Crazy Good Article For Football Nerds

The issue many SEC team will have is that they may have to play a different defensive scheme against us than they do against any other team on their schedule

How do they master that in a week?

That is a good read. Same guy wrote an article last year on Washington stopping Leach consistently.

https://blogs.usafootball.com/blog/6...t-the-air-raid

basically, play zone, have better talent to pressure with only 3 rushers

If LSU can't get home consistently with 4, I don't know others will get home with 3, but maybe its a coverage sack issue.

I think we expect him to be pragmatic and run Hill with a 4/5 man box. Will he?

B

I mean, we are running on this, right?

https://assets.usafootball.com/cms/i...ington%202.png

How does the zone defense stop K Hill?

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Originally Posted by Jack Lambert

How does the zone defense stop K Hill?

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Exactly... In this video, WSU tries to run and cannot vs the UW front. https://youtu.be/WkPgbC_TWu4

And in the above link, this is a key takeaway..

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Only a week prior to the 2018 Apple Cup, Minshew threw for 7 touchdowns against the Arizona Wildcats. ?Zona also rushed 3 guys a lot but a) couldn?t get pressure and b) dropped too shallow (often because they were dropping defensive linemen).

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If we start seeing 3 man fronts, and lots of zone, we need our line to be able to get to the 2nd level, and our RB's to take advantage.

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Originally Posted by Jack Lambert

How does the zone defense stop K Hill?

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Well this kind of brings to my next point.

Pelini has faced Leach twice before and the offense hasn’t changed. So why did Pelini choose to do this?

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Originally Posted by YoungB

I mean, we are running on this, right?

https://assets.usafootball.com/cms/i...ington%202.png

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I would hope our OL would be able to get to those LB, and have Hill running free for 15 yards before the safety can get down.

Seems ripe for that shovel pass or a draw as well as the several running plays.

Leech will make the SEC better, if they play it once a year they will at least have some experience against it if they an air raid type team in the post season

one week is difficult indeed ... I'm reminded of having a month to prepare for Ga Tech's triple option ... I know we didn't have a DC (G Collins had already left) but even after 3 or 4 weeks prep we still couldn't stop it .... and that was with a powerful offense of our own

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Originally Posted by ShotgunDawg

Well this kind of brings to my next point.

Pelini has faced Leach twice before and the offense hasn’t changed. So why did Pelini choose to do this?

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He didn't respect our receivers and thought they sucked. That's exactly what happened pure arrogance from dbu.

The problem he faced at WSU was that Washington recruits at around a top 30 level most years and WSU even on their best years are barely able to crack the top 50. That big of a recruiting disadvantage on top of Leach not being in an area that's especially fertile recruiting grounds is not a recipe for success no matter how much scheming you're able to do. Another problem when he faced Washington was that Chris Peterson was always able to strike on 1-2 Samoans every couple of years that turned into top 15 D line picks. I think Leach had one first OL taken his entire time at WSU. That's a big talent gap in the trenches. The other answer is that the weather for that game is ALWAYS crap. It's either raining, sleeting, or snowing every year.

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Originally Posted by StarkVegasSteve

The problem he faced at WSU was that Washington recruits at around a top 30 level most years and WSU even on their best years are barely able to crack the top 50. That big of a recruiting disadvantage on top of Leach not being in an area that's especially fertile recruiting grounds is not a recipe for success no matter how much scheming you're able to do. Another problem when he faced Washington was that Chris Peterson was always able to strike on 1-2 Samoans every couple of years that turned into top 15 D line picks. I think Leach had one first OL taken his entire time at WSU. That's a big talent gap in the trenches. The other answer is that the weather for that game is ALWAYS crap. It's either raining, sleeting, or snowing every year.

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Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't four of those front seven for Washington get taken in the that years' draft? That may have a lot to do with it.

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Originally Posted by TrapGame

Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't four of those front seven for Washington get taken in the that years' draft? That may have a lot to do with it.

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EXACTLY. I was very quick to judge it the same way that they had figured out how to stop the Air Raid, but it really came down to they were just flat out more talented in the trenches and the big splits in the Air Raid hinder you when you're being out athleted in the trenches. We're good enough there that there's not many teams that can out athlete us. Cross is a 1st round talent and Dolla Bill has the ability to be a fringe 1st round guy. Add in Eiland, Parker, and Smith who all can play at the next level and you're just not going to get man handled at the line like UW was able to do against Wazzu

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Originally Posted by SheltonChoked

I would hope our OL would be able to get to those LB, and have Hill running free for 15 yards before the safety can get down.

