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Thread: Next 3 games

  1. #41
    Senior Member DownwardDawg's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Goldendawg View Post
    100%. It is a tough gig to be a State fan and takes a lot of love and loyalty, not counting hard earned $. Look at our overall history and many of us have stuck it out no matter what, "waiting till next year". Don't expect to win the conference and certainly not a NC anytime soon, but expect better than 6-6 with 4 OOC wins and an unexciting low tier bowl. I've seen some good years. Tyler until OM helping lead us to NCAA probation, Bellard's good years, Jackie's best years with my only trip to Atlanta, and Dan taking us to #1 for 4 or so weeks. State fans are not losers! We are long suffering, always hope for the best, and deserve much better than we often get! Hail State!
    100% brother!!!!!!

  2. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by TrapGame View Post
    Moorhead would have been given 5 years if he maintained discipline and a top notch S&C program. That was his ultimate downfall.
    Disagree. His standing on the sidelines "studying" SEC defenses that he arrogantly thought he could outsmart as he finally got his play in with 3 seconds left on the clock would never have worked. His version of the RPO reminded me of Croom's West Coast Offense. His lack of people skills with fans was also a disaster. He gained fool's gold having Barkley and McSorley (?) at Penn State.

  3. #43
    Senior Member KOdawg1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BlackSailsDawg View Post
    Who said JoMo should have been given 5 year? Not me. He lost control of the football team. Players were walking out of practice because they wanted to. Players fighting. The QB was put out of the bowl game by our own LB and the LB still played. You are over the top extreme on this. If any coach allows that, it don't matter in what year, they should be fired. Would not care if it was Saban.

    The Portal and NIL change nothing about building a program and a mentality to the team.

    I can list example after example. I already listed 3. Stoops, Clawson (at each stop), and the Utah coach. here is another, Mizzou.

    Pinkel took 7 years to build that program to a 12 win season. Once he got there (2007) this was his record. 81-38 with five seasons of 10 plus wins in a season and two of those were 12 wins. One 11 win.

    History is not on your side with this.
    And history is irrelevant in the current landscape of college football. That's what you're not getting.

  4. #44
    Senior Member KOdawg1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TrapGame View Post
    Moorhead would have been given 5 years if he maintained discipline and a top notch S&C program. That was his ultimate downfall.
    Uhh no

  5. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by chef dixon View Post
    It feels like we are good, but not good enough to really stomp good teams out.
    That's been my struggle with the team this year. For such a veteran team, we show no ability to put the nail in the coffin and close out a game when we have the chance. Look at our first 2 games. Sure we won by a couple of scores, but we could've (should've) put the game away by the 3rd quarter. Instead we drug it out into the 4th and didn't completely close the other team out of the game. LSU game, get a stop before half and come out and score and the home team is staring at a 20-0 scoreboard. Instead, we let them back in the game to say the least. I don't know if its a player thing or staff thing, but there's not killer instinct in this group.

  6. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by DawgFromOxford View Post
    That's been my struggle with the team this year. For such a veteran team, we show no ability to put the nail in the coffin and close out a game when we have the chance. Look at our first 2 games. Sure we won by a couple of scores, but we could've (should've) put the game away by the 3rd quarter. Instead we drug it out into the 4th and didn't completely close the other team out of the game. LSU game, get a stop before half and come out and score and the home team is staring at a 20-0 scoreboard. Instead, we let them back in the game to say the least. I don't know if its a player thing or staff thing, but there's not killer instinct in this group.
    Until they play 4 quarters in one game, cut down on mistakes, and win said games to prove me wrong, I'm afraid our experienced team is just a year older and not much better.

  7. #47
    Senior Member TrapGame's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Goldendawg View Post
    Disagree. His standing on the sidelines "studying" SEC defenses that he arrogantly thought he could outsmart as he finally got his play in with 3 seconds left on the clock would never have worked. His version of the RPO reminded me of Croom's West Coast Offense. His lack of people skills with fans was also a disaster. He gained fool's gold having Barkley and McSorley (?) at Penn State.
    Quote Originally Posted by KOdawg1 View Post
    Uhh no
    I know. And I agree.

