Starting pitchers lately

[basedog]

It's a little concerning seeing our Friday and Sunday pitchers struggling after one time thru the lineup. Not sure what needs to be done to fix this situation, maybe starting Harding on Sunday, move Bednar to Friday but I'm iffy and what I would do. Seems it's our biggest question mark moving forward, playing Leggett at third has helped a lot.

But things have worked out so far, winning makes life much easier. I will say I have questioned several times about us being say a top 6 team in the country, but yet we keep finding ways to win. I do think we have improved especially hitting and again I think our defense will be better, but it goes back to what can be done with say Friday and Sunday starters?

I will hang up and listen, I have not the answer but I do know I would be making at least a change to one of those two starters. Walks and errors have hurt both.

[CadaverDawg]

Don't know the answer, but we may need to just try a piggyback approach like we did with Fitts years ago. Maybe go ahead and predetermine that Mac and Fristoe will only go one time through, and then piggyback with a completely different type of pitcher. Maybe follow Mac with Brandon Smith every week, and follow Fristoe with Harding like yesterday? One great thing is that we have depth but it would be great to be able to combine 2 guys pre-planned and get 6 innings, then use some guys like Tullar, Preston, and Sims as needed after 6. Not nearly that cut and dry, but I agree it's concerning that our starters have been bad lately outside of Bednar

[Gutter Cobreh]

I wouldn't make a change with either starter.

Our issues, from my perspective, are fielding and watching too many third strikes.

I liked to see the lineup shuffled yesterday and we seemed better defensively.

Our plate discipline has improved, but too many times it seems like our guys would rather walk than swing the bat. This may be a bi-product of working counts, but if it's close with 2 strikes and with umps like we saw this weekend - you have to swing the bat.

[Cowbell]

I wouldn't make a change with either starter.

Our issues, from my perspective, are fielding and watching too many third strikes.

I liked to see the lineup shuffled yesterday and we seemed better defensively.

Our plate discipline has improved, but too many times it seems like our guys would rather walk than swing the bat. This may be a bi-product of working counts, but if it's close with 2 strikes and with umps like we saw this weekend - you have to swing the bat.

We don't have major pitching issues, but we do have big enough issues that will keep us from going to Omaha if something doesn't improve. Our pen may be deep but the quality of our starters offsets that depth.

[chef dixon]

To me this is just college baseball. Anyone not named Vandy has this problem and they still have off weekends. We are looking for perfection in a very imperfect level of baseball. We're up there with anybody, just need to get hot in June.

[Gutter Cobreh]

We don't have major pitching issues, but we do have big enough issues that will keep us from going to Omaha if something doesn't improve. Our pen may be deep but the quality of our starters offsets that depth.

It goes back to what Cadaver posted. We have such depth that you have to find the right mix.

Would you rather go to Omaha with Vandy's starters or Arkansas' hitters? Which one do you think give you the best chance of winning? Some will say pitching, others prefer hitting. For us, we have outstanding pitching and our starters aren't giving up big numbers. We have bullpen depth for days, so just need to mix and match.

I'm still more concerned with our defense and working pitch counts than I am with our starting rotation.

[Saltydog]

It doesn't concern you that our starters can't get thru 4 or 5 innings at the most? It darn sure bothers me. Yes, the bp has been good but once we start getting into regionals we need those starters to step up and give us 6 innings.

[Cowbell]

It goes back to what Cadaver posted. We have such depth that you have to find the right mix.

Would you rather go to Omaha with Vandy's starters or Arkansas' hitters? Which one do you think give you the best chance of winning? Some will say pitching, others prefer hitting. For us, we have outstanding pitching and our starters aren't giving up big numbers. We have bullpen depth for days, so just need to mix and match.

I'm still more concerned with our defense and working pitch counts than I am with our starting rotation.

I can agree with this. I think our hitting is not quite good enough to leave some of our starters out there as long as we do sometimes. I'm hoping lemon is just letting our guys endure hardships to get them ready for a run.

[Cowbell]

It doesn't concern you that our starters can't thru 4 or 5 innings at the most? It darn sure bothers me. Yes, the bp has been good but once we start getting into regionals we need those starters to step up and give us 6 innings.

Either that or we better have some relievers really take a step to the next level.

[parabrave]

It doesn't concern you that our starters can't get thru 4 or 5 innings at the most? It darn sure bothers me. Yes, the bp has been good but once we start getting into regionals we need those starters to step up and give us 6 innings.

Good point. We need our starters to give us 6-7 innings and at this point in the season we should have ar least one who can. One big thing that is causing these guys to lose it is the stupid errors that are happening when we have 2 outs. Nothing kills a pitcher more than an error which prolongs an inning when he knows he should be out of it.

[parabrave]

It doesn't concern you that our starters can't get thru 4 or 5 innings at the most? It darn sure bothers me. Yes, the bp has been good but once we start getting into regionals we need those starters to step up and give us 6 innings.

Good point. We need our starters to give us 6-7 innings and at this point in the season we should have ar least one who can. One big thing that is causing these guys to lose it is the stupid errors that are happening when we have 2 outs. Nothing kills a pitcher more than an error which prolongs an inning when he knows he should be out of it.

