Our Athletic Dept as a Whole

[Extendedcab]

Absolute BS. People have let their desires rule them since the beginning of time (or have you not read Genesis?). Coaches have committed all sorts of improprieties at universities since they first began athletic competition. Hell, the first Egg Bowl was delayed because Ole Miss believed that we hired professional ringers to play the game. Do you know why Babe McCarthy was fired? Why Richard Williams "retired"? MSU had a player shaving points in basketball in the early 60s. Ever heard of the Black Sox?

I'm not condoning any of it - but to act like there is some Golden Era of Principals and Ethics in sports is possibly the dumbest take I've ever read on a message board.

The only dumb stance is not realizing that morals in the country and around the world have eroded over time. Look at the activities we allow and celebrate today compared to times past. One example, look at pop music stars and the way they dress, predominately on stage, and the way they gyrate on stage like some uncontrollable animal. In days past, men wore suites or coats onstage and women wore apparel that did not degenerate them and make them look like some cheap whore.

People today are less ethical/moral as a whole, yes, ethics/morals were taught years ago - the bible was taught in schools - not anymore since around 1962. Look at the discussion we are having here about hiring Freeze, a person that is known to hire call girls not just for himself but for teenagers as well! There are people on this board are all for hiring him! Why, just because he wins football games? But at what cost to the young student athletics and to the reputation of the university? None of that seems to matter, just win baby, just win at all cost!

Go back to the beginning of this country and this type of behavior was unheard of "as a whole"- it was severely condemned and pushed into the fringes of society. Those that did practice this type of behavior were severely punished - public whippings, fines, even capital punishment for the more sever offenders.

So my statements were not that we as a people did not commit sins, we all do as fallen creation, but that as a whole unethical or unmoral behavior was done in secret and not publicly pronounced and celebrated like we do today. People used to be ashamed of their sins and wanted to cover it up as much as possible.

Also in the past if a person was unethical, his professional career was finished. Today, they get another job at a so called Christian institution; really? And now since he is winning there, people are wanting to hire him or recommend he be hired at other more prominent institutions!

[StarkVegasSteve]

The only dumb stance is not realizing that morals in the country and around the world have eroded over time. Look at the activities we allow and celebrate today compared to times past. One example, look at pop music stars and the way they dress, predominately on stage, and the way they gyrate on stage like some uncontrollable animal. In days past, men wore suites or coats onstage and women wore apparel that did not degenerate them and make them look like some cheap whore.

People today are less ethical/moral as a whole, yes, ethics/morals were taught years ago - the bible was taught in schools - not anymore since around 1962. Look at the discussion we are having here about hiring Freeze, a person that is known to hire call girls not just for himself but for teenagers as well! There are people on this board are all for hiring him! Why, just because he wins football games? But at what cost to the young student athletics and to the reputation of the university? None of that seems to matter, just win baby, just win at all cost!

Go back to the beginning of this country and this type of behavior was unheard of "as a whole"- it was severely condemned and pushed into the fringes of society. Those that did practice this type of behavior were severely punished - public whippings, fines, even capital punishment for the more sever offenders.

So my statements were not that we as a people did not commit sins, we all do as fallen creation, but that as a whole unethical or unmoral behavior was done in secret and not publicly pronounced and celebrated like we do today. People used to be ashamed of their sins and wanted to cover it up as much as possible.

Also in the past if a person was unethical, his professional career was finished. Today, they get another job at a so called Christian institution; really? And now since he is winning there, people are wanting to hire him or recommend he be hired at other more prominent institutions!

So since you want to go the religion route on this one, why does Freeze not deserve a second chance? Why does one mistake cause someone to be cast out? Does the bible not say that all sin and fall short of the glory of God? You can't pick and choose what you want to condemn if you want to go that route. Hugh won't be hired here for a few reasons, but his past shouldn't be one of them. His name has been dragged through the mud and he seems to have changed his ways. Whether he has, I don't know. But he's a successful coach and an amazing play caller. I'd be willing to give him a chance if there was a chance in hell he'd actually come here.

[BeardoMSU]

I see we've reached the inevitable "Sunday School" portion of this thread**

[Extendedcab]

So since you want to go the religion route on this one, why does Freeze not deserve a second chance? Why does one mistake cause someone to be cast out? Does the bible not say that all sin and fall short of the glory of God? You can't pick and choose what you want to condemn if you want to go that route. Hugh won't be hired here for a few reasons, but his past shouldn't be one of them. His name has been dragged through the mud and he seems to have changed his ways. Whether he has, I don't know. But he's a successful coach and an amazing play caller. I'd be willing to give him a chance if there was a chance in hell he'd actually come here.

Coaches get a second chance? What about the embezzler that gets caught and goes to prison. They socially paid the price of the crime. Would you hire that person to be your accountant or CFO? I don't think so.