    BUT... it was a colossal shit show getting this guy fired with OBVIOUS problems with team discipline. If he was just a bad Xs and Os coach but maintained culture and discipline Keenum would have given him 5 years. Y'all know we do this shit all the time.

  8. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by KOdawg1 View Post
    And history is irrelevant in the current landscape of college football. That's what you're not getting.
    No, I get what you are saying. Nil is here. The portal has been here 4 years. Our recruiting remains at the same levels. But none of that changes program building. In fact, it gives a greater need than ever. Stability is what it takes to build the recruiting landscape that we need. You keep changing out coaches and and you keep getting bumped down because players do not know what to expect out of the new coach and they know they only have 4 years to play. Case after case after case in this current environment can show that.

    It takes time to build a program. The identity. Changes in the system. Building up the recruiting base to meet your needs. Building long term success is stability. Rotating coaches is nothing more than trying to catch lightening in a bottle.

    In this case, we are at the base of what we can be. We did a major overhaul and are now pulling in recruits that have our QB rroom, RB room, WR room at a higher level than ever. Give the man time to continue to build those and the OL to go with it.

  9. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by DawgFromOxford View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by chef dixon View Post
    It feels like we are good, but not good enough to really stomp good teams out.




    That's been my struggle with the team this year. For such a veteran team, we show no ability to put the nail in the coffin and close out a game when we have the chance. Look at our first 2 games. Sure we won by a couple of scores, but we could've (should've) put the game away by the 3rd quarter. Instead we drug it out into the 4th and didn't completely close the other team out of the game. LSU game, get a stop before half and come out and score and the home team is staring at a 20-0 scoreboard. Instead, we let them back in the game to say the least. I don't know if its a player thing or staff thing, but there's not killer instinct in this group.
    But isn't it great to know that we are looking in the review mirror of not even being able to compete? We just have to learn to take that next step.

  10. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by BlackSailsDawg View Post
    Look at Clawson. Look at Stoops. Look at Utah's HC. It's called building a program.
    It's not 2010 anymore. Portal and free transfers rule the day
    Walk like the King or walk like you don't care who the King is

  11. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by TrapGame View Post
    I know. And I agree.

    BUT... it was a colossal shit show getting this guy fired with OBVIOUS problems with team discipline. If he was just a bad Xs and Os coach but maintained culture and discipline Keenum would have given him 5 years. Y'all know we do this shit all the time.
    His career bounce back as the OC at Oregon shows that is were his ceiling needs to be, just like Croom was basically a career NFL RB coach and really how hard is that with NFL RB's? I know JoMo is now head coach at Akron and that also speaks for itself. People who are promoted above their real abilities seldom works out. Now about our AD.

  12. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by Coach34 View Post
    It's not 2010 anymore. Portal and free transfers rule the day
    And it has not changed any of what I said.

  13. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by BlackSailsDawg View Post
    But isn't it great to know that we are looking in the review mirror of not even being able to compete? We just have to learn to take that next step.
    We competed under Dan for the most part and no I don't want that late season annual job searching guy back. The JoMo hire gutted the program. I know the hire looked good at the time on paper but look where he is now, Akron. His interview with Cohen must have been similar to the Ogre at OM.

  14. #54
    Senior Member TrapGame's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Goldendawg View Post
    We competed under Dan for the most part and no I don't want that late season annual job searching guy back. The JoMo hire gutted the program. I know the hire looked good at the time on paper but look where he is now, Akron. His interview with Cohen must have been similar to the Ogre at OM.
    At least Moorhead can string together multiple syllable words.

    He won't last 5 years at Akron either.

  15. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by Goldendawg View Post
    We competed under Dan for the most part and no I don't want that late season annual job searching guy back. The JoMo hire gutted the program. I know the hire looked good at the time on paper but look where he is now, Akron. His interview with Cohen must have been similar to the Ogre at OM.
    Was not saying we were not competing under Mullen. I'm saying that we have left the Jomo years behind .


    Let's really put it into focus for a minute. When is the last time a MSU team was the favorite on the road at LSU? to TAMU at home? etc.. When have we been picked as favorites in this many SEC games in a year? 69% over TAMU.. 73% over Ark... Favored over UK on the Road. Auburn.. a 93% chance

    The people with the books are seeing it. Our fans need to be patient and let the man continue to build.

