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Thread: MSU tuition during a pandemic.....

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    MSU tuition during a pandemic.....

    Let me vent for a moment.....somehow during a pandemic the cost of a semester at MSU has increased. Online courses offered at a premium, course codes sold to students to access homework online, books appear to have gone up as well.

    I smell a rat......profs sitting at home ?teaching?

    Anybody else with college students notice this increase?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Harrydawg View Post
    Let me vent for a moment.....somehow during a pandemic the cost of a semester at MSU has increased. Online courses offered at a premium, course codes sold to students to access homework online, books appear to have gone up as well.

    I smell a rat......profs sitting at home ?teaching?

    Anybody else with college students notice this increase?
    Don?t disagree with your overall assessment but be very careful looping professors into your argument. They?re working hard as ever to provide a solid learning environment and criteria during all this

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    Senior Member Lord McBuckethead's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DEDawg View Post
    Don?t disagree with your overall assessment but be very careful looping professors into your argument. They?re working hard as ever to provide a solid learning environment and criteria during all this
    Dude, professors write a syllabus once and teach it for 25 years. Not sure why they should be complaining having to put in a little work to pass that worn out prepared class a new way.

    Online classes should be less money. No doubt.
    Downvotes_Hype

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    Senior Member MetEdDawg's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lord McBuckethead View Post
    Dude, professors write a syllabus once and teach it for 25 years. Not sure why they should be complaining having to put in a little work to pass that worn out prepared class a new way.

    Online classes should be less money. No doubt.
    I can't speak for professors, but my teachers in my building do more prep and work for their 80-90 remote kids than they do for their 150 kids they have in the building.

    And I can promise you that as an AP, it's requiring me to do a hell of a lot more work too.

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    Is there anything more overvalued than a college education today?.... except Game Stop stock.

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    Until the masses wake up to the racket, keep expecting to pay for the Ponzi scheme that is the US education system. Benefits the haves, waters down the degrees of the have nots, and takes the tax dollars of the 2/3rds of Americans that don?t go to college to keep the scheme alive.

    Have to give them credit. They are pulling one of the biggest scams on the American public with barely any notice. Hats off to them.

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    Senior Member Tbonewannabe's Avatar
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    My sister in law works at UAH and they make most of their money on students spending money on campus. Their revenue is impacted by less students on campus. MSU is probably trying to get some money to recoup the lost revenue.

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    My kid is a Freshman at another college. My observation is that she has more weekly assignments than I had in college. Typically she will have a writing assignment, quiz and test each class, each week. That's more than I remember having.

    One class and a lab is completely online. Her other 4 classes are hybrid. So she still goes to 4 classes (once a week) but has this online work.

    So my opinion is, you are getting the education the schools promised. Your student may be more challenged than in a classroom setting. Because they have to read and research more on their own.

    The rip off is not going completely online and allowing students to stay home and save on housing.
    Last edited by Maroonthirteen; 02-03-2021 at 09:34 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lord McBuckethead View Post
    Dude, professors write a syllabus once and teach it for 25 years. Not sure why they should be complaining having to put in a little work to pass that worn out prepared class a new way.

    Online classes should be less money. No doubt.
    Show me where I said they are complaining? Also your syllabus assessment is not correct.

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    Quote Originally Posted by RougeDawg View Post
    Until the masses wake up to the racket, keep expecting to pay for the Ponzi scheme that is the US education system. Benefits the haves, waters down the degrees of the have nots, and takes the tax dollars of the 2/3rds of Americans that don?t go to college to keep the scheme alive.

    Have to give them credit. They are pulling one of the biggest scams on the American public with barely any notice. Hats off to them.
    Not just with the public barely noticing, with much of the public demanding that the scam be expanded and doubled down on.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Leeshouldveflanked View Post
    Is there anything more overvalued than a college education today?.... except Game Stop stock.
    It depends on the major! Not all professions (majors) have the same pay scale. If you major in underwater basket weaving, your chances of making a decent living are very limited, especially if you have a student loan.

