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If you ask the more experienced MSU Alumni, (those who have been around since the Vaught years at OM), they'll tell you that yes indeed, OM will keep cheating. That's a given, and I very much agree.
But these things will always happen in cycles. OM fans that believe this is a bump in the road are gravely mistaken, and they will have some lousy years in the near future. The NCAA has to cripple them if they want to remain an entity of consequence. The Power 5 grows stronger yearly, and they can assert themselves at any given time. But they won't come to the defense of OM. Small potatoes in the big picture.
Show Causes for Freeze and much of his staff along with 20-25 over 4-5 would be devastating. Might take a decade to get back in the picture. But that's a lot like asking members of ISIS all to gather somewhere on an island so we could nuke them.
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Last edited by lastmajordog; 07-24-2016 at 08:05 AM.
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Talking to an UNM supporter at a meeting I recently attended. He asked me what I thought would happen with the NCAA. I replied that they were going to get hammered. He agreed. I then stated that after a large # of scholarships were lost, that they would have more 4 and 5 star walk-on's come to UM than any school in the history of college football. He agreed again. My Dad carried me to my first State-UM game in 1964. Without a very strong penalty from the NCAA, they will never change.
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Even if OM goes back to their pre 2013 recruiting ways, it is a win for us. Mullen had beaten that system 3 years in a row, and 4 out of 5. Plus, there is always the chance they mess up and get repeat offender status.
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Originally Posted by
Turfdawg67
... is the fact the if they do get hammered, the Network of boosters, disassociated or not, will come together and look at the stuff they are accused of and say "Boys, the NCAA spent 3+ years digging into our dubious ways of doing things and really didn't find all that much" (1). "If we would have paid off Miller like I told y'all, they wouldn't have much at all". "They couldn't trace the signing bonuses, the new vehicles, the jobs for the parents or the multitude of stipends we pay out each week". "We tie up a few loose ends and we can keep on keeping on!" "They found nada on Nkemdiche or Treadwell and we all know how much they cost!" "Hahahahaha". "We got hammered boys, but it's business as usual! Let's get the best ones we can get with the schollies we have left." "Now pass me that manila envelope with the info on that 5* DL out of NC... what's it gonna take to get him? My bagman is ready."
(1) Yes I realize they have 8 Level 1's but considering what the Network was probably doing for the last 4+ years... they have to figure their plan, for the most part, is still solid.
I agree. It appears they are getting away with the worst infractions (unless the new investigation into the 2016 class turns up something).
Even with a 2-year bowl ban, if Freeze is still there, they will still sign 5* and 4* and the recruits will talk about "getting to play in the NC playoff when I'm a junior or senior". It will only be one year left for the 2018 recruits.
Even with severe scholarship penalties they will still be able to sign classes of 15-20, so the 5* and 4* recruits will still get scholarships. It's the 3-star recruits who will walk-on at OM (over scholarship offers from other D1 schools) and be taken care of.
To truly be effective to punish OM, the NCAA has to give Freeze a show cause or watch them VERY closely over the next few years to catch them for repeat offender status.
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Originally Posted by
MedDawg
I agree. It appears they are getting away with the worst infractions (unless the new investigation into the 2016 class turns up something).
Even with a 2-year bowl ban, if Freeze is still there, they will still sign 5* and 4* and the recruits will talk about "getting to play in the NC playoff when I'm a junior or senior". It will only be one year left for the 2018 recruits.
Even with severe scholarship penalties they will still be able to sign classes of 15-20, so the 5* and 4* recruits will still get scholarships. It's the 3-star recruits who will walk-on at OM (over scholarship offers from other D1 schools) and be taken care of.
To truly be effective to punish OM, the NCAA has to give Freeze a show cause or watch them VERY closely over the next few years to catch them for repeat offender status.
So you think om can withstand punishments that crippled usc?
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If they get close to what USC got it will cripple them. Say bye to the kimchees tonsils and littles of the world. They will get a few good ms players but anybody on the national recruit level is t going there. I don't care how beautiful their campus is or how threatening freezus' teeth are.
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I agree with I seen it. You guys are giving the Bearsharts too much credit. So unm can withstand punishment that set USCw back a decade? Y'all do realize that this is the only team in the west that hasn't been to Atlanta right? This isn't some blue blood program that can recruit itself. Anywhere north of 20 scholly reduction will be devastating. Hell an 8 scholly reduction set us back 15 years, of course it didn't help that we pretty much self imposed a 5 year death penalty by hiring ol' Sly Crooms.
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The thing I'm worried about is UNM will get off easy because of what recent SEC/NCAA infractions did to other SEC schools. Remember the the SEC is the top of the heap in football.
Example A: the Scam debacle at AU. Cam is required to be suspended for 1/2 a game then magically reinstated by the NCAA because Scam says he knew nothing about his daddy pimping him out for pay-for-play 180K. Geesh!
