Managing the Bullpen in Omaha

With the setup of the CWS at it is (every other day), I was thinking how we might manage the bullpen, which is clearly our ace in the hole. We've basically been using Mitchell and Girodo as long relievers and burning them in one particular game which I certainly don't have a problem with. But given the every other day thing, would it be better to try to use Mitchell, Girodo, and Bracewell two innings apiece so they will be available for every game or should we continue to go with the hot hand in relief burning him for the next game (obviously a guy could pitch on one day's rest but for all intents and purposes he is probably not going to have his best stuff on a Monday after throwing 60 pitches on a Saturday). I'll hang up and listen.

I kind of like the way we are doing it- tandem pitching. Start the righty and try to get 3-4 out of them- the opposing team has their line-up set- then come with the lefty for 3-4 innings- close it with Holder.

Saturday- Graveman/Mitchell/Holder
Monday- Fitts/Girodo/Holder

I guess a Game 3 would be Pollo/Bracewell/Holder or do we go Bracewell/Pollo/Holder

I'd cut Graveman off at about 60-70 pitches and bring him back for Game 3 if it were me. That would be 4 days in between starts- but you have to cut him off at 70 pitches

I like Bracewell as the 3rd guy. I think. I like Pollo, but if Bracewell is on he has great stuff. I wouldn't be upset either way.

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Originally Posted by Coach34

I'd cut Graveman off at about 60-70 pitches and bring him back for Game 3 if it were me. That would be 4 days in between starts- but you have to cut him off at 70 pitches

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That seems to be right when Graveman finds his groove. I don't know if I could justify pulling him if he was cruising- just take it one game at a time.

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Originally Posted by SaltyDawg

I like Bracewell as the 3rd guy. I think. I like Pollo, but if Bracewell is on he has great stuff. I wouldn't be upset either way.

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So are we just completely axing Lindgren. He has been kinda off lately but not terribly bad

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Originally Posted by hometowndawg

So are we just completely axing Lindgren. He has been kinda off lately but not terribly bad

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I imagine he'll just be on the "bench mob" unless we make a run from the loser's bracket.

We've essentially been starting two relief pitchers (unless Graveman's pitching), getting about 1-2 times through the lineup with each, and then going to the closer. It's weird as hell and definitely unconventional, but it's worked and you can't argue with results. I say keep doing it.

stupid question - why not start Girodo? The way he's pitching right now, we could expect to get 4-5 solid innings out of him, turn it over to Fitts or Gentry, then Holder (if we're ahead). Then we save Graveman/Mitchell for game 2. I think that gives us a great chance to come out 2-0. At least 1-1.

I don't see how you couldn't start Graveman in Game 1. He's been our guy all year- don't start getting too cute with everything.

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Originally Posted by PMDawg

stupid question - why not start Girodo? The way he's pitching right now, we could expect to get 4-5 solid innings out of him, turn it over to Fitts or Gentry, then Holder (if we're ahead). Then we save Graveman/Mitchell for game 2. I think that gives us a great chance to come out 2-0. At least 1-1.

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I'm not sure why people keep asking this question. We are 12-3 in our last 15 games beating some very solid competition...multiple times in some cases over that span - why would/should we change up the formula now?

But look at it this way - would you rather have Girodo or Mitchell for the 4th-8th innings when every successive pitch is more critical, or would you rather have Pollo, Fitts or Gentry? Think of Pollo and Fitts like a relief pitcher who instead of pitching the 6th, 7th and 8th innings will now pitch the 1st, 2nd and 3rd. Our best pitchers are being used at the most critical times. Unless you dig yourself a hole in the first 3 innings (which we haven't been doing because we are hitting well too) then this formula is actually better. And if Fitts or Pollo or Lindgren give up a couple of runs in the first 2-4 innings we have a lot more time to come back than if they gave up those runs in the 6th or 7th.

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Originally Posted by SaltyDawg

I don't see how you couldn't start Graveman in Game 1. He's been our guy all year- don't start getting too cute with everything.

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my question still remains. Why not start Girodo? He has been better than Fitts and has been lasting longer per outing. Switch em.

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Originally Posted by PMDawg

my question still remains. Why not start Girodo? He has been better than Fitts and has been lasting longer per outing. Switch em.

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Because Girodo's effectiveness comes from him being murder on LH'ed hitters. By starting a Righty, the other team gets their lefty's in the line-up- then we bring Girodo in. Start him, and you will see a team combat that and start more RH'ed hitters

Because Girodo has been lights out in crunch time at the end of the game.

Have you also ever thought the reason these guys are effective is because A) they come out of the pen- different mindset than starting and B) because they are a complete change of pace from the starter.

At this point, I'm all in with whatever the hell Cohen wants to do.

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Originally Posted by Ghost of Hank Flick

I guess a Game 3 would be Pollo/Bracewell/Holder or do we go Bracewell/Pollo/Holder

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Lets just hope there is a game 3. If so, I like your first group

because fitts and pollo get bad fast when they tire and they either give up some runs or put is in very bad situations before exiting the game. it's an odd situation, and, yes, it's working right now. But how many jams can we get out of? 6 of one, half a dozen of the other. I just think Girodo would be a better starter than Fitts. If you get 5 out of Girodo, you only need two out of Fitts before you go to Holder. He usually tires out sometime around 3. We would'nt "have" to leave him in so long. I think it's worth discussing, but if you don't, then don't.

