Page 2 of 3 FirstFirst 123 LastLast
Results 21 to 40 of 52

Thread: Starting pitchers lately

  1. #21
    Senior Member Todd4State's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Posts
    40,210
    vCash
    3700
    Quote Originally Posted by 99jc View Post
    Back in the days of the Big Red Machine Sparky Anderson was know as Captain Hook If a starter made 5 innings he was gone at the first sign of trouble. You can only do that if you have an elite Bullpen and WE DO. Landon Sims is really a starter/Elite reliever. when you have an ace like that it can go a long way if we make it to Omaha. And I am telling you Cerentola has 1 great game in him this season and i think we will see it before the end of the World Series. He has to throw from the stretch to be effective and once he learns not to over stride Game on!.
    The best thing about Sims is his flexibility. He can go 1 inning or he can give us 3 and be really effective. I believe against Tulane he went a little more than that and gave up one of his runs on the year.

    If I was in Lemonis's shoes I would accept that our staff is what it is. We have some good starters but neither one is Ethan Small, Maholm, Hudson, Stratton, etc. level. We're just not going to get 7 IP, 100 pitches and 10-12 K's a game from these guys. If I had to go with an ideal "script" it I would probably go:

    Fri- MacLeoud 3-5, Brandon Smith, 1-2, Preston Johnson, 1-2, and then close with Sims 1-3. Those are our three best relievers in my opinion and I want to try to have the opportunity to use them twice in a weekend if needed.
    Sat- Bednar- 3-6, Patrick 1, Stinnett, 1-2, and Simmons 1-2 and if needed Sims for 1 if available.
    Sun- Fristoe- 1-3 one time through order as an opener, Harding for 3-5, Tullar 1-2, and then Price 1, and then if available and needed Sims for 1.

    Koestler and Cerentola are my "hit the fan" options.

  2. #22
    Senior Member KOdawg1's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2016
    Posts
    10,784
    vCash
    966500
    Quote Originally Posted by parabrave View Post
    You want to trust your D but when you never know when a ball is going to be thrown into the dugout of a ball mishandled or a misjudged fly ball you try to S/O the batter.
    But Mac isn't an over powering pitcher. His stuff is pretty average. He's got to attack the batter instead of nibbling. If they hit it or if we sail it into the dugout, then so be it, but by nibbling, he raises his pitch count up which doesn't allow him to go deep into games, and then he gives them free passes.

  3. #23
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2016
    Posts
    11,942
    vCash
    427176943
    Quote Originally Posted by KOdawg1 View Post
    But Mac isn't an over powering pitcher. His stuff is pretty average. He's got to attack the batter instead of nibbling. If they hit it or if we sail it into the dugout, then so be it, but by nibbling, he raises his pitch count up which doesn't allow him to go deep into games, and then he gives them free passes.
    Good point. Another small item is we got to know what the Umps strike zone is. If he has a wide Tom Glavin zone then you can live on that outside corner. If not then you better throw strikes.

  4. #24
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2014
    Posts
    4,733
    vCash
    3621
    Quote Originally Posted by BeardoMSU View Post
    Agreed.
    Agreed, but I see the Coach dilemma. These games are close shaves. We have guys that are good but are not lock down good.

    Also, seems like we can use Parker Stinnett for more than a weekly inning. The kid was a starter at Northwest. He tossed 72 innings in his sophomore season. He threw +100 pitches on many weekends.

  5. #25
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    May 2017
    Posts
    721
    vCash
    3100
    Just my 2 cents on this. I'm not worried about starting pitching, but McCloud needs to just throw strikes and quit nibbling. His success happens when he gets ahead of batters. The way I see it is that we should start pitching our starters fewer innings. We are DEEP in the bullpen and I think a lot of our inconsistency comes from lack of game reps for these guys. Don't be surprised if we throttle back the innings for our starters a little bit and start
    Going to the bullpen a little sooner. We're in the weaker half of our schedule and if the bats keep pace we can do that and start getting ready for post season. This team, if they'll play basic 12u level defense, is built to go a long way given our pitching.

    FWIW, my only post season concern is Arkansas. They've got our number. I liken this to 2013, Vandy had our number that year but they got taken out before Omaha. I look at Arky the same way; we need to not be on their side of the brackets and let someone else take care of them.

  6. #26
    Senior Member Really Clark?'s Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Posts
    12,666
    vCash
    3100
    Quote Originally Posted by The Federalist Engineer View Post
    Agreed, but I see the Coach dilemma. These games are close shaves. We have guys that are good but are not lock down good.

    Also, seems like we can use Parker Stinnett for more than a weekly inning. The kid was a starter at Northwest. He tossed 72 innings in his sophomore season. He threw +100 pitches on many weekends.
    That was his freshman year, sophomore season was cut short.

