Ray has taken a step back

[Political Hack]

his lack of recruiting is a killer right now. Having no better options at PG and C off the bench is inexcuseable

how about a two man for our starting group? In year three? One shooter who can create off the dribble when needed? One. Is that too much to ask?

We've gotten worse. This BS about "progress" is garbage.

[maroonmania]

What happened to the full roster gonna make the difference? I'll have to admit - your excuses are very flexible.

Well, it apparently has made the difference between losing most all of our SEC games by 10 to 15 points to now where we are losing most of our SEC games by 4 to 10 points. So there is that. We are a slightly improved team from what we had the past 2 years (in the SEC that is, the pre-SEC was a disaster) but it hasn't translated to many more wins. We likely end up with 6 SEC wins but that is not near enough of a move up to show real progress. Ray's first 2 years were understandable given what he inherited and the injuries so I stayed behind him but he's lost me this year. This team has no clue how to win and every game is a replay. We essentially hang around in games and then have no clue how to finish. Even though we were within 2 to 4 points most of the latter part of the game last night I never had ANY hope that we would actually win. That is NOT a good feeling to have while watching your team play.

[TheDogFather]

Most everyone here wanted us to get pollard. Here's his juco stats...

12.0 ppg, 59.4 fg%, 0 3-pt %, 6.3 rebs

Zuppardo beat him in every category

So, Zuppardo was better than another player with shitty stats?

[maroonmania]

So, Zuppardo was better than another player with shitty stats?

Hey, at least they are also better JUCO stats than Travis Daniels had.

[tcdog70]

Most everyone here wanted us to get pollard. Here's his juco stats...

12.0 ppg, 59.4 fg%, 0 3-pt %, 6.3 rebs

Zuppardo beat him in every category

Pollard is averaging double figures and 6 reb a game where He starts at Houston. He has been named player of the week a couple of times.Who averages that on our team Now--Chicken-who else? Shit, I hope Zup scores tons of points. But I believe He is a spot up shooter who has to be set up to shoot. I so far haven't seen Ray be able to set up a shooter. I think Ready could be a great spot up shooter, but I never see a play run to get Him a shot. Did you notice how Vandy goes inside out for their spot up shooters? That never crosses our minds. Shooting a 3 with your dribble is a lot better than shooting off the dribble.

[tcdog70]

I'm not sure anyone other than SS thinks Ray DESERVES another year. I think there's several of us that just realize Ray will get another year so we look for any sign that things are getting better. No one is convinced ray can get us over the hump

i believe a couple of weeks ago You and some others were suggesting how we were going to win 3 of our last 4 games. Now we might win 1. Last night Chicken was Hot, what did Ray do take Him and Ready out of the game. We would be better if every trip the Ball went through Chicken.

[msstate7]

Pollard is averaging double figures and 6 reb a game where He starts at Houston. He has been named player of the week a couple of times.Who averages that on our team Now--Chicken-who else? Shit, I hope Zup scores tons of points. But I believe He is a spot up shooter who has to be set up to shoot. I so far haven't seen Ray be able to set up a shooter. I think Ready could be a great spot up shooter, but I never see a play run to get Him a shot. Did you notice how Vandy goes inside out for their spot up shooters? That never crosses our minds. Shooting a 3 with your dribble is a lot better than shooting off the dribble.

I agree we have to set up shooters better. If zuppardo is on the perimeter, he could get plenty of open shots if sword and Houston kick it out to him off their drive

[Ifyouonlyknew]

Pollard is averaging double figures and 6 reb a game where He starts at Houston. He has been named player of the week a couple of times.Who averages that on our team Now--Chicken-who else? Shit, I hope Zup scores tons of points. But I believe He is a spot up shooter who has to be set up to shoot. I so far haven't seen Ray be able to set up a shooter. I think Ready could be a great spot up shooter, but I never see a play run to get Him a shot. Did you notice how Vandy goes inside out for their spot up shooters? That never crosses our minds. Shooting a 3 with your dribble is a lot better than shooting off the dribble.

Not that I disagree with you bc I don't but honest question who is going to set Ready up for the 3? Noboby seem to be capable of running a play, dribbling, & giving a good pass to get Ready the shot.

[tcdog70]

I agree we have to set up shooters better. If zuppardo is on the perimeter, he could get plenty of open shots if sword and Houston kick it out to him off their drive

IF? a big word-why don't they do that now?

[tcdog70]

Not that I disagree with you bc I don't but honest question who is going to set Ready up for the 3? Noboby seem to be capable of running a play, dribbling, & giving a good pass to get Ready the shot.

And whose fault is that? We only have 1 man capable of an assist after 3 years?

[Ifyouonlyknew]

And whose fault is that? We only have 1 man capable of an assist after 3 years?

We know whose fault it is. That wasn't the intent of my post. My post was meant to say yea I would love to run Ready off a down screen out for a 3 but I don't have the faith that we have anyone who could run the offense to run the play.

[Tbonewannabe]

Not that I disagree with you bc I don't but honest question who is going to set Ready up for the 3? Noboby seem to be capable of running a play, dribbling, & giving a good pass to get Ready the shot.

Watch our team and then watch the women's team. Big difference between just passing and dribbling. We have great athletes who happen to play basketball. Our offense looks like a rec league game.

