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[MD2020]

That has very little to do with Shrader. I think Shrader has been fantastic considering his terrible protection, dancing RB, & the terrible offensive system he's playing in.

He's completing 55% of his passes, ran for 504, & thrown for over 1,000 yards

If you're blaming Shrader for any of this, you clearly don't understand football

I guess you don't understand he's racking up yards and points in mop up and backups playing. We've only been in 1 game with him as the starter. Our average losing score is almost 19 points.

[Ifyouonlyknew]

Go back and watch the AU and A&M games last year. Those were classic Mullen games. Fitz ran it 44 times in those two games. He threw it 39 times in those two games vs 58 in the games against KY and FL.

To Joe's credit I think he realized early on that Fitz couldn't run his offense and he switched to QB run offense. I just don't fully understand why he didn't give that offense more of a chance this year with KT, especially in the toss up games. I guess spilt milk and all.

It's not like Fitz didn't run a ton vs KY & FL though. He had 28 carries vs Auburn, 16 carries vs A&M, 16 vs KY, & 20 vs FL. They didn't suddenly change the offense against A&M & Auburn. The reason why they passed more against KY & FL was because they shut the running game down. 20yds vs KY, 32yds vs FL, 88yds vs A&M, & 195yds vs Auburn. We were constantly in 2nd & 3rd & long vs KY & FL where as we controlled the line of scrimmage against A&M & Auburn & played ahead of the chains.

[Todd4State]

Then you're as bad as Joe. Shrader has won no games starting. KT is undefeated and beat a Heisman winner.

Kentucky? And no the stats don?t show that KT was/is better. KT struggled in the spring too.

[Todd4State]

I guess you don't understand he's racking up yards and points in mop up and backups playing. We've only been in 1 game with him as the starter. Our average losing score is almost 19 points.

And KT racked up most of his stats against Stephen F Austin. And still couldn’t complete half of his passes.

[Ifyouonlyknew]

I would assume you agree with the first part but disagree with the second part.

I can't imagine you disagree with the first part.

If he ran his offense against AU and A&M - then I agree, we will have to agree to disagree.

But you would agree that you don't expect him to come in and force his system on players ill equipped to run it, figuring you take your lumps and the team eventually learns how to run your offense, or do you? Its possible you do, but I would just be surprised by that.

I agree with everything you just said. He tried his best to tweak his offense with Fitz last year & not really open it up. He ran Fitz a ton Bc that's what he's good at the offense was just usually disjointed. This offseason he said I have to get me a guy who can run my offense. KT got a full spring to go through his offense & Joe decided nope he can't run the offense the way I want it to run. He decided to get a QB who he felt could run the offense. It happened to be Tommy Stevens. It could've been Kelly Bryant, or 1 or 2 other guys he pursued. Tommy came & won the job, which isn't surprising, Bc he's a better fit for the offense. Unfortunately he got hurt. By that time KT has decided he doesn't want to play at MSU anymore & Mayden is suspended. Shrader took the job & ran with it. Is he a finished product? No. Does he make mistakes? Yes. However in my opinion he's shown he has the potential to be a very good SEC QB.

[HancockCountyDog]

It's not like Fitz didn't run a ton vs KY & FL though. He had 28 carries vs Auburn, 16 carries vs A&M, 16 vs KY, & 20 vs FL. They didn't suddenly change the offense against A&M & Auburn. The reason why they passed more against KY & FL was because they shut the running game down. 20yds vs KY, 32yds vs FL, 88yds vs A&M, & 195yds vs Auburn. We were constantly in 2nd & 3rd & long vs KY & FL where as we controlled the line of scrimmage against A&M & Auburn & played ahead of the chains.

Actually he only carried it 14 times against Florida - the other 6 carries were sacks. Same with Kentucky - 13 carries - with 3 sacks.

Also a few of those carries were designed pass plays that ended up as runs because no one was open.

I'm just saying that it seemed to me, and maybe I'm alone on this that after the Florida loss our offense became much more Fitz running power runs. At times it didn't help, but we certainly were going to win and lose games on Fitz' legs. It didn't feel that way in the FL/KY games, hence the 9 sacks in two games.

