Reply With QuoteWe are 65-110-1 in the SEC since division play started worst in the WestOriginally Posted by Bubb Rubb
Ole Miss is next at 66-110
UPig then comes in at 80-94-2 (1-15 the last 2 seasons)
I think this is a good point and really says something about Mullen. When you have established Sr playmakers like TR and Perk who have worked hard and demonstrated nothing but good attitudes, it's a tough call just to bench them. All I'm saying is, I wouldn't want to have to make that choice. It was frustrating at times, but a big part of me admires the fact that he didn't just cast TR and Perk aside. He was repaying loyalty with loyalty.
To all of you who say "It's his job to play the best players"... well, you're wrong. It's his job to put our program in the best position to succeed and sustain success. Sometimes that may entail rewarding hard work and dedication above all else. The bottom line is that we like to simplify Mullen's decisions into black and white, but in reality he is juggling a much more nuanced, complex system than any of us give him credit for. Any of us in the professional world can vouch: Politics matter. Culture matters. Alot. It is never as simple as A > B so A is the correct answer.
We are 65-110-1 in the SEC since division play started worst in the West
Ole Miss is next at 66-110
UPig then comes in at 80-94-2 (1-15 the last 2 seasons)
Last edited by Coach34; 12-12-2013 at 05:19 PM.
Walk like the King or walk like you don't care who the King is
Good post.
SO much fail in this little diatribe.
Yes, Mullen makes his decisions based on the prior week's practice. I'm guessing you were never an athlete. I was. I know there are guys who light it up in practice, but tighten up and choke when it's game time. Beyond that, it's one thing to look good in practice versus something far less than your first team going full out, and quite another to get the job done against a quality opponent giving their all.
As far as Sobiesk is concerned, prior to the Egg Bowl, he was 2-3 on attempts under 40 yards. Bell was 5-9 under 40 yards. Let that sink in. You can say Sobiesk had a bad Egg Bowl, but you can say Bell had a bad OSU, Auburn, Troy, & Arky, and that's being charitable, as Bell has the leg to hit from 40+, while Sobiesk doesn't. If you include attempts at 40+. Bell sets a record for sucking. Sobiesk should have been given a chance at the sub-40 yarders much earlier and much more often. As early as the Troy game, Bell was 2-5 on sub-40 yarders, yet got 6 more sub-40 attempts before the Egg Bowl. Sobiesk got one attempt at Troy and made it. He got one attempt at SCar and made it. Now throw in the Bell punting fiascoes and it becomes even more of a head-scratcher.
Got that, YOU BRAINDEAD MFER?
Dan has seemed to have many more questionable play-calls than the opposing coach, with the possible exception of Bucky.
You calling wins over this years Arky, "a huge win" is pretty pathetic. It was "huge" only in the sense we actually needed to beat that screwed up mess of a tea, in order to keep our bowl hopes and potential .500 season alive. We barely did. While we can call any win over our Rival, "huge" due to the nature of the rivalry, let's not confuse that with being a "quality win". OM was vastly overrated, just as they were last year.
So you're suggesting Dan is the best we can do because he won't often lose to the teams we have no business losing to? Really?? Have all the years of frustration, the Maines, etc beat you down to the point that you're wooly over winning those games?
How freaking sad is that?
Coach, we were a ****-hair from losing to BGSU, Arky & OM, thus finishing 3-9. That is not a stretch. BGSU dropped a pass that would have put them in position to beat us at the end. As stated, we then beat the 2 last place teams in OT. That kind of performance should not inspire confidence. I'll give you that BGSU is a good team, but again, they had to drop an easy pass to lose to us. I expected more from Dan than "more of the same" from last year. DP & JRob make that possible, and I'm optimistic about our upcoming season. But I'm not confident Dan won't find a way to lose when he shouldn't, like he did in previous games where we "took our foot off the gas way too early", or continue to stick with a guy on game day when he's proven time & again he is not up to the task at hand.
Mullen overall has done a pretty good job but anyone who can't see that its MUCH, MUCH easier to win at MSU than it has been historically in the past is just not looking at the situation honestly. Heck, I was there in the early 80s and have seen everything since and the facilities we used to have compared to the rest of the conference was like High School. We almost NEVER got on TV and what is considered "rural" Starkville today is almost a metropolis compared to what used to be there. Also, really before Sherrill, we had little to no history of winning and no belief we COULD win. Post-Sherrill most of that has changed and though we know we still have our hurdles most all MSU fans believe we can produce a fairly consistent winner with a quality coach. Now, on top of all that add in the lifting tide of the SEC where we are now expected to beat pretty much ANY team from a non-BCS conference and it should be clear that our floor IS much higher than it used to be. Yes, it may still be as hard for us to win the SEC as its ever been but it is nowhere near as difficult to field a competitive, bowl type team at MSU as it used to be.
