Miss State Basketball and Howland

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02-13-2021, 01:58 PM
PGHBulldogBG

Miss State Basketball and Howland

When we hired Howland after Ray, I wasn?t thrilled with the hire since he didn?t even win a title with all that talent at UCLA. Also he really fell off at the end of his career. We all know I wanted Kermit instead, but that?s here nor there

Year 1 and 2 he gets a complete pass. I usually don?t let coaches get a pass with not much improvement for 2 years but it was a big mess and I gave him a C+

Year 3 was a solid B. We got screwed that year and should?ve been in the tournament and made a nice NIT run. Missouri, Alabama a few other teams with losing conference records and worse overall records had no business being there over us. Not Howlands fault

Year 4 was a bit disappointing. No complaints with non conference and starting to feel maybe I was wrong about the hire. Got an A- from me in non conference. That fell quick when we started conference play terrible. Not a great SEC tournament showing or great final SEC record. Team should?ve been a 3 minimum 4 based on talent. Then the Liberty loss happened which was inexcusable in every way. No excuse for that team not to make a sweet 16

Year 5 was by far the worst, even worse than this year. All that talent and not even being on the right side of the bubble. Losing to terrible non conference teams and no excuse for not being a top 12 team. This was atleast sweet 16 but elite 8 team. We weren?t even going to make the tournament. He got a big D- for that

Year 6 I could actually live with these results had Year 4 and Year 5 went as plan. Since we will be 5-8 and 11-11 after today, he is just barely hitting expectations. He needed a big year to make up for his underachieving year 4 and 5 and year 3 to a small extent.

At this point, we are stuck between a rock and a hard place. Cohen will hire a complete nobody and it will be Rick Ray 2.0. I just hope Howland keeps us relevant for the next couple years until we get a new AD and he retires. All we can hope for at this point or we somehow make sure Cohen has no say in the next hire
02-13-2021, 02:18 PM
Cowbell

Quote:

Originally Posted by PGHBulldogBG

When we hired Howland after Ray, I wasn?t thrilled with the hire since he didn?t even win a title with all that talent at UCLA. Also he really fell off at the end of his career. We all know I wanted Kermit instead, but that?s here nor there

Year 1 and 2 he gets a complete pass. I usually don?t let coaches get a pass with not much improvement for 2 years but it was a big mess and I gave him a C+

Year 3 was a solid B. We got screwed that year and should?ve been in the tournament and made a nice NIT run. Missouri, Alabama a few other teams with losing conference records and worse overall records had no business being there over us. Not Howlands fault

Year 4 was a bit disappointing. No complaints with non conference and starting to feel maybe I was wrong about the hire. Got an A- from me in non conference. That fell quick when we started conference play terrible. Not a great SEC tournament showing or great final SEC record. Team should?ve been a 3 minimum 4 based on talent. Then the Liberty loss happened which was inexcusable in every way. No excuse for that team not to make a sweet 16

Year 5 was by far the worst, even worse than this year. All that talent and not even being on the right side of the bubble. Losing to terrible non conference teams and no excuse for not being a top 12 team. This was atleast sweet 16 but elite 8 team. We weren?t even going to make the tournament. He got a big D- for that

Year 6 I could actually live with these results had Year 4 and Year 5 went as plan. Since we will be 5-8 and 11-11 after today, he is just barely hitting expectations. He needed a big year to make up for his underachieving year 4 and 5 and year 3 to a small extent.

At this point, we are stuck between a rock and a hard place. Cohen will hire a complete nobody and it will be Rick Ray 2.0. I just hope Howland keeps us relevant for the next couple years until we get a new AD and he retires. All we can hope for at this point or we somehow make sure Cohen has no say in the next hire

To be "kept relevant", you must first be relevant...
02-13-2021, 02:21 PM
parabrave

He has done what he was hired to do. The day after the season ends he needs to be ordered to either hire an offensive asst and be the figurehead or retire. And when it comes to the hiring Cohen needs to just show up at the press conference and act like he had something to do with it and otherwise stay out of it.
02-13-2021, 02:22 PM
PGHBulldogBG

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cowbell

To be "kept relevant", you must first be relevant...

Agreed that relevant is probably the wrong word. I mean keep us from Rick Ray level bad, but today is that level
02-13-2021, 02:29 PM
trob115

Cohen's future is very much in doubt. He's fallen out of grace with several boosters, especially seeing how NMP is nuking the women's program.