[Ifyouonlyknew]

Actually he only carried it 14 times against Florida - the other 6 carries were sacks. Same with Kentucky - 13 carries - with 3 sacks.

Also a few of those carries were designed pass plays that ended up as runs because no one was open.

I'm just saying that it seemed to me, and maybe I'm alone on this that after the Florida loss our offense became much more Fitz running power runs. At times it didn't help, but we certainly were going to win and lose games on Fitz' legs. It didn't feel that way in the FL/KY games, hence the 9 sacks in two games.

I agree with that also. I think after KY & FL he realized I really don't have the OT to keep the QB up for these deeper routes & tried to adjust the best way he know how within his system. It's not like Mullen left his playbook in the desk drawer & was like "if you ever get in a bind these are Fitz go to plays". I just think after the roller coaster year last year on offense he decided I'm running my stuff & I need someone I'm confident who can run it. I don't fault him for that at all.

[HancockCountyDog]

I agree with everything you just said. He tried his best to tweak his offense with Fitz last year & not really open it up. He ran Fitz a ton Bc that's what he's good at the offense was just usually disjointed. This offseason he said I have to get me a guy who can run my offense. KT got a full spring to go through his offense & Joe decided nope he can't run the offense the way I want it to run. He decided to get a QB who he felt could run the offense. It happened to be Tommy Stevens. It could've been Kelly Bryant, or 1 or 2 other guys he pursued. Tommy came & won the job, which isn't surprising, Bc he's a better fit for the offense. Unfortunately he got hurt. By that time KT has decided he doesn't want to play at MSU anymore & Mayden is suspended. Shrader took the job & ran with it. Is he a finished product? No. Does he make mistakes? Yes. However in my opinion he's shown he has the potential to be a very good SEC QB.

What is funny is that I agree with you that Shrader definitely has potential to be a very good SEC QB.

I just think for this year alone I would have liked to have seen another season of run first QB with KT at the helm, but it looks like that ship sailed the minute we signed Tommy.

I just hate wasting a season - i'm not saying KT would have led us to 9 wins - far from it - I just think we win the KSU and Tenn game with him. I could be way off. I'm also probably just longing for the Mullen offense an KT running it, because I was looking forward to it for several seasons and now that we are running a 50/50 offense it looks pretty much what I expected which is inconsistent because we don't have good enough WR's or elite enough OT's to run that type of offense.

I just hope we win out and win the bowl game so we can try and turn this around, because barring a blowout on Thanksgiving, we aren't firing a second year coach. Its not in our DNA. Its possible, but I don't see it happening - especially because John hired him. If we had a new AD I'd think there is a chance, but its just not happening.

[BhamDawg205]

That includes, of course, Shotgun himself.

https://www.elitedawgs.com/showthread.php?51671-Keytaon-Thompson-Is-Currently-On-the-Field-Practicing-at-MSU

https://www.elitedawgs.com/showthread.php?51194-Keytaon-Thompson-Is-Giving-Me-Warm-amp-Fuzzies

https://www.elitedawgs.com/showthread.php?49495-Keytaon-Thompson

https://www.elitedawgs.com/showthread.php?60474-Keytaon-Thompson

Yea it's why you can't take these so called experts seriously. Funny they try to rewrite history. Remember there's Always a post.

[BhamDawg205]

I'm not a Joe fan, but why do you assume that Joe knows Mullen's offense? Joe's never ran the Mullen offense or coached under anyone who did.

We've never run the Mullen under Joe unless you are reducing that offense to simply the zone read.

Heck over the last few weeks Shrader has been running zone read with passes here and there. Joe ran Fitz more than Mullen. Part of that can be defenses dictating things. Joe is lost and so is his offensive philosophy. KT should have been his bridge to Shrader, his QB.
Now some think Shrader will leave if Joe leaves, so be it. This why Cohen needs to pull the trigger. Go get Napier or similar. This may salvage our QB depth and use the OL for what it was built for.

[BhamDawg205]

Yea but you don't bring in a coach & tell him don't run his offense. That's just not practical.

But a good coach adapts to his current team. Joe has proven he's can't or too stubborn to.

[Todd4State]

But a good coach adapts to his current team. Joe has proven he's can't or too stubborn to.

