Shapen listed as probable today

[MoreCowbell]

Going by the last 11 games I would let Shapen play the first series then Kamario play the next 2 quarters then give Shapen the last 2 series. We would score 40.

[Coach34]

I like what Jackie did when he had 2 QB's that should play. Let the starter play the 1st 2 drives then the other go in for the 3rd drive. After 2 drives you have a pretty good idea of what the defense is doing

[TrapGame]

I am willing to bet Shapen does not play more than one quarter. He will not be 100% by any stretch and that defense is going to pin their ears back and come after him.

[shoeless joe]

the correct answer for this team at this moment is to play both. and depending on the situations and the defense you make a decision about which gives us the best chance to win. unfortunately our HC has shown over and over and over and over again that he doesn't have the skillset to have any inkling of what needs to be done when when it comes to players, play calls, etc...

if it was me, i start shapen and as soon as the O bogs down i bring in KT and roll with him until it bogs down giving him at least 2 series to work. then go from there.

i am definitely on the bandwagon of "KT needs more snaps than he's had" (before the georgia game of course). but all these stats being thrown around are dumb because of a couple of factors:

1. how many more TDs would shapen have accounted for if we didn't bring KT in inside the 5 to run it in...then of course his disciples scream that he has so many TDs
2. our O line sucks...but multiple sacks are the fault of shapen and not the line. yes they suck. but things can be done to counteract that by the QB and of course the play caller...neither do any of the things that would benefit us in this regard.

[Pancho]

does the veer and shoot have any plays to counter a 7 man in the box and the ALL come scheme?

[StarkVegasSteve]

I like what Jackie did when he had 2 QB's that should play. Let the starter play the 1st 2 drives then the other go in for the 3rd drive. After 2 drives you have a pretty good idea of what the defense is doing

This is probably the best strategy. If we don't score on the first two drives we're in trouble anyways. That also allows us 2 scripted drives in the first 3 series and we are MARKEDLY better on scripted drives because it allows us to go fast and not take time for plays to be called in to the QB.

[Coach34]

does the veer and shoot have any plays to counter a 7 man in the box and the ALL come scheme?

Well if we have any screens in the playbook besides the Now pass out wide we need to use them this week

Tunnel, TB, Screen throwback, double screen...all of them

[StarkVegasSteve]

does the veer and shoot have any plays to counter a 7 man in the box and the ALL come scheme?

It kind of depends what the D is going to do. Are they playing cover 2? Are they man up? Are the DBs bailing?

1. If they are cover 2 then you get Thompson running and hope he either out runs the safety and Blake places the ball far enough out there or you try to quickly fit it in the gap between the corner and safety.

2. If they are man then you either are going to hit Booth out of the backfield, quick slant to Brennen or Ant, or hope one of them gets over the top

3. If they are bailing I'd slip Booth into the flat or leak Seydou or West out the back door.

[MaroonFlounder]

O-Line ain't gonna cut it with Shapen in there.

This feels like a loss.

[Todd4State]

KT wasn't sacked. He hasn't been sacked yet.

KT has thrown 19 passes. That number is extremely skewed.

I love how you conveniently ignored the large amount of turnovers your boy has.

Here's some stats for you, when pressured:

Shapen - 42.9% | 339 Passing Yards | 2 TDs | 4 INTs | PFF OFF: 37.2 | Pass: 42.9 | Run: 42.9 | Fumble: 24.9 | Passer Rating: 45.6

KT - 66.7% | 110 Passing Yards | 2 TDs | 0 INTs | PFF OFF: 86.7 | Pass: 75.7 | Run: 76.2 | Fumble: 65.6 | Passer Rating: 149.3

You know since our OL sucks so bad and all, maybe play the QB that can actually handle the pressure.

KT has 34 carries and 200 Yards rushing with 5 TDs.

I love how you admit that the stats are skewed but then you use stats anyway. And yes, according to ESPN KT was sacked once. Take that up with them.

[Todd4State]

I like what Jackie did when he had 2 QB's that should play. Let the starter play the 1st 2 drives then the other go in for the 3rd drive. After 2 drives you have a pretty good idea of what the defense is doing

I hated that. I don't remember it ever working once when Jackie did it and it usually got the offense out of rhythm and resulted in a three and out.

[Todd4State]

does the veer and shoot have any plays to counter a 7 man in the box and the ALL come scheme?

That should leave at least two receivers man on man so yes, we should be able to find something even if it's a slant.