Seems ripe for that shovel pass or a draw as well as the several running plays.

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I suspect UW gets away with it due to a talent disparity. I don't think a SEC Defense would drop 8 against our O-line and RBs on a consistent basis. I'm sure it will be thrown in occasionally.

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Originally Posted by YoungB

That is a good read. Same guy wrote an article last year on Washington stopping Leach consistently.

https://blogs.usafootball.com/blog/6...t-the-air-raid

basically, play zone, have better talent to pressure with only 3 rushers

If LSU can't get home consistently with 4, I don't know others will get home with 3, but maybe its a coverage sack issue.

I think we expect him to be pragmatic and run Hill with a 4/5 man box. Will he?

B

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Well if you can control the run game and get pressure on the quarterback with just rushing 3, then there aren?t a lot of offenses in the world that work.

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Originally Posted by Delmar

Well if you can control the run game and get pressure on the quarterback with just rushing 3, then there aren?t a lot of offenses in the world that work.

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I was thinking the same thing. If you control the los with 3 you're good against anyone.

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Originally Posted by Commercecomet24

He didn't respect our receivers and thought they sucked. That's exactly what happened pure arrogance from dbu.

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+1
Exactly.

Everyone acts like Washington 'figured it out,' when they've been playing Leach since 2012. If it was as easy as rushing 3 and dropping 8, everyone else would have 'figured it out' and been stopping it long before now.

Washington was simply better than Washington State, the same way Bama has been simply better than us. What did Bama do to 'figure us out' and shut us down? They beat us in the trenches and at the second level and in the secondary. That's a pretty good way to do it.

Certain schemes are better than others, but if your linemen can block, your WRs can find space, and your QB can deliver it on target and on time, you'll have success against any scheme. Pretending 'figuring out' the scheme of a guy who's been coaching and using the exact same scheme for more than 20 years is some kind of accomplishment is hilarious. Everyone knows Leach's scheme and knows the principles of how you might stop it. But you still have to go do it. Just like if LSU had gotten constant pressure and their DBs had draped our WRs, they would have beaten us.

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Originally Posted by smootness

Everyone acts like Washington 'figured it out,' when they've been playing Leach since 2012. If it was as easy as rushing 3 and dropping 8, everyone else would have 'figured it out' and been stopping it long before now.

Washington was simply better than Washington State, the same way Bama has been simply better than us. What did Bama do to 'figure us out' and shut us down? They beat us in the trenches and at the second level and in the secondary. That's a pretty good way to do it.

Certain schemes are better than others, but if your linemen can block, your WRs can find space, and your QB can deliver it on target and on time, you'll have success against any scheme. Pretending 'figuring out' the scheme of a guy who's been coaching and using the exact same scheme for more than 20 years is some kind of accomplishment is hilarious. Everyone knows Leach's scheme and knows the principles of how you might stop it. But you still have to go do it. Just like if LSU had gotten constant pressure and their DBs had draped our WRs, they would have beaten us.

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Rep given!

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Originally Posted by smootness

Everyone acts like Washington 'figured it out,' when they've been playing Leach since 2012. If it was as easy as rushing 3 and dropping 8, everyone else would have 'figured it out' and been stopping it long before now.

Washington was simply better than Washington State, the same way Bama has been simply better than us. What did Bama do to 'figure us out' and shut us down? They beat us in the trenches and at the second level and in the secondary. That's a pretty good way to do it.

Certain schemes are better than others, but if your linemen can block, your WRs can find space, and your QB can deliver it on target and on time, you'll have success against any scheme. Pretending 'figuring out' the scheme of a guy who's been coaching and using the exact same scheme for more than 20 years is some kind of accomplishment is hilarious. Everyone knows Leach's scheme and knows the principles of how you might stop it. But you still have to go do it. Just like if LSU had gotten constant pressure and their DBs had draped our WRs, they would have beaten us.

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/slow clap

Lets schedule Washington in the neat future and settle this argument once and for all. **

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Originally Posted by SheltonChoked

Exactly... In this video, WSU tries to run and cannot vs the UW front. https://youtu.be/WkPgbC_TWu4

And in the above link, this is a key takeaway..



