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Thread: The Covid-19 Info thread (keep politics out please)

  1. #4861
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    Quote Originally Posted by BeardoMSU View Post
    Lol...I can't wait for her to be right about alien DNA and people having sex with demons and witches getting them sick. That would be fun.

    And she hasn't ripped anyone a new asshole....unless you're referring to the gullible rubes who buy into her grift.
    You got video of her saying those things. Or you listening to the Ministry of Truth from 1984 (CNN, MSNBC, etc.)?

    If you got video, then I'll stand corrected. Sure ain't gonna listen to Mr. ex-CIA Anderson Cooper.

    ETA: And there are at least as many or more official studies now that I would trust more that says it does work if prescribed early.
    Last edited by dawgday166; 07-28-2020 at 07:17 PM.

  2. #4862
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    Quote Originally Posted by msstate7 View Post
    Keeping with the subject of the day... here's an opinion piece written by Harvey Risch (professor of epidemiology at Yale) about HCQ...

    https://www.newsweek.com/key-defeati...pinion-1519535
    Yeah, I guess there is still some disagreement in the ranks. Not sure how many other scientists and docs agree with Risch's take on the most recent literature, though. In addition to the July 10 JAMA piece I linked a page or two ago with the reference to 200+ studies on the drug -- studies that only the whole apparently found that it wasn't an effective treatment -- the day that Risch's Newsweek op-ed piece was published, the the New England Journal of Medicine published the results of a clinical trial of hydroxychloroquine and azithromycin for COVID patients. The results didn't jive with Risch, either:

    A total of 667 patients underwent randomization; 504 patients had confirmed Covid-19 and were included in the modified intention-to-treat analysis. As compared with standard care, the proportional odds of having a higher score on the seven-point ordinal scale at 15 days was not affected by either hydroxychloroquine alone . . . or hydroxychloroquine plus azithromycin . . . .

    CONCLUSIONS
    Among patients hospitalized with mild-to-moderate Covid-19, the use of hydroxychloroquine, alone or with azithromycin, did not improve clinical status at 15 days as compared with standard care.
    I'm with Risch re: tossing the political crap out the window and let scientists and doctors do what they need to do. So far -- at least according to the Journal of the American Medical Association's study of 200+ trials and studies -- the majority of scientists and docs seem to think that it's not a viable treatment. If that's the case, cool, move on to something else. If that's not the case, cool, use it where it helps.

  3. #4863
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    Quote Originally Posted by dawgday166 View Post
    You got video of her saying those things. Or you listening to the Ministry of Truth from 1984 (CNN, MSNBC, etc.)?

    If you got video, then I'll stand corrected. Sure ain't gonna listen to Mr. ex-CIA Anderson Cooper.

    ETA: And there are at least as many or more official studies now that I would trust more that says it does work if prescribed early.

    Here's some reading material:

    https://www.idsociety.org/practice-g...fqbMyz_sMqvFK0

    Its essentially an exhaustive summary of all treatment studies for COVID-19 and the recommendations based off of them. I'm sure you've got a reason to distrust it, but its from the Infectious Disease Society of America. I know its not as convenient, glamorous, or easy as watching a video of a random doctor who drove to DC and gave a fantastic speech. Its going to be really boring, but try and stick with it.

  4. #4864
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    Quote Originally Posted by msstate7 View Post
    Isn't all that data from the states? Are you saying that the HHS changes what the state gives them? It would be fairly easy to check this, right? Just go to each state's health dept site, no?
    Doesn't the worldometers page use state data? Just keep using that page.

  5. #4865
    Senior Member BeardoMSU's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Matt3467 View Post
    Yes, context. Someones personal beliefs outside of medicine doesn't matter as long as it stays outside of it. You bringing up her religious beliefs to slander her is a prime example of straying out of the context of medicine. She says she's personally treated 350 Covid patients across all spectrums and all have recovered with HCQ tx. Is it misinformation if she's used HCQ in her practice and it's worked? What can you say to that except say that she's lying? Btw she wasn't the only doctor up there saying the same things yet it's the black one that didn't meet your standards. Why not run background checks on the others while you're at it? "I fail to see the benefit to "Western Medicine" that practices such as blood-letting, exorcisms, seances, happy-thoughts, etc. may have," okay.....unless she's practicing this what purpose did you have bringing that up?

