Coach34 or I guess others...

[HoopsDawg]

try to put yourself in the unique mind of Mike Leach. What the hell is he thinking right now? 3 games in a row we have been Croomish against the EXACT SAME DEFENSE. We have been blitzed only 6 times combined in the last 3 games. No one is playing man to man against us the rest of the year.

Against A&M according to Alex Kirshner:

"-Mississippi State got blitzed just twice all day,

-Yet still gave up the highest rate of pressures/hits/sacks/hurries of any team in FBS this week except for the service academies.

Almost impossible to do"

Does he think our OT's are just going to magically figure it out? Does he think the DE's at Bama, UGA, AU etc are going to be worse? Is he just going to keep doing the same thing he's done the past 3 weeks or is he smart enough, humble enough to admit his system is not working and making some signifcant changes during the bye week.

How hard would it be to tighten up our splits? Bring in a TE to help our RT? Keep the backs in longer to help protect? Add in a couple of power run plays to counter what the defenses are doing? I mean we know exactly what everyone is going to do on Defense. That has to be an advantage to a smart, offensive minded coach.

What do you think?

[ShotgunDawg]

fast forward to the 4 min mark if you want Leach's opinion on it.

My opinion is that he would've been out of coaching 20 years ago if it were this easy to stop. Something must be wrong from an execution standpoint. While he may not have faced as many great defensive players over years, he faced plenty of great defensive players over the years and this didn't happen.

So, while I don't have the Xs and Os knowledge to say what's wrong and how to fix it, common sense tells me that there is a real execution issue, that's fixable, that is preventing this from working. Not sure what it is, but I can't imagine this guy would've had the success he's had over the years if his offense fell to this level of crap when a boarderline NFL player was on defense.

I'm kind of curious if the center is screwing up the protection calls. We are really bad at center right now and I think that's leading to enormous issues. However, I don't have enough Xs and Os knowledge to know if that's really the issue

[defiantdog]

The center (no matter who it is) keeps missing the guy in front of him. I don't think our interior guys know how to block one on one. They're confused on who to pick up.

[Johnson85]

The center (no matter who it is) keeps missing the guy in front of him. I don't think our interior guys know how to block one on one. They're confused on who to pick up.

There were several plays that made me wonder if the OLine hates KJ, particularly the center. I can see it being hard to block while snapping, but a couple of times it's like he didn't even get his hands up before the DL was past him.

[basedog]

There were several plays that made me wonder if the OLine hates KJ, particularly the center. I can see it being hard to block while snapping, but a couple of times it's like he didn't even get his hands up before the DL was past him.

I'd say no to hate, even if they did and still aren't doing there job then why isn't that guy pulled and play someone with effort.

[Lord McBuckethead]

The center (no matter who it is) keeps missing the guy in front of him. I don't think our interior guys know how to block one on one. They're confused on who to pick up.

Shit, all you have to do is atleast pick up one guy. So many times 1 or 2 of our OL just didn't pick up anyone.

[HoopsDawg]

There aren't many calls for the center to make. Arkansas and UK were very vanilla with their 3 man front. A&M did a couple of different things, but again it's a very basic 3 man front for the most part. So you are reaching looking for an excuse. I don't blame you.

And Shotgun, I fear that Leach is thinking exactly like you, "It's just an execution issue, nothing else." Croom said the same and Moorhead said the same. There's nothing wrong with the scheme, we just have to execute better. That's coach speak for "my system is great, I'm not changing a thing".

[R2Dawg]

There aren't many calls for the center to make. Arkansas and UK were very vanilla with their 3 man front. A&M did a couple of different things, but again it's a very basic 3 man front for the most part. So you are reaching looking for an excuse. I don't blame you.

And Shotgun, I fear that Leach is thinking exactly like you, "It's just an execution issue, nothing else." Croom said the same and Moorhead said the same. There's nothing wrong with the scheme, we just have to execute better. That's coach speak for "my system is great, I'm not changing a thing".

Leach has said the poor execution multiple times. I said other day this will go on for years until he realizes or starts to that it may not work here like it has everywhere else. I'm not sure he will ever admit it. He has 20 years he has convinced himself that this is the best O ever. Oh, we'll get better and win some games down the road but I'm not sure he will ever be what he was in the past here due to SEC speed.

[Todd4State]

fast forward to the 4 min mark if you want Leach's opinion on it.

My opinion is that he would've been out of coaching 20 years ago if it were this easy to stop. Something must be wrong from an execution standpoint. While he may not have faced as many great defensive players over years, he faced plenty of great defensive players over the years and this didn't happen.