If we start seeing 3 man fronts, and lots of zone, we need our line to be able to get to the 2nd level, and our RB's to take advantage.

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Sorry but Arkansas isn't that Washington team and that WSU running back wasn't K Hill.

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Originally Posted by smootness

Everyone acts like Washington 'figured it out,' when they've been playing Leach since 2012. If it was as easy as rushing 3 and dropping 8, everyone else would have 'figured it out' and been stopping it long before now.

Washington was simply better than Washington State, the same way Bama has been simply better than us. What did Bama do to 'figure us out' and shut us down? They beat us in the trenches and at the second level and in the secondary. That's a pretty good way to do it.

Certain schemes are better than others, but if your linemen can block, your WRs can find space, and your QB can deliver it on target and on time, you'll have success against any scheme. Pretending 'figuring out' the scheme of a guy who's been coaching and using the exact same scheme for more than 20 years is some kind of accomplishment is hilarious. Everyone knows Leach's scheme and knows the principles of how you might stop it. But you still have to go do it. Just like if LSU had gotten constant pressure and their DBs had draped our WRs, they would have beaten us.

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Like the link says, the thing that should scare SEC Defensive coordinators is this. LSU did get pressure. They "hurried" 40 passes.

KJ passed for 600 yards with an LSU defender affecting his pass, 66% of the time....

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Originally Posted by Jack Lambert

Sorry but Arkansas isn't that Washington team and that WSU running back wasn't K Hill.

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I agree. And that is my point. Arizona tried to rush 3 vs Leach and got TORCHED.

Let's talk some more about this idea that Washington figured Leach out, as though it's something special. So in 2016, Washington St. scored 17 points, put up 334 yards of total offense, and threw for 269 yards against Washington. Not great numbers. But Washington played 4 other ranked teams that year, and here's how those teams fared:

#7 Stanford - 6 points, 213 yards of offense, 184 yards passing
#17 Utah - 24 points, 376 yards of offense, 163 yards passing
#9 Colorado - 10 points, 163 yards of offense, 81 yards passing (Pac-12 Champ Game, the game following WSU)
#1 Bama - 24 points, 326 yards of offense, 57 yards passing (CFP Semifinal)


2017:
Washington State - 14 points, 345 yards of offense, 369 yards passing

Washington played a weak schedule that year, but out of their 8 other conference games, 5 opponents scored fewer than 14, 6 put up fewer than 345 yards of offense, and 8 put up fewer than 369 yards passing.


2018:
Washington State - 15 points, 237 yards of offense, 152 yards passing (This was no doubt Washington's most impressive performance defensively against a very good WSU team)

#9 Auburn - 21 points, 420 yards of offense, 273 yards passing
#20 BYU - 7 points, 194 yards of offense, 160 yards passing
#17 Oregon - 30 points, 379 yards of offense, 202 yards passing
#17 Utah - 3 points, 188 yards of offense, 137 yards passing (Pac-12 Champ Game, the game following WSU)
#5 Ohio St - 28 points, 364 yards of offense, 251 yards passing


2019:
Washington State - 13 points, 339 yards of offense, 308 yards passing

#21 USC - 14 points, 375 yards of offense, 163 yards passing
#12 Oregon - 35 points, 468 yards of offense, 280 yards passing
#9 Utah - 33 points, 399 yards of offense, 284 yards passing
#18 Boise St - 7 points, 266 yards of offense, 188 yards passing (Bowl game, the game following WSU)


Let's not pretend this is some issue against Washington unique to WSU. They are consistently comparable to other ranked teams against Washington while typically being much less talented than those other ranked teams as well. So don't compare WSU's games against Washington to WSU's other games. Compare them to Washington's other games, and they're no outlier. In fact, usually Washington performs better in the following game, even against ranked teams, which seems to suggest weather plays a factor as well.

Washington has fielded an elite defense recently. They don't just shut down WSU. They shut down everybody.

