ESPN's Post Spring top 25..A&M at 14? Are they high?

[PMDawg]

They were a sub-.500 team when Keenum went down at the start of '09.......

they were on their 3rd or 4th string QB when we beat them that year. and they kept it pretty close for 2 or 3 quarters if i remember correctly.

[PMDawg]

This doesn't support your argument, it's just an opinion and one that I happen to still think will be quite wrong.

engie, they have recruited very well, no doubt. But I just don't see them going from what they were last year to anything decent, regardless of the number of recruiting stars. If the talent was all legit, they would have at least shown flashes last year.

they've recruited very well, as already documented. Sumlin has a good history of putting up massive offensive numbers, no matter who is the QB. They have better offensive personnel on the line and at the skill positions than what Sumlin worked with at Houston. they have plenty of talent to replace their losses at WR, RB, and OL. the only question is QB, and Sumlin will just call more screens, slants, and "extended handoffs" than he had to with JFF.

As far as the defense goes, they were all young last year. Very talented but young. They got better as the season progressed, and they're all coming back. They won't be great, but they won't be terrible either. they'll be a hard out for virtually everyone outside of maybe Bama.

[Pollodawg]

they were on their 3rd or 4th string QB when we beat them that year. and they kept it pretty close for 2 or 3 quarters if i remember correctly.

And they could potentially be trotting a true freshman out this season. JFF was a redshirt. He had more than a single Fall to get prepped for the starting role and get adjusted to NCAA game speed. Not to mention he was a freak.

[smootness]

they've recruited very well, as already documented. Sumlin has a good history of putting up massive offensive numbers, no matter who is the QB.

It just so happens that when they put up big offensive numbers, his QBs were Sam Bradford, Case Keenum, and Johnny Manziel. I'm not using that to discredit him, but if we're going to say 'no matter who is the QB,' then we should at least mention who those QBs happened to be.

They have better offensive personnel on the line and at the skill positions than what Sumlin worked with at Houston. they have plenty of talent to replace their losses at WR, RB, and OL.

Of course they have better personnel than at Houston, but they're also playing a far more difficult schedule. If they were in CUSA, you'd have no argument from me on them winning 8-10 games.

And again, no one is questioning the recruiting stars. But we've seen in the past that doesn't always equate to success on the field. Florida had what was considered by many to be arguably the greatest recruiting class of all time a few years ago, and we see what that produced last year.

[Pollodawg]

I think I know why some people are saying this about TAMU. They know what will inevitably follow when we beat TAMU this season. "TAMU was down. They lost a lot. This win means nothing," will scream the bears and segments of our own naysaying fans. They are trying to head that off.

[hacker]

Learn to use the board before posting.

lol, you still think you are doing it right? I don't know why you are so reluctant to understand this, but this isn't SPS. Threaded view isn't default here, so most people don't use it. So when you reply to people without quoting them, nobody knows who the hell you are talking to.

So perhaps, and I've said this several times to you already, YOU should learn to use THIS board before posting.

edit: I also see that you are so dense that you still haven't noticed that literally every single other person on the board uses the quote feature for this exact reason.

[RougeDawg]

And it's not just JFF. It's Evans, Labhart, Malina. The list goes on and on on that offense. Their O line should be solid, tho.

Yea they will be a solid team, but so were we last year and we struggled to 6-6. Without JFF they are essentially us and most likely a step below us the last 2 seasons. They would have struggled to beat the other teams in the west except Ark. Hell they even struggled with us and OM, WITH JFF. that's 5 losses without Manziel along with Mizzou and Rice gave them all they wanted while JFF was sitting out his 30 minute suspension for signing autograph$$$$$. Looking at this objectively, JFF was single handedly responsible for +3-4 wins for A&M the two seasons he was there.

