A good M&W Nation artilce on Barbay's offense, what to expect, accomplishments, etc.

[Thick]

Not to mention that Barbary was Director of Player Personnel at UF - he wasn't even an on field coach. Doug Nusmeier was OC at UF

Dammit?..that?s going to leave a mark!

[yjnkdawg]

Oops. One minor detail overlooked, but then that would render the argument defenseless.

Barbay, when he was Director of Player Personnel at UF, secretly called the plays and/or gave McElwain advice on what plays to call, but don't tell anybody as it's a secret. Nothing to see here.

[BrunswickDawg]

I really don't see any relevance concerning what Florida's offense did to what Barbay will do at MSU, but keep on trolling if it makes you happy.

None at all. McElwain inherited a shitshow of a culture at UF and was still able to win the East his first two seasons. Then after the sharkfricker incident and the "death threat" incident, the school started finding ways to hobble the program so they could fire him - suspending 9 players for "miss-use of school funds", which was likely a pay for play scheme cooked up during Spurrier's era. Dude never stood a chance there with the culture and the boosters.

[Coursesuper]

Go watch film of this offense at Florida when McElwain and Barbay were there.

People grow and evolve over time. This is not really a valid point.

[HancockCountyDog]

I like this offense a lot more than what we were running, but I am concerned about the stark differences in what we are going to be doing.

I just wish we had an extra year for all of our defensive players and the OL that are coming back.

[Todd4State]

This may be me being naive I don't know. But at CMU he ran an offense like McElwain which makes sense as McElwain was the head coach.

But his offense at Appalachian State looked like what Appalachian State ran in 2021 under Frank Ponce. And it was completely different than what he ran at CMU outside of maybe a couple of formations here and there.

So given what we have I wouldn't be surprised if he runs an offense that's very similar to what we ran last year in 2022.

[662dawg]

This may be me being naive I don't know. But at CMU he ran an offense like McElwain which makes sense as McElwain was the head coach.

But his offense at Appalachian State looked like what Appalachian State ran in 2021 under Frank Ponce. And it was completely different than what he ran at CMU outside of maybe a couple of formations here and there.

So given what we have I wouldn't be surprised if he runs an offense that's very similar to what we ran last year in 2022.

This is true. I believe he's going to do what's best personal wise while adding the pistol formation & more running game to it. He seems to be that kind of coach. Young with a great innovative mind. Kind of like Arnett but on the offensive side. I bet the run pass ratio is closer to 50/50 than 55/45 run/pass which I'm perfectly fine with.

[yjnkdawg]

This may be me being naive I don't know. But at CMU he ran an offense like McElwain which makes sense as McElwain was the head coach.

But his offense at Appalachian State looked like what Appalachian State ran in 2021 under Frank Ponce. And it was completely different than what he ran at CMU outside of maybe a couple of formations here and there.

So given what we have I wouldn't be surprised if he runs an offense that's very similar to what we ran last year in 2022.

I think his play calling was somewhat restricted due to the App State HC wanting more running plays (most likely), or maybe it was due to his player personnel (less likely). However, I think he wanted to pass the ball more like he did when he was at CMU. I think, as well, that he will adapt his offense to our player personnel and strengths. I think the best offensive plan is take what the defense gives you whether that be passing or running and I think that is what he will do.

[KB21]

So there are still people who refuse to accept the fact that he runs McElwain?s system.

[Prediction? Pain.]

This may be me being naive I don't know. But at CMU he ran an offense like McElwain which makes sense as McElwain was the head coach.

But his offense at Appalachian State looked like what Appalachian State ran in 2021 under Frank Ponce. And it was completely different than what he ran at CMU outside of maybe a couple of formations here and there.

So given what we have I wouldn't be surprised if he runs an offense that's very similar to what we ran last year in 2022.

I think your observation is right on point. The '21 and '22 App. St. offenses were mirror images statistically. Here are their conference ranks for lots of offensive categories in Sun Belt games the past two years:



That makes sense for a couple of reasons. First, they brought back their starting QB from '21, who was a senior in '22, and their two leading rushers from '21. (The slight dip in the passing numbers also makes sense given that they lost their three leading receivers from '21, all of whom were seniors.)