    "Do me a favor and name a single person I've rooted-out/discredited/slandered in a way that wasn't absolutely germane to the topic of discussion. I'll look forward to this detective work." I'm glad you asked because I won't have to look far. You slandered me on page 41 of the COVID thread when I mentioned working in healthcare and not being ignorant (concerning COVID) by responding, "Look...no one said emptying out bed pans wasn't a noble profession...thank you for your bravery**." You called that a joke but I'm not an idiot as it was a sly remark to attempt to discredit any opinion I had on the matter.

    "I don't even engage the overtly religious discussions that many posters have, so I'm at a loss. I avoid them actually." You jumped in that boat when you criticized someone else's religious beliefs and then tried using that to discredit their career.
    Ok, lets try to unpack all of this...

    "Yes, context. Someones personal beliefs outside of medicine doesn't matter as long as it stays outside of it. You bringing up her religious beliefs to slander her is a prime example of straying out of the context of medicine."

    I didn't make her religious beliefs paramount to her credibility; she did. Her Twitter bio reads, and I quote, "Physician, Author, Speaker, Entrepreneur, Deliverance Minister, God's battle axe and weapon of war." And it doesn't take long scrolling down through her twitter feed to see some rather controversial statements regarding medicine, it's application, science, and the lot. So, it's clear she's not separating her life as a doctor and her life as a prosperity-gospel/entrepreneur/sayer of crazy things regarding demons, aliens, and Fauci urine tests, thus, the public shouldn't either when vetting her expertise.

    "She says she's personally treated 350 Covid patients across all spectrums and all have recovered with HCQ tx. Is it misinformation if she's used HCQ in her practice and it's worked? What can you say to that except say that she's lying?"

    I definitely find her statements curious, as they seem to stand in contrast to the vast majority of scientific/medical consensus...so...as I said, I'm curious. Anyone can say anything, after all...and they often do, especially in front of video cameras. So, without taking her word for it, I would like to see the data, her methods, etc. I do find it odd that her supposed employer (http://www.rehobothmedicalcenter.com/), doesn't have a functional website. They do have a facebook page, however (https://www.facebook.com/Rehoboth-Me...0321995001608/), though it doesn't leave me brimming with trust.

    "Btw she wasn't the only doctor up there saying the same things yet it's the black one that didn't meet your standards. Why not run background checks on the others while you're at it?"

    This would be fair, if not for the fact I was responding directly to another poster who was referencing her directly. So that's that.

    "okay.....unless she's practicing this what purpose did you have bringing that up?"

    Because she is presenting herself as an authority on medicine, and more specifically, the treatment of COVID. She's not just saying HCQ works; she's saying it's the ****ing CURE, so no need to wear a mask....which is outlandish, non scientific, and potentially damaging to public health, yet none of that is surprising when taken in with other statements of hers (e.g., demon semen, alien DNA, etc.). And btw, if she was just some rube on the street saying this stuff, it wouldn't that big a deal, but since she's now being amplified by the ruler of the free world and several of his minions, those words have power, and thus require scrutiny.

    "I'm glad you asked because I won't have to look far. You slandered me on page 41 of the COVID thread when I mentioned working in healthcare and not being ignorant (concerning COVID) by responding, "Look...no one said emptying out bed pans wasn't a noble profession...thank you for your bravery**." You called that a joke but I'm not an idiot as it was a sly remark to attempt to discredit any opinion I had on the matter."

    It absolutely was a joke. A callus one, perhaps? Sure, but still a joke. I see you've been a member of ED since 2014, so I might've wrongly assumed you understood people sometimes joke hard here, and usually people take what they dish (myself included). However, if you noticed on page 40, I ask you directly to clarify this statement:
    "And the difference in public response between the coronavirus and the flu is the msm over sensationalizing it causing people to panic. Ridiculous we can't go to a store now without waiting hours in line only to find out all the toilet paper just sold out and most of the meat, bread, and bottled water are gone as well. This is crazy and it's all because of our media."