So, while I don't have the Xs and Os knowledge to say what's wrong and how to fix it, common sense tells me that there is a real execution issue, that's fixable, that is preventing this from working. Not sure what it is, but I can't imagine this guy would've had the success he's had over the years if his offense fell to this level of crap when a boarderline NFL player was on defense.

I'm kind of curious if the center is screwing up the protection calls. We are really bad at center right now and I think that's leading to enormous issues. However, I don't have enough Xs and Os knowledge to know if that's really the issue

Sounds like our offensive line can't handle the lights being on.

[HancockCountyDog]

My opinion is that he would've been out of coaching 20 years ago if it were this easy to stop. Something must be wrong from an execution standpoint. While he may not have faced as many great defensive players over years, he faced plenty of great defensive players over the years and this didn't happen.

So, while I don't have the Xs and Os knowledge to say what's wrong and how to fix it, common sense tells me that there is a real execution issue, that's fixable, that is preventing this from working. Not sure what it is, but I can't imagine this guy would've had the success he's had over the years if his offense fell to this level of crap when a boarderline NFL player was on defense.

He simply is not used to this level of athlete on defense. If he had to go up against SEC level defenses, week in and week out, he would not have been as successful. The only team in the Pac 10 that had near SEC athletes on defense was Washington and we have beaten that horse into the ground.

I'm telling you, go back and watch the Wazzu/Oregon game Minshew's year, watch how many open field tackles Oregon missed. They also didn't have the athletes to stay in the 3-8, so they blitzed occasionally and Leach killed them.

Bottom line is that Leach has never proven that he can beat the 3-8 with top level athletes in the back 8 and front 3, in fact its been the exact opposite. Anyone that watched him struggle with Washington for the last 5 years, would have watched the last 3 games and thought "Yeah, I've seen this movie before".

I wish he would add some wrinkles, but that simply is not going to happen anytime soon. It is going to get worse before it gets better.

[ShotgunDawg]

He simply is not used to this level of athlete on defense.

I really don’t think it’s this simple.

[HancockCountyDog]

I really don?t think it?s this simple.

We can make it more complicated.

I really think you should go and watch a few Wazzu games on YouTube. It was eye opening to me. Their guys out of the backfield made LBs and DBs look silly.

Teams came out of the 3-8 a ton because they couldn?t tackle guys one on one and we?re getting trashed by the check down guys.

Maybe it?s a talent issue for us on offense, but I think we have some solid RBs.

I also think we haven?t recruited the right OL for this offense. That is causing us problems all over the offense. SEC teams can get pressure rushing 3. The DL are simply too good and our guys aren?t built to pass block 70 times a game.

Maybe it?s just an adjustment we have to go through, it?s just hard to watch. Hopefully Rogers will give the team a boost and the offense gets better.

[Coach34]

We can make it more complicated.

I really think you should go and watch a few Wazzu games on YouTube. It was eye opening to me. Their guys out of the backfield made LBs and DBs look silly.

Teams came out of the 3-8 a ton because they couldn?t tackle guys one on one and we?re getting trashed by the check down guys.

This is what people dont seem to understand. Thats not going to happen in the SEC.

[HoopsDawg]

Let me say this, just so everyone is clear, the reason for the wide splits is to give the QB more time to pass b/c the rusher has more distance to travel. This is supposed to be a get rid of it quick offense.

We keep talking about the athletic D-linemen in the SEC and that is true. But the LB's and DB's are much more athletic too. When they are dropping 8 and covering the entire field against our 5, we simply can't get rid of it quickly b/c no one has time to get open except for the checkdowns. It's a losing propostion for the offensive tackles. They aren't near as bad as posters are making them out to be. Sure you can always execute better and sometimes it will work, but this is 90% a scheme problem.

[HancockCountyDog]

We keep talking about the athletic D-linemen in the SEC and that is true. But the LB's and DB's are much more athletic too. When they are dropping 8 and covering the entire field against our 5, we simply can't get rid of it quickly b/c no one has time to get open except for the checkdowns. It's a losing propostion for the offensive tackles. They aren't near as bad as posters are making them out to be. Sure you can always execute better and sometimes it will work, but this is 90% a scheme problem.

If you give us a power running qb and a Mullen offense, this OL magically looks way better. These guys are built to run block. I think the OL could have been good this year in a spread power run option offense. We will never know for sure, but it sure seemed like it based off last season.

[Todd4State]

Let me say this, just so everyone is clear, the reason for the wide splits is to give the QB more time to pass b/c the rusher has more distance to travel. This is supposed to be a get rid of it quick offense.

