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[Cooterpoot]

Finally a take we agree on lol

Though I think we needed a Friday starter more than Montgomery. Montgomery is probably a bigger "failure", just because we had so much going for us.

Stephens was crushed in two games Indiana and Ole Miss. Outside of that, the ERA was 3.30.

But he was the Purdue Friday night guy. At MSU, he is long relief. He would not be extended or expected to eat innings versus a bad match-up team.

He's going to compete for a starting spot

[Coach34]

Wouldn't throw Siary with that bunch. His stats this summer:

7G 34.2IP 23H 5ER 5-0 1.30ERA 11BB 34K

It blows my mind that our fans cant grasp that us throwing 5 true freshmen out there to the SEC wolves was going to end badly. And then they dont seem to understand that these guys should improve as Soph's.

[Commercecomet24]

It blows my mind that our fans cant grasp that us throwing 5 true freshmen out there to the SEC wolves was going to end badly. And then they dont seem to understand that these guys should improve as Soph's.

This. For every level you go up there?s an adjustment period to the speed of the game, and the only way to get better is to take your lumps and learn We have talented players the question is can they adjust, but the talent and the potential is certainly there.

[the_real_MSU_is_us]

Wouldn't throw Siary with that bunch. His stats this summer:

7G 34.2IP 23H 5ER 5-0 1.30ERA 11BB 34K

Vs what competition? These summer leagues vary greatly

[the_real_MSU_is_us]

It blows my mind that our fans cant grasp that us throwing 5 true freshmen out there to the SEC wolves was going to end badly. And then they dont seem to understand that these guys should improve as Soph's.

Everyone understands that!

But players tend to improve year over year- they don't make massive jumps out of nowhere. These Fr will get 1 offseason with a real pitching coach, that's it. Then they'll be thrown to the wolves like they wer elast year. It's just not much time for Parker to fix things

[Homedawg]

Siary is a pen guy. Strike thrower but not elite stuff. Not dogging him but not a high ceiling. But like his competitiveness

[Homedawg]

Everyone understands that!

But players tend to improve year over year- they don't make massive jumps out of nowhere. These Fr will get 1 offseason with a real pitching coach, that's it. Then they'll be thrown to the wolves like they wer elast year. It's just not much time for Parker to fix things

Not saying this is goi g to happen but here's an example of improving .... Uber talented Dakota Hudson pitched here his Jr year AFTER he had his scholarship yanked. A year later he was a 1st rounder. People get better. Heck, from all our first round pitchers thru the years, jay Powell was by far the best his fr year. Bj Wallace was raw and meh. Loewer, same. Ginter couldn't throw strikes. Ethan small couldn't get anyone out ... then blew his arm out. It's not rare fr struggle in this league. Matter of fact, it's more common than being good as a fr. Even today.
Eta
Mahlom was good as a fr. Dubose was good but made a jump the next year to greater heights. Keep this in mind- the guy people are losing their mind over losing, Holman , pitched 19 innings as a fr and didn't make a start until March this year!!!

[Homedawg]

Vs what competition? These summer leagues vary greatly

He wasn't in the toughest of leagues. But at least he did well, where he was. All you can hope. If you aren't in the cape it's hard to gauge. Yet we have fans complaint that Hunter is hitting 250 w a wood bat in the toughest league by a mile.

[the_real_MSU_is_us]

Not saying this is goi g to happen but here's an example of improving .... Uber talented Dakota Hudson pitched here his Jr year AFTER he had his scholarship yanked. A year later he was a 1st rounder. People get better. Heck, from all our first round pitchers thru the years, jay Powell was by far the best his fr year. Bj Wallace was raw and meh. Loewer, same. Ginter couldn't throw strikes. Ethan small couldn't get anyone out ... then blew his arm out. It's not rare fr struggle in this league. Matter of fact, it's more common than being good as a fr. Even today.

Absolutely big jumps are possible, sometimes things just"click". I'm saying that far more rare than a steady slow improvement most guys follow

[smootness]

Not saying this is goi g to happen but here's an example of improving .... Uber talented Dakota Hudson pitched here his Jr year AFTER he had his scholarship yanked. A year later he was a 1st rounder. People get better. Heck, from all our first round pitchers thru the years, jay Powell was by far the best his fr year. Bj Wallace was raw and meh. Loewer, same. Ginter couldn't throw strikes. Ethan small couldn't get anyone out ... then blew his arm out. It's not rare fr struggle in this league. Matter of fact, it's more common than being good as a fr. Even today.
Eta
Mahlom was good as a fr. Dubose was good but made a jump the next year to greater heights.

All this is no doubt true. The issue is not that these guys are unable to improve. You can point to plenty of guys who were great but struggled initially. But you can point to more who just continued to struggle. And we do not have essentially anyone we know we can count on going into next year. We need EVERYONE, or at least quite a few, to take big jumps at the same time. Possible, but seems quite unlikely.

[the_real_MSU_is_us]

Vs what competition? These summer leagues vary greatly

Found it.

https://pgcbl.com/2023-east-division-preview/

So teamates with Wakes SS, a Bama commit, and a guy from each of Maryland, Utah, and Pitt. The article mentions returning pitchers for his team (Mohawks) and they're from Fairfield, Cornell, Brown, and New Haven. Scanned down the article and didnt see any SEC svhools repped at pitcher. So I'm going to say that, wake SS asside, the league he's in is not full of top tier talent.

