This is 99.9% of MSU's problem

[confucius say]

We have fans that do not care if our QB can pass as long as he can run the ball. That is insane.

Correct. Arnold is atrocious. Every Auburn fan would trade him for Shapen right now. Auburn had a top 3 defense in the sec, but Arnold is so bad that freeze is about to be fired. Yet our fans want him.

[msstate7]

Qbr overall in sec...

[msstate7]

Qbr by pass...

[msstate7]

Qbr by run...

[EdwardDrayton]

All of this. And it's very obvious.


And on Shapen- to those talking about how "immobile" he is- most people did not want him to rush because of his injury history. And now we're complaining about him not running it enough.

Mobility out of the pocket behind the line of scrimmage is different than rushing. It's difficult to judge his mobility because his reaction to pressure is to duck and run straight ahead. Under pressure his eyes drop. As Dak says it's not pressure if you have a plan. Shapen just is not good under pressure. This is something effective coaching can help.

[msstate7]

Qbr overall in sec...

Looking at this, we've faced one top half qb in the sec so far. After this weekend, our D is about to see a huge increase in qb play

[StarkVegasSteve]

We have fans that do not care if our QB can pass as long as he can run the ball. That is insane.

Because we have fans who never played past HS and every one of their teams ran either the Power I, Wishbone, I-formation, etc. That is how they know football. It also goes back to we would rather be "blue collar and hard working" than "flashy". It's why OM has always embraced the pass happy spread offenses and our fans look for the first sign of failure and want to go back to the 1970s with the Wishbone.

[Matt3467]

Shapen isn't slow. He's definitely not Will Rogers. I think it's by design they've chosen not to run him more. I get it as far as his injury history is concerned but at this point you may as well open it up. Curious how we haven't seen the portal QB yet but we've seen Taylor. That can't be a good indicator.

[StarkVegasSteve]

Shapen isn't slow. He's definitely not Will Rogers. I think it's by design they've chosen not to run him more. I get it as far as his injury history is concerned but at this point you may as well open it up. Curious how we haven't seen the portal QB yet but we've seen Taylor. That can't be a good indicator.

My guess, with absolutely ZERO knowledge of the thinking, is that they are being overprotective of Kromenhoek because if Shapen gets injured that's who the starter would be. You can run Kamario out there because he's not your backup. We are treating him like Sean Payton treated Taysom Hill in regards to QB runs. Kind of the, "We can be less cautious because he's not the backup."

I also could be completely wrong and Kamario is the backup and Kromenhoek sucks. I do know Kromenhoek is faster than Kamario though.

[TrapGame]

All of this. And it's very obvious.


And on Shapen- to those talking about how "immobile" he is- most people did not want him to rush because of his injury history. And now we're complaining about him not running it enough.

Yep. Shapen is not even trying to get extra yards when he runs for green grass. If he gets close to the 1st down marker, great, but he?s not trying to run over guys. He can?t make the QB runs that Gabriel or Arnold were making in Lebby?s offense because he would get hurt again. Lebby is missing an important weapon in his offense because of this.

[Goldendawg]

We read all off season and in the Spring that he was being taught and told to get down on his runs to avoid contact. Even our opponents know it and we are playing 10 1/2 against 11 when we are on offense. You can't have it both ways with him and he is now "Mr. Slide".

Also, I posted earlier in the season that there was no way that he is 6'2". He cannot see over the line, thus no crossing pattern or slants and the horrible interception against FL. We have two fast WR's who get open on the deep ball. I doubt Shapen can even see them downfield most throws and just blindly lets it go to the spot, if he doesn't overthrow. If this continues in a Texas loss this wwek give Hawk or Taylor a chance to start. With another loss, six wins with short, 24 year old "Mr. Slide" will be impossible.

[tcdog70]

1. Kamario will not win 3 of the next 5 if he starts. He will lose all 5, and lose them very bad.

2. He is not Dak 2.0 and he is not more advanced, which is saying something. Kamario cannot run the offense to its fullest.

3. We only pursued 2 QBs, Arnold and Kromenhoek. Jackson went to Auburn because they overpaid by a million dollars. Not one QB gave a flying 17 that Kamario was committed.

4. Van Buren transferred because we brought back Shapen. He also did not give one iota of a flying 17 about Kamario.

5. If we play Kamario we will not thrive. We will suck and all of you will say he is a bust. I have a mountain of backup QBs to prove my point.