We keep talking about the athletic D-linemen in the SEC and that is true. But the LB's and DB's are much more athletic too. When they are dropping 8 and covering the entire field against our 5, we simply can't get rid of it quickly b/c no one has time to get open except for the checkdowns. It's a losing propostion for the offensive tackles. They aren't near as bad as posters are making them out to be. Sure you can always execute better and sometimes it will work, but this is 90% a scheme problem.

We have SEC players on our team too.

[bluelightstar]

He simply is not used to this level of athlete on defense. If he had to go up against SEC level defenses, week in and week out, he would not have been as successful. The only team in the Pac 10 that had near SEC athletes on defense was Washington and we have beaten that horse into the ground.

I'm telling you, go back and watch the Wazzu/Oregon game Minshew's year, watch how many open field tackles Oregon missed. They also didn't have the athletes to stay in the 3-8, so they blitzed occasionally and Leach killed them.

Bottom line is that Leach has never proven that he can beat the 3-8 with top level athletes in the back 8 and front 3, in fact its been the exact opposite. Anyone that watched him struggle with Washington for the last 5 years, would have watched the last 3 games and thought "Yeah, I've seen this movie before".

I wish he would add some wrinkles, but that simply is not going to happen anytime soon. It is going to get worse before it gets better.

I saw a national cfb guy point out that our most recent games were basically like watching the last 7 Apple Cups. Everybody is saying he will figure it out but he never figured out how to crack that defense with SEC-type athletes in nearly a decade.

[Hot Rock]

I saw a national cfb guy point out that our most recent games were basically like watching the last 7 Apple Cups. Everybody is saying he will figure it out but he never figured out how to crack that defense with SEC-type athletes in nearly a decade.

why people reference the Apple Cup is crazy to me. You cannot compare the level of athletes Washington Huskies had with what Leech had. They just weren't the same.

Huskies recruiting level was on par with most SEC teams. They had enough talent to compete in the national title conversation a couple of those years.

Wash St got non-rated players and two star guys. Hell, one year he only got 5 rated players to campus or something like that.

This thing may not work out but it won't because Wash had some secret formula. It's simple, if you can't block 3 & 4 with 5 O-ine, we lose.

[HoopsDawg]

There is one change that Leach and Mason Miller could make that would not fundamentally change what he is trying to do. We have to go to traditional splits on the offensive line. We simply have too. Art Briles did it. Dana Holgerson did it. And Lincoln Riley did it. All 3 guys are disciples directly or indirectly from Leach's air raid, and all 3 guys have had a lot of success running the ball after evolving to traditional splits.

My original question for this thread is what is Leach thinking. Is he too vain/hardheaded to change? Or can he accept that it's not just "execution", there is a fundamental problem with his beloved system. It's the same system that has bought him a place at Key West and earns him 5 milly a year. Joe Lee Dunn had a great system at one time too. So I know it must be difficult to accept reality. But reality hit us right in the face with 0 points against UK. Arkansas could have been chalked up as a fluke. Fool me once, fool me twice, fool me 3 times??

[bluelightstar]

There is one change that Leach and Mason Miller could make that would not fundamentally change what he is trying to do. We have to go to traditional splits on the offensive line. We simply have too. Art Briles did it. Dana Holgerson did it. And Lincoln Riley did it. All 3 guys are disciples directly or indirectly from Leach's air raid, and all 3 guys have had a lot of success running the ball after evolving to traditional splits.

My original question for this thread is what is Leach thinking. Is he too vain/hardheaded to change? Or can he accept that it's not just "execution", there is a fundamental problem with his beloved system. It's the same system that has bought him a place at Key West and earns him 5 milly a year. Joe Lee Dunn had a great system at one time too. So I know it must be difficult to accept reality. But reality hit us right in the face with 0 points against UK.

Considering his past quotes [see: https://fivethirtyeight.com/features...re-thinks-so/], Leach seems to be looking for vindication. He wants to show that his pure Air Raid system works in the SEC.

“Everybody says you can’t do this in this league or that in that league. But how!? Everybody starts with, ‘Well you can’t do this in the NFL or SEC because our corners are all Deion Sanders.’ Well, no, they’re not.”

“Your level isn’t special, your conference isn’t special. … How’s it better? Somebody coaches better athletes, somehow they morph into something smarter? That’s crazy. I mean, you still have problems, you still have 11 parts you can wiggle around to counter the other 11 parts.”

If Leach decides that it's more important to prove one way or another that the unadulterated Air Raid works in the SEC throwing the ball 80%+ of the time, I think this will go poorly. But I have to assume a smart guy like Leach will admit that he was wrong about the SEC being no different and tweak the offense. Otherwise, he will join the list of coaches whose schemes always worked right up until they didn't (see, e.g., Joe Lee Dunn).