And second, Barbay said out of the gate that his plan wasn't to change what App. St. was doing but was instead to add wrinkles while retaining what the offensive players did well. Check out this podcast interview with some App. St. dudes before the '22 season started and go to the 1-hour, 25-minute mark:

https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcas...=1000553396384

Over 5 or 10 minutes, he talks about his offensive philosophy. Most of what he says focuses on pretty common ideas -- spread people out, playmakers in space, matchup skill guys on weak defenders, tempo, being aggressive, etc. -- but a couple of other things stuck out. He emphasized his need to study what App. St. had been doing well in previous years so that he could "mesh" his ideas with the offense that was already installed. That dovetailed into his discussion of using playmakers in space and focusing on using what you have -- if your most explosive guys are three RBs, you figure out how to get them the ball in space, but if it's a bunch of WRs, you get those dudes the ball. He also mentioned how his weeks during the season were heavy on situational analytics, like what plays/schemes typically work on specific downs and distances.

I haven't watched tons of film, but looking at App. St.'s offense in '21 vs. Coastal Carolina, it indeed looks pretty similar to what the M&W Nation article says Barbay did in '22:



Barbay also mentions in one point that part of his fit at App. St. was the connection between the head coach Shawn Clark and Jim McElwain and that the overall schemes weren't too different. I didn't catch him saying what that connection was other than the fact that Clark and his staff had visited McElwain's staffs over the years to learn from him, and the only other thing I've found at a quick glance was that Clark was a GA at Louisville while McElwain coached WR there in the early 00s. I'd be interested to know exactly what wrinkles he brought with him to App. St. given the personnel he had there.

I'm of course more curious, though, about what all this means for MSU. Adding wrinkles to a system and then largely keeping intact what the players know how to do makes sense for lots of reasons, but especially so when what you've previously run is similar to what they were doing anyway. But I'm really interested to see how that translates to a team running the Leach air raid over the past three years. Barring a change in QB, and assuming that the flexible approach he touted in his interview before the '22 season is still a priority, maybe that means more continuity for us than the flavor of his '22 offense would otherwise lead us to believe? And if not, what scheme is he going with? The one from App. St. that seems to resemble what App. St. did before his arrival? Or something different? Regardless, I'm excited to watch it play out.

[Commercecomet24]

I think your observation is right on point. The '21 and '22 App. St. offenses were mirror images statistically. Here are their conference ranks for lots of offensive categories in Sun Belt games the past two years:



That makes sense for a couple of reasons. First, they brought back their starting QB from '21, who was a senior in '22, and their two leading rushers from '21. (The slight dip in the passing numbers also makes sense given that they lost their three leading receivers from '21, all of whom were seniors.)

And second, Barbay said out of the gate that his plan wasn't to change what App. St. was doing but was instead to add wrinkles while retaining what the offensive players did well. Check out this podcast interview with some App. St. dudes before the '22 season started and go to the 1-hour, 25-minute mark:

https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcas...=1000553396384

Over 5 or 10 minutes, he talks about his offensive philosophy. Most of what he says focuses on pretty common ideas -- spread people out, playmakers in space, matchup skill guys on weak defenders, tempo, being aggressive, etc. -- but a couple of other things stuck out. He emphasized his need to study what App. St. had been doing well in previous years so that he could "mesh" his ideas with the offense that was already installed. That dovetailed into his discussion of using playmakers in space and focusing on using what you have -- if your most explosive guys are three RBs, you figure out how to get them the ball in space, but if it's a bunch of WRs, you get those dudes the ball. He also mentioned how his weeks during the season were heavy on situational analytics, like what plays/schemes typically work on specific downs and distances.

I haven't watched tons of film, but looking at App. St.'s offense in '21 vs. Coastal Carolina, it indeed looks pretty similar to what the M&W Nation article says Barbay did in '22:



Barbay also mentions in one point that part of his fit at App. St. was the connection between the head coach Shawn Clark and Jim McElwain and that the overall schemes weren't too different. I didn't catch him saying what that connection was other than the fact that Clark and his staff had visited McElwain's staffs over the years to learn from him, and the only other thing I've found at a quick glance was that Clark was a GA at Louisville while McElwain coached WR there in the early 00s. I'd be interested to know exactly what wrinkles he brought with him to App. St. given the personnel he had there.

