Sunday Night Thoughts-We May Have Found A QB Between The Hedges Pt. 2

An encouraging day between the hedges yesterday sans the final score. We put together drives and had really solid effort all day, outside of the Lanier play.

1. We have something in MVB. I am not ready to crown him the heir apparent just yet and I still want to bring in Arnold if we have the opportunity, but we are not as dire at the position now as I thought we were headed into the game. MVB settled in to the game and started to show some moxie. It reminded me a little of Will Rogers going in there in 2020 and kind of establishing himself as the future of the position at State.

2. Defense is still bad, but they played with really good effort yesterday and I never thought they were out of position. Forced 2 TOs and probably should have forced at least two more.

3. I still have no clue what happened on the Lanier play. I saw today he said he thought the guy dropped the ball, but even if he did, why not just take the guy to the ground.

4. Lebby finally took the kid gloves off MVB in the 2nd half and I thought we saw him mature before our eyes. He could not hit the broad side of the barn in the 1st half from 5-15 yds, but thought in the 2nd half he settled in to the game and started finding those short crossing routes.

5. MVB can throw the deep ball, and place it, as good as any QB we have had in my lifetime. We saw it a bit last week but he consistently dropped it in the bucket yesterday.

6. Our WRs came to play yesterday and it showed. KellyA finally did what we have been expecting him to do, Traore finally played like he is capable of playing, Coleman did Coleman things, and Craver looked like his explosive self once again. We have to continue to find ways to get those guys the ball and get Mosley involved too.

7. Our run game was a disappointment at times yesterday but opened up once Lebby turned MVB loose. I still think Daniels needs to be RB1 going forward but thought Booth actually looked for the holes yesterday and made a nice catch on the 4th down TD.

8. Kirby Smart and the officials can go kick 17 rocks. If that was Lebby, they would have flagged him, fined him, and tried to suspend him this week. Kirby gets to laugh about it.

9. I thought our line looked good in spurts yesterday and for the most part protected MVB well. Like I said, run game was not where it has been, but I would not hate rolling with that group going forward and keeping Work out there at LT

10. 12 million can buy you a lot, it still cannot buy you a win in Tiger Stadium.

11. I like where we are trending and think 4-8 or even 5-7 is gettable.

12. Be great to have the 14 team back this weekend and for the love of god folks, DO NOT BOO DAN.

I think the past two games are going to really pay off for MVB the rest of the season. Most of our games are at home minus Tennessee and the Egg Bowl. Tennessee can be tough but it won't be any more difficult than Georgia or Texas.

I agree that Daniels should start at RB. I think Booth is a big part of the problem with the running game. He's just not very good. If Xavier Gayten was healthy I would use him and Daniels. Even when Booth got a TD on fourth down it looked like he was about to go down and no one was around him. Thankfully he fell in the end zone because it was fourth down. We also can't run up the middle and we need to stop. Run outside or something.

You nailed it with the Kirby Smart comment. That was unacceptable if even if it was an accident. Should have been a flag at the very least.

You are right about the 12 million comment. I think LSU had the right gameplan looking at the defensive statistics. Ole Miss is almost as bad as we are at defending the pass. When the Egg Bowl comes around we need to take some shots because we should be able to hit some. The thing is LSU's QB had a bad game and if he had even been average that game is a LSU blowout. I bet we see similar game plans against Ole Miss as teams are becoming more and more analytical.

I would be pretty surprised if Dan gets booed.

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Originally Posted by Todd4State

I think the past two games are going to really pay off for MVB the rest of the season. Most of our games are at home minus Tennessee and the Egg Bowl. Tennessee can be tough but it won't be any more difficult than Georgia or Texas.

I agree that Daniels should start at RB. I think Booth is a big part of the problem with the running game. He's just not very good. If Xavier Gayten was healthy I would use him and Daniels. Even when Booth got a TD on fourth down it looked like he was about to go down and no one was around him. Thankfully he fell in the end zone because it was fourth down. We also can't run up the middle and we need to stop. Run outside or something.

You nailed it with the Kirby Smart comment. That was unacceptable if even if it was an accident. Should have been a flag at the very least.

You are right about the 12 million comment. I think LSU had the right gameplan looking at the defensive statistics. Ole Miss is almost as bad as we are at defending the pass. When the Egg Bowl comes around we need to take some shots because we should be able to hit some. The thing is LSU's QB had a bad game and if he had even been average that game is a LSU blowout. I bet we see similar game plans against Ole Miss as teams are becoming more and more analytical.

I would be pretty surprised if Dan gets booed.