    ...in which you were still equating COVID to the damn flu...to which you never responded. So yeah, I zinged you with a joke. If you do, in fact, empty out bedpans, I sincerely apologize for degrading what you do (see?...another joke; laugh a little). Granted, this was back in March, but there were a few of y'all still clamoring to die on that hill. Thanks for directing my attention back to the 40 page mark of this thread; it's quite interesting to see how things have changed, while some things haven't. Fascinating.

    Now, I asked you to provide an example of where I have "rooted-out/discredited/slandered". I will contend that joke, if taken seriously, could be considered callus, even hateful; if one is devoid of humor, I suppose. However, to be clear, in that moment, you were an anonymous message board poster equating the severity and contagion of COVID to the common flu, something that even in March was soundly discredited. Our credentials aren't posted under our avatars, after all. Also, I sure hope you can see the difference between me zinging you with a joke on a message board me directing criticism to a person who is being platformed by POTUS and a number of his surrogates. Apples to bowling balls.

  6. #4866
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gutter Cobreh View Post
    You've been holding on to that for 202 pages (or 4 months) of this thread??? Jeez man, that's a heavy burden to be carrying around....
    Lolz...

    Quote Originally Posted by Homedawg View Post
    If you've ever heard Ron white.... it's fitting for you I bet you are like one of those bouncers that like beating off to brave heart. Except it's you w bad news w covid.
    Nah, he's a realist. And if Hillary was prez you'd be right there with him. I'm guessing, and I speak for myself, Hacker would be just as critical if the roles were reversed. Statements like "It'll all be gone one day like magic". Or "We have 15 cases, soon to be none." (paraphrasing) would have 50 pages by themselves. GTFOH

  7. #4867
    Senior Member BeardoMSU's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by msstate7 View Post
    Keeping with the subject of the day... here's an opinion piece written by Harvey Risch (professor of epidemiology at Yale) about HCQ...

    https://www.newsweek.com/key-defeati...pinion-1519535
    I saw that earlier after you responded to me, just forgot to post it. Thanks for doing so.

  8. #4868
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    Quote Originally Posted by Turfdawg67 View Post
    Lolz...



    Nah, he's a realist. And if Hillary was prez you'd be right there with him. I'm guessing, and I speak for myself, Hacker would be just as critical if the roles were reversed. Statements like "It'll all be gone one day like magic". Or "We have 15 cases, soon to be none." (paraphrasing) would have 50 pages by themselves. GTFOH
    Yeah hes clearly realistic and you too.....**** now go find tatersalad....

  9. #4869
    Senior Member hacker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by confucius say View Post
    Doesn't the worldometers page use state data? Just keep using that page.
    They don't post hospitalization data, which is what my post was about

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    Quote Originally Posted by chef dixon View Post
    Here's some reading material:

    https://www.idsociety.org/practice-g...fqbMyz_sMqvFK0

    Its essentially an exhaustive summary of all treatment studies for COVID-19 and the recommendations based off of them. I'm sure you've got a reason to distrust it, but its from the Infectious Disease Society of America. I know its not as convenient, glamorous, or easy as watching a video of a random doctor who drove to DC and gave a fantastic speech. Its going to be really boring, but try and stick with it.
    Here's a 2013 Conspiracy Theory episode describing down to a science what we're going through now with one exception: Trump was elected and he believes in freedom ... not FEMA camps. I'd forgotten that I watched that show regularly, including this episode. Was surprised to find it easily on internet and rewatched it cause I couldn't remember the details of it. He did an earlier one on 9/11 a year or 2 before and I quite honestly was surprised he lived long past that one.