    I think all potential students need to be shown, by the university and/or their parents, a comparison chart of what professions (majors) pay. One has to go to college with their eyes open and "know" what they are getting into. Also, whatever profession (major) is chosen, then be happy or content with what you make and do not be jealous or envious of others that have more than you do! This creates an entitlement mentality where they think they are entitled to more than they have, when in reality they had the same opportunity to make a sensible choice as others.

    What you do in life is a choice!

    There are a multitude of charts showing salaries of various college majors. I am showing one below.

    https://www.visualcapitalist.com/vis...llege-degrees/

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    Senior Member Maroonthirteen's Avatar
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    State (as well as other universities) has salary information for most degrees. Maybe all.... I recall from browsing the site with my kids and discussing potential majors.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Extendedcab View Post
    It depends on the major! Not all professions (majors) have the same pay scale. If you major in underwater basket weaving, your chances of making a decent living are very limited, especially if you have a student loan.

    I think all potential students need to be shown, by the university and/or their parents, a comparison chart of what professions (majors) pay. One has to go to college with their eyes open and "know" what they are getting into. Also, whatever profession (major) is chosen, then be happy or content with what you make and do not be jealous or envious of others that have more than you do! This creates an entitlement mentality where they think they are entitled to more than they have, when in reality they had the same opportunity to make a sensible choice as others.

    What you do in life is a choice!

    There are a multitude of charts showing salaries of various college majors. I am showing one below.

    https://www.visualcapitalist.com/vis...llege-degrees/
    Absolutely.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Extendedcab View Post
    It depends on the major! Not all professions (majors) have the same pay scale. If you major in underwater basket weaving, your chances of making a decent living are very limited, especially if you have a student loan.

    I think all potential students need to be shown, by the university and/or their parents, a comparison chart of what professions (majors) pay. One has to go to college with their eyes open and "know" what they are getting into. Also, whatever profession (major) is chosen, then be happy or content with what you make and do not be jealous or envious of others that have more than you do! This creates an entitlement mentality where they think they are entitled to more than they have, when in reality they had the same opportunity to make a sensible choice as others.

    What you do in life is a choice!

    There are a multitude of charts showing salaries of various college majors. I am showing one below.

    https://www.visualcapitalist.com/vis...llege-degrees/
    Dead on. My daughter is at MSU in engineering working her tail off and college is expensive but there are many majors that it is hard to justify the cost (engineering or medicine are not them). Many majors may have students get out making 25-35K a year. The model just doesn't give a return. While many are jealous of those kids who chose tough majors that make good money later, they don't want anything to do with the sacrifice it takes to get there. Just have the gov or someone give me the money.

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    Quote Originally Posted by R2Dawg View Post
    Dead on. My daughter is at MSU in engineering working her tail off and college is expensive but there are many majors that it is hard to justify the cost (engineering or medicine are not them). Many majors may have students get out making 25-35K a year. The model just doesn't give a return. While many are jealous of those kids who chose tough majors that make good money later, they don't want anything to do with the sacrifice it takes to get there. Just have the gov or someone give me the money.
    A lot of those degrees still end up having a solid return because while the starting pay is not great, it allows them to compete for higher paying jobs as they move up. I know plenty of people that started out in the high 20's or low 30's fifteen years ago that are now making anywhere from ok money to really good money. What they are doing doesn't really require anything that they learned in college, but I think without exception, the employers require a degree as part of the job requirement. So for them, they end up getting an ok to really good return on their degree. Of course there are plenty of other people that started off there or even lower and didn't move up. Sometimes that's due to luck; sometimes that due to them not being good workers; a lot of times it's probably due to them not being somebody that should have been in college to begin with.

    Of course the real problem is that we have so tightly tied college degrees to the job market. You get sued if you just hire based on tests showing generalized intelligence (or even particular intelligence/knowledge if you don't do it correctly), but you can hire based on degree and college GPA and be completely safe. Really messed up and inefficient system the government has managed to set up and support. And of course, per the norm, the government managed to inflict disproportionate harm on minorities while imposing rules and regulations ostensibly meant to help them.

