Our defensive Front 7...

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09-08-2014, 11:56 AM
Tdawg

Our defensive Front 7...

Our front 7, against the run, is as good as any I've seen in this short season. They are big, strong and quick up front, and our LB's are really, really good, across the board. I don't know the height/weight of our DL off the top of my head, but we seem to be much bigger than the average SEC DL--while retaining and very high level of athleticism (see Preston Smith's pick-6). Seems like our DT's are 300+ (which is normal), but our DE's look to be in the 275 range. They are hosses against the run--and we seem to have pretty good depth there as well. The only thing that has disappointed me, and maybe this is a function of our size, is that the DL doesn't seem to be producing much QB pressure in the passing game when only rushing 4. I would've hoped to have seen more pressure from the front 4 against the caliber of OL's that we've been playing. Will this cause us to have to blitz more to pressure QB's? What is the solution?
09-08-2014, 12:08 PM
War Machine Dawg

http://i.imgur.com/2YJ5inX.gif

I guess I'm going to have to explain this multiple times every week this season. Pressure is not equal to sacks. Last week we did a TREMENDOUS job of generating pressure with our front 4. We weren't as good this week, but we weren't terrible, either. We're making QBs move off their spot, throw on the run, keep them from setting their feet to throw, and/or rush the throw. THAT'S pressure. When he wants to, Chris Jones gets to the QB about as fast as any human I've ever seen. Nick James has gotten tremendous push in limited snaps so far. Eulls has gotten some pressure. Preston Smith was freaking SEC DL of the week due to the pressure he generated. We'll see how it shakes out in SEC play, but as of right now, we're definitely improved at getting pressure with the front 4 compared to previous years.

That said, yes, we need to get better about getting the QB on the ground when we get there. But that will come, I think. The big thing is just not letting the QB get comfortable and forcing him to move, prevent him from setting his feet, or make him rush his reads/progression/throw.
09-08-2014, 12:12 PM
Political Hack

we're running two to three complete DLs. When we want pressure from those four, we'll put in a separate package. A la jones, jones, Smith, and Brown (maybe?).
09-08-2014, 12:12 PM
BrunswickDawg

We also have 6 sacks through 2 games -putting us on pace for 30 which would be 10 more than last year.
09-08-2014, 12:20 PM
Tdawg

Quote:

Originally Posted by War Machine Dawg

http://i.imgur.com/2YJ5inX.gif

I guess I'm going to have to explain this multiple times every week this season. Pressure is not equal to sacks. Last week we did a TREMENDOUS job of generating pressure with our front 4. We weren't as good this week, but we weren't terrible, either. We're making QBs move off their spot, throw on the run, keep them from setting their feet to throw, and/or rush the throw. THAT'S pressure. When he wants to, Chris Jones gets to the QB about as fast as any human I've ever seen. Nick James has gotten tremendous push in limited snaps so far. Eulls has gotten some pressure. Preston Smith was freaking SEC DL of the week due to the pressure he generated. We'll see how it shakes out in SEC play, but as of right now, we're definitely improved at getting pressure with the front 4 compared to previous years.

That said, yes, we need to get better about getting the QB on the ground when we get there. But that will come, I think. The big thing is just not letting the QB get comfortable and forcing him to move, prevent him from setting his feet, or make him rush his reads/progression/throw.

I get that--and yes we were better against USM. Our D front reminds me of recent Alabama D-lines that are great run stoppers but have trouble pressuring the QB. We've seen with Alabama that a lack of a pass rush with 4 exposes your secondary significantly, and we have teams on our schedule that have the ability to dissect our secondary if given 4 seconds on pass plays. We aren't bad there, it's just not a strength. I worry more about that than the weird big plays we gave up versus UAB.
09-08-2014, 12:32 PM
CadaverDawg

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tdawg

Our D front reminds me of recent Alabama

And you're complaining about it
09-08-2014, 12:40 PM
preachermatt83

Quote:

Originally Posted by Political Hack

we're running two to three complete DLs. When we want pressure from those four, we'll put in a separate package. A la jones, jones, Smith, and Brown (maybe?).

i'd go AJ over Brown.
09-08-2014, 12:43 PM
maroonmania

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tdawg

I get that--and yes we were better against USM. Our D front reminds me of recent Alabama D-lines that are great run stoppers but have trouble pressuring the QB. We've seen with Alabama that a lack of a pass rush with 4 exposes your secondary significantly, and we have teams on our schedule that have the ability to dissect our secondary if given 4 seconds on pass plays. We aren't bad there, it's just not a strength. I worry more about that than the weird big plays we gave up versus UAB.

I wouldn't put too much stock in how dominant we looked against USM. Seriously, USM has maybe the worst OL in all of D1 football. If not, they are pretty dang close.
09-08-2014, 12:45 PM
Tdawg

Quote:

Originally Posted by CadaverDawg

And you're complaining about it

Not really complaining about it--just wanting to discuss how we get better at the one thing we don't appear to be upper-eschelon at. Seriously, I think it's the only thing right now keeping our D from being the best in the SEC. I'm obviously nitpicking.
09-08-2014, 12:48 PM
starkvegasdawg

I tweeted Matt Wyatt Sunday about what he thought happened to our secondary. His response: "Looked like lost inside leverage, it's 1 on 1 w/no help and got out run to the football. No QB pressure and nice throws."