    However, Jessie shut the show down immediately after this episode cause someone let him know he better ... or else. Jessie was quite shaken by that when interviewed about why the show shut down about a year or so later. And he was a Navy Seal. Jessie's and his team's investigation will probably be too complex for your simple mind. Notice it's not on Youtube cause ... you know ... free speech and whatnot.

    https://www.dailymotion.com/video/x4j660e

    So ... I'm reading and watching a lot and going down a few rabbit holes but I ain't wasting time on Covid nonsense. I know why it's here and I know that Gates & Fauci have already made themselves immune to it in some manner.

  11. #4871
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    Quote Originally Posted by BeardoMSU View Post
    Ok, lets try to unpack all of this...

    "Yes, context. Someones personal beliefs outside of medicine doesn't matter as long as it stays outside of it. You bringing up her religious beliefs to slander her is a prime example of straying out of the context of medicine."

    I didn't make her religious beliefs paramount to her credibility; she did. Her Twitter bio reads, and I quote, "Physician, Author, Speaker, Entrepreneur, Deliverance Minister, God's battle axe and weapon of war." And it doesn't take long scrolling down through her twitter feed to see some rather controversial statements regarding medicine, it's application, science, and the lot. So, it's clear she's not separating her life as a doctor and her life as a prosperity-gospel/entrepreneur/sayer of crazy things regarding demons, aliens, and Fauci urine tests, thus, the public shouldn't either when vetting her expertise.

    "She says she's personally treated 350 Covid patients across all spectrums and all have recovered with HCQ tx. Is it misinformation if she's used HCQ in her practice and it's worked? What can you say to that except say that she's lying?"

    I definitely find her statements curious, as they seem to stand in contrast to the vast majority of scientific/medical consensus...so...as I said, I'm curious. Anyone can say anything, after all...and they often do, especially in front of video cameras. So, without taking her word for it, I would like to see the data, her methods, etc. I do find it odd that her supposed employer (http://www.rehobothmedicalcenter.com/), doesn't have a functional website. They do have a facebook page, however (https://www.facebook.com/Rehoboth-Me...0321995001608/), though it doesn't leave me brimming with trust.

    "Btw she wasn't the only doctor up there saying the same things yet it's the black one that didn't meet your standards. Why not run background checks on the others while you're at it?"

    This would be fair, if not for the fact I was responding directly to another poster who was referencing her directly. So that's that.

    "okay.....unless she's practicing this what purpose did you have bringing that up?"

    Because she is presenting herself as an authority on medicine, and more specifically, the treatment of COVID. She's not just saying HCQ works; she's saying it's the ****ing CURE, so no need to wear a mask....which is outlandish, non scientific, and potentially damaging to public health, yet none of that is surprising when taken in with other statements of hers (e.g., demon semen, alien DNA, etc.). And btw, if she was just some rube on the street saying this stuff, it wouldn't that big a deal, but since she's now being amplified by the ruler of the free world and several of his minions, those words have power, and thus require scrutiny.

    "I'm glad you asked because I won't have to look far. You slandered me on page 41 of the COVID thread when I mentioned working in healthcare and not being ignorant (concerning COVID) by responding, "Look...no one said emptying out bed pans wasn't a noble profession...thank you for your bravery**." You called that a joke but I'm not an idiot as it was a sly remark to attempt to discredit any opinion I had on the matter."

    It absolutely was a joke. A callus one, perhaps? Sure, but still a joke. I see you've been a member of ED since 2014, so I might've wrongly assumed you understood people sometimes joke hard here, and usually people take what they dish (myself included). However, if you noticed on page 40, I ask you directly to clarify this statement:
    "And the difference in public response between the coronavirus and the flu is the msm over sensationalizing it causing people to panic. Ridiculous we can't go to a store now without waiting hours in line only to find out all the toilet paper just sold out and most of the meat, bread, and bottled water are gone as well. This is crazy and it's all because of our media."

    ...in which you were still equating COVID to the damn flu...to which you never responded. So yeah, I zinged you with a joke. If you do, in fact, empty out bedpans, I sincerely apologize for degrading what you do (see?...another joke; laugh a little). Granted, this was back in March, but there were a few of y'all still clamoring to die on that hill. Thanks for directing my attention back to the 40 page mark of this thread; it's quite interesting to see how things have changed, while some things haven't. Fascinating.