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It already looks like MVB has played his way into a permanent starting position. Shapen is an injury liability at this point. I hate it but it is what it is. I still see us with Jackson Arnold b/c Oklahoma's offense is worse than ours.

If OM finishes 9-3 and misses the playoffs there are gonna be some really pissed off members of the Grove Collective. IMO, Pete Golding was the only OM coach earning his paycheck Saturday night.

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Originally Posted by TrapGame

It already looks like MVB has played his way into a permanent starting position. Shapen is an injury liability at this point. I hate it but it is what it is. I still see us with Jackson Arnold b/c Oklahoma's offense is worse than ours.

If OM finishes 9-3 and misses the playoffs there are gonna be some really pissed off members of the Grove Collective. IMO, Pete Golding was the only OM coach earning his paycheck Saturday night.

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I mean go read Twitter or an OM message board right now or any time since Kyren Lacy caught that pass Saturday night. They are pissed. And honestly, rightfully so. When you have a coach bring in THAT MUCH TALENT, call it The Last Dance, constantly call out the fans for not staying or not donating enough, AND THEN YOU LOSE.......Lane deserves every bit of hate he will get for the next 11 days. And Walker Jones deserves to lose every dollar that was donated. Btw, go read some of the stuff people were posting about him. I mean damn, he was the 3rd most hated person in Oxford Saturday night. Right behind Kiffin and the RB coach.

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Originally Posted by TrapGame

It already looks like MVB has played his way into a permanent starting position. Shapen is an injury liability at this point. I hate it but it is what it is. I still see us with Jackson Arnold b/c Oklahoma's offense is worse than ours.

If OM finishes 9-3 and misses the playoffs there are gonna be some really pissed off members of the Grove Collective. IMO, Pete Golding was the only OM coach earning his paycheck Saturday night.

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MVB came on strong and glad to have him for the rest of the season. How it plays out after that, who knows.

That has been part of the problem with our fanbase. MSU fans fall in love with a player and want to anoint them as the savior for the rest of their career. And sometimes it just doesn't work out. QBs can regress, or god forbid, somebody better just comes along or the player leaves on their own. It happens all over the college football landscape. Look at Will Howard. He led Kansas State to a 9-4 record finishing in the top 25 and took the money to go to Ohio State. Riley Leonard left Duke, Cam Ward left Washington State. There is no loyalty. These guys left GOOD teams in major conferences to go play for one of the bigger boys.

We have got to learn, as a fanbase, to support the TEAM and not get too caught up in the individual player. That is especially going to be true going forward in the NIL world of college football. These guys aren't loyal to the school colors near as much as you are as a FAN.

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Originally Posted by RockyDog

MVB came on strong and glad to have him for the rest of the season. How it plays out after that, who knows.

That has been part of the problem with our fanbase. MSU fans fall in love with a player and want to anoint them as the savior for the rest of their career. And sometimes it just doesn't work out. QBs can regress, or god forbid, somebody better just comes along or the player leaves on their own. It happens all over the college football landscape. Look at Will Howard. He led Kansas State to a 9-4 record finishing in the top 25 and took the money to go to Ohio State. Riley Leonard left Duke, Cam Ward left Washington State. There is no loyalty. These guys left GOOD teams in major conferences to go play for one of the bigger boys.

We have got to learn, as a fanbase, to support the TEAM and not get too caught up in the individual player. That is especially going to be true going forward in the NIL world of college football. These guys aren't loyal to the school colors near as much as you are as a FAN.

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Thanks for the PSA, Scooter.

And that's exactly why Lebby will probably bring in Arnold. It's about winning not coddling feelings.

Ok, so is Dan a special guest this weekend or he calling the game?

While I hated the way he left, we do need to embrace him at this point. He can be a great spokesman for us going forward in the media as he promotes himself and what he did at MSU. In the end it is good for MSU. MSU was Dan's crowning achievement in college football.

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Originally Posted by R2Dawg

Ok, so is Dan a special guest this weekend or he calling the game?

While I hated the way he left, we do need to embrace him at this point. He can be a great spokesman for us going forward in the media as he promotes himself and what he did at MSU. In the end it is good for MSU. MSU was Dan's crowning achievement in college football.

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I'd love for Dan to be calling the game too. And we somehow beat A&M. That would be awesome. Dan gets honored, reminisces about his State tenure in the booth while watching us beat A&M.

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Originally Posted by RockyDog

MVB came on strong and glad to have him for the rest of the season. How it plays out after that, who knows.

