My guess on OM sanctions

[Indndawg]

Save Face Option for Both

NCAA Offers:

A 3 Year DP and substantial penalties after DP is done

or

Full weight of the calculated penalties per matrix

[Reason2succeed]

Guys. Nowhere in the bylaws or matrix does it state they have to stack the penalties with each violation. In fact it does say they can choose which part of the penalties they may or may not use for punishment. And I can't think of a time they have ever just across board added penalties on top of each other when dealing with multiple infractions. Honestly, the base penalty matrix for the starting point of what they are looking at is Level 1 aggravated and the COI will add or subtract accordingly each subsection. That will probably be the minimum. But nowhere are they required to added each penalty together by the matrix standard for each and every penalty. The Fraud and LOIC (especially since that is usually an aggravated offense) will be the starting point of the penalties more than likely then adjust upward from there. The coaches penalty matrix is considered separately from the school as well.

In that case OM is validated in continuing to cheat. If there is no additional penalties then the smartest thing to do is just make sure it is worth it. Once again the NCAA comes out looking toothless and irrelevant. After all the issues at Penn State, Baylor, and Louisville the national media will slaughter the NCAA. I understand exactly what you are saying but I disagree.

[WSOPdawg]

There is no way the NCAA doesn't end up looking foolish. They cannot use their own matrix, because that would literally shut down OM's football program. So no matter the verdict, they will be hypocrites for not imposing their own specific matrix for punishments.

Matrix Link:
http://www.ncaa.org/sites/default/files/matrix.pdf

TCUN can still field a team without scholarship players - but everybody know they won't be competitive enough to beat Alcorn St. Just remember, TCUN did this to themselves and now they have to answer to the judge, jury and executioner (the NCAA) as rules are established which all NCAA participants agree to play by on the field of play -- TCUN just chose poorly and they will pay dearly imo.

[Dawgology]

32 over 4
2 year bowl ban
5 years probabtion
Bucky gets the show cause

[WSOPdawg]

I'm thinking (at a minimum)
north of 40 schollies over 4 years
3 year bowl ban
5 years probation
show causes MANY TCUN coaches including Freezus (and he never coaches again in Division I)

BUT NOT ANNOUNCED UNTIL LATE-NOVEMBER OR EARLY JANUARY 2018.

[Really Clark?]

In that case OM is validated in continuing to cheat. If there is no additional penalties then the smartest thing to do is just make sure it is worth it. Once again the NCAA comes out looking toothless and irrelevant. After all the issues at Penn State, Baylor, and Louisville the national media will slaughter the NCAA. I understand exactly what you are saying but I disagree.

One Level 1 aggravated penalty is pretty bad just by itself. And I think the min of that matrix is the starting point of their penalties. Remember that is a min of 6 years probation, 25% scholarship reduction, 2 year postseason ban (which will allow transfers which adds to the total scholarship numbers lost), significant financial penalties, greatly reduces recruiting time, unofficial visits, etc. That's the starting point that I believe they are looking at. The COI will adjust from that in certain sections. But I don't see the COI going over the max for one Level 1 aggravated. That's 10 years probation, 50% scholarship reduction, 4 years postseason ban, etc.

[Mimi's Babies]

Anything slightly equal or north of USCw and I am happy. Based on all the other decisions I have read several coaches will get an SC. If you look at the cases this past year the COI hands them out pretty regularly for far less.

David Saunders received 8 years show cause for his roll in the 5 accounts of ACT Fraud..... Look him up...

[Mimi's Babies]

One Level 1 aggravated penalty is pretty bad just by itself. And I think the min of that matrix is the starting point of their penalties. Remember that is a min of 6 years probation, 25% scholarship reduction, 2 year postseason ban (which will allow transfers which adds to the total scholarship numbers lost), significant financial penalties, greatly reduces recruiting time, unofficial visits, etc. That's the starting point that I believe they are looking at. The COI will adjust from that in certain sections. But I don't see the COI going over the max for one Level 1 aggravated. That's 10 years probation, 50% scholarship reduction, 4 years postseason ban, etc.

I may have over looked this but.... I will ask Really Clark? I did not see the penalties matrix of the recruits who lied or excepted the bribes of the school, boosters, hookers, and coaches. Is there a martix for this?

[Really Clark?]

I may have over looked this but.... I will ask Really Clark? I did not see the penalties matrix of the recruits who lied or excepted the bribes of the school, boosters, hookers, and coaches. Is there a martix for this?

No. That would be under student athlete eligibility and that is handled outside of the COI penalty phase. Tunsil and Hampton sitting out a few years ago because of those violations were taken care of before the investigation was completed. As soon as they discover a violation that jeopardizes a student athletes eligibility, it has to be handled immediately. It doesn't wait for the COI penalty meeting. Normally this is in the form of suspensions, community service, repayment structure of impermissible benefits, etc.

[Mimi's Babies]

No. That would be under student athlete eligibility and that is handled outside of the COI penalty phase. Tunsil and Hampton sitting out a few years ago because of those violations were taken care of before the investigation was completed. As soon as they discover a violation that jeopardizes a student athletes eligibility, it has to be handled immediately. It doesn't wait for the COI penalty meeting. Normally this is in the form of suspensions, community service, repayment structure of impermissible benefits, etc.

