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Thread: MSU/Alabama basketball

  1. #181
    Senior Member MoreCowbell's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ifyouonlyknew View Post
    We're 12-4 (3-1) with our 2nd best player having played 6 games & our best bench scorer not being healthy all year. Yes we've had 1 really frustrating loss (OM) & 1 game where we gave away a chance at big win (Colorado St). People want to act like we've been bad or under achieved all year are just incorrect.
    This year? No, we have been respectable so far. We have under achieved under Howland though if you go by talent. That is why I and a lot of fans have taken a wait and see approach. The Alabama game is the type of game we usually lose under Howland but with that win I have bought in. This team might be different than his prior teams hopefully.

  2. #182
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    Quote Originally Posted by MoreCowbell View Post
    This year? No, we have been respectable so far. We have under achieved under Howland though if you go by talent. That is why I and a lot of fans have taken a wait and see approach. The Alabama game is the type of game we usually lose under Howland but with that win I have bought in. This team might be different than his prior teams hopefully.
    This team has nothing to do with the past though. They're being punished for something they didn't do. The fact our fans have required this program to win at a certain level before they support is crazy to me. Then it only takes 1 loss for fans to just say oh well we don't care again just doesn't sit well with me. That horse has been beaten to death though so I'll move along.

  3. #183
    Senior Member AROB44's Avatar
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    The fact our fans have required this program to win at a certain level before they support is crazy to me. Then it only takes 1 loss for fans to just say oh well we don't care again just doesn't sit well with me.

    Amen!!!
    "I'm sure the universe is full of intelligent life. It's just been too intelligent to come here." -- Arthur C. Clarke

  4. #184
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    Quote Originally Posted by AROB44 View Post
    The fact our fans have required this program to win at a certain level before they support is crazy to me. Then it only takes 1 loss for fans to just say oh well we don't care again just doesn't sit well with me.

    Amen!!!
    Thank you for saying this! I've said it multiple times on multiple threads about all of our sports. I genuinely don't understand how people call themselves fans... but when we are losing its "I'm not supporting this team anymore" "If they start winning the fans will come back" mentality. That's not what being a fan means.. You love and support your team through ups and downs no matter what.

  5. #185
    Senior Member smootness's Avatar
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    The end of Stans' tenure soured much of our fanbase on the program and began the 'Ugh, these guys don't care' thought. Then the Rick Ray years convinced them there was no need to care about the team anymore.

    It will take more than making a Tourney every once in a while to bring them all the way back.

  6. #186
    Senior Member Ari Gold's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ifyouonlyknew View Post
    This team has nothing to do with the past though. They're being punished for something they didn't do. The fact our fans have required this program to win at a certain level before they support is crazy to me. Then it only takes 1 loss for fans to just say oh well we don't care again just doesn't sit well with me. That horse has been beaten to death though so I'll move along.
    Excellent post..

  7. #187
    Senior Member Ari Gold's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by smootness View Post
    The end of Stans' tenure soured much of our fanbase on the program and began the 'Ugh, these guys don't care' thought. Then the Rick Ray years convinced them there was no need to care about the team anymore.

    It will take more than making a Tourney every once in a while to bring them all the way back.

    Which again makes these people the dumbest of all of our fans..

  8. #188
    Senior Member LC Dawg's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by smootness View Post
    The end of Stans' tenure soured much of our fanbase on the program and began the 'Ugh, these guys don't care' thought. Then the Rick Ray years convinced them there was no need to care about the team anymore.

    It will take more than making a Tourney every once in a while to bring them all the way back.
    In addition to souring existing fans the end of Stansbury and the Ray era produced a lot of alumni who don't give a damn about basketball. My daughter attended State from 2012-2017 and probably attended 2 basketball games. Those students during those years became alumni who don't care about basketball.
    I graduated in 1993 and I was probably a bigger fan of our basketball program than football.

  9. #189
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    Quote Originally Posted by MoreCowbell View Post
    How does a Q1 win drop us what the hell
    Everybody else moves up and down around us. I wouldn't lose sleep over it.

  10. #190
    Senior Member smootness's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ari Gold View Post
    Which again makes these people the dumbest of all of our fans..
    Maybe, but it's pretty easy to see how it happened. It's not like our basketball program has produced much to be excited about over the last 10+ years.