Then why would our fans want a QB they has been proven to be a worse passer and roughly the same as a runner in KT? Even in a run first offense you would still take Shrader over KT.

It’s not adapt to the upper class players. It’s adapt to who the best players on your team are.

[BhamDawg205]

Then why would our fans want a QB they has been proven to be a worse passer and roughly the same as a runner in KT? Even in a run first offense you would still take Shrader over KT.

It?s not adapt to the upper class players. It?s adapt to who the best players on your team are.

If Shrader, Joe's recruited QB, beat out KT in the spring or take over during the season 80-90% of fans would be ok. Shrader seems to have the intangibles, but still not ready.
KT has won and don't give the competition excuse, you play who on the schedule. Dak wasn't the the best passer, but by 2014 you could see the profession.
So Mullen didn't adapt to the roster he inherited? Hill was the best overall RB in 2018. I think Gibson has shown more than Hill. I know Gibson fumbled, but how many drives this year and last Hill refusal to pass block ended drives. Joe's has history of not putting the best players in. So did Mullen, but did adjust offense to team's strengths.

Mullen adapted until he got his Dak and now with Tasker.

[ShotgunDawg]

That includes, of course, Shotgun himself.

https://www.elitedawgs.com/showthread.php?51671-Keytaon-Thompson-Is-Currently-On-the-Field-Practicing-at-MSU

https://www.elitedawgs.com/showthread.php?51194-Keytaon-Thompson-Is-Giving-Me-Warm-amp-Fuzzies

https://www.elitedawgs.com/showthread.php?49495-Keytaon-Thompson

https://www.elitedawgs.com/showthread.php?60474-Keytaon-Thompson

Well... I don't know KT personally and don't know if he can comprehend an offense. I thought he was going to be better, but the more you saw him play, he never took a step forward.

Mostly, I'm surprised that his body never got thicker. He's essentially the same size now as he was when he got on campus.

[Hambone]

KT didn’t win shit........

He didn’t beat Lamar Jackson.... Our defense did.

He SUCKED against Steven F Austin, but our defense was the best in the country.

[Todd4State]

If Shrader, Joe's recruited QB, beat out KT in the spring or take over during the season 80-90% of fans would be ok. Shrader seems to have the intangibles, but still not ready.
KT has won and don't give the competition excuse, you play who on the schedule. Dak wasn't the the best passer, but by 2014 you could see the profession.
So Mullen didn't adapt to the roster he inherited? Hill was the best overall RB in 2018. I think Gibson has shown more than Hill. I know Gibson fumbled, but how many drives this year and last Hill refusal to pass block ended drives. Joe's has history of not putting the best players in. So did Mullen, but did adjust offense to team's strengths.

Mullen adapted until he got his Dak and now with Tasker.

Newsflash: Shrader did best KT out and 90% of our fans and probably more are OK with that.

Shrader is ahead of KT right now as a freshman. Analytically he is one of the best QB’s in the league and one of the best freshmen QB’s in the country. He has actually been better against SEC teams than he has against OOC teams.

[Todd4State]

Well... I don't know KT personally and don't know if he can comprehend an offense. I thought he was going to be better, but the more you saw him play, he never took a step forward.

Mostly, I'm surprised that his body never got thicker. He's essentially the same size now as he was when he got on campus.

I’m confused why some of our fans think he’s better? He’s just simply not. In fact he’s pretty bad. No one was jumping to get him when he was in the transfer portal.

[Ifyouonlyknew]

I’m confused why some of our fans think he’s better? He’s just simply not. In fact he’s pretty bad. No one was jumping to get him when he was in the transfer portal.

I don't think he's bad at all. I just don't think he's a good fit for this offense. I can definitely see him going to a run spread system & playing well.

[Ifyouonlyknew]

Newsflash: Shrader did best KT out and 90% of our fans and probably more are OK with that.

Shrader is ahead of KT right now as a freshman. Analytically he is one of the best QB’s in the league and one of the best freshmen QB’s in the country. He has actually been better against SEC teams than he has against OOC teams.

KT is the reason he's not playing not Shrader.

[Bubb Rubb]

Meh, QB is a crap shoot. Because LSU hot the lottery with Burrow doesn?t mean it?s always going to work that way. Hell, Burrow was underwhelming last year.