    Now, I asked you to provide an example of where I have "rooted-out/discredited/slandered". I will contend that joke, if taken seriously, could be considered callus, even hateful; if one is devoid of humor, I suppose. However, to be clear, in that moment, you were an anonymous message board poster equating the severity and contagion of COVID to the common flu, something that even in March was soundly discredited. Our credentials aren't posted under our avatars, after all. Also, I sure hope you can see the difference between me zinging you with a joke on a message board me directing criticism to a person who is being platformed by POTUS and a number of his surrogates. Apples to bowling balls.
    We'll just have to agree to disagree on whats contextual here. If she's a physician and her work is helping people then I don't care what her philosophical or religious beliefs are. As someone that works around dozens of doctors there are a few that have what some may consider "quack" views but that doesn't detract that several of them are excellent at what they do.

    I get that if you said you believed what she said then you'd have to concede that HCQ is an effective method of treatment so it's not surprising that your approach is to be "curious" of her integrity and skeptical of her employer. On another note if what she says is true and all 350 of her Covid patients improved with HCQ treatment then would it be wrong of her to say that it's a "cure?" Here's an interesting poll taken several month back with thousands of physicians across the world backing HCQ as the most effective treatment: https://www.sermo.com/press-releases...ic-in-context/

    Now when you talk about trust and bring up my contrast to the medias portrayal of COVID vs the Flu can you see how I could believe that way? How can anyone here believe the numbers that are posted by the "authorities" when time and time again instances have come up that have shown the numbers cannot be trusted. The entire legitimacy of the numbers are in question. When the CDC came out with the guidelines that it was okay to put cause of death as COVID on someones death certificate even without a positive test as long as it was assumed they had it how can one not see the dishonesty in that? Do you not remember the projected death totals when I made that post? I do and it was in the millions and that was forecasted by your experts. That caused people to panic and I don't blame them. People are being told to wear face coverings when they go out and unless they're wearing N95s they aren't safe from any airborne infections: https://www.osha.gov/SLTC/covid-19/c...face-coverings
    How can you trust the people that are enforcing these mandates when they can't abide by the mandates themselves? Here recently the D.C. mayors executive order for all citizens to wear masks exempted the government employees. Does that make you curious? Here's the order: https://coronavirus.dc.gov/maskorder

    As far as the "joke" is concerned you're right I didn't find it funny. This site is a MSU sports fan site and somehow a Covid thread is being allowed to run 240+ pages filled with hyper politics. According to the ones that make decisions around here threads like this don't belong and in the thread title is "keep politics out please." A joke in the confines of sports is great but when things degrade to making personal jokes because of your disdain for ones beliefs regarding Covid it's no longer a "zinger." I've been here since 2014 and have visited ED daily for sporting news regarding our team and have loved it but this thread is toxic to this community. It's impossible to have a peaceful thread on a forum when politics are involved.

  12. #4872
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    Quote Originally Posted by hacker View Post
    They don't post hospitalization data, which is what my post was about
    Got ya.

    Speaking of worldometers and state data, 7 day case average is now falling! I suck at pics, but if you look at the line it is now moving down after being flat for almost 2 weeks. Great news!

  13. #4873
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    Quote Originally Posted by Matt3467 View Post
    We'll just have to agree to disagree on whats contextual here. If she's a physician and her work is helping people then I don't care what her philosophical or religious beliefs are. As someone that works around dozens of doctors there are a few that have what some may consider "quack" views but that doesn't detract that several of them are excellent at what they do.