  11. #191
    Super Moderator CadaverDawg's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by smootness View Post
    Maybe, but it's pretty easy to see how it happened. It's not like our basketball program has produced much to be excited about over the last 10+ years.
    Yeah, I don't get the shock. When we suck in football attendance drops...were there not bigger crowds during Vic's tenure than there are now on the Women's side?

    I mean, I get it, in a perfect world we pack out every stadium regardless of how shitty the product is because "that's what fans are supposed to do"....but that isn't reality. We were far more exciting to watch, even when we lost, during the Stans years, and we had bigger crowds. It's entertainment at the end of the day, and even when we win, the Howland teams aren't that fun to watch. Is what it is.

    Again, not saying it's ideal...but to say I'm surprised would be a lie. Winning helps, putting an exciting brand of basketball on the court helps a ton too though.

    Another example...I hated watching Cohen's teams play bc the small ball was atrocious. I ended up watching a ton bc we started winning and I love college baseball, but there was nothing exciting about watching that style of play.
    Last edited by CadaverDawg; 01-17-2022 at 11:38 PM.

  12. #192
    Senior Member yjnkdawg's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NCMSTFAN View Post
    Thank you for saying this! I've said it multiple times on multiple threads about all of our sports. I genuinely don't understand how people call themselves fans... but when we are losing its "I'm not supporting this team anymore" "If they start winning the fans will come back" mentality. That's not what being a fan means.. You love and support your team through ups and downs no matter what.
    He was quoting what IYOK posted and I agree too.

  13. #193
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    Quote Originally Posted by smootness View Post
    Maybe, but it's pretty easy to see how it happened. It's not like our basketball program has produced much to be excited about over the last 10+ years.
    Howland has won enough to get more support than he's gotten. I think you can agree with that.

  14. #194
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    Quote Originally Posted by CadaverDawg View Post
    Yeah, I don't get the shock. When we suck in football attendance drops...were there not bigger crowds during Vic's tenure than there are now on the Women's side?

    I mean, I get it, in a perfect world we pack out every stadium regardless of how shitty the product is because "that's what fans are supposed to do"....but that isn't reality. We were far more exciting to watch, even when we lost, during the Stans years, and we had bigger crowds. It's entertainment at the end of the day, and even when we win, the Howland teams aren't that fun to watch. Is what it is.

    Again, not saying it's ideal...but to say I'm surprised would be a lie. Winning helps, putting an exciting brand of basketball on the court helps a ton too though.

    Another example...I hated watching Cohen's teams play bc the small ball was atrocious. I ended up watching a ton bc we started winning and I love college baseball, but there was nothing exciting about watching that style of play.
    That's just it. No one is asking for sold out crowds. 3-4K crowds for SEC games are embarrassing. If we could consistently have 6-8k fans for SEC games it would be huge. That's all I'm asking for. This team has won enough for that.

  15. #195
    Senior Member BeardoMSU's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CadaverDawg View Post
    YI hated watching Cohen's teams play bc the small ball was atrocious. I ended up watching a ton bc we started winning and I love college baseball, but there was nothing exciting about watching that style of play.
    I can't remember who it was that posted some comparative stats for our teams over the years (probably Todd; if it was someone else, I apologize), but seeing that the 2013 team only had like 32 or so HRs (with Hunter getting 16 of them) compared to the 70+ we hit this year, with 5 guys in the order with double digits, was definitely eye opening, and certainly more fun, lol.

    Dingers are fun, but even last year it never felt like they were our bread and butter.

  16. #196
    Super Moderator CadaverDawg's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ifyouonlyknew View Post
    That's just it. No one is asking for sold out crowds. 3-4K crowds for SEC games are embarrassing. If we could consistently have 6-8k fans for SEC games it would be huge. That's all I'm asking for. This team has won enough for that.
    True, and I think we'll see a big crowd Saturday and going forward hopefully. Unfortunately we dont have another Saturday home game for like a month after Saturday.