If what I am hearing is true, he's not going to make another coaching hire.
02-13-2021, 02:31 PM
mparkerfd20

F Howland and F Cohen.
02-13-2021, 02:41 PM
PGHBulldogBG

Quote:

Originally Posted by trob115

Cohen's future is very much in doubt. He's fallen out of grace with several boosters, especially seeing how NMP is nuking the women's program.

If what I am hearing is true, he's not going to make another coaching hire.

We need to hope that is true. I think he possibly lucked out with Lemonis but the process was a disaster. He outsmarted himself hiring NMP over Harris. Moorhead was a joke I can?t believe people even thought that was a good hire when it happened over other options. To make matters worse he looked at Pruitt and Morris as the other targets. Leach is too early to say but I had doubts. Howland isn?t his fault but due to the track record listed above I don?t want him hiring a basketball coach because I know it will be Rick Ray 2.0
02-13-2021, 02:53 PM
KOdawg1

I was told we can't do better than Howland. 1 tournament in 6 years is good. The future is bright.
02-13-2021, 03:13 PM
Bothrops

I think people need to realize that MSU basketball will never be good again. That run ended in the late 2000s The whole college game is now in decline, even in places where there's money. You have dwindling interest across the board and hs participation is at an all time low. It's hurt the talent pool. Howland lost his energy some time ago, and I suspect will retire either this year or next. The next cat to come along may improve our play at first, but things will eventually become same old hat.

Fans and heads that are interested in college basketball right now are weird to me.
02-13-2021, 03:16 PM
Dawgface

Quote:

Originally Posted by trob115

Cohen's future is very much in doubt. He's fallen out of grace with several boosters, especially seeing how NMP is nuking the women's program.

If what I am hearing is true, he's not going to make another coaching hire.

Hope that's true.
02-13-2021, 03:28 PM
confucius say

Most teams take on the personality of its coach.

Low energy, no passion.
02-13-2021, 03:40 PM
MetEdDawg

The game has passed Howland. It's like football in a way. You can play great defense, but offenses and talent are too good to hold people back forever. I don't know that there's a single game we could win in the SEC scoring 51 points.

We have 5 conference games where we've scored less than 60 and 3 of those were at home. That should never happen in today's basketball and with our talent.

Howland was never a brilliant offensive tactician and that shows itself routinely. To me he has to go. We need someone young that's been successful. You can recruit to MSU. But we need someone that can actually coach offense. Adjust to different defense. And Howland can no longer do that. Howland has to go.
02-13-2021, 03:46 PM
parabrave

Quote:

Originally Posted by MetEdDawg

The game has passed Howland. It's like football in a way. You can play great defense, but offenses and talent are too good to hold people back forever. I don't know that there's a single game we could win in the SEC scoring 51 points.

We have 5 conference games where we've scored less than 60 and 3 of those were at home. That should never happen in today's basketball and with our talent.

Howland was never a brilliant offensive tactician and that shows itself routinely. To me he has to go. We need someone young that's been successful. You can recruit to MSU. But we need someone that can actually coach offense. Adjust to different defense. And Howland can no longer do that. Howland has to go.

Hell we scored 80 last game and still lost.
02-13-2021, 08:19 PM
Dawg-gone-dawgs

Quote:

Originally Posted by KOdawg1

I was told we can't do better than Howland. 1 tournament in 6 years is good. The future is bright.

That is what the basketball elitist think but us ?ignorant? basketball fans think logically.
02-13-2021, 09:41 PM
ImissCityBagel

it seems like just yesterday we have Q take over what's his name's job
02-15-2021, 10:44 PM
yjnkdawg

Quote:

Originally Posted by MetEdDawg

The game has passed Howland. It's like football in a way. You can play great defense, but offenses and talent are too good to hold people back forever. I don't know that there's a single game we could win in the SEC scoring 51 points.

We have 5 conference games where we've scored less than 60 and 3 of those were at home. That should never happen in today's basketball and with our talent.

Howland was never a brilliant offensive tactician and that shows itself routinely. To me he has to go. We need someone young that's been successful. You can recruit to MSU. But we need someone that can actually coach offense. Adjust to different defense. And Howland can no longer do that. Howland has to go.

I'm glad that old Four Corners Stall Offense is gone, or we may be running it. Who knows? That's what got a shot clock involved in the game.
02-16-2021, 02:38 PM
HoopsDawg

Quote:

Originally Posted by yjnkdawg

I'm glad that old Four Corners Stall Offense is gone, or we may be running it. Who knows? That's what got a shot clock involved in the game.

We are 335th in the nation in 3 point attempts per game. 335th out of 347. The game has changed, we haven't changed with it.