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    Senior Member KOdawg1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lord McBuckethead View Post
    Dude, professors write a syllabus once and teach it for 25 years. Not sure why they should be complaining having to put in a little work to pass that worn out prepared class a new way.
    Just an ill-informed, incorrect statement all the way around.

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    Senior Member maroonmania's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by R2Dawg View Post
    Dead on. My daughter is at MSU in engineering working her tail off and college is expensive but there are many majors that it is hard to justify the cost (engineering or medicine are not them). Many majors may have students get out making 25-35K a year. The model just doesn't give a return. While many are jealous of those kids who chose tough majors that make good money later, they don't want anything to do with the sacrifice it takes to get there. Just have the gov or someone give me the money.
    I feel your pain. My daughter is a JR at MSU and I'm paying the same ridiculous online tuition. Not only that, I'm still paying for her sorority fees and I don't even think they can have in person meetings or parties or events or anything. You are still paying the same money either way but you sure feel better about it when it seems a little more justified.

    And on the other topic, when the dems get done raising minimum wage to $15/hour you will be able to make over 30K/year flipping burgers. Heck, why go to college?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Johnson85 View Post
    A lot of those degrees still end up having a solid return because while the starting pay is not great, it allows them to compete for higher paying jobs as they move up. I know plenty of people that started out in the high 20's or low 30's fifteen years ago that are now making anywhere from ok money to really good money. What they are doing doesn't really require anything that they learned in college, but I think without exception, the employers require a degree as part of the job requirement. So for them, they end up getting an ok to really good return on their degree. Of course there are plenty of other people that started off there or even lower and didn't move up. Sometimes that's due to luck; sometimes that due to them not being good workers; a lot of times it's probably due to them not being somebody that should have been in college to begin with.

    Of course the real problem is that we have so tightly tied college degrees to the job market. You get sued if you just hire based on tests showing generalized intelligence (or even particular intelligence/knowledge if you don't do it correctly), but you can hire based on degree and college GPA and be completely safe. Really messed up and inefficient system the government has managed to set up and support. And of course, per the norm, the government managed to inflict disproportionate harm on minorities while imposing rules and regulations ostensibly meant to help them.
    A large % of people have no reason to go to college. Many need to learn a skill. They will make more money and have more success than most college graduates of whom many never really use their degrees. I work in manufacturing and we have tons of college degree folks working shift that use nothing in their degree. They couldn't get a job in what they majored. Yes a few end up making more money but that is the rare exception not the rule.

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    Senior Member Maroonthirteen's Avatar
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    My advice to my kids, figure out what you love and do that.

    Myself, I can live on a lesser salary doing something I love to be happy in life. Rather than getting a degree in a field I'm not interested but pays well, only to hate life.

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    Hot take - College degrees are mostly a scam at these elevated prices and are just pillaging middle class American families.

    I am 100% certain that I could get a high-school kid with a 30+ ACT and a good upbringing and decent vocabulary and put them in an entry level job at a Fortune 200/500 company and they would shine and progressively rise. The merits and quality of the raw material (the student) is 90% of the ultimate value, the rest is mostly experience.

    The good kid would only need to take some essential classes and teach themselves some mechanics, programming, and physics, they would do just fine. College professors don't really teach the 30+ kids very much, just give them the reading list and experience, then good to go. Colleges are merely a toll booth to many kids. Peter Theil, Paypal and Palantir co-founder, has written and spoken expensively about this and acts upon it to recruit premium talent.

    Another reason the expensive college is a scam is that direct competitors overseas are being offered at a fraction of the price. Imperial College of London, Swiss Federal Institute, Munich TU, New South Wales, Delft TU cost less than Ole Miss. The best Universities in the world, with English language options cost less than a barely accredited college in Lafayette County Mississippi. That's not even factoring the high quality universities in the 3rd world and Eastern Europe. You can talk with a new grad of decent Philippines university, you would not be able to Pepsi challenge with Philippine immigrant graduating from the University of Illinois. Same with Romanian kids.

    Only immigration laws and limits on work visas keep the bubble from a spectacular pop.

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