I'm of course more curious, though, about what all this means for MSU. Adding wrinkles to a system and then largely keeping intact what the players know how to do makes sense for lots of reasons, but especially so when what you've previously run is similar to what they were doing anyway. But I'm really interested to see how that translates to a team running the Leach air raid over the past three years. Barring a change in QB, and assuming that the flexible approach he touted in his interview before the '22 season is still a priority, maybe that means more continuity for us than the flavor of his '22 offense would otherwise lead us to believe? And if not, what scheme is he going with? The one from App. St. that seems to resemble what App. St. did before his arrival? Or something different? Regardless, I'm excited to watch it play out.

Great stuff as usual, Pain! Thanks!

[662dawg]

I think your observation is right on point. The '21 and '22 App. St. offenses were mirror images statistically. Here are their conference ranks for lots of offensive categories in Sun Belt games the past two years:



That makes sense for a couple of reasons. First, they brought back their starting QB from '21, who was a senior in '22, and their two leading rushers from '21. (The slight dip in the passing numbers also makes sense given that they lost their three leading receivers from '21, all of whom were seniors.)

And second, Barbay said out of the gate that his plan wasn't to change what App. St. was doing but was instead to add wrinkles while retaining what the offensive players did well. Check out this podcast interview with some App. St. dudes before the '22 season started and go to the 1-hour, 25-minute mark:

https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcas...=1000553396384

Over 5 or 10 minutes, he talks about his offensive philosophy. Most of what he says focuses on pretty common ideas -- spread people out, playmakers in space, matchup skill guys on weak defenders, tempo, being aggressive, etc. -- but a couple of other things stuck out. He emphasized his need to study what App. St. had been doing well in previous years so that he could "mesh" his ideas with the offense that was already installed. That dovetailed into his discussion of using playmakers in space and focusing on using what you have -- if your most explosive guys are three RBs, you figure out how to get them the ball in space, but if it's a bunch of WRs, you get those dudes the ball. He also mentioned how his weeks during the season were heavy on situational analytics, like what plays/schemes typically work on specific downs and distances.

I haven't watched tons of film, but looking at App. St.'s offense in '21 vs. Coastal Carolina, it indeed looks pretty similar to what the M&W Nation article says Barbay did in '22:



Barbay also mentions in one point that part of his fit at App. St. was the connection between the head coach Shawn Clark and Jim McElwain and that the overall schemes weren't too different. I didn't catch him saying what that connection was other than the fact that Clark and his staff had visited McElwain's staffs over the years to learn from him, and the only other thing I've found at a quick glance was that Clark was a GA at Louisville while McElwain coached WR there in the early 00s. I'd be interested to know exactly what wrinkles he brought with him to App. St. given the personnel he had there.

I'm of course more curious, though, about what all this means for MSU. Adding wrinkles to a system and then largely keeping intact what the players know how to do makes sense for lots of reasons, but especially so when what you've previously run is similar to what they were doing anyway. But I'm really interested to see how that translates to a team running the Leach air raid over the past three years. Barring a change in QB, and assuming that the flexible approach he touted in his interview before the '22 season is still a priority, maybe that means more continuity for us than the flavor of his '22 offense would otherwise lead us to believe? And if not, what scheme is he going with? The one from App. St. that seems to resemble what App. St. did before his arrival? Or something different? Regardless, I'm excited to watch it play out.

This was a fantastic read.

[Todd4State]

This is true. I believe he's going to do what's best personal wise while adding the pistol formation & more running game to it. He seems to be that kind of coach. Young with a great innovative mind. Kind of like Arnett but on the offensive side. I bet the run pass ratio is closer to 50/50 than 55/45 run/pass which I'm perfectly fine with.

I agree we'll see some pistol stuff. But right now as I type this I think we may be 60/40 pass/run because of the players that we have. At least for next year.

I think your observation is right on point. The '21 and '22 App. St. offenses were mirror images statistically. Here are their conference ranks for lots of offensive categories in Sun Belt games the past two years:



That makes sense for a couple of reasons. First, they brought back their starting QB from '21, who was a senior in '22, and their two leading rushers from '21. (The slight dip in the passing numbers also makes sense given that they lost their three leading receivers from '21, all of whom were seniors.)