So you're telling me Russell/Perkins were chokers? Again, I defer to the coaches. Suspensions, injuries, etc. support ME, not you.
Just shut up about the kicking stuff. You look dumb.
No, he hasn't. Bucky is a good coach too, though, since you mention him.
No, they weren't. And Arkansas has a pulse, and were a tough team at home. Various other teams struggle with them up there. LSU was very lucky to beat them in Death Valley. It was a HUGE win, especially considering the history.
**And if you start the 'LSU isn't good' crap to discredit Ole Miss and Arkansas, go f*ck yourself, really**
Do you realize what you just said you f*cking idiot???? You just contradicted yourself. I don't know if he's the best we can do. But he's pretty damn good.
What's sad is people like you running down our football program. You absolutely cannot be satisfied. Might want to figure out that little personal problem there, pal, before you go criticizing other people, who are working their tails off for success.
Let me ask you this, did you become CEO of whatever company you worked for in five years? Competing for championships don't happen over night esp when you that school has never competed before on a regular bases
Last edited by WinningIsRelentless; 12-12-2013 at 06:13 PM.
duplicate
Last edited by maroonmania; 12-12-2013 at 07:58 PM. Reason: duplicate
We had 12 starters returning to start this season. We then lost 2 of those guys in the 1st half of Game 1. Then apparently our F/S partially tore his ACL in the same game. THEN, we lost that F/S's back-up for the season in the same game in Arrington. We effectively entered Game 2 of this season with only 10 starters from the previous season- and our green Secondary had already suffered 2 season ending injuries, a partially torn ACL, and a high ankle sprain from our best returning CB.
We had a very young team get better all season long- despite the injuries. We didn't have a veteran team returning. We played one of the toughest schedules in the nation- if not THE toughest- This was a prime situation for us to not make it back to a bowl game. But we did. We accomplished something the Florida's and Tennessee's couldn't- despite all their advantages.
Too many people- like yourself- just look at each season like they begin at the same place every year. Or that State and Bama begin at the same place and the same spot every year. It's not like that. You have to look at where WE started THIS season, the journey along the way from Sept-November, and the shape of the program moving forward.
Walk like the King or walk like you don't care who the King is
Stop avoiding his question regarding Mizzou, Florida and Tennessee. Those are SEC schools.
The thing is, it's not an all or nothing deal. Like people in general and jobs in general, most coaches do better in certain situations than others. What our fans need to open their eyes to are Dan's strengths and weaknesses. Both sides are over the top and off the mark. Dan has learned Urban Meyer's system and implements it well, but he clearly didn't invent it and clearly doesn't do well adjusting it to personnel that don't fit it well. That weakness has showed, but will now turn into a strength since the personnel (Dak, JRob) have arrived. Dan is also a stubborn SOB, and how that plays out depends alot on our AD. You cannot give a personality type like Mullen free reign. He HAS to report to somebody, or he will never face up to mistakes, and will never improve. And when you need improvement in clock management etc, being too stubborn to improve will kill many a season. There's no point in debating it right now, this is Dan's job to lose now. If he overcomes his stubbornness enough to improve the areas where he has SUCKED for several seasons now, then he should become a very good coach. If not, he's the next Joe Lee Dunn. Nothing left to do but sit back and watch, and see which happens.
Allyn McKeen was not successful from 1938 - 1947? 65-19 is successful last I looked.
Also Sewannee was a charter member of the SEC and old Southern League against us. They never won a SEC game.
We beat Ole Miss and we made a bowl. No one wants him fired right now.
as was noted- the owner of this magazine is a Rebel
Walk like the King or walk like you don't care who the King is
..I've ever read here & that's saying something:
You always post cynical crap that downplays any accomplishment Mullen & this team may achieve (you just don't usually write a novel in expressing it).Originally Posted by blacklistedbully
Anybody who assumes those who feel Mullen may not be our best option going forward is stupid, is, well, stupid!
You gotta love it when a poster thinks his position is so undeniable that for anyone to have an opposing opinion is "stupid".
Personally, I was as pro-Mullen as a fan could get, and defended him rigorously to OM fans for the first 3.5 years. And I'm not one of those who is frustrated with him simply because we've not had as good a record as I'd hoped.
