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Thread: In the SEC, you still have to run the ball....

  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by ShotgunDawg View Post
    Maybe. I'm not sure how any of us would know that
    I explained it in the other thread that I started. Art Briles, Dana Holgerson, and Lincoln Riley learned that the air raid needed traditional splits. They are all running Air Raid 2.0 or maybe even 4.0. Leach is still running DOS.

  2. #22
    Senior Member TrapGame's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HoopsDawg View Post
    I explained it in the other thread that I started. Art Briles, Dana Holgerson, and Lincoln Riley learned that the air raid needed traditional splits. They are all running Air Raid 2.0 or maybe even 4.0. Leach is still running DOS.
    This.

    If the only thing Leach did was utilize a good dual threat QB that would add a completely different dimension to his offense that would change how defenses scheme it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cooterpoot View Post
    LSU was a balanced team and OM never won it. You are so hung up on OM you're blind. You beat AL with similar talent, not a damn scheme.
    OM also had 3 of the best receivers in the SEC that year and had a good running game which was utilized. Look at Bama this year they have gone back to a more balanced attack. They were good because they had the best receiving corps the last 3 years and Tua and Hurts were a threat to run. No teams could just drop 8 and rush 3 against that. You have to be able to run the ball in the SEC.

  4. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by ShotgunDawg View Post
    Maybe. I'm not sure how any of us would know that
    Let me try to put it another way and maybe this should be a separate thread, but can we all agree that the number 1 priority for Leach should be how to beat the rush 3 drop 8? If we can at least agree on that, let me ask you this:

    Would it be better to attack a 3-8 with traditional splits or wide splits? The answer is easy and obvious, it's traditional splits.

  5. #25
    Senior Member ShotgunDawg's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HoopsDawg View Post
    Let me try to put it another way and maybe this should be a separate thread, but can we all agree that the number 1 priority for Leach should be how to beat the rush 3 drop 8? If we can at least agree on that, let me ask you this:

    Would it be better to attack a 3-8 with traditional splits or wide splits? The answer is easy and obvious, it's traditional splits.
    Ok. Well hopefully he makes some adjustments over the next two weeks
    CAN'T PUT A SADDLE ON A MUSTANG

    Quit Your Bi$&$&?!, He's Not Going to Run the Ball More

  6. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Maroonthirteen View Post
    That does not bode well. At all.

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    Quote Originally Posted by TrapGame View Post
    This.

    If the only thing Leach did was utilize a good dual threat QB that would add a completely different dimension to his offense that would change how defenses scheme it.
    Shrader can throw the check down pass**(sorta-I'm wanting anything tried right now). Put shrader as one of two running back w Will at qb. At least that would make defenses have to "think" and respect the qb run. Shrader can throw a little too.

  8. #28
    Senior Member Coach34's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ShotgunDawg View Post
    LSU was pass first last year
    LSU ran for 2500 yards last year. Nobody is saying you can?t be pass 1st. We are run never right now. We have 144 yards rushing in 4 games. That?s ridiculous
    Walk like the King or walk like you don't care who the King is

  9. #29
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    Some are saying we don't run it enough, but I think what Shotgun and others (including myself) are trying to point out is that we can't run the ball well even if we wanted to.

    Yes, we are last in the country in rushing attempts per game, but we are also last in the country in yards per carry. It goes back to the o-line, there is no point in running it more if you can't block better.

    Scheme, playcalling, none of it matters if your o-line is going to be as bad as ours has been.

  10. #30
    Senior Member Cooterpoot's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Captain Falcon View Post
    Some are saying we don't run it enough, but I think what Shotgun and others (including myself) are trying to point out is that we can't run the ball well even if we wanted to.

    Yes, we are last in the country in rushing attempts per game, but we are also last in the country in yards per carry. It goes back to the o-line, there is no point in running it more if you can't block better.

    Scheme, playcalling, none of it matters if your o-line is going to be as bad as ours has been.
    And the point to that is change the way the OL splits are or add some other running plays (toss worked ok this week) outside the three everybody knows. Put your OL in a position to be successful. There are things that can be done.

  11. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cooterpoot View Post
    And the point to that is change the way the OL splits are or add some other running plays (toss worked ok this week) outside the three everybody knows. Put your OL in a position to be successful. There are things that can be done.
    I'm open to that kind of suggestion. I just think that there's more to it than "we just need to run the ball more" as some have suggested. Well no, there's a lot more to it than that.