[CoachT14]

I love how you admit that the stats are skewed but then you use stats anyway. And yes, according to ESPN KT was sacked once. Take that up with them.

I love how you ignore all the statistical evidence that shows your boy is an awful QB and can only cherry pick 1 phantom sack that didn't happen and completion percentage on 19 throws despite everyone telling you that anyone who's seen KT play know he's not inaccurate in the least.

[CoachT14]

Shapen: 8 TDs in SEC play to 10 turnovers in 400 snaps.

KT: 7 TDs in SEC play to 0 turnovers in 58 snaps.

[Todd4State]

I love how you ignore all the statistical evidence that shows your boy is an awful QB and can only cherry pick 1 phantom sack that didn't happen and completion percentage on 19 throws despite everyone telling you that anyone who's seen KT play know he's not inaccurate in the least.

Accuses me of ignoring statistical evidence. Then ignores KT's 57% completion percentage including 40% against Arkansas in the game some claimed he "won". You're also ignoring multiple missed reads and some throws that were closer to fans than any of our receivers.

Now Shapen isn't "my boy". It's absolutely stupid that MSU fans try to make factions over stupid things. I have constantly said that we should play both. Lebby agrees with me. Cole Cubelic who knows a hell of a lot more about football than you also agrees with me. I want both KT and Shapen to succeed because they are MSU players and them doing well means that MSU is doing well. But I'm more objective than you. Shapen should start now unless he is hurt. KT should come in and give him a break every now and then. I get pissed off as much as anyone at Shapen when he makes mistakes he shouldn't. He still makes fewer than KT. KT has a crazy high ceiling and he is special and is going to win a lot of games for us. But he is missing reads left and right and most of his passing yards against Georgia came on one play to Thompson. Also Shapen has led us to two fourth quarter comeback wins this year. Sure, KT did his part but Shapen was the one throwing the winning TD's.

[Todd4State]

Shapen: 8 TDs in SEC play to 10 turnovers in 400 snaps.

KT: 7 TDs in SEC play to 0 turnovers in 58 snaps.

Yeah. And now many of those were because Shapen got us down to the goal line and KT ran it in or threw a 1 yard pass?

[Coach34]

Shapen: 8 TDs in SEC play to 10 turnovers in 400 snaps.

KT: 7 TDs in SEC play to 0 turnovers in 58 snaps.

arent 3 of those TD's from inside the 5 after Shapen got us all the way down the field?

[CoachT14]

Accuses me of ignoring statistical evidence. Then ignores KT's 57% completion percentage including 40% against Arkansas in the game some claimed he "won". You're also ignoring multiple missed reads and some throws that were closer to fans than any of our receivers.

Now Shapen isn't "my boy". It's absolutely stupid that MSU fans try to make factions over stupid things. I have constantly said that we should play both. Lebby agrees with me. Cole Cubelic who knows a hell of a lot more about football than you also agrees with me. I want both KT and Shapen to succeed because they are MSU players and them doing well means that MSU is doing well. But I'm more objective than you. Shapen should start now unless he is hurt. KT should come in and give him a break every now and then. I get pissed off as much as anyone at Shapen when he makes mistakes he shouldn't. He still makes fewer than KT. KT has a crazy high ceiling and he is special and is going to win a lot of games for us. But he is missing reads left and right and most of his passing yards against Georgia came on one play to Thompson. Also Shapen has led us to two fourth quarter comeback wins this year. Sure, KT did his part but Shapen was the one throwing the winning TD's.

Lol I've explained my statistics. You keep parroting 57% completion % in limited throws as some type of evidence he's an inaccurate passer. Carry on.

[Lord McBuckethead]

In the last game Shapen was sacked 1 more time than KT. And by the way, Shapen has already been sacked 31 times- 6 more than he has any season of his career and we still have two games left.

Our issue isn't Shapen. It isn't him holding onto the ball too long. And it sure as hell isn't his lack of mobility. It's our offensive line absolutely sucks. And KT's lack of accuracy offsets the production from his legs relative to what Shapen gives us in terms of accuracy.

Agreed. The issue isn't Shapen. It is the OL. Kamario offsets the OL issue, but then doesn't have the accuracy. But the more he plays the better he is going to be on that front, as the nerves gets calmed.

[CoachT14]

arent 3 of those TD's from inside the 5 after Shapen got us all the way down the field?

Is a TD a TD or not?