  17. #197
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    Quote Originally Posted by CadaverDawg View Post
    True, and I think we'll see a big crowd Saturday and going forward hopefully. Unfortunately we dont have another Saturday home game for like a month after Saturday.
    I hope you're right. I'll say this & leave it alone. If things this season hold like they should, this would be the 4th time in the last 5 seasons that we'd finish top half of the SEC. This program deserves more support. Again not sellouts but 6-8k consistently for SEC games isn't an unreasonable expectation.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ifyouonlyknew View Post
    I hope you're right. I'll say this & leave it alone. If things this season hold like they should, this would be the 4th time in the last 5 seasons that we'd finish top half of the SEC. This program deserves more support. Again not sellouts but 6-8k consistently for SEC games isn't an unreasonable expectation.
    Marketing sucks. Product is uninspiring and bland basketball. Success is non-existent, our last Tourney win was 14 years ago. There was a better show in town for a while. Covid kinda still is a thing whether we want it to be or not. The seating arrangement is ass for both Students and long time ticket holders who were alienated with the reseating.

    Yea you've got your 5k or so die-hards that make every game that's feasible, but you're average poster here isn't reality. You've got dumbasses like Ari calling people stupid for not supporting this when he clearly hasn't spoken to anyone other than a mirror since march 2020.

    How the hell do you sell going to a basketball game to someone who doesn't go right now? Why make the drive, fight awful traffic, pay for parking, watch an uninspiring product, most likely get disappointed, fight awful traffic back... all the while in the middle of a pandemic. Because of a sense of duty to the school? That may work on you, me, or your average forum poster. But it doesn't work on the average joe. What incentive are we giving kids to come?

    You can say I'm complaining and nitpicking and spoiled, but I'm telling you people who point these things out aren't speaking about things that stop them. I'm telling you what stops my fellow alumni, what stops students now. The Griss got packed out for volleyball when those girls kicked it up a notch. The Hump got packed out when those girls kicked it into overdrive. The mens team just isn't doing anything to inspire the sidewalk fan.

    Part of the problem is the marketing of everything but baseball needs an overhaul. I'm about to the point myself where I'm gonna just bang on Cohen's door to let me help set up a school program to revolutionize State's digital content and vastly improve social media presence. I do similar shit for a living and have almost built up enough of a nest egg to take on a passion job at a big pay cut to fix this mess.

    But really, I'm curious how you people think you can attract someone to going to these games that currently has 0 interest other than "school duty." I'll hang up and listen.

  19. #199
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tater View Post
    Marketing sucks. Product is uninspiring and bland basketball. Success is non-existent, our last Tourney win was 14 years ago. There was a better show in town for a while. Covid kinda still is a thing whether we want it to be or not. The seating arrangement is ass for both Students and long time ticket holders who were alienated with the reseating.

    Yea you've got your 5k or so die-hards that make every game that's feasible, but you're average poster here isn't reality. You've got dumbasses like Ari calling people stupid for not supporting this when he clearly hasn't spoken to anyone other than a mirror since march 2020.

    How the hell do you sell going to a basketball game to someone who doesn't go right now? Why make the drive, fight awful traffic, pay for parking, watch an uninspiring product, most likely get disappointed, fight awful traffic back... all the while in the middle of a pandemic. Because of a sense of duty to the school? That may work on you, me, or your average forum poster. But it doesn't work on the average joe. What incentive are we giving kids to come?

    You can say I'm complaining and nitpicking and spoiled, but I'm telling you people who point these things out aren't speaking about things that stop them. I'm telling you what stops my fellow alumni, what stops students now. The Griss got packed out for volleyball when those girls kicked it up a notch. The Hump got packed out when those girls kicked it into overdrive. The mens team just isn't doing anything to inspire the sidewalk fan.

    Part of the problem is the marketing of everything but baseball needs an overhaul. I'm about to the point myself where I'm gonna just bang on Cohen's door to let me help set up a school program to revolutionize State's digital content and vastly improve social media presence. I do similar shit for a living and have almost built up enough of a nest egg to take on a passion job at a big pay cut to fix this mess.

    But really, I'm curious how you people think you can attract someone to going to these games that currently has 0 interest other than "school duty." I'll hang up and listen.
    I'll admit, I'm one of the ones complaining about the low attendance but your post makes alot of sense. I don't have the answers either, but I know crowd sizes and fan support also affects recruiting

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    Quote Originally Posted by NCMSTFAN View Post
    I'll admit, I'm one of the ones complaining about the low attendance but your post makes alot of sense. I don't have the answers either, but I know crowd sizes and fan support also affects recruiting
    Yep. And anyone can point out a problem like several here have done. But we pay big bucks for problem solvers and project managers who can engineer solutions. (By we, I mean America, not State. State still hasn't done the first step. Identify that there's a problem.)

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