  16. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by BlackSailsDawg View Post
    No, I get what you are saying. Nil is here. The portal has been here 4 years. Our recruiting remains at the same levels. But none of that changes program building. In fact, it gives a greater need than ever. Stability is what it takes to build the recruiting landscape that we need. You keep changing out coaches and and you keep getting bumped down because players do not know what to expect out of the new coach and they know they only have 4 years to play. Case after case after case in this current environment can show that.

    It takes time to build a program. The identity. Changes in the system. Building up the recruiting base to meet your needs. Building long term success is stability. Rotating coaches is nothing more than trying to catch lightening in a bottle.

    In this case, we are at the base of what we can be. We did a major overhaul and are now pulling in recruits that have our QB rroom, RB room, WR room at a higher level than ever. Give the man time to continue to build those and the OL to go with it.
    Players don't have to stay loyal to the coach, system, or school with the portal. One of our young running backs announced for the portal last week during the season but changed his mind for now. Players won't wait 3 or 4 years to develop if they are any good or think they are. They can leave after one year and as many times as they want. Developmental programs will go the way of the dodo bird. BTW, we are currently #42 in recruiting with no commits ranked .90 or better and our recruiting thread is dead on this site. Hope we have something on the back burners and finish stronger than it looks.
    Last edited by Goldendawg; 09-29-2022 at 02:30 PM.

  17. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by BlackSailsDawg View Post
    Was not saying we were not competing under Mullen. I'm saying that we have left the Jomo years behind .


    Let's really put it into focus for a minute. When is the last time a MSU team was the favorite on the road at LSU? to TAMU at home? etc.. When have we been picked as favorites in this many SEC games in a year? 69% over TAMU.. 73% over Ark... Favored over UK on the Road. Auburn.. a 93% chance

    The people with the books are seeing it. Our fans need to be patient and let the man continue to build.
    And how did that LSU game workout? Will be glad to discuss us being favored over a bunch of remaining ranked SEC teams if/when we win.

  18. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by Goldendawg View Post
    Players don't have to stay loyal to the coach, system, or school with the portal. One of our young running backs announced for the portal last week during the season but changed his mind for now. Players won't wait 3 or 4 years to develop if they are any good or think they are. They can leave after one year and as many times as they want. Developmental programs will go the way of the dodo bird. BTW, we are currently #42 in recruiting with no commits ranked .90 or better and our recruiting thread is dead on this site. Hope we have something on the back burners and finish stronger than it looks.
    Never said that they have to, but they do everywhere you look. As being pointed out on a regular basis, a lot of these end up nowhere. But, we will just disagree here. Changing out coaches is program killing. You are not going to get the money from the fans because they are not going to want to until they see results. Every 2 to 3 years will kill that. But leave a good coach in place to build it, and the whole aspect of the program stabilizes. After 5 to 6 years, part ways if needs be.

    This sends several messages. Next coach, unless you are just horrible or lose control of the team, we will give you time. As a coach that's wanted by many, what job are you going to take? The one that's in the dumpster because in 6 years time you have fired 3 coaches or the one that gave the time to build and he simplly failed? MSU in the dumpster over UT, LSU, TAMU, AU..... is always going to win out if it's a MSU in the dumpster because of recruiting. See what I mean?

    We may never agree, but HAILSTATE!

  19. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by BlackSailsDawg View Post

    Let's really put it into focus for a minute. When is the last time a MSU team was the favorite on the road at LSU? to TAMU at home? etc.. When have we been picked as favorites in this many SEC games in a year? 69% over TAMU.. 73% over Ark... Favored over UK on the Road. Auburn.. a 93% chance .
    2018 State was favored over A&M, Fla, Kentucky, and UPig...as well as Mississippi
    Walk like the King or walk like you don't care who the King is

  20. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by Goldendawg View Post
    And how did that LSU game workout? Will be glad to discuss us being favored over a bunch of remaining ranked SEC teams if/when we win.

    That's not the point at all. The point is the people who put the lines out see it. Mullen was picked once as a favorite over TAMU. Never over LSU. The perception is changing on MSU.

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