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Originally Posted by smootness

Let's talk some more about this idea that Washington figured Leach out, as though it's something special. So in 2016, Washington St. scored 17 points, put up 334 yards of total offense, and threw for 269 yards against Washington. Not great numbers. But Washington played 4 other ranked teams that year, and here's how those teams fared:

#7 Stanford - 6 points, 213 yards of offense, 184 yards passing
#17 Utah - 24 points, 376 yards of offense, 163 yards passing
#9 Colorado - 10 points, 163 yards of offense, 81 yards passing (Pac-12 Champ Game, the game following WSU)
#1 Bama - 24 points, 326 yards of offense, 57 yards passing (CFP Semifinal)


2017:
Washington State - 14 points, 345 yards of offense, 369 yards passing

Washington played a weak schedule that year, but out of their 8 other conference games, 5 opponents scored fewer than 14, 6 put up fewer than 345 yards of offense, and 8 put up fewer than 369 yards passing.


2018:
Washington State - 15 points, 237 yards of offense, 152 yards passing (This was no doubt Washington's most impressive performance defensively against a very good WSU team)

#9 Auburn - 21 points, 420 yards of offense, 273 yards passing
#20 BYU - 7 points, 194 yards of offense, 160 yards passing
#17 Oregon - 30 points, 379 yards of offense, 202 yards passing
#17 Utah - 3 points, 188 yards of offense, 137 yards passing (Pac-12 Champ Game, the game following WSU)
#5 Ohio St - 28 points, 364 yards of offense, 251 yards passing


2019:
Washington State - 13 points, 339 yards of offense, 308 yards passing

#21 USC - 14 points, 375 yards of offense, 163 yards passing
#12 Oregon - 35 points, 468 yards of offense, 280 yards passing
#9 Utah - 33 points, 399 yards of offense, 284 yards passing
#18 Boise St - 7 points, 266 yards of offense, 188 yards passing (Bowl game, the game following WSU)


Let's not pretend this is some issue against Washington unique to WSU. They are consistently comparable to other ranked teams against Washington while typically being much less talented than those other ranked teams as well. So don't compare WSU's games against Washington to WSU's other games. Compare them to Washington's other games, and they're no outlier. In fact, usually Washington performs better in the following game, even against ranked teams, which seems to suggest weather plays a factor as well.

Washington has fielded an elite defense recently. They don't just shut down WSU. They shut down everybody.

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That is some excellent (and eye opening) statistics. Good job Smoot.

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Originally Posted by smootness

Let's talk some more about this idea that Washington figured Leach out, as though it's something special. So in 2016, Washington St. scored 17 points, put up 334 yards of total offense, and threw for 269 yards against Washington. Not great numbers. But Washington played 4 other ranked teams that year, and here's how those teams fared:

#7 Stanford - 6 points, 213 yards of offense, 184 yards passing
#17 Utah - 24 points, 376 yards of offense, 163 yards passing
#9 Colorado - 10 points, 163 yards of offense, 81 yards passing (Pac-12 Champ Game, the game following WSU)
#1 Bama - 24 points, 326 yards of offense, 57 yards passing (CFP Semifinal)


2017:
Washington State - 14 points, 345 yards of offense, 369 yards passing

Washington played a weak schedule that year, but out of their 8 other conference games, 5 opponents scored fewer than 14, 6 put up fewer than 345 yards of offense, and 8 put up fewer than 369 yards passing.


2018:
Washington State - 15 points, 237 yards of offense, 152 yards passing (This was no doubt Washington's most impressive performance defensively against a very good WSU team)

#9 Auburn - 21 points, 420 yards of offense, 273 yards passing
#20 BYU - 7 points, 194 yards of offense, 160 yards passing
#17 Oregon - 30 points, 379 yards of offense, 202 yards passing
#17 Utah - 3 points, 188 yards of offense, 137 yards passing (Pac-12 Champ Game, the game following WSU)
#5 Ohio St - 28 points, 364 yards of offense, 251 yards passing


2019:
Washington State - 13 points, 339 yards of offense, 308 yards passing

#21 USC - 14 points, 375 yards of offense, 163 yards passing
#12 Oregon - 35 points, 468 yards of offense, 280 yards passing
#9 Utah - 33 points, 399 yards of offense, 284 yards passing
#18 Boise St - 7 points, 266 yards of offense, 188 yards passing (Bowl game, the game following WSU)


Let's not pretend this is some issue against Washington unique to WSU. They are consistently comparable to other ranked teams against Washington while typically being much less talented than those other ranked teams as well. So don't compare WSU's games against Washington to WSU's other games. Compare them to Washington's other games, and they're no outlier. In fact, usually Washington performs better in the following game, even against ranked teams, which seems to suggest weather plays a factor as well.