[Cabo32]

They'll be good...#1qb from 2013 or #1dual-threat from 2012 won't pick up where JFF left off, but they'll be able to run that offense. Rickey seal jones isn't mike Evans, but he's one hell of an athlete and will be a threat on the outside. They finally have depth on D and hell, not having JFF running those fast scoring drives will actually give the D time to rest. They'll be just fine this year..they're not going to win the west but I bet they get 8 wins. I'm still sticking with my prediction that they'll be one of the top teams in the next few years

[tenureplan]

No we aren't ranked. Go figure. Surprised Ole Miss wasn't at #5

I think ESPN is ranking them that high because they open with USCe. I believe there wont be a CBS game that week because of tennis. So this will be ESPN's prime time game and they want to trump it up a bit. Their preseason lists do influence the preseason polls. So to sum it up, it is about viewership and money.

[Bothrops]

It's this year's must win game. I can't reiterate this enough. We all have high expectations, but could easily go 0-3 to start out league play. We have to avoid this, and prove, for once, that we are over our big game heebie-jeebies.

[smootness]

It's this year's must win game. I can't reiterate this enough. We all have high expectations, but could easily go 0-3 to start out league play. We have to avoid this, and prove, for once, that we are over our big game heebie-jeebies.

I agree, at least to some extent.

I think we have 7 'should win' games this year, which might seem crazy until you realize the two toughest games in that group are Arkansas and @Kentucky; I truly think all 7 of those games we should win.

Then, I think there are 2 true toss-ups, Texas A&M and Ole Miss, and 3 'unlikely' games...and I think there's a chance Auburn could slip into true toss-up territory, given that it's at home and I think they'll take a step back this year.

It really is crazy how well this schedule sets up for us when you realize it's been a long time since the two toughest teams on our schedule had such huge question marks at QB, the only consecutive road games we play are South Alabama followed by LSU, we have our two byes placed pretty well, and we don't play any multi-week gauntlet like we have in the past.

Our toughest 3-week stretch will either be @LSU-bye-Texas A&M, Texas A&M-Auburn-bye, or @Alabama-Vandy-@Ole Miss. That's nothing like what we've seen recently.

But agreed, we can't start 0-3 in the league.

[Goat Holder]

He then had Manziel both of his years at A&M so far.

To be fair, you must note that Manziel was redshirted by Sherman, and it was Sumlin who made the decision to start him and helped develop him. Yeah, Sherman had the other guy (that got drafted by the Dolphins), but Manziel was an unknown until Sumlin got there. You cannot ignore this. Sumlin will be just fine.

All good coaches end up with good players around them.

[PMDawg]

It just so happens that when they put up big offensive numbers, his QBs were Sam Bradford, Case Keenum, and Johnny Manziel. I'm not using that to discredit him, but if we're going to say 'no matter who is the QB,' then we should at least mention who those QBs happened to be.



Of course they have better personnel than at Houston, but they're also playing a far more difficult schedule. If they were in CUSA, you'd have no argument from me on them winning 8-10 games.

And again, no one is questioning the recruiting stars. But we've seen in the past that doesn't always equate to success on the field. Florida had what was considered by many to be arguably the greatest recruiting class of all time a few years ago, and we see what that produced last year.

I don't have the desire or time to argue. It's just my opinion and it will bear itself out eventually. I was subjected to the same type of arguments when I predicted Ole Miss would go 6-6 in Freeze's first year, and when I said they would win 8 games last year.

[MarketingBully01]

To be fair, you must note that Manziel was redshirted by Sherman, and it was Sumlin who made the decision to start him and helped develop him. Yeah, Sherman had the other guy (that got drafted by the Dolphins), but Manziel was an unknown until Sumlin got there. You cannot ignore this. Sumlin will be just fine.

All good coaches end up with good players around them.

Don't act like Sumlin was this guy who anointed Johnny Football the starter when he got there. Shit, Sumlin almost kicked Johnny Football off the team when he got there. He wasn't named starter until their first game of the season. Sumlin lucked up on Johnny Football and when JFF wasn't in there last year they looked worse then Arkansas. I say 7-5 is a generous record prediction for them. I don't think the A&M fans will like the PJ (Post Johnny) era very much at all. At least not this year.

[MarketingBully01]

It's this year's must win game. I can't reiterate this enough. We all have high expectations, but could easily go 0-3 to start out league play. We have to avoid this, and prove, for once, that we are over our big game heebie-jeebies.

