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Thread: Lem will be back

  1. #101
    Senior Member Todd4State's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by the_real_MSU_is_us View Post
    I can't believe this thread lol

    We go from universal agreement Lemonis needs to go, nicknames comparing him to Chizik etc to defending him and wanting him to return, all because we took 2/3 from a team that just lost a series to Auburn? What?

    We're worst in the conference in defense, yet Todd is defending Lemonis saying "well we're not as bad as we were". Newsflash: THE ENTIRE SEASON MATTERS! WHY DID LEMO NOT HAVE THE D READY TO GO AT THE START OF THE YEAR??

    We're one of the worst teams in the conference yet the LSU series proves something? Newsflash: THE ENTIRE SEASON MATTERS! ONE SEC SERIES DOES NOT UNDO THE FACT WERE MISSING HOOVER

    Kentucky missed the NCAA tournament for years but is now really good, therefore we shouldn't fire a coach who missed Hoover back to back? Newsflash: THIS LOGIC WOULD PREVENT ANY COACH FROM BEING FIRED IN ANY SPORT EVER INCLUDING MOORHEAD

    The mental gymnastics people here are going through to defend the decision to keep Lemo is pathetic. Do better. Just admit "Boosters don't want to pay for it" or "Selmon has no balls" or whateverthe case is. don't come here with this weak ass logic pretending keeping Lemo is actually going to work out for us next year. We all know he's in over his head.
    No one is saying he is coming back because of the LSU series. A lot of people were saying he was coming back after the Arkansas series where we looked awful. Actually a lot of people have been saying he is coming back the whole year.

    Why did we not have the defense ready to go? I guess he figured his shortstop who has been known for his defense would be himself and he figured that Alford would be better. My point is he didn't just sit there and do nothing. He made changes. We have gotten a lot better overall. Same thing happened in 2021. I don't care how the defense looked against VMI. I care how it looks at the end of the year.

    Not only that- you shouldn't judge a team on the most subjective baseball stat ever in fielding percentage.

    You want me to tell you what the case is? How about our major baseball boosters don't want to tank our baseball program because people like you are pissed off that we had a bad season because we had a shitty pitching coach. Is that clear enough for you? Because I've spelled this out several times on multiple boards and some of our fans are either baseball ignorant or they just like to bitch to bitch. Or both.

  2. #102
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    Quote Originally Posted by Todd4State View Post
    No one is saying he is coming back because of the LSU series. A lot of people were saying he was coming back after the Arkansas series where we looked awful. Actually a lot of people have been saying he is coming back the whole year.

    Why did we not have the defense ready to go? I guess he figured his shortstop who has been known for his defense would be himself and he figured that Alford would be better. My point is he didn't just sit there and do nothing. He made changes. We have gotten a lot better overall. Same thing happened in 2021. I don't care how the defense looked against VMI. I care how it looks at the end of the year.

    Not only that- you shouldn't judge a team on the most subjective baseball stat ever in fielding percentage.

    You want me to tell you what the case is? How about our major baseball boosters don't want to tank our baseball program because people like you are pissed off that we had a bad season because we had a shitty pitching coach. Is that clear enough for you? Because I've spelled this out several times on multiple boards and some of our fans are either baseball ignorant or they just like to bitch to bitch. Or both.
    "Nobody is saying he's coming back because of the LSU series"

    Maybe I should speak more clearly: we have people defending Lemonis and saying bringing him back is best for the program based on the LSU series. Youre one of them- Please link me to your comments from a week or 2 ago saying Lemonis isn't responsible for the defense? You only started post LSU and C34 has only started defending Lemonis this week.

    You seek to blame all of our defense on Alford and Forsythe. That's not true and you know it- we've seen collisions in the outfield, missed cutoff men, misplaced bunts, have the moved passed balls in the conference because we went into the season without a SEC catcher, have to play Hancock at 1B at times because Hines glove isn't ready, etc.

    And you want to call FIELDING PERCENTAGE "subjective"?? Oh come on man, this is pathetic. Yes individual plays are up to the score keeper. Yes home cooking happens on hits vs errors. But that's equal across every team and no, an entire seasons worth of data + our own eyes aren't "subjective" enough to be worst in the conference and fine with it lol

    "Our major baseball boosters don't want to tank the program"

    1) yeah it would suck if the program tanked- we might even start missing Hoover!