Forgiveness is a different issue! I do forgive Freeze IF he has truly had a change of heart. However, the bible also teaches a concept of being disqualified in your job for past sins as well - see 1 Corinthians 9:27 - "I discipline my body like an athlete, training it to do what it should. Otherwise, I fear that after preaching to others I myself might be disqualified."

Freeze should be disqualified form being a coach, he should go do something else.

This is not talking about loosing your salvation, so don't go there!

[Extendedcab]

I see we've reached the inevitable "Sunday School" portion of this thread**

If this is what the WORLD thinks of Christianity, then they have missed the mark, again! I think this scene is from a Benny Hinn, charismatic preacher, in one of his crusades. This is nothing like main stream Christian churches in America.

[R2Dawg]

Our women's basketball coach better win because she has already alienated some of her fanbase

What has she done? Have not seen anything.

[Matt3467]

I think there is a misunderstanding in what previous posts implied regarding ethics. Ethics is not all that matters, however it is the primary criteria. In other words if a coach does not have ethics then they automatically do NOT qualify for the job. When a coach or coaches are found that do have ethics, then we grade them on how well they coach. It is pretty simple!

My question, regarding ethical coaches, is why would you want an unethical coach 1) representing your university and 2) having access to young impressionable kids? This is a recipe for disaster! Look at Freeze, hiring a call service for himself and reportedly for prospective student/athletics as well! Look at Penn State, the MSU baseball coach a couple of years ago, now I'm hearing our golf coach was fired for improprieties. This level of depravity was unheard of in generations pasts. Has anybody thought about the negative impact these coaches have on the students/athletics? What has happen to us as a people? The apostle Paul wrote, that men in the last days would become "incontinent", or without self-control, and "lovers of pleasure more than lovers of God". Those phrases accurately describe the self-centered mindset overrunning our nation. How disgraceful!

I love MSU just as much as anyone else, (I am a 82 graduate in electrical engineering, my wife went to MSU for 1 year, 3 of my 4 sons went to MSU - 2 graduated with degrees in physics), but is putting a W in the win column more important than hiring a moral person first and foremost and then a coach? Is there any such person left that would fill that role? I have ethics, but I am not a coach, even though I play one on TV or else I would apply!

There has to be a better way than imitating unethical institutions by hiring known unethical people.

I wish the world over people thought like you but fact is that there will never be sports without corruption and there's next to no chance a consistent winner will be built in college football without some shortcuts. You replied the other day and said that you hoped I didn't lead my personal life that way and the answer is I don't. There's a difference though between my personal life and sports. I would also never entertain coaching because I know that unless I wanted to go far and win big on the big stage there would have to be some moral sacrifices somewhere. Just the way it is in sports.

[R2Dawg]

Man I miss the days when we argued about how many times Fitzgerald was actually calling his own number instead of running a read.

Hah, so true.

[Matt3467]

The only dumb stance is not realizing that morals in the country and around the world have eroded over time. Look at the activities we allow and celebrate today compared to times past. One example, look at pop music stars and the way they dress, predominately on stage, and the way they gyrate on stage like some uncontrollable animal. In days past, men wore suites or coats onstage and women wore apparel that did not degenerate them and make them look like some cheap whore.

People today are less ethical/moral as a whole, yes, ethics/morals were taught years ago - the bible was taught in schools - not anymore since around 1962. Look at the discussion we are having here about hiring Freeze, a person that is known to hire call girls not just for himself but for teenagers as well! There are people on this board are all for hiring him! Why, just because he wins football games? But at what cost to the young student athletics and to the reputation of the university? None of that seems to matter, just win baby, just win at all cost!

Go back to the beginning of this country and this type of behavior was unheard of "as a whole"- it was severely condemned and pushed into the fringes of society. Those that did practice this type of behavior were severely punished - public whippings, fines, even capital punishment for the more sever offenders.

So my statements were not that we as a people did not commit sins, we all do as fallen creation, but that as a whole unethical or unmoral behavior was done in secret and not publicly pronounced and celebrated like we do today. People used to be ashamed of their sins and wanted to cover it up as much as possible.

Also in the past if a person was unethical, his professional career was finished. Today, they get another job at a so called Christian institution; really? And now since he is winning there, people are wanting to hire him or recommend he be hired at other more prominent institutions!

As a father raising a daughter I would dissuade her from attending the majority secular colleges (and several "christian" colleges too) and yes that includes State. I've seen the way education has gone and morals have gone out of the window. I don't like the way it is but sometimes the only way to deal with it is avoid it.

[PendingTransaction]

What has she done? Have not seen anything.

You won't believe it...she tweeted a picture of Biden and Harris! Just desecrated our University's great southern conservative values. It will probably result in her not being able to recruit any players from our fine Mississippi Academies.

[R2Dawg]

Yeah. Have to realize most of your fan base is pretty conservative. You are free to opinion and I don?t much care for what someone?s political belief is but if you push your political beliefs in public with an official account as your official capacity as a state employee and a coach that can have multiple ramifications. For one you lose support of your fan base but on the other hand if she doesn?t support certain trending political ideologies she loses her team. Fine line. If they win more people will not care as much. But looking at pro sports and lack of viewers from the BLM stuff there are a large group of fans that are lost regardless of winning.

