase your budget to be competitive. Now, the NIL, transfer portal, and non existent ncaa has totally blown competitive balance out of the water, therefore creating an even bigger gap between schools like us and Bama. This is the biggest reason why I hate it all. It has no regulation and it the Wild West. May the deepest pockets win! It’s an unsustainable model and the competition gap will only widen. It disheartens me and I’m sure some of yall feel the same way. I don’t mind if the athletes gets a part of the pie, but this unregulated bullcrap we are watching unfold is ridiculous. If they want to get paid like adults, then sign a damn contract with the school and at least make something binding in all this mess. All I really want is to have that feeling back that we were at least competing on a level playing field. I don’t think I will ever have that feeling again and it’s why I’m losing interest.
Tuition(which is stupidly high now and getting worse), books, room and board, daily meals, stipend…. That’s getting paid and a damn good start to life. Now if they can get NIL, so be it. But what they were getting before wasn’t badQuote:
Originally Posted by maroonmania
It’s not setup to be employee right now and you know it.Quote:
Originally Posted by the_real_MSU_is_us
A few items:
1. The players deserve to make money and be able to do so.
2. Currently, the amounts are very very high in some cases.
Most importantly:
1. Why are there no contracts considering the amounts being paid?
2. The spirit of this law/rule is NAME IMAGE and LIKENESS and that is NOT how this is being done by and large. You can’t dispute that. Collectives are distributing funds “donated” to a collective and are getting NO value from their “employees”.
No one or very few are getting any value from this essentially, donated money.
If anyone is interested to hear or read the full context of what Geno said, the link is below. While he may have mentioned NIL, the crux of his argument was against the transfer portal. The OP slanted the context of his argument.
Geno also calls out one of our players (Park-Lane) for transferring from Seton Hall to us and insinuated that Seton Hall made her the player she is and that she should be loyal to them...
https://www.foxsports.com/stories/wo...w-do-you-coach
He's like Saban and hates a system was created to limit his success but at the same time is mature enough to say it.