    2) boosters not believing we can get a good coach is a fine excuse to have Leminis back. But it's very different from actually defending Lemonis or saying this back to back crapshows aren't his fault. That's all I'm asking for- honesty. You can say "we're stuck with this guy another year" without convincing me the piss is rain.

    "We had a bad season because of a shitty pitching coach"

    1) again you downplay the situation by saying "a" bad season. It's actually back to back missing Hoover seasons.

    2) you're also downplaying the teams flaws by blaming just pitching. Again, defense is league worst. I've seen the team outright quit caring (vs Tennessee for example). Hitting is OK but is actually underperforming our recruiting rankings. The team sucked last year but somehow it didn't light a fire under them. Lemonis has had some very odd pinch hits or failures to pinch hit. We suck at fundamentals like sliding. We've got locker room issues like Alford and fights in the dugout.

    3) Lemonis hired Fox. Lemonis could have fired him after last year. Lemonis signs off on every recruit Fox picks. Lemonis is the HC and is responsible for the total team. No, I don't trust Lemonis to get the pitching fixed because he clearly doesn't know what he's looking at there.

  3. #103
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    I just wonder when Lemo all of a sudden got his new evaluating tools****. If he actually doesn't change his approach to player assessments then I feel as if the so called bad season thing will become very normal as long as he is allowed to be the HC.

  4. #104
    Senior Member Dawgface's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pancho View Post
    I just wonder when Lemo all of a sudden got his new evaluating tools****. If he actually doesn't change his approach to player assessments then I feel as if the so called bad season thing will become very normal as long as he is allowed to be the HC.
    Surely there's some free online software that will do the job. Can't be any worse than what we have now.

  5. #105
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    Anything short of parting ways with Lemonis this year is kicking the can down the road another year. People can make all the excuses they want but unless he has some kind of massive reinvention of how he approaches everything from evaluation to off-season practice I don't know how any of this changes. For people making the pitching coach argument, we had a year (2016ish but I can't remember) when we barely even had a pitching staff and we still made a regional. We're so jacked up right now that we had a team that literally had to convert a 1B to a pitcher and use its CF as a Sunday guy because we literally didn't have enough arms, yet we were still better than we are this year. Let that sink in.

    Fox was clearly not doing his job and it likely didn't just start at the beginning of the season so, yeah, that's on Lemonis. Dude should've done something about it sooner and maybe we've got 3 or 4 more wins and we aren't having this conversation.

    Also, how many times has Lemonis answered questions with "I don't know...I don't know how to fix it?" I've heard that multiple times and it is accompanied by a bewildered hopeless look. Our head coach in our most prized sport literally sat in front of a camera and microphone and said 'I dunno'. How is that defensible?

    So let's let a weekend where we beat a very flawed LSU team effect our decision.

    Dude needs to go.

    ETA: didn't mean for that to turn into a rant.

  6. #106
    Senior Member Coach34's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pancho View Post
    I just wonder when Lemo all of a sudden got his new evaluating tools****. If he actually doesn't change his approach to player assessments then I feel as if the so called bad season thing will become very normal as long as he is allowed to be the HC.
    2022- we signed the 5th ranked recruiting class
    2023- class is currently ranked 9th by PG

    The problem has been our portal pitching. We have not done a good job there for whatever reason
    Walk like the King or walk like you don't care who the King is

  7. #107
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    Quote Originally Posted by Coach34 View Post
    2022- we signed the 5th ranked recruiting class
    2023- class is currently ranked 9th by PG

    The problem has been our portal pitching. We have not done a good job there for whatever reason
    So Coach, since we have such a highly ranked class the last 2 years, why don't we have better results? We salivate at other teams that have a top 10 recruiting class and wish MSU could do that. Well, we did but the production has not been evident or consistent. doesn't this lack of production fall back to the coach? If it does fall on the HC, then shouldn't he be held accountable?

  8. #108
    Senior Member Cooterpoot's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Coach34 View Post
    2022- we signed the 5th ranked recruiting class
    2023- class is currently ranked 9th by PG

    The problem has been our portal pitching. We have not done a good job there for whatever reason
    We ran off the 2020 and 2021 classes for the most part. Two dead years. Also, those baseball recruiting rankings are boo boo. They're about as real as titties on a Housewives show.