A person would be best served to hold those beliefs less public no matter where you fall. Like MJ said years ago, Republicans buy sneakers too. Great one liner and true.

[R2Dawg]

So since you want to go the religion route on this one, why does Freeze not deserve a second chance? Why does one mistake cause someone to be cast out? Does the bible not say that all sin and fall short of the glory of God? You can't pick and choose what you want to condemn if you want to go that route. Hugh won't be hired here for a few reasons, but his past shouldn't be one of them. His name has been dragged through the mud and he seems to have changed his ways. Whether he has, I don't know. But he's a successful coach and an amazing play caller. I'd be willing to give him a chance if there was a chance in hell he'd actually come here.

Good point but here is the problem. People mix the two but separate issues. From a righteousness standpoint, yes we are all sinners and need the righteous blood of Christ to save us but just because that is true does not erase the consequences of our sin in this life. Murders in prison are saved and had their sin erased by Jesus' forgiveness all the time but they still have to serve their time. People can and do get second chances but that is very situational. Do you hire a guy that was guilty of stealing millions of $ to keep your books or too big a risk?

For Freeze, I'd probably give him a second chance at some point, hey he has that already at a Christian University so already done.

[Maroonthirteen]

Just desecrated our University's great southern conservative values. It will probably result in her not being able to recruit any players from our fine Mississippi Academies.

Regarding the fans pushing back on the basketball coach, I have a feeling this thread is making a mountain out of an ant hill.

Maybe there is a few folks at the Bogiechitto barber shop that complain thatMiss State has a liberal coach. However the folks that actually go to games have similar political views of the coach.

As for recruitment; the president to the ad to the ball coach will tow whatever political view to land players. Recruiting will be fine despite Bob from Bogiechitto.

[StarkVegasSteve]

You won't believe it...she tweeted a picture of Biden and Harris! Just desecrated our University's great southern conservative values. It will probably result in her not being able to recruit any players from our fine Mississippi Academies.

This is actually kind of humorous because right after Vic was hired there was a girl playing at Starkville Academy that some of the lifelong women's basketball fans wanted him to offer and instead he offered his daughter. Those people swore they'd never step foot in the Hump again until he was gone. Those same people were right back there when we were winning. Just more proof that winning solves everything.

For reference, his daughter was a two year starter on a team that played for 2 consecutive national championships, the other girl was a reserve that played at Central Arkansas. I think Vic made the right choice.

[AROB44]

The "wonderful" thing about message boards is that you can always find folks who will bitch about something relating to the University.....academics, athletics, president, coaches, players ... you name it ... there is always somebody..

[Mobile Bay]

Yes she has. Taking Vic's place was a hard enough job, and she's apparently made it more difficult.

I don't know. I doubt it's bothering the recruits and players. Might even help there. Who knows, the next Tiera McCowin might have had a Biden sign in the yard, or all over her Instagram.

[Captain Falcon]

I think that saying will haunt State fans for years to come.

In any other sport I would agree with you, but women's basketball is such a haves and have nots sport. Nikki may gradually end up failing, but I would be really shocked if it happens immediately. I guess it also depends on your definition of failure.

[Percho]

So since you want to go the religion route on this one, why does Freeze not deserve a second chance? Why does one mistake cause someone to be cast out? Does the bible not say that all sin and fall short of the glory of God? You can't pick and choose what you want to condemn if you want to go that route. Hugh won't be hired here for a few reasons, but his past shouldn't be one of them. His name has been dragged through the mud and he seems to have changed his ways. Whether he has, I don't know. But he's a successful coach and an amazing play caller. I'd be willing to give him a chance if there was a chance in hell he'd actually come here.

Second, chance? Read between the lines a bit on, Hey Hugh.

[was21]

The United States is now an almost secular country. Religion is an outlier. There are a lot of hypocrites. The way it's viewed is one's professional life and then there's the personal life...two sides viewed from different perspectives. Unfortunately, that's the way it is. If you're good at your job, and yet your personal life is a moral trainwreck it's not newsworthy.

[maroonmania]

Regarding the fans pushing back on the basketball coach, I have a feeling this thread is making a mountain out of an ant hill.

Maybe there is a few folks at the Bogiechitto barber shop that complain thatMiss State has a liberal coach. However the folks that actually go to games have similar political views of the coach.

As for recruitment; the president to the ad to the ball coach will tow whatever political view to land players. Recruiting will be fine despite Bob from Bogiechitto.

While I would certainly prefer our coaches kept their political views to themselves, it certainly doesn't bother me that our WBB coach is a Biden/Harris supporter. Maybe its profiling but given that 90%+ of all African-Americans support liberal democrat candidates, I pretty much assume it to be that way unless someone of color makes it clear to me that they aren't a liberal supporter. So why would it be a big deal to anyone? The real shocker would be if she was somehow a conservative Republican.