"Because Girodo's effectiveness comes from him being murder on LH'ed hitters. By starting a Righty, the other team gets their lefty's in the line-up- then we bring Girodo in. Start him, and you will see a team combat that and start more RH'ed hitters "


this is a good answer. take notes TCD.

This makes sense.

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Originally Posted by Coach34

Because Girodo's effectiveness comes from him being murder on LH'ed hitters. By starting a Righty, the other team gets their lefty's in the line-up- then we bring Girodo in. Start him, and you will see a team combat that and start more RH'ed hitters

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I don't think any team that we have recently played has started a player because we started a RH pitcher. Their lineups have been set for a while now- there were no surprises based on matchup.

If we win Saturday and Monday, we wouldn't play again until Friday, when I assume we'd pitch Graveman again

Big if, but something to keep in mind.

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Originally Posted by Quaoarsking

If we win Saturday and Monday, we wouldn't play again until Friday, when I assume we'd pitch Graveman again

Big if, but something to keep in mind.

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Didnt realize that and it actually gives me a better feeling about our chances.

When opposing teams fans are saying they'd rather see the 2000 version of Pedro Martinez than Girodo you're doing something right. The man doesn't get enough credit for hard he busted his ass to get to the position he's in now.

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Originally Posted by PMDawg

"Because Girodo's effectiveness comes from him being murder on LH'ed hitters. By starting a Righty, the other team gets their lefty's in the line-up- then we bring Girodo in. Start him, and you will see a team combat that and start more RH'ed hitters "


this is a good answer. take notes TCD.

This makes sense.

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Take notes? I don't disagree with that point, although if it is as simple as switching out righties and lefties in a platoon all they have to do is pinch hit.

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Originally Posted by Quaoarsking

If we win Saturday and Monday, we wouldn't play again until Friday, when I assume we'd pitch Graveman again

Big if, but something to keep in mind.

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This is a funky set up. You kind of have a decision to make there because if you pitch your ace on Friday then he wouldn't be fully rested until a Game 3 in the Championship series. But on the other hand, if you don't pitch your ace on Friday and lose, then go with him on Saturday he won't be fully rested until after the CWS is completed.

I really like Kendall against Oregon State the more I look at their lineup. Last night they hit a lot of fly balls and they have a RH dominant lineup, so Kendall could do well against them. Plus, nothing frustrates a team like OSU that is used to facing those big Pac12 arms, than to throw a sinker baller at them and them start hitting a ton of ground balls. I'm thinking Graveman with Ross as the first man out of the pen against OSU, and Holder to close it.

It's hard to plan ahead in this format because like many of you have said, we will have days between games so guys like Ross should be available most of the week. Plus, I think Game 1 is SO important, especially in a bracket like we have, that we will need to do whatever it takes to get that first game.

Basically, I think we go in there and try to frustrate the shit out of those big arms they have by playing our typical hit and run style mixed with some bunt singles, etc, and try to get an early lead....and then frustrate the shit out of them by throwing Kendall and Ross and try to get them hammering everything into the ground. We can beat this team, but they will be confident that there is no way they lose to us

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Originally Posted by messageboardsuperhero

We've essentially been starting two relief pitchers (unless Graveman's pitching), getting about 1-2 times through the lineup with each, and then going to the closer. It's weird as hell and definitely unconventional, but it's worked and you can't argue with results. I say keep doing it.

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Thats the future of the game my friend.

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Originally Posted by Will James

Thats the future of the game my friend.

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I believe this. It really makes no sense not too if you have the arms to match up and give teams fits.

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Originally Posted by Raytoraid83

When opposing teams fans are saying they'd rather see the 2000 version of Pedro Martinez than Girodo you're doing something right. The man doesn't get enough credit for hard he busted his ass to get to the position he's in now.

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I'm not discounting Girodo one bit. I think getting drafted where he did is a credit to how far he has come in its own right.

UVA's fan base is completely delusional and have absolutely no baseball knowledge, using what they say in an argument shouldn't hold any weight at all.

Don't be surprised if you see Girodo in a MLB bullpen next summer. He is there as a LH specialist.

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Originally Posted by CadaverDawg

I believe this. It really makes no sense not too if you have the arms to match up and give teams fits.

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The Astros are tinkering around with this in their farm system. It's the next evolution for sure, the 5 man rotation's days are numbered.

I have a good feeling about this CWS.

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Originally Posted by Will James

The Astros are tinkering around with this in their farm system. It's the next evolution for sure, the 5 man rotation's days are numbered.

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It's the pitching counter to a manager's platoon match-ups. Pitch guys less pitches but start them more often- and use what you have to create advantages in the righty-lefty match-ups. And then you also dont see a guy but once-maybe twice in a game-which is another advantage for the pitcher.

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Originally Posted by Spider-Man

I have a good feeling about this CWS.

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If Frazier and renfroe stay hot, we could make some noise. I don't think we can beat these teams if Adam and hunter go cold.

I'd much rather have a Stratton or a Rodon, but yeah, if it's working let's keep doing it. Problem is, you have to have alot of pitchers to make it work.

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Originally Posted by Goat Holder

I'd much rather have a Stratton or a Rodon, but yeah, if it's working let's keep doing it. Problem is, you have to have alot of pitchers to make it work.

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Then it's not a problem...we've got em

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Originally Posted by Will James

The Astros are tinkering around with this in their farm system. It's the next evolution for sure, the 5 man rotation's days are numbered.

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I think they are going to have to expand rosters to make it happen. And that is something that MLB has talked about doing- expanding rosters from 25 to 28.