Washington has fielded an elite defense recently. They don't just shut down WSU. They shut down everybody.

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Thanks, Smoot. Great info. Well done.

If anyone on our schedule rushes 3 and drops 8 all game Kylin will run for 700 yards. Whatever stopped Leach at WSU won’t with our OL. Maybe Georgia or Alabama could but not even they could this year.

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Originally Posted by smootness

Everyone acts like Washington 'figured it out,' when they've been playing Leach since 2012. If it was as easy as rushing 3 and dropping 8, everyone else would have 'figured it out' and been stopping it long before now.

Washington was simply better than Washington State, the same way Bama has been simply better than us. What did Bama do to 'figure us out' and shut us down? They beat us in the trenches and at the second level and in the secondary. That's a pretty good way to do it.

Certain schemes are better than others, but if your linemen can block, your WRs can find space, and your QB can deliver it on target and on time, you'll have success against any scheme. Pretending 'figuring out' the scheme of a guy who's been coaching and using the exact same scheme for more than 20 years is some kind of accomplishment is hilarious. Everyone knows Leach's scheme and knows the principles of how you might stop it. But you still have to go do it. Just like if LSU had gotten constant pressure and their DBs had draped our WRs, they would have beaten us.

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I don't always agree with your posts. But I agree with this one.

Who stole your password?**

The bottom line is this:

We have Mike Leach running our offense, a guy that is a rising star at DC, a good ST coach, and we have recent history and support.

The rest of the SEC is screwed.

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Originally Posted by YoungB

That is a good read. Same guy wrote an article last year on Washington stopping Leach consistently.

https://blogs.usafootball.com/blog/6...t-the-air-raid

basically, play zone, have better talent to pressure with only 3 rushers

If LSU can't get home consistently with 4, I don't know others will get home with 3, but maybe its a coverage sack issue.

I think we expect him to be pragmatic and run Hill with a 4/5 man box. Will he?

B

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The big difference is UW has top 10 talent and WSU has top 60-70. UW also had a DT that was a top 10 pick and starts in the NFL.

There is a lot less of a talent gap at MSU to anyone than he had at WSU.

This year has always been set up to be a sneaky good year for us. Leach revamps the offense with a legit QB but still has his legit RB, and our D still has enough talent to at least be decent. We don't know if we'll have a QB or RB like this again soon, and we don't know how we'll continue to recruit on D. So while Leach will get more of his guys in and instill more and more of his offense and principles, it's also possible the talent mix isn't quite this good going forward.

With Leach's offense so much easier to install quickly, this year always had the potential to be much better than anyone envisioned.

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Originally Posted by smootness

This year has always been set up to be a sneaky good year for us. Leach revamps the offense with a legit QB but still has his legit RB, and our D still has enough talent to at least be decent. We don't know if we'll have a QB or RB like this again soon, and we don't know how we'll continue to recruit on D. So while Leach will get more of his guys in and instill more and more of his offense and principles, it's also possible the talent mix isn't quite this good going forward.

With Leach's offense so much easier to install quickly, this year always had the potential to be much better than anyone envisioned.

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Early indications are that our talent level will improve.

Seems like we’ve got a lot of traction in 2022 class with bing time guys and WR/QB recruiting is about to explode.

My only long term concern is the OL. Right now with Cross, Dollar Bill, and Cole Smith, we’re set up for a few years, but we’ve got to replace them with equal or better talents. I think the JUCO program and the ability to sell winning to normal Mississippi defensive classes, we’ll be fine over there

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Originally Posted by smootness

This year has always been set up to be a sneaky good year for us. Leach revamps the offense with a legit QB but still has his legit RB, and our D still has enough talent to at least be decent. We don't know if we'll have a QB or RB like this again soon, and we don't know how we'll continue to recruit on D. So while Leach will get more of his guys in and instill more and more of his offense and principles, it's also possible the talent mix isn't quite this good going forward.

With Leach's offense so much easier to install quickly, this year always had the potential to be much better than anyone envisioned.

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I agree with most of this, but Leach is about to surprise some people on the recruiting trail (defensive talent included). We are going to stack the secondary this year with talent and next year we are going to clean up in state with the front 6. He will naturally recruit blue chip offensive skill positions in and out of state.