[Ifyouonlyknew]

Watch our team and then watch the women's team. Big difference between just passing and dribbling. We have great athletes who happen to play basketball. Our offense looks like a rec league game.

I watch all the girls games & I agree but also when we need a bucket we have 3 girls we can go to & feel really good about it getting done. Drop it to Alwal in the post, run a play for Vivians to get a jumper, or Williams to break a defender down. At the end of the day you have to have people who can just go get you a bucket when the offense isn't working & we have exactly 1 player who can do that right now & that's Sword.

[Coach34]

I watch all the girls games & I agree but also when we need a bucket we have 3 girls we can go to & feel really good about it getting done. Drop it to Alwal in the post, run a play for Vivians to get a jumper, or Williams to break a defender down. At the end of the day you have to have people who can just go get you a bucket when the offense isn't working & we have exactly 1 player who can do that right now & that's Sword.

this- its not the offense- it's the people running it that need to be better.

With Stands- we just passed it around the perimeter and took a lot of 3-balls late in the shot clock because of our lack of movement vs zone. It wasn't unusual for a Stands team to shoot 28-30 3's vs a team that zoned them a lot

Ray's guys got the ball inside last nite to Ware- which was the intent. Ware just wasn't good enough to finish the play. And it happened twice in a row at a crucial point in the game unfortunately. But we got the shot the offense itself intended to get

[Tbonewannabe]

I watch all the girls games & I agree but also when we need a bucket we have 3 girls we can go to & feel really good about it getting done. Drop it to Alwal in the post, run a play for Vivians to get a jumper, or Williams to break a defender down. At the end of the day you have to have people who can just go get you a bucket when the offense isn't working & we have exactly 1 player who can do that right now & that's Sword.

I was more talking about just passing and dribbling. We don't seem like a good fundamental team. Just from our assist to turnover ratio.

[Ifyouonlyknew]

I was more talking about just passing and dribbling. We don't seem like a good fundamental team. Just from our assist to turnover ratio.

Oh yea I agree.

[codeDawg]

this- its not the offense- it's the people running it that need to be better.

With Stands- we just passed it around the perimeter and took a lot of 3-balls late in the shot clock because of our lack of movement vs zone. It wasn't unusual for a Stands team to shoot 28-30 3's vs a team that zoned them a lot

Ray's guys got the ball inside last nite to Ware- which was the intent. Ware just wasn't good enough to finish the play. And it happened twice in a row at a crucial point in the game unfortunately. But we got the shot the offense itself intended to get

Dude. We just got passed by Indiana Purdue University Fort Wayne in KenPom. It's everything, and Ray is responsible for everything. You sound like Freeze.

[DudyDawg]

this- its not the offense- it's the people running it that need to be better.

With Stands- we just passed it around the perimeter and took a lot of 3-balls late in the shot clock because of our lack of movement vs zone. It wasn't unusual for a Stands team to shoot 28-30 3's vs a team that zoned them a lot

Ray's guys got the ball inside last nite to Ware- which was the intent. Ware just wasn't good enough to finish the play. And it happened twice in a row at a crucial point in the game unfortunately. But we got the shot the offense itself intended to get

It's the offense too. We have exactly one play against the zone that isn't "pass it around the perimeter and maybe cut high post sometimes"

[Gatordog]

this- its not the offense- it's the people running it that need to be better.

With Stands- we just passed it around the perimeter and took a lot of 3-balls late in the shot clock because of our lack of movement vs zone. It wasn't unusual for a Stands team to shoot 28-30 3's vs a team that zoned them a lot

Ray's guys got the ball inside last nite to Ware- which was the intent. Ware just wasn't good enough to finish the play. And it happened twice in a row at a crucial point in the game unfortunately. But we got the shot the offense itself intended to get

First time poster but long time reader. A conversation I had with Coach Richard Williams before the season started, on the state of MSU basketball and Coach Ray. He stated that he hopes it works but the issues Coach Ray are facing are tough. First thing he came into a fire storm. This has been gone over 1000 times no need to validate. Second he stated that Coach Ray is trying to bring Big 10 and Big East ball down south. That means more screens, picks, and toughness. What concerned the Coach is the fact that he doesn't have the players to run this type of basketball and furthermore the kids he will be recruiting in the south don't play this type of ball. They are all athletes, thin and lanky. Coach doesn't believe the recruits down south want to play in this type of system because they aren't (A) built that way and (B) aren't running up and down letting their ability take over the game. The other issue Coach mentioned was that Ray is a strict disciplinarian. Coach Williams mentioned how all the kids today smoke the weed not just drink like most kids did 20 years ago. None of them can pass a test. If you don't think this effects recruits then you are kidding yourself. Coach thinks Ray is a great Coach with a lot of variables and if they all line up MSU basketball will be great again. Now this was before season started and his views could have changed. Flame away and bash the first post. By the way WillClarkfan has to be a rebel

[dawgs]

Then Ray should've spent the last 3 years recruiting the hell out of players from the Midwest and northeast that grew up playing his style.

The problem with saying we don't have the players is that it doesn't even look like we are attempting to play the style of offense you are describing and failing, we aren't showing any signs of playing any style of offense.