And second, Barbay said out of the gate that his plan wasn't to change what App. St. was doing but was instead to add wrinkles while retaining what the offensive players did well. Check out this podcast interview with some App. St. dudes before the '22 season started and go to the 1-hour, 25-minute mark:

https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcas...=1000553396384

Over 5 or 10 minutes, he talks about his offensive philosophy. Most of what he says focuses on pretty common ideas -- spread people out, playmakers in space, matchup skill guys on weak defenders, tempo, being aggressive, etc. -- but a couple of other things stuck out. He emphasized his need to study what App. St. had been doing well in previous years so that he could "mesh" his ideas with the offense that was already installed. That dovetailed into his discussion of using playmakers in space and focusing on using what you have -- if your most explosive guys are three RBs, you figure out how to get them the ball in space, but if it's a bunch of WRs, you get those dudes the ball. He also mentioned how his weeks during the season were heavy on situational analytics, like what plays/schemes typically work on specific downs and distances.

I haven't watched tons of film, but looking at App. St.'s offense in '21 vs. Coastal Carolina, it indeed looks pretty similar to what the M&W Nation article says Barbay did in '22:



Barbay also mentions in one point that part of his fit at App. St. was the connection between the head coach Shawn Clark and Jim McElwain and that the overall schemes weren't too different. I didn't catch him saying what that connection was other than the fact that Clark and his staff had visited McElwain's staffs over the years to learn from him, and the only other thing I've found at a quick glance was that Clark was a GA at Louisville while McElwain coached WR there in the early 00s. I'd be interested to know exactly what wrinkles he brought with him to App. St. given the personnel he had there.

I'm of course more curious, though, about what all this means for MSU. Adding wrinkles to a system and then largely keeping intact what the players know how to do makes sense for lots of reasons, but especially so when what you've previously run is similar to what they were doing anyway. But I'm really interested to see how that translates to a team running the Leach air raid over the past three years. Barring a change in QB, and assuming that the flexible approach he touted in his interview before the '22 season is still a priority, maybe that means more continuity for us than the flavor of his '22 offense would otherwise lead us to believe? And if not, what scheme is he going with? The one from App. St. that seems to resemble what App. St. did before his arrival? Or something different? Regardless, I'm excited to watch it play out.

Awesome as always! I just can't see us doing what App State has been doing. Just doesn't make sense to. Now by 2025 we certainly could look like that. But I feel like he may be a coach searching for his identity or maybe I should say an opportunity to truly do what he wants to do. At CMU he had to do what McElwain wanted. So I guess he decided to go to App State with the intent of turning them into what he wants but maybe he realized that wasn't going to be allowed there. It should be worth noting that App State's head coach also was their OC before he became their head coach and he was an OL coach. They like to run the ball if you believe the football sterotype about OL coaches. So it is very plausible that Clark had some if not a lot of say in the offense. Barbey won't have that issue at MSU.

[dawg meat]

I think your observation is right on point. The '21 and '22 App. St. offenses were mirror images statistically. Here are their conference ranks for lots of offensive categories in Sun Belt games the past two years:



That makes sense for a couple of reasons. First, they brought back their starting QB from '21, who was a senior in '22, and their two leading rushers from '21. (The slight dip in the passing numbers also makes sense given that they lost their three leading receivers from '21, all of whom were seniors.)

And second, Barbay said out of the gate that his plan wasn't to change what App. St. was doing but was instead to add wrinkles while retaining what the offensive players did well. Check out this podcast interview with some App. St. dudes before the '22 season started and go to the 1-hour, 25-minute mark:

https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcas...=1000553396384

Over 5 or 10 minutes, he talks about his offensive philosophy. Most of what he says focuses on pretty common ideas -- spread people out, playmakers in space, matchup skill guys on weak defenders, tempo, being aggressive, etc. -- but a couple of other things stuck out. He emphasized his need to study what App. St. had been doing well in previous years so that he could "mesh" his ideas with the offense that was already installed. That dovetailed into his discussion of using playmakers in space and focusing on using what you have -- if your most explosive guys are three RBs, you figure out how to get them the ball in space, but if it's a bunch of WRs, you get those dudes the ball. He also mentioned how his weeks during the season were heavy on situational analytics, like what plays/schemes typically work on specific downs and distances.