  9. #109
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    Quote Originally Posted by Coach34 View Post
    2022- we signed the 5th ranked recruiting class
    2023- class is currently ranked 9th by PG

    The problem has been our portal pitching. We have not done a good job there for whatever reason
    So how do we do this with this tiny NIL? Everyone says we can't get talent without big NIL

    Agree on talent evaluation or talent development hasn't been good.

  10. #110
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cooterpoot View Post
    We ran off the 2020 and 2021 classes for the most part. Two dead years. Also, those baseball recruiting rankings are boo boo. They're about as real as titties on a Housewives show.
    Don't disagree with this. I've said for decades, the recruiting rankings are so so in every sport to a degree. Sure the top 50 players are hard to miss on but even them we have missed on.

    The fanatics perspective is mental. One minute we such in recruiting because of low ranking. Next minute we can't get recruits because of NIL. Next it is rankings are BS when we do have a high ranking. Next it is we got a suck coach even though we pay them top NCAA money. Next we can't get a good coach because we want pay them.

    Anyone see a pattern here?

  11. #111
    Senior Member sandjunky's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Coach34 View Post
    2022- we signed the 5th ranked recruiting class
    2023- class is currently ranked 9th by PG

    The problem has been our portal pitching. We have not done a good job there for whatever reason
    You know how you raise your pg grade? Spend more money doing pg events - I?ve watched it first hand

  12. #112
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dawgface View Post
    Surely there's some free online software that will do the job. Can't be any worse than what we have now.
    Would an AI robot HC be cheaper?****

  13. #113
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    Quote Originally Posted by Extendedcab View Post
    So Coach, since we have such a highly ranked class the last 2 years, why don't we have better results? We salivate at other teams that have a top 10 recruiting class and wish MSU could do that. Well, we did but the production has not been evident or consistent. doesn't this lack of production fall back to the coach? If it does fall on the HC, then shouldn't he be held accountable?
    2020 and 2021 were a complete miss. Our freshman class this year is really good. We finally have recruited an SEC quality SS to come in this Fall. Stacking classes and getting some good pieces from the portal is what it takes
    Walk like the King or walk like you don't care who the King is

  14. #114
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    Quote Originally Posted by Todd4State View Post
    No one is saying he is coming back because of the LSU series. A lot of people were saying he was coming back after the Arkansas series where we looked awful. Actually a lot of people have been saying he is coming back the whole year.

    Why did we not have the defense ready to go? I guess he figured his shortstop who has been known for his defense would be himself and he figured that Alford would be better. My point is he didn't just sit there and do nothing. He made changes. We have gotten a lot better overall. Same thing happened in 2021. I don't care how the defense looked against VMI. I care how it looks at the end of the year.

    Not only that- you shouldn't judge a team on the most subjective baseball stat ever in fielding percentage.

    You want me to tell you what the case is? How about our major baseball boosters don't want to tank our baseball program because people like you are pissed off that we had a bad season because we had a shitty pitching coach. Is that clear enough for you? Because I've spelled this out several times on multiple boards and some of our fans are either baseball ignorant or they just like to bitch to bitch. Or both.
    The program is tanked. This staff tanked it. There are no excuses for this level of tank with what we have

  15. #115
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    Quote Originally Posted by Coach34 View Post
    2022- we signed the 5th ranked recruiting class
    2023- class is currently ranked 9th by PG

    The problem has been our portal pitching. We have not done a good job there for whatever reason
    How many runs are recruiting rankings worth

  16. #116
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    first thing he needs and has failed to evaluate is pitchers with a sub 5.00 ERA capability

  17. #117
    Senior Member Dawgface's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BuckyIsAB**** View Post
    The program is tanked. This staff tanked it. There are no excuses for this level of tank with what we have
    Yep. Amazing the few here supporting him.

  18. #118
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    Quote Originally Posted by BuckyIsAB**** View Post
    How many runs are recruiting rankings worth
    either lemo knew zilch about the arms foxhall wanted or he's totally responsible for the bad evals all on his own. He is the CEO of the whole operation?

  19. #119
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    Quote Originally Posted by R2Dawg View Post
    So how do we do this with this tiny NIL? Everyone says we can't get talent without big NIL

    Agree on talent evaluation or talent development hasn't been good.
    SEC baseball is looking like SEC football for State. because of NIL.

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