  7. #27
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Posts
    3,717
    vCash
    3168
    We could minimize the ill effects of our starting pitching not being lights out if we got them out at the right time. It just seems like the past few weeks we have tried to let them face a few too many batters. If our bullpen was bad, I would understand that strategy. But, with what we have, I don't get it. Take Bednar on Saturday for example; it was obvious he was done after 5.0. The box score won't show it, but if you were watching the game, he was running out of gas. I was convinced we wouldn't see him in the 6th, but here he came trotting out. And A&M proceeded to smash him. 1st batter HR, hard single, then a walk. We were lucky to get out of that inning without giving up a bunch (and probably losing the game). Even if it's not ideal, our staff just needs to accept the fact that these guys need a quick hook.

  8. #28
    Senior Member Saltydog's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Posts
    8,154
    vCash
    3706
    It's not just the errors it's also the walks and hits they are giving up as well. Every time one of them goes out you can bet your ass that around the 4th or 5th they'll implode. Sure, errors haven't helped but it's like the second time thru the lineup they get their ass hammered and that is a cause for concern. It's bothersome that such an "elite" staff (which is b.s.) can't get thru 4 innings, 5 max.
    "The QB and the receiver weren't on the same page there, but hey its only week eleven". (Jack Cristil)

  9. #29
    Senior Member Commercecomet24's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2016
    Posts
    24,717
    vCash
    3100
    Starting pitchers at every level are pitching less innings now. It's just the way the game has evolved. I don't necessarily like it but its the way it is now. The average mlb start is 4.7 innings now. The key is getting the pitcher out before he gives it all away, which we haven't done in every case.

  10. #30
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2014
    Posts
    4,733
    vCash
    3621
    Quote Originally Posted by Commercecomet24 View Post
    Starting pitchers at every level are pitching less innings now. It's just the way the game has evolved. I don't necessarily like it but its the way it is now. The average mlb start is 4.7 innings now. The key is getting the pitcher out before he gives it all away, which we haven't done in every case.
    Hey Commerce, is it just me but I don’t see many multi game relief pitchers anymore. I recall Chuck Holly being the fireman at least twice per weekend in years past. Pete Young would save 2 games per weekend.

    Is my memory deceiving me?

  11. #31
    Senior Member StarkVegasSteve's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2017
    Posts
    6,204
    vCash
    98074
    I think we've kind of figured out the mix with our pitchers it seems like we've got it set at:

    Friday: Mac, Preston Johnson, Sims
    Saturday: Bednar, Smith, Simmons/Tullar
    Sunday: Fristoe, Harding, Committee, Sims

  12. #32
    Senior Member Commercecomet24's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2016
    Posts
    24,717
    vCash
    3100
    Quote Originally Posted by The Federalist Engineer View Post
    Hey Commerce, is it just me but I don’t see many multi game relief pitchers anymore. I recall Chuck Holly being the fireman at least twice per weekend in years past. Pete Young would save 2 games per weekend.

    Is my memory deceiving me?
    I'd have to do some research but just based on what I've observed I believe you're right. Pitch counts and innings pitched are being watched so closely now you just don't see pitchers going a little extra these days.

  13. #33
    Senior Member Tbonewannabe's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Location
    Florida
    Posts
    10,651
    vCash
    3500
    Quote Originally Posted by Todd4State View Post
    The best thing about Sims is his flexibility. He can go 1 inning or he can give us 3 and be really effective. I believe against Tulane he went a little more than that and gave up one of his runs on the year.

    If I was in Lemonis's shoes I would accept that our staff is what it is. We have some good starters but neither one is Ethan Small, Maholm, Hudson, Stratton, etc. level. We're just not going to get 7 IP, 100 pitches and 10-12 K's a game from these guys. If I had to go with an ideal "script" it I would probably go:

    Fri- MacLeoud 3-5, Brandon Smith, 1-2, Preston Johnson, 1-2, and then close with Sims 1-3. Those are our three best relievers in my opinion and I want to try to have the opportunity to use them twice in a weekend if needed.
    Sat- Bednar- 3-6, Patrick 1, Stinnett, 1-2, and Simmons 1-2 and if needed Sims for 1 if available.
    Sun- Fristoe- 1-3 one time through order as an opener, Harding for 3-5, Tullar 1-2, and then Price 1, and then if available and needed Sims for 1.

    Koestler and Cerentola are my "hit the fan" options.
    I don't remember Ethan Small going 7 innings very often. He pretty much had 4-6 pitches on every batter which would lead to him getting to around the 5th - 6th inning every game. Strike out pitchers just throw more. MacLeod and Bednar don't get many 10 pitch innings very similar to Ethan Small.

  14. #34
    Senior Member Tbonewannabe's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Location
    Florida
    Posts
    10,651
    vCash
    3500
    Quote Originally Posted by Saltydog View Post
    It's not just the errors it's also the walks and hits they are giving up as well. Every time one of them goes out you can bet your ass that around the 4th or 5th they'll implode. Sure, errors haven't helped but it's like the second time thru the lineup they get their ass hammered and that is a cause for concern. It's bothersome that such an "elite" staff (which is b.s.) can't get thru 4 innings, 5 max.
    MacLeod seems to have a rough 1st inning every week also. Most of the time he gets out of it without doing too much damage but it seems like every week the 1st ends with the bases loaded.