    I get that if you said you believed what she said then you'd have to concede that HCQ is an effective method of treatment so it's not surprising that your approach is to be "curious" of her integrity and skeptical of her employer. On another note if what she says is true and all 350 of her Covid patients improved with HCQ treatment then would it be wrong of her to say that it's a "cure?" Here's an interesting poll taken several month back with thousands of physicians across the world backing HCQ as the most effective treatment: https://www.sermo.com/press-releases...ic-in-context/

    Now when you talk about trust and bring up my contrast to the medias portrayal of COVID vs the Flu can you see how I could believe that way? How can anyone here believe the numbers that are posted by the "authorities" when time and time again instances have come up that have shown the numbers cannot be trusted. The entire legitimacy of the numbers are in question. When the CDC came out with the guidelines that it was okay to put cause of death as COVID on someones death certificate even without a positive test as long as it was assumed they had it how can one not see the dishonesty in that? Do you not remember the projected death totals when I made that post? I do and it was in the millions and that was forecasted by your experts. That caused people to panic and I don't blame them. People are being told to wear face coverings when they go out and unless they're wearing N95s they aren't safe from any airborne infections: https://www.osha.gov/SLTC/covid-19/c...face-coverings
    How can you trust the people that are enforcing these mandates when they can't abide by the mandates themselves? Here recently the D.C. mayors executive order for all citizens to wear masks exempted the government employees. Does that make you curious? Here's the order: https://coronavirus.dc.gov/maskorder

    As far as the "joke" is concerned you're right I didn't find it funny. This site is a MSU sports fan site and somehow a Covid thread is being allowed to run 240+ pages filled with hyper politics. According to the ones that make decisions around here threads like this don't belong and in the thread title is "keep politics out please." A joke in the confines of sports is great but when things degrade to making personal jokes because of your disdain for ones beliefs regarding Covid it's no longer a "zinger." I've been here since 2014 and have visited ED daily for sporting news regarding our team and have loved it but this thread is toxic to this community. It's impossible to have a peaceful thread on a forum when politics are involved.
    Even physicians get sucked into BS stuff sometimes. What she cited about what she had done is anecdotal evidence, it is not a scientific statement or study. It's the kind of thing that triggers real scientific studies. Those have been done on this finally. Randomized double blind studies, the gold standard, have shown no benefit. One has even showed that it increases mortality in COVID patients. That actually makes sense because if there is no medical benefit with COVID from it, and you are giving it to sick patients, the side effects that we ABSOLUTELY know about are going to kill a few.

  14. #4874
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    1505 new cases today. We need to do something different. What should we do differently? I have no idea, but what we are doing now is obviously not working.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dolphus Raymond View Post
    1505 new cases today. We need to do something different. What should we do differently? I have no idea, but what we are doing now is obviously not working.
    We are about a month or little less away from herd immunity starting to set in, at which point things will get better. Just have to wait it out.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dolphus Raymond View Post
    1505 new cases today. We need to do something different. What should we do differently? I have no idea, but what we are doing now is obviously not working.
    There are many other countries that have modeled what to do, but our leaders simply don't care and are asleep at the wheel. They're basically allowing our economy to be wrecked and people to get sick and possibly die. But they're all getting rich off being politicians, so why do they care? It's every man for himself.

  17. #4877
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    ?It?s every man for himself.? Sir, sadly, you are correct.

  18. #4878
    Senior Member msstate7's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dawg2003 View Post
    There are many other countries that have modeled what to do, but our leaders simply don't care and are asleep at the wheel. They're basically allowing our economy to be wrecked and people to get sick and possibly die. But they're all getting rich off being politicians, so why do they care? It's every man for himself.
    You're now president. How do you stop this?

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    Msstate7, I am afraid we have crossed the Rubicon and only Draconian measures will alter the trajectory in the near to mid term. Mississippi, as well as other states, is in an extremely precarious situation. I pray I am wrong.

  20. #4880
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dawg2003 View Post
    There are many other countries that have modeled what to do, but our leaders simply don't care and are asleep at the wheel. They're basically allowing our economy to be wrecked and people to get sick and possibly die. But they're all getting rich off being politicians, so why do they care? It's every man for himself.
    The economy isn't getting wrecked. In June non-farm payrolls grew by 4.8 million, unemployment fell to a "crisis" low 11.1%, and temp-layoff numbers fell 4.8 million. Largest single month gain in the HISTORY of America. I have a suspicion that July will probably double those numbers.

    It's scary out there but America is saying "**** it" and getting back to work. It may be foolhardy and lead to more deaths but that is what's happening.

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