Must win game? Nope, the LSU game IMO is bigger and a bigger must win game. I am thinking big this year and in order for us to have the season we know we can have. LSU is the big game. Really in all honesty the only game that is a sure loss on our schedule and that is Bama and even they have some question marks. This should be a great season. To me, 7-5 or 8-4 would be a disappointment. We finally have the schedule to move up the ladder and we have great leaders on both sides of the ball. The only thing that could hold us back in my opinion is special teams. We need to figure out the kicking situation badly.

[smootness]

To be fair, you must note that Manziel was redshirted by Sherman, and it was Sumlin who made the decision to start him and helped develop him. Yeah, Sherman had the other guy (that got drafted by the Dolphins), but Manziel was an unknown until Sumlin got there. You cannot ignore this. Sumlin will be just fine.

All good coaches end up with good players around them.

Just because he didn't play until Sumlin got there doesn't necessarily mean his success can be attributed to Sumlin, though. Obviously Sumlin can't be ignored in the process, but it's entirely possible Manziel was a stud and nobody realized it until he started playing.

My point is, Manziel was an unknown prior to Sumlin because he hadn't played. If he had played for a year or two and wasn't that great, this point would be more legitimate. And obviously it will be more legitimate if the next guy turns out to be Manziel 2.0.

But as of now, I'm still going to let him prove it. He will be 'just fine' to some degree, the question is simply to what degree. I don't think he's proven enough to think they can lose those kind of cornerstones and not skip a beat.

[Bothrops]

Must win game? Nope, the LSU game IMO is bigger and a bigger must win game. I am thinking big this year and in order for us to have the season we know we can have. LSU is the big game. Really in all honesty the only game that is a sure loss on our schedule and that is Bama and even they have some question marks. This should be a great season. To me, 7-5 or 8-4 would be a disappointment. We finally have the schedule to move up the ladder and we have great leaders on both sides of the ball. The only thing that could hold us back in my opinion is special teams. We need to figure out the kicking situation badly.

I predict 8-4, if Dak stays healthy. I like the confidence, but it's not going to be that easy. We could beat LSU, I mean it has to happen sometime, right? Not really, but this is a year that we orbit that atmosphere. Auburn will be better. They may not be as lucky, but they will improve almost everywhere. Like I said, A&M is a game we can't afford to lose.

[Goat Holder]

Well damn, YOU are judging Sumlin before he has a chance to prove himself too. All I pointed out was the other side of the coin. I don't know what he will do.

Good coaches build teams around what they have. Sumlin did in fact have Manziel on his team, so he built the team around him. It backfires sometimes (injuries), but if you have that type of horse, you ride it. THIS YEAR......Sumlin knows he has to build another type of team, and I think he'll do OK. He may go 6-6 or whatever, but I'm guessing within 2 years time he'll have another QB putting up big numbers.

Rarely, and I mean RARELY, does a player prop a coach up some much that it bucks the trend. The only time I can remember that happening is with Cam Newton and Gene Chizik. Half of coaching is getting the good players in there. Fine line. Was Bobby Petrino only good because he had Brian Brohn, Stefan Lefores, Dave Ragone, Ryan Mallett and (most recent guy, names scapes me-he sort of crashed and burned without BP there too by the way), or was it because BP found them, signed them, and coached them up? Or both?

Bottom line......Texas A&M's success wasn't ALL about Johnny Football. I personally think Sumlin's a better coach than that.

[engie]

It just so happens that when they put up big offensive numbers, his QBs were Sam Bradford, Case Keenum, and Johnny Manziel. I'm not using that to discredit him, but if we're going to say 'no matter who is the QB,' then we should at least mention who those QBs happened to be.

This "down year" everyone mentions when referring to Sumlin makes me shake my head. You mean when Case Keenum and backup Cotton Turner went down for the season in game 3(thus turning it over to true freshmen David Piland and Terrence Broadway) that STILL resulted in a national #13 scoring offense and #11 total offense? That's a good example of a "down offensive year" under Sumlin, where the deck was stacked against him, wouldn't you agree?