  15. #35
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Posts
    3,717
    vCash
    3168
    Quote Originally Posted by Commercecomet24 View Post
    The key is getting the pitcher out before he gives it all away, which we haven't done in every case.
    Exactly

  16. #36
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2016
    Posts
    11,942
    vCash
    427176943
    Quote Originally Posted by Tbonewannabe View Post
    I don't remember Ethan Small going 7 innings very often. He pretty much had 4-6 pitches on every batter which would lead to him getting to around the 5th - 6th inning every game. Strike out pitchers just throw more. MacLeod and Bednar don't get many 10 pitch innings very similar to Ethan Small.
    Speaking of Ethan. He is with the Biloxi Shuckers this season. So if you are on or near the coast come on out and support him

  17. #37
    Senior Member Cooterpoot's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2016
    Posts
    11,578
    vCash
    52714
    Fristoe has an ERA over 7 in conference games. Got to try someone else there. McLeod is Fitts. Just going to have to piece it together there.

  18. #38
    Senior Member Cooterpoot's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2016
    Posts
    11,578
    vCash
    52714
    Quote Originally Posted by The Federalist Engineer View Post
    Hey Commerce, is it just me but I don’t see many multi game relief pitchers anymore. I recall Chuck Holly being the fireman at least twice per weekend in years past. Pete Young would save 2 games per weekend.

    Is my memory deceiving me?
    We baby our pitchers too much. And I'm all for taking our time with inning increases but we're at the end of the season and still doing it. But when Sims goes 3, you just can't use him again much. But heck, even Dubose would come back and throw an inning or two after starting back in the day. I'll say it again, my only complain with this staff is player management. We just struggle with decisions.

  19. #39
    Senior Member BrunswickDawg's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Location
    Home of Slay, GA
    Posts
    11,916
    vCash
    1746501
    Quote Originally Posted by Cooterpoot View Post
    We baby our pitchers too much. And I'm all for taking our time with inning increases but we're at the end of the season and still doing it. But when Sims goes 3, you just can't use him again much. But heck, even Dubose would come back and throw an inning or two after starting back in the day. I'll say it again, my only complain with this staff is player management. We just struggle with decisions.
    Yes, our player management is so bad we are battling for an SEC title, ranked as high as #2 in polls, have a shot at 40 regular season wins, and we seem to be building to a late season hot streak as the coach makes adjustments to the lineup.
    I'm just not going to nit-pick every decision on a team doing this well. Lemonis has shown us over 3 seasons now that more often than not, he is right and he has gotten results. I think he is setting up this team - in particular the pitching staff - for post-season. We will have a stable of fresh arms, and if we need to pitch Sims on a Friday and again on a Sunday to win a SR - I bet Sims will be out there.
    "After dealing with Ole Miss for over a year," he said, "I've learned to expect their leadership to do and say things that the leadership at other Division I schools would never consider doing and to justify their actions by reminding themselves that "We're Ole Miss.""
    - Tom Mars, Esq. 4.9.18

  20. #40
    Senior Member Cooterpoot's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2016
    Posts
    11,578
    vCash
    52714
    Quote Originally Posted by BrunswickDawg View Post
    Yes, our player management is so bad we are battling for an SEC title, ranked as high as #2 in polls, have a shot at 40 regular season wins, and we seem to be building to a late season hot streak as the coach makes adjustments to the lineup.
    I'm just not going to nit-pick every decision on a team doing this well. Lemonis has shown us over 3 seasons now that more often than not, he is right and he has gotten results. I think he is setting up this team - in particular the pitching staff - for post-season. We will have a stable of fresh arms, and if we need to pitch Sims on a Friday and again on a Sunday to win a SR - I bet Sims will be out there.
    And had we not left a pitcher in to get shelled, and a guy hitting below .200 and a DP machine, while a quality hitter sat the bench, who knows, we might not be behind Ark and Vandy in the rankings or be in first place already. Nobody was complaining about the season. But carry on. Imagine if we were the #1 seed in the NCAAs and got the easiest route.
    Message boards aren't for just saying it's all great. There's discussion here.
    Last edited by Cooterpoot; 05-03-2021 at 03:39 PM.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
Disclaimer: Elitedawgs is a privately owned and operated forum that is managed by alumni of Mississippi State University. This website is in no way affiliated with the Mississippi State University, The Southeastern Conference (SEC) or the National Collegiate Athletic Association (NCAA). The views and opinions expressed herein are strictly those of the post author and may not reflect the views of other members of this forum or elitedawgs.com. The interactive nature of the elitedawgs.com forums makes it impossible for elitedawgs.com to assume responsibility for any of the content posted at this site. Ideas, thoughts, suggestion, comments, opinions, advice and observations made by participants at elitedawgs.com are not endorsed by elitedawgs.com
Elitedawgs: A Mississippi State Fan Forum, Mississippi State Football, Mississippi State Basketball, Mississippi State Baseball, Mississippi State Athletics. Mississippi State message board.