My frustration, one that is shared by many MSU fans is the way we have stumbled the past season and 1/2. It's the insistence on playing TR with just Perk in the backfield, and running Perk over & over between the tackles for little-to-no-gain, or alternatively TR keeping and running for little-to-no-gain. It's the consistently horrible ST play, of which Mullen is the coach. It's the failed-Bell-FG attempt after failed-Bell-FG-attempt, after failed-Bell-FG attempt, after failed Bell-FG attempt before he finally realized, as everybody else had done weeks earlier, that Bell is a choker, plain & simple.
When we looked our best this year, it was with DP at QB and JR or Shumpert in the backfield to run between the tackles. I wish I could credit Mullen for making the wise decision to do that, but the reality is, he was forced to do it due to injuries to TR & Perk. Even after DP & JRob showed us what they could do, Mullen still insisted on giving the bulk of the carries to Perk, not using him much the way we all know he should be used, receiving the ball in space, not running between the tackles.
As much as it is great that we've had a relatively good run the past 4 seasons (by MSU standards), I am still frustrated that DM did not, IMO consistently put the best players in the best position to succeed. He made far too many crucial bad decisions, in personnel and play-calling that cost is in close losses or kept an opponent closer than perhaps they should have been in close wins.
I'll tell you what seems silly to me, and that's fans who see 2 overtime wins over the 2 last-place teams in the West as some kind of validation that they were right to criticize those of us who've become disenchanted with Dan.
And as far as the bowl streak goes, I'm very happy we have it, and as long as Dan is our coach, I'll go into every season rooting for him and our team to succeed. But let's not ignore the fact that it's much easier to get into a bowl these days, and the recent rush of money we get from our SEC association helps us to beat most of those teams that are getting us bowl eligible.
We should beat Alcorn State, Troy, BGSU, UK, a really bad Arky and a vastly overrated OM. That shouldn't be viewed as some great accomplishment, given our resource advantage over all but Arky & OM. And do not sell short the impact Arky's woes have had on our ability to qualify for a bowl.
We should beat JSU, USA, Troy, Middle Tenn, a WAY down Tenn, a WAY down Auburn and a WAY down Arky. But we often looked like shit doing it last year, and continued to do the same things on offense this year that made us look like shit last year. The exception was mostly what we saw when DP came in after TR got injured and when JRob (and to a lessor degree" Shumpert) came in when Perk got hurt.
What scares me about Dan going forward is his apparent inability to see who is better personnel-wise, his at times mind-boggling gameday play-calling decisions and the horrific condition of our ST, of which he is the coach.
Am I supposed to forget all of that frustration simply because he narrowly beat a really bad Arky in OT and squeeked by an overrated OM at home in OT to get to .500 when added to wins over out-gunned Alcorn State, Troy, BGSU, & UK? Am I supposed to forget that his play-calling late in the Auburn game cost us our best chance at beating a top team, one that will now play for the NC?
I'm not saying it's all bad. I'm not even saying it's not mostly good. He's been good at developing our players, good at identifying talent in the recruiting process, great at sparking interest in our program, great at increasing expectations, etc. But if he's going to be successful in the SEC West, he's got to get MUCH, MUCH better at putting the right guys in, and in the best position to win.
Auburn is really good again. Arky is on their way back, they will not stay down. Even UK seems to be doing well on the recruiting trail, so they may soon be more than competitive. If we're going to continue to make bowl games, if we're going to consistently be more than a .500 team that beats up on the softer part of our schedule, we have to find a way to beat really good SEC teams.
What about the past 2 games makes you so sure Dan is the guy to accomplish that?
The UPIg win & The OM win were miraculous achievements that pulled our football program out of the shit pile, placed MUllen back in good standing with the fanbase, & united the fanbase which was severely fractured when we were 4-6.
If you can't appreciate what has transpired concerning MSU football over the last 3 weeks, & insist on knocking it by writing all the negative crap you always post here, then take your ass over to sixpackspeak.com. They love your style of "journalism."
I agree that we had some tough breaks, especially on the defensive side of the ball. However, like myself, many are frustrated with the offense. If Mullen was as billed, this would be our strength. But he has shit running down his leg with a awful stench, while stomping around the room demanding to know who farted.
My opinion and limited knowledge says that Mullen's personality does not allow for good cohesion between the staff and players. His stubbornness hampers his development. Just take the Cam, Sallach and Angelo situations. Plus it's well known that he does not trust nor seek the input of his staff...has a hard time being HC vs a coach. Hopefully, experience will correct much of this.