I know the facts have once again gotten in the way of a good narrative but sometimes you just have to understand and accept that there is a reason Kamario is not playing. He is not ready. He is ready for what we are asking him to do, which is why he plays in those situations. He may be ready next year and he may not. I do know we will be pursuing a QB in the portal and it will be someone who can start. Because you do not just roll with Taylor and do not look back. Think what would have happened if OM would have just said, ?hell, we got Simmons and he was good for one drive. We do not need to give 500K to the Ferris St QB?. You always should attempt to make your team better. I mean if Kamario is as good as you all say he is then he should have no problem at all winning a QB competition. Unless?..

why do you hate KT? have you ever watched Him play? he scored only Td in The spring game. Hell He scored our first Td Saturday. Let give Him a try, playing Shapen isn't the answer.

[StarkVegasSteve]

why do you hate KT? have you ever watched Him play? he scored only Td in The spring game. Hell He scored our first Td Saturday. Let give Him a try, playing Shapen isn't the answer.

I do not hate Kamario, please for the love of god stop calling him KT he is not Keytaon Thompson. I have watched him play plenty. I have also watched the all 22 for every game, including this last one. He does not know how to make the reads quick enough. It is not his fault. He ran a simplistic offense in HS that let him do whatever he wanted to do. There were no reads to make. I think Kamario is going to be a hell of a player for us, maybe the best QB ever, but I have watched enough to know he is not ready.

Talk to any coach from HS to FBS and they will tell you the same thing in regards to Kamario. He is not ready because Noxubee did not prepare him to be ready. Yogi Roth, of Elite 11, has literally said that exact thing. Said he may be one of the physically gifted QBs they have ever had, but he did not know how to read a coverage. Or how to attack cover 2 vs how you attack cover 3.

[Goldendawg]

I do not hate Kamario, please for the love of god stop calling him KT he is not Keytaon Thompson. I have watched him play plenty. I have also watched the all 22 for every game, including this last one. He does not know how to make the reads quick enough. It is not his fault. He ran a simplistic offense in HS that let him do whatever he wanted to do. There were no reads to make. I think Kamario is going to be a hell of a player for us, maybe the best QB ever, but I have watched enough to know he is not ready.

Talk to any coach from HS to FBS and they will tell you the same thing in regards to Kamario. He is not ready because Noxubee did not prepare him to be ready. Yogi Roth, of Elite 11, has literally said that exact thing. Said he may be one of the physically gifted QBs they have ever had, but he did not know how to read a coverage. Or how to attack cover 2 vs how you attack cover 3.

Well Shapen made a similar read on that 4th down failure and admitted he didn't even see the 6'6" or so nose guard that dropped into coverage that didn't give us a chance to kick a possible winner. Lose to Texas and we are on a 16 game SEC losing streak and it is time to try something new. It's not like Shapen will be here next season.

[Todd4State]

Well Shapen made a similar read on that 4th down failure and admitted he didn't even see the 6'6" or so nose guard that dropped into coverage that didn't give us a chance to kick a possible winner. Lose to Texas and we are on a 16 game SEC losing streak and it is time to try something new. It's not like Shapen will be here next season.

Sure that was a bad read. It's not about being perfect. It's about who can make the right read the majority of the time and that's Shapen.

[StarkVegasSteve]

Well Shapen made a similar read on that 4th down failure and admitted he didn't even see the 6'6" or so nose guard that dropped into coverage that didn't give us a chance to kick a possible winner. Lose to Texas and we are on a 16 game SEC losing streak and it is time to try something new. It's not like Shapen will be here next season.

And trying something new is not always better. Again, I know we all want the kid to be the second coming of Cam Newton, and maybe he will be, but even Cam wasn't Cam as a Freshman. And guess what he struggled with? Learning the playbook. And no that is not opinion that is a fact told to a group of us by Mullen. I've talked to Mullen plenty about it since, actually talked about Cam last year when he was here for the reunion because I was asking him what were the chances that a True Freshman could succeed in this league. He said, "No 17 chance. The playbook is too big at this level and you will spazz them out to the point of you're scared they'll s*** themselves on 3rd and 8th." He actually talked to Lebby as well that weekend about how to operate with a True Freshman QB and the challenges that come with it.

[Homedawg]

We'd be 6-1with Arnold.

Freeze totally ****ed us.

No we wouldn't. He can't throw. At all.

[StarkVegasSteve]

No we wouldn't. He can't throw. At all.

We very well might be. He can throw it enough and knows this offense. We may not be 6-1 but I feel confident in saying that Jackson Arnold wins that game on Saturday. He can make the same throws as Shapen and we would've called QB run at the end.

[Homedawg]

Correct. Arnold is atrocious. Every Auburn fan would trade him for Shapen right now. Auburn had a top 3 defense in the sec, but Arnold is so bad that freeze is about to be fired. Yet our fans want him.

Correct. And anyone that thinks otherwise hasn't watched Auburn play 5 snaps.

[StarkVegasSteve]

Correct. And anyone that thinks otherwise hasn't watched Auburn play 5 snaps.

He just can't run Hugh's offense. Which, anyone with half of brain, knew when he signed with them.