  12. #32
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    People... running has nothing to do with it.. absolutely nothing

    it simply does not matter

    I know I am pissing in the wind trying to explain it one more time.. Saying anything about Washington vs Wash St is stupid. Huskies had a bunch four stars and Leech and mostly non-rated to two star guys.

    As long as the Oline cannot block three man rush, we will suck. you can't run it, you can't pass it with an O-line that stinks. Now, go find us some guys that can block dammit.

  13. #33
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    yes, it's hard to watch.. It sucks to be this bad.

    You cannot play against SEC defenses if 5 can't block 3. They all have horses on the D-Line. Until that is fixed, we are going to stink and at best win a couple more games.

  14. #34
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    My concern is that John Cohen is paying a guy $15 Million over the next 3 years who was looking for a pay day and his best days are behind him.. meanwhile completely killing our Athletic Department as Football pays for everything.

  15. #35
    Senior Member defiantdog's Avatar
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    We need to run the ball to be successful..... and in the A&M game, we actually had TE's with a hand on the ground in the second half. This tells me we may evolve into a more fluid offense.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hot Rock View Post
    yes, it's hard to watch.. It sucks to be this bad.

    You cannot play against SEC defenses if 5 can't block 3. They all have horses on the D-Line. Until that is fixed, we are going to stink and at best win a couple more games.
    We aren't blocking 3 with 5. That's what a lot of people just can't grasp. The wide splits BY DESIGN mean your O-linemen are going to be in one on one matchups. That's tough for any tackle to win for longer than 3 seconds. We can't help with a guard b/c of the splits. If a guard slid over, teams would send 4 and get pressure easily like A&M did. They sent 5 only twice and were successful both times. But say it again, it's not 5 vs 3. This is a major schematic flaw that has haunted Leach in the last 7 apple cups and 3 games in a row. How much more evidence does he need?

  17. #37
    Senior Member Todd4State's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Leeshouldveflanked View Post
    My concern is that John Cohen is paying a guy $15 Million over the next 3 years who was looking for a pay day and his best days are behind him.. meanwhile completely killing our Athletic Department as Football pays for everything.
    Why are we worried about failure at a program that hasn't won any kind of football championship since 1998 and hasn't won the SEC outright since 1941?

    Arkansas just had a run where they were the most absolutely atrocious football program I have ever seen in the SEC including Vanderbilt. They weren't able to beat San Jose State and North Texas. And yet- despite that it didn't destroy their program. Just like neither Croom nor Joe could ruin ours. Historically we've had even worse coaches than them- see Charley Shira and Wade Walker may have been even worse than him. If Leach fails or mails it in MSU could EASILY hire some coach that is a good recruiter on the cheap and then hire two elite coordinators by paying above board to run our offense and defense like Arkansas and LSU. That's actually almost what kind of happened when we almost hired Joe Judge so Cohen certainly isn't above doing that.

    Heck- if anything we should be taking risks. And a coach with a 20 year track record of success is about as safe as we could go.

  18. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by Todd4State View Post
    Why are we worried about failure at a program that hasn't won any kind of football championship since 1998 and hasn't won the SEC outright since 1941?

    Arkansas just had a run where they were the most absolutely atrocious football program I have ever seen in the SEC including Vanderbilt. They weren't able to beat San Jose State and North Texas. And yet- despite that it didn't destroy their program. Just like neither Croom nor Joe could ruin ours. Historically we've had even worse coaches than them- see Charley Shira and Wade Walker may have been even worse than him. If Leach fails or mails it in MSU could EASILY hire some coach that is a good recruiter on the cheap and then hire two elite coordinators by paying above board to run our offense and defense like Arkansas and LSU. That's actually almost what kind of happened when we almost hired Joe Judge so Cohen certainly isn't above doing that.

    Heck- if anything we should be taking risks. And a coach with a 20 year track record of success is about as safe as we could go.
    Exactly. At the end of the day, keep your program top 30 in talent and the right coach can IMMEDIATELY right back in it with Kentucky, Arky, Ole Miss, the mediocre P5 non-con opponent, and one of the SEC powers if their team is falling apart. You're a good hire from a bowl game and top 25 classes year 1.

    Let's not forget that the new SEC TV deal is about to give us $23M more money per year. Yeah it might not help us jump up in the SEC since they have the same deal, BUT it does allow us to afford buyouts should Leach not work out, it allows us to offer a $15M total coaching pay vs the $10M we do now. We'll be able to attract and keep better coaches than we can now. It's all up to the Ad to make the right hire when the time comes

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