So, per an earlier post in this thread about Chris Jones getting pressure at will...do you think he is just taking plays off or if he is being told to hold at the line for some reason?
09-08-2014, 01:00 PM
1bigdawg

Quote:

Originally Posted by BrunswickDawg

We also have 6 sacks through 2 games -putting us on pace for 30 which would be 10 more than last year.

30 would be great, but did we drop a couple of games?
09-08-2014, 01:09 PM
CadaverDawg

Our pressure is fine. Eulls drilled the QB on one of the home runs,and he was being double covered in 4vs6 max protect coverage. If you think we are not getting pressure, you're not paying close enough attention. Besides, our best 4 have only played together a hand full of times through 2 games. I guess Collins wants nobody depending on anybody else, so he's not putting the best together much. Not saying I like it, but that's the way it appears to me.

If we see rotating QB's and/or a DLine not consisting of CJ, Preston, Ryan, & Eulls/PJ....the MSU fan base will erupt in anger if we lose.
09-08-2014, 01:13 PM
starkvegasdawg

Quote:

Originally Posted by CadaverDawg

If we see rotating QB's and/or a DLine not consisting of CJ, Preston, Ryan, & Eulls/PJ....the MSU fan base will erupt in anger if we lose.

I'll erupt if we win. The coaches job is to put the team in the best position to win week in and week out. Playing with the lineup like this does not give us that chance. If they want to experiment - fine. Do it in practice. Mullen seems to think kicking well in practice counts. Why shouldn't wholesale substitutions count then too?
09-08-2014, 01:19 PM
BrunswickDawg

Quote:

Originally Posted by 1bigdawg

30 would be great, but did we drop a couple of games?

Bad math skills are the reason I was a History Major. 36 sacks - 16 more than last year
09-08-2014, 01:19 PM
archdog

In Dan we Trust, right guys. Get off of his back about it. Who here has been part of a National Championship NCAA coaching staff? Let Mullen do what he wants.

It's cool for the late Sat or Sun conversation, but it's a new week now. Let this crap go until Saturday night. I am sure Mullen has goals in mind for his substitutions and he also has privileged information about the team's health. We have beat this dead horse. Let's start discussing the many positives so far. Morrow, Bear, etc.
09-08-2014, 01:45 PM
gravedigger

So we r rushing 4 and two corners are on islands vs 2 wr's. The qb and 6 f ing linemen make 9 offensive players we don't have to cover or already are.

ThAt leaves 5 defensive players covering 2 players I'd say dropping two safeties is the smart move once you've been burned 3-4 f ing times.

We are getting suckered into over covering the midrange pass/run. Why put the corners on an island and even risk it?
09-08-2014, 01:49 PM
CadaverDawg

Quote:

Originally Posted by gravedigger

So we r rushing 4 and two corners are on islands vs 2 wr's. The qb and 6 f ing linemen make 9 offensive players we don't have to cover or already are.

ThAt leaves 5 defensive players covering 2 players I'd say dropping two safeties is the smart move once you've been burned 3-4 f ing times.

We are getting suckered into over covering the midrange pass/run. Why put the corners on an island and even risk it?

My guess...the same reason we rotate QB's in the first quarter. As a test, and for experience/practice. Makes no sense to me
09-08-2014, 01:59 PM
shoeless joe

Pressure is not an issue. UAB went to a max protect on most of their big plays and we still got decent push.

I think AJ has shown some great things so far...I wouldn't mind seeing him on first string along with Chris jones, but I don't think you take r brown out either. We have enough talent on the line to pull of the subbing.
09-08-2014, 02:55 PM
War Machine Dawg

Quote:

Originally Posted by CadaverDawg

And you're complaining about it

No shit. I'll say right now, without any hesitation or reservation, I think we have the best front 7 in college football. That alone will win a boatload of games. Ask Bama.
09-08-2014, 03:00 PM
War Machine Dawg

Quote:

Originally Posted by shoeless joe

Pressure is not an issue. UAB went to a max protect on most of their big plays and we still got decent push.

I think AJ has shown some great things so far...I wouldn't mind seeing him on first string along with Chris jones, but I don't think you take r brown out either. We have enough talent on the line to pull of the subbing.

Exactly. Our DL can be subbed as an entire unit like we did in '99. There's little or no drop off for our first 9 up front. People are freaking out over the tiniest issues right now. We really need SEC play to hurry up and start. Until then, EVERYTHING is speculation because Mullen is treating these non-con games like NFL Preseason.
09-08-2014, 03:38 PM
HoopsDawg

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tdawg

Not really complaining about it--just wanting to discuss how we get better at the one thing we don't appear to be upper-eschelon at. Seriously, I think it's the only thing right now keeping our D from being the best in the SEC. I'm obviously nitpicking.

Recruit better D-Ends. That's it. We have lost a lot of recruiting battles at this spot. Z. Smith starts for UK, Elijiah Daniels starts for AU, CJ Johnson starts for Ole Miss. These are all productive players that would have made an impact opposite P. Smith.
09-08-2014, 03:43 PM
CadaverDawg

Quote:

Originally Posted by HoopsDawg

Recruit better D-Ends. That's it. We have lost a lot of recruiting battles at this spot. Z. Smith starts for UK, Elijiah Daniels starts for AU, CJ Johnson starts for Ole Miss. These are all productive players that would have made an impact opposite P. Smith.

I agree to an extent, but we also won battles like McPhee, Autry, and Chris Jones. AJ Jefferson was heavily recruited by OM, and Ryan Brown may wind up as good as any of them.