[Gutter Cobreh]

It doesn't concern you that our starters can't get thru 4 or 5 innings at the most? It darn sure bothers me. Yes, the bp has been good but once we start getting into regionals we need those starters to step up and give us 6 innings.

No. To get 6 innings from a starter (assuming they're on a pitch count) - that averages out around 17 pitches per inning. We may stretch some guys out when the postseason comes around, but our coaching staff has shown us that they are not going to push a kid past this limit very often. To expect any of our pitchers to go 6 innings consistently is only setting yourself up to be disappointed. On top of that, I don't think they need to go 6 innings. In the past, we've had to rely on position players to pitch relief and we have the staff this year where that isn't needed. We have the depth in the bullpen where we don't need any starter to carry us. We simply need for them to not leave anything hanging and not walk a bunch of batters.

This is also why I'm more worried about us working counts against opposing pitchers. The called 3rd strikes without swinging the bat when it's close drives me nuts, but at the least - we are working counts and not up there swinging at every breaking ball. If we can work the counts on the opposing team's ace - we then get to their bullpen quicker and have a better shot. I have yet to see a team we've faced whose bullpen is anywhere close to what we put out there.

I can agree with this. I think our hitting is not quite good enough to leave some of our starters out there as long as we do sometimes. I'm hoping lemon is just letting our guys endure hardships to get them ready for a run.

Our hitting is not where it needs to be consistently. Outside of TA, who else do we have? We have major holes in the lineup that hinders us far worse than our pitching staff.

Good point. We need our starters to give us 6-7 innings and at this point in the season we should have ar least one who can. One big thing that is causing these guys to lose it is the stupid errors that are happening when we have 2 outs. Nothing kills a pitcher more than an error which prolongs an inning when he knows he should be out of it.

Great point! Errors extend innings, which causes pitch counts to go up.

[Todd4State]

MacLeoud needs to throw strikes and not worry about striking every one out. Fristoe needs a third pitch.

[BeardoMSU]

They've just been inconsistent. One week either Mac and Beldar will look amazing, go 5 or 6...then the next, they just don't have it. Also with both of them, they'll be cruising, and then hit some adversity and just crumble...which is obviously all mental. Fristoe does this almost every week it seems, but he's just a freshman, so I can't really knock him. Also, many of those "adversity" moments involve shitty defense behind them or a shitty ump, but still.

I still think we're in good shape, though. We've got several guys out of the pen that can go deep. We just need to get our minds right for the post season, which has certainly been a characteristic of recent MSU teams, so lets hope for more of the same.

[BeardoMSU]

MacLeoud needs to throw strikes and not worry about striking every one out. Fristoe needs a third pitch.

This, lol.

As Crash said, "Strikeouts are fascist....lets get some groundballs". Mac also tries to nibble too much. He needs to pitch to contact, keep the ball down, and not try so hard.

[Lord McBuckethead]

Getting hot in June will require hits with risp.

[parabrave]

You want to trust your D but when you never know when a ball is going to be thrown into the dugout of a ball mishandled or a misjudged fly ball you try to S/O the batter.

[Todd4State]

They've just been inconsistent. One week either Mac and Beldar will look amazing, go 5 or 6...then the next, they just don't have it. Also with both of them, they'll be cruising, and then hit some adversity and just crumble...which is obviously all mental. Fristoe does this almost every week it seems, but he's just a freshman, so I can't really knock him. Also, many of those "adversity" moments involve shitty defense behind them or a shitty ump, but still.

I still think we're in good shape, though. We've got several guys out of the pen that can go deep. We just need to get our minds right for the post season, which has certainly been a characteristic of recent MSU teams, so lets hope for more of the same.

We're in good shape because of our bullpen. The only concern I have is Foxhall being too patient. Or not trusting guys. I think we can use Chase Patrick, Koestler, and Spencer Price more along with the guys we are already using and be even better.

And yes I know Patrick gave up a home run against A&M. His ERA is under two. Price had a bad outing against UAB. He also has really good peripheral stats and he is a SEC veteran. They both are capable of eating an inning for us.

And we need to keep using Cerentola in relief midweek and try to get him ready for the postseason.

[BeardoMSU]

We're in good shape because of our bullpen. The only concern I have is Foxhall being too patient. Or not trusting guys. I think we can use Chase Patrick, Koestler, and Spencer Price more along with the guys we are already using and be even better.

And yes I know Patrick gave up a home run against A&M. His ERA is under two. Price had a bad outing against UAB. He also has really good peripheral stats and he is a SEC veteran. They both are capable of eating an inning for us.

And we need to keep using Cerentola in relief midweek and try to get him ready for the postseason.

Agreed.

[99jc]

Back in the days of the Big Red Machine Sparky Anderson was know as Captain Hook If a starter made 5 innings he was gone at the first sign of trouble. You can only do that if you have an elite Bullpen and WE DO. Landon Sims is really a starter/Elite reliever. when you have an ace like that it can go a long way if we make it to Omaha. And I am telling you Cerentola has 1 great game in him this season and i think we will see it before the end of the World Series. He has to throw from the stretch to be effective and once he learns not to over stride Game on!.