My biggest concern is with his offensive philosophy. I see it as a antiquated version of the spread, no evolution. It particularly lacks speed and creativity. It he does not update his system, we will need five QBs, because he will continue to get them hurt. Whether it's running backs or bubble screens to slot guys, he has to get past the QB running the ball or cover the sins of his offense. I suggest he study Malzahn in depth.
Ok, I was trying to play nice, but since you insist on being a complete, bumbling moronic jackass, I'll play along.
It's losers like you that can't win a debate on merits that start the "personal attack" BS. You think it hides your lack of intelligence, when in reality, it highlights it. You just aren't competent enough to do it civilly, so out pour the "f*cking idiot's", "you're dumb", "you're stupid", juvenile antics.
I never said TR or Perk were chokers. I did infer Bell is a choker. TR is a matter of Dan trying to force a square peg into a round hole, combined with a guy (TR) who has great character and leadership qualities, but he also continued to struggle on the field by being too slow on his progressions and not throwing to targets before their break. I think TR got frustrated with being a non-running QB playing in a system that requires the QB to be a real running threat. I think he sometimes tried too hard to prove he could succeed in that system, by "hanging in tough" willing to take the hit, but giving up crucial sacks, or scrambling for little-to-no-gain. Perk is another high-character, leader-type, but for as much as I loved the guy, he was not at all effective running the ball between the tackles, yet that is how Mullen mostly used him. I would have loved to see a lot more of Perk in the slot, or possibly optioning Perk on the edges with Dak as QB. This is what I meant by Dan not putting the right guys in position to succeed. TR throwing for a bunch of yards is not what I meant by succeed if those 70 yards he got on a drive are negated because he took a sack on 3rd down that pushed us back out of FG range.
"Just shut up about the kicking stuff. You look dumb." What a well-thought-out, intelligent reply to the facts I gave you. I may "look dumb" to you, but you, sir are certifiably dumb.
Arky. You ridiculous moron. Home field advantage is worth about 3 points. Some Arky scores:
52-0
52-7
20 point loss to a badly struggling UF.
They scored a lot on TAMU. Who didn't?
Of their 9 losses, only 3 were close. 2 of those were us & Rutgers, both teams who have struggled this year despite being bowl-bound.
LSU is good, but inconsistent. There is simply no way you can compare their effort versus us to their effort over OM. Ironically, the LSU game we played was one of the more impressive efforts until the wheels came off the wagon late. But don't accuse me of saying something I didn't say. It just further proves what a complete imbecile you are. Ole Miss was overrated this year. Do you really want to argue that point??
You're either drunk, incompetent or both if you somehow get from my statement that I'm "contradicting myself", That statement is just so over-the-top stupid that there isn't even an opportunity to point out it's flaw. It's that disconnected and useless.
I've been a rabid fan since the early 80s, and have only criticized our team when I feel it's honest & justified. I do it on message boards like this much the same as I would at a party, just casual conversation & debate. Debate I keep respectful until some moron like you takes it in another direction. You see, intelligent, decent people can disagree respectfully. Assholes like you don't seem capable. In my experience that's more often than not a sign that the asshole-in-question (you) is self-aware enough to know he's a bit of a dumbass, therefore needs to mask his inefficiencies in loud, boastful talk and/or insults. What makes this even funnier is I got accused by other fans of being "too optimistic" earlier in the season. You want to accuse me of "running down our program" and "never being satisfied", yet I was absolutely thrilled with our program & Mullen until I saw what we did last year, AND followed it up with this year.
Last year, I was defending Dan & staff during our win streak over soft teams by saying & believing Dan was just being conservative so he wouldn't show his hand too early to the good teams. That turned out to not be true. I started getting frustrated then. But coming into this season, I was again optimistic, more than most because I didn't think there was any way Mullen would continue to roll with TR at QB, Perk as the sole Rb, and running Perk between the tackles over & over & over again. I convinced myself that there was simply no way Dan could review what happened in the last half of last year, AND DO THE SAME THING AGAIN! But he did, and more. He added the Bell debacle to that shitastic formula.
THAT, more than anything is why I am frustrated with Dan. Because he will take something that has failed repeatedly, rarely ever succeeding, and run it again & again, almost as if he's thinking to himself, "It'll work this time because there's no way they'll expect me to dial that shit up again! I'll catch 'em by surprise."
Last edited by blacklistedbully; 12-12-2013 at 09:27 PM.
A lot of what you said is just not true. There's no reasoning with someone like you. Your mind is made up. Sadly.
If this were a debate, blacklisted is kicking ass in this thread.
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