Example B: Johnny football at TAM signing autograph football memorabilia for undisclosed amounts $$'s. Probably in the 6 figure range. All that happened to Johnny/TAM was he was suspended for the first game of the year against a team that TAM could have beaten with their water boys and athletic trainers. Geesh!
Example C: The Univ of Miami. No need for further discussion. Total NCAA screw up!
The only glimmer of hope is what the NCAA did to La. Lafayette regarding Saunders and the ACT scandal.
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Originally Posted by
Ranchdawg
The thing I'm worried about is UNM will get off easy because of what recent SEC/NCAA infractions did to other SEC schools. Remember the the SEC is the top of the heap in football.
Example A: the Scam debacle at AU. Cam is required to be suspended for 1/2 a game then magically reinstated by the NCAA because Scam says he knew nothing about his daddy pimping him out for pay-for-play 180K. Geesh!
Example B: Johnny football at TAM signing autograph football memorabilia for undisclosed amounts $$'s. Probably in the 6 figure range. All that happened to Johnny/TAM was he was suspended for the first game of the year against a team that TAM could have beaten with their water boys and athletic trainers. Geesh!
Example C: The Univ of Miami. No need for further discussion. Total NCAA screw up!
The only glimmer of hope is what the NCAA did to La. Lafayette regarding Saunders and the ACT scandal.
Cam was at the end of a heisman trophy/national championship run. JFF was the biggest star in college football. Who has that kind of star power on om? In fact, om's biggest star last year was suspended for half the season, so obviously this isn't apples to apples
Last edited by msstate7; 07-23-2016 at 11:37 AM.
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Originally Posted by
msstate7
Cam was at the end of a heisman trophy/national championship run. JFF was the biggest star in college football. Who has that kind of star power on om? In fact, om's biggest star last year was suspended for half the season, so obviously this is apples to apples
TRUE
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If that happens, college sports is over.
That means the NCAA has lost control and after one year of 5* walk on's at Ole miss. Then Bama and the big boys will go all out.
Might as well call it NFL jr
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Originally Posted by
starkvegasdawg34
The NCAA COI is the only one that knows what they are going to do and they may not have even decided yet. Everything on TSUN's part is mainly delusion that they haven't really found anything and that the sanctions won't be that bad, and everything on the MSU side is looking at similar cases at other schools and the penalties they got. I'm sure reality will be somewhere in the middle of the two, but I am still thinking leaning more towards the MSU side of thinking. The NCAA knows they have got to set an example or all these fears of things happening will happen and they can't have that. My only question is how much of an influence Sankey tries to have in the matter. Does he try to protect the image of the conference as a whole and force the NCAA to tread a little lighter than they want, or does he take the stance of being tough and following the rules and allow a mid-tier team get eviscerated to give that image? I know he was quoted back during media days that it was his desire that no team under his watch get a bowl ban or have to return a trophy. You could read into that he will actively try to protect teams that broike rules for the sake of image or you could read into that he will try to do everything in his power that all the conference teams play by the rules and don't put themselves into that situation like TSUN has done.
Here is something that a lot of people never bring up. These sanctions go back to the last 3 university chancellors, 2 athletic directors and 3 head coaches. This is clearly habitual and a perfect example of "lack of institutional control". Not only that, but the NCAA as late as a week to week and a half ago were still interviewing people. It is a long, long way from being over and if they weren't uncovering further irregularities there interviewing people would cease and it's not. It's going to be bad for them, book it!
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Junior Member
Originally Posted by
Ranchdawg
The thing I'm worried about is UNM will get off easy because of what recent SEC/NCAA infractions did to other SEC schools. Remember the the SEC is the top of the heap in football.
Example A: the Scam debacle at AU. Cam is required to be suspended for 1/2 a game then magically reinstated by the NCAA because Scam says he knew nothing about his daddy pimping him out for pay-for-play 180K. Geesh!
Example B: Johnny football at TAM signing autograph football memorabilia for undisclosed amounts $$'s. Probably in the 6 figure range. All that happened to Johnny/TAM was he was suspended for the first game of the year against a team that TAM could have beaten with their water boys and athletic trainers. Geesh!
Example C: The Univ of Miami. No need for further discussion. Total NCAA screw up!
The only glimmer of hope is what the NCAA did to La. Lafayette regarding Saunders and the ACT scandal.
This was before the NCAA's new penalty matrix kicked in. And Manziel's case was different from the other two. The NCAA has been showing their teeth in basketball, and the OM case will be their first chance in football. OM is getting major sanctions- anything thinking different is kidding themselves
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Pretty sure that there's a rule that prevents players from walking on if they have other D1 offers....they can walk on, but I think they have to count against your scholarship numbers if they have other offers.
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