So I know for a fact of at least one student who excepted benefits from OM and signed with OM.... Will the father that sold this child be expected to pay back this money?
I cannot even imagine.....

[BeardoMSU]

David Saunders received 8 years show cause for his roll in the 5 accounts of ACT Fraud..... Look him up...

Yeah, but Saunders lied to the NCAA, Freeze just quoted some Bible verses**

[yjnkdawg]

Yeah, but Saunders lied to the NCAA, Freeze just quoted some Bible verses**

But Freeze, as the HC, is responsible for any violations that have occurred during his tenure as HC, even though he may not.....hmmmm have been privy too, or orchestrated the whole thing.

[PassInterference]

Pain.

[Really Clark?]

So I know for a fact of at least one student who excepted benefits from OM and signed with OM.... Will the father that sold this child be expected to pay back this money?
I cannot even imagine.....

Did they get caught? Was the player suspended? If no, then there was no violation discovered and nothing will happen. Think about Scarbourgh, he had a 4 game suspension and paid back monies. If you don't see a suspension, more than likely there is not enough evidence of a violation or the total monetary amount of the impermissible benefit was small and just paying it back was enough.

[Mimi's Babies]

But Freeze, as the HC, is responsible for any violations that have occurred during his tenure as HC, even though he may not.....hmmmm have been privy too, or orchestrated the whole thing.

Yeah, but Saunders lied to the NCAA, Freeze just quoted some Bible verses**

I agree with both of you..... I believe that Freezus could not tell the truth if he wanted too.... The NCAA has not caught him in the lies.... YET.
Will he agree that He was in a home with at least one booster? On how many different occasions? Will he agree that he knew about the burner phones and who supplied the phones?
So I will quote a Bible verse.....
Exodus 20: 14-15
14 “You shall not commit adultery.
15 “You shall not steal.

Leviticus 19:11 "'Do not steal. "'Do not lie. "'Do not deceive one another.

The HC is responsible for His entire staff.... He should have kept the staff as Very Close Friends.....

[Really Clark?]

But Freeze, as the HC, is responsible for any violations that have occurred during his tenure as HC, even though he may not.....hmmmm have been privy too, or orchestrated the whole thing.

Not quite. The head coach is responsible for creating an atmosphere of compliance and monitor the activities of the staff that report directly or indirectly to him. That is not the same as responsible for any violations that his staff may have committed. What the NCAA wanted to remove was the "I didn't know what was happening" defense for all cases, although it could still be valid with a one time offense or just one rouge staffer. It won't work with multiple infractions by a staff. The presumption at that point is that the HC should have known there was a problem by monitoring or he wasn't really trying to promote an atmosphere of compliance.

[BeardoMSU]

Y'all must have missed my use of these "**".....perhaps I should have used the appropriate amount (i.e., ************************************************** **********), then my sarcasm wouldn't have as subtle, lol.

[TUSK]

Tusk, not saying wrong but your guess is based your opinion of what's reasonable and not on the recent penalty matrix that the NCAA designed.

Objectively, it should end up much worse than this.

That's correct, buddy... My O/U is my "bet", per se.... not what should happen or what current legislation calls for, etc...

Additionally, I think UM would recover FASTER from the DP than they would from paralytic sanctions....

[sandwolf]

In that case OM is validated in continuing to cheat. If there is no additional penalties then the smartest thing to do is just make sure it is worth it. Once again the NCAA comes out looking toothless and irrelevant. After all the issues at Penn State, Baylor, and Louisville the national media will slaughter the NCAA. I understand exactly what you are saying but I disagree.

The NCAA can hammer OM to the point that it isn't worth it for them or anyone else to get this far out of line without giving them the death penalty or the crazy sanctions that would result from adding up each individual violations' penalties from the matrix. If they hit them with 30+ scholarships, a 2-3 year bowl ban and 6-10 years of probation (meaning they are under a microscope for that time and are forced to recruit within the rules), they will become a doormat for every bit of a decade......anything at that level or worse will be a huge win for us and a huge loss for them. So when they don't get the death penalty (and they won't, there's just too much money involved), don't come back here starting a bunch of threads about how they got off easy, giving them some sense of victory....take the win, talk about how they are going to be a joke for the foreseeable future and talk about the opportunity we have to elevate our program

[Reason2succeed]

The NCAA can hammer OM to the point that it isn't worth it for them or anyone else to get this far out of line without giving them the death penalty or the crazy sanctions that would result from adding up each individual violations' penalties from the matrix. If they hit them with 30+ scholarships, a 2-3 year bowl ban and 6-10 years of probation (meaning they are under a microscope for that time and are forced to recruit within the rules), they will become a doormat for every bit of a decade......anything at that level or worse will be a huge win for us and a huge loss for them. So when they don't get the death penalty (and they won't, there's just too much money involved), don't come back here starting a bunch of threads about how they got off easy, giving them some sense of victory....take the win, talk about how they are going to be a joke for the foreseeable future and talk about the opportunity we have to elevate our program

I hear you. But if they get what you described what I will say is that OM was smart to continue cheating since there is obviously a max penalty that the NCAA is willing to drop.

I would then expect many programs to make sure that if they are cheating to make sure that they make it worth it. Why only rob one bank when you can rob ten banks and you still won't get life in prison?