Well see what he's got next spring, maybe he's made a big jump maybe he's just striking out Fairfield hitters. There's not much point reading into summer stats either way

[Homedawg]

All this is no doubt true. The issue is not that these guys are unable to improve. You can point to plenty of guys who were great but struggled initially. But you can point to more who just continued to struggle. And we do not have essentially anyone we know we can count on going into next year. We need EVERYONE, or at least quite a few, to take big jumps at the same time. Possible, but seems quite unlikely.

I'm not counting on all of them taking a jump. However, I find it hard to believe that none of them do. Which is basically what happpened last year. And we get auger and Simmons back. Auger was starting to be a guy before he got hurt in 22. We have legit arms in Holcombe, loo, and loftin. Loftin has never been a great strike thrower. Up down up down. But the potential is there. We will be better in the bump. How much? I don't know that more than you. Either way, we either win or lem is gone. Lem is here for 24 let's hope Parker makes them better or they have natural progression

[Homedawg]

Found it.

https://pgcbl.com/2023-east-division-preview/

So teamates with Wakes SS, a Bama commit, and a guy from each of Maryland, Utah, and Pitt. The article mentions returning pitchers for his team (Mohawks) and they're from Fairfield, Cornell, Brown, and New Haven. Scanned down the article and didnt see any SEC svhools repped at pitcher. So I'm going to say that, wake SS asside, the league he's in is not full of top tier talent.

Well see what he's got next spring, maybe he's made a big jump maybe he's just striking out Fairfield hitters. There's not much point reading into summer stats either way

Stated in post above. ....

[Coach34]

Keep this in mind- the guy people are losing their mind over losing, Holman , pitched 19 innings as a fr and didn't make a start until March this year!!!

Holman had a 5.68 ERA as a Freshman- throwing just 6.2 innings vs SEC teams allowing 4 earned runs. Made quite the jump as a Soph didnt he to Friday night SP?

[the_real_MSU_is_us]

Holman had a 5.68 ERA as a Freshman- throwing just 6.2 innings vs SEC teams allowing 4 earned runs. Made quite the jump as a Soph didnt he to Friday night SP?

He did make quite the jump!

And how many others did Bama have make such a jump? Oh, it was just him? Most of the giys what sucked last year failed to turn into studs this year?

Again, big jumps are 100% possible. They're also the minority. So for Loftin/Loo/Holcombe/Siary/insert Fr here, we might get 1 "Holman" from them if we're lucky, maybe 2 more "solid reliever" type jumps from the rest, but the odds of us getting as many big jumps as we need are quite low.

For example, LSU has just as much -if not more- pure arm talent on their roster. Did Jay Johnson trust they'd make the jumps he needs? No- he went out and got Tulanes ace, Bamas ace, another Bama transfer, a highly thought of prospect from UCLA, and they tried to get Burns. Why all this bother? Because he knows he can't rely on existing guys making huge jumps.

[SilentSteel16]

Bunch of y’all sound like the old guys at the gas station arguing about if it is going to rain or not…. If you are on the field as a true freshman, in the SEC, you will be a very solid performer for your career. Montgomery is a win if we get him, the more arms you get the better. Parker will be better than Fox. The rest is spilled milk. Hail State and have a great day.

[the_real_MSU_is_us]

Bunch of y’all sound like the old guys at the gas station arguing about if it is going to rain or not…. If you are on the field as a true freshman, in the SEC, you will be a very solid performer for your career. Montgomery is a win if we get him, the more arms you get the better. Parker will be better than Fox. The rest is spilled milk. Hail State and have a great day.

Bud if you put me on that mound I promise you I won't turn into a "very solid performer". We played guys we had no business playing due to lack of arms, not because those Fr forced themselves onto the field due to raw talent

[SilentSteel16]

Bud if you put me on that mound I promise you I won't turn into a "very solid performer". We played guys we had no business playing due to lack of arms, not because those Fr forced themselves onto the field due to raw talent

But did you step foot on the mound?? Kind of a moot point there.

Fact of the matter is this, there is a MAJOR step up from HS to SEC ball, there will be a wall or hurdle every player has to get over to be successful in baseball with changing levels. There are exceptions but those are rare. The sooner you get guys on that field to get them to see that hurdle, the sooner they are over it and on the upside swing. If they aren’t that is what the transfer portal is for. You either GROW UP quick or you get out.

Whatever the reason for them being on the field does not change the fact they were on the field to realize they need to grow. They either will adjust and grow up or they will move on. This is not a bad situation to be in as a State fan. This year they saw the difference. They either make the jump or they don’t. Next year will be better or there will be massive personnel turnover in 25.

[Cooterpoot]

Making a jump isn't the problem here. It's the number of guys we need to make that jump. By whiffing on pitchers for a couple years, we're in a spot that's got us relying on a lot of jumping. Some will, some won't. Then we've got the injured guys coming back who you never know about. Lots of "ifs". But, always know, this past season was the bottom. It was the absolute bottom.

[Coach34]

Making a jump isn't the problem here. It's the number of guys we need to make that jump.

Well, we now have 5 guys with the talent to be a weekend SP. It's up to Parker now to get 3 of them ready.

We still lack LHP is my only real concern for 24