I haven't watched tons of film, but looking at App. St.'s offense in '21 vs. Coastal Carolina, it indeed looks pretty similar to what the M&W Nation article says Barbay did in '22:



Barbay also mentions in one point that part of his fit at App. St. was the connection between the head coach Shawn Clark and Jim McElwain and that the overall schemes weren't too different. I didn't catch him saying what that connection was other than the fact that Clark and his staff had visited McElwain's staffs over the years to learn from him, and the only other thing I've found at a quick glance was that Clark was a GA at Louisville while McElwain coached WR there in the early 00s. I'd be interested to know exactly what wrinkles he brought with him to App. St. given the personnel he had there.

I'm of course more curious, though, about what all this means for MSU. Adding wrinkles to a system and then largely keeping intact what the players know how to do makes sense for lots of reasons, but especially so when what you've previously run is similar to what they were doing anyway. But I'm really interested to see how that translates to a team running the Leach air raid over the past three years. Barring a change in QB, and assuming that the flexible approach he touted in his interview before the '22 season is still a priority, maybe that means more continuity for us than the flavor of his '22 offense would otherwise lead us to believe? And if not, what scheme is he going with? The one from App. St. that seems to resemble what App. St. did before his arrival? Or something different? Regardless, I'm excited to watch it play out.

First off, I'd like to say that I am a long-time lurker on this board and truly enjoy reading about the many ups and downs that many posters bring to this site. I would like to say that Prediction? Pain certainly deserves some rep and wish he would post more than he does because he delivers the facts and analytics with more positivity than anyone else. Also, doesn't cut other fans down, unlike some of the unrelenting, bickering, back and forth bs that I have to sift through to read good quality posts like this.
I will try to follow good psychological advice and not even engage with the personality type that wants to constantly argue like what I've seen fill up every single thread here lately. I wish others wouldn't either, but I understand, it's extremely difficult to do when some folks don't get what Mike Leach really brought to STATE. It was more than just the Air Raid system. He brought a winning culture with him and that, to me, is worth more than a playbook.
In all reality, even if Arnett had hired an Air Raid guy, the offense was going to be more run heavy. That's just a fact. Just because someone comes from the same coaching tree doesn't mean you're getting the same thing as the guy he learned from. This is what I think the issue is with folks hung up on the "Air Raid guys" and them hating on Barbay coming from a McElwain system. Good coaches will see what works, tweak it, be very flexible with playcalling, and add new things that they pick up along the way.
It truly sucks that Leach is gone now, but we must move on, and I am confident that the culture needed to succeed was ingrained into Arnett. I trust he's got the man for the job in Barbay. Sure, there may be some growing pains. There are with most new coaching staffs, but this post (along with a few others showing game film) has given me the confidence that we can continue the winning culture that The Pirate left us with.
HAIL STATE and gtfhom!

[KB21]

So, Barbay mentions how much influence Jim McElwain has had on him as a play caller.

[Really Clark?]

So, Barbay mentions how much influence Jim McElwain has had on him as a play caller.

[CoachT14]

So, Barbay mentions how much influence Jim McElwain has had on him as a play caller.

I hope your message board attitude doesn?t leak into your personal life, cause you?d be a miserable prick to be around.

And I say that as someone that hates overly positive posting. You can?t even critique constructively.

[Pancho]

Leach instilled a tough as nails mentality at all times in his players and minus the SEC officials in Memphis(21), won 9 games 2 years in a row. I was always intrigued by the air raid and Leach was slowly doing his best to continue being competitive even though in my opinion the O was still lacking. I'm cool with Barbay and the App State system but the bottom line will be whether we can execute and score consistently on 4 and 5 star SEC defenses.

[KB21]

Imagine having a coach who grew up and coached at the high school level in Texas who says his biggest influences as far as his play calling and philosophy goes is Greg Davis and Jim McElwain and not Mike Leach.

[KB21]

Arnett is hiring another OL coach for his new ground and pound offense.