That has been part of the problem with our fanbase. MSU fans fall in love with a player and want to anoint them as the savior for the rest of their career. And sometimes it just doesn't work out. QBs can regress, or god forbid, somebody better just comes along or the player leaves on their own. It happens all over the college football landscape. Look at Will Howard. He led Kansas State to a 9-4 record finishing in the top 25 and took the money to go to Ohio State. Riley Leonard left Duke, Cam Ward left Washington State. There is no loyalty. These guys left GOOD teams in major conferences to go play for one of the bigger boys.

We have got to learn, as a fanbase, to support the TEAM and not get too caught up in the individual player. That is especially going to be true going forward in the NIL world of college football. These guys aren't loyal to the school colors near as much as you are as a FAN.

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AGREED. Every fan base does it but it seems ours takes it to a new level. I mean I get appreciating the players but our fan base sometimes idolizes players. It's really bad with baseball, but it happens in every sport.

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Originally Posted by TrapGame

I'd love for Dan to be calling the game too. And we somehow beat A&M. That would be awesome. Dan gets honored, reminisces about his State tenure in the booth while watching us beat A&M.

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He will just be a guest. They are honoring the entire 14 team so it will be good to have all those guys in town. Mullen and Dak have both confirmed they will be there so I imagine the rest of the team will follow suit. I do not know if it is planned but I do hope they do something to honor De’Runnya.

If MVB finishes season off good I would not bring in another QB.

Unless you want that other QB over MVB.

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Originally Posted by cheewgumm

If MVB finishes season off good I would not bring in another QB.

Unless you want that other QB over MVB.

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In this day and age, you have to be looking to upgrade every position. If it pisses off MVB then he'll either transfer or step his game up. That will also tell me what kind of competitor we have. Hell Kiffin brought in a 3 year starter to compete with Dart after a year and you know what happened? Dart stepped up and won the job. If MVB is the type of QB everyone says he is, he will step up and invite the competition. If he's not, then I don't want him because there's a ceiling where he will take us.

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Originally Posted by StarkVegasSteve

He will just be a guest. They are honoring the entire 14 team so it will be good to have all those guys in town. Mullen and Dak have both confirmed they will be there so I imagine the rest of the team will follow suit. I do not know if it is planned but I do hope they do something to honor De’Runnya.

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If I could, I would be there Saturday. I hope the crowd is big and gives the type of response that '14 team deserves.

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Originally Posted by cheewgumm

If MVB finishes season off good I would not bring in another QB.

Unless you want that other QB over MVB.

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You have too nowadays. If Jackson Arnold wants to come to State to play for Lebby, you take him. We need quality depth with healthy competition.

Is that Oklahoma QB an upgrade?

So we have a QB that ia coming into his own and rolling a s we are gonna bring in someone who failed elsewhere.

And if our good QB does not like it our response is F him? In which case we would then have the failed QB instead of our good one?

In this day and age where they can transfer easily and he would be a hot pick up for a lot of teams.

I would not do that. I would see how MVB finishes first though.

10. Does the loss to LSU mean that ole miss has to give their trophy back? I mean listening to them all summer and fall it was not a question IF they were going to make the playoffs it was how deep of a run they were going to make and would be playing for the national championship. Well, well how things have changed. They burned a lot of $$’s just to go play in the weed whacker bowl.

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Originally Posted by cheewgumm

Is that Oklahoma QB an upgrade?

So we have a QB that ia coming into his own and rolling a s we are gonna bring in someone who failed elsewhere.

And if our good QB does not like it our response is F him? In which case we would then have the failed QB instead of our good one?

In this day and age where they can transfer easily and he would be a hot pick up for a lot of teams.

I would not do that. I would see how MVB finishes first though.

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These kids are being paid to play. You can't really care if it upsets him. This is a problem with our fan base, we want to idolize players after one performance. We did with Rogers, we did it Thompson, with did it with Dam Williams. This is the new age. If they don't want to compete, then leave. We all talk about this is the NFL, well hell, treat it like that. If he doesn't want to compete then yes, you pack his bags for him. Also, how do we know Arnold would fail? Burrow couldn't see the field at OSU he was so down the depth chart. Murray couldn't stay on the field at A&M. You have to make your team better these days. And if that kid makes us better, then you go get him. You have to stockpile talent to compete. Again, like I have said repeatedly, don't overpay for the kid if Van Buren looks good down the stretch. But don't just stick with the kid because he started for you this year and is a Freshman. Hell a lot people don't realize, or want to bury their head in the sand to the fact that, Leach wanted to replace Rogers at the end of 20. That's why Abraham was brought in. Of course then the freak injury happened and he was never able to play for us. The point is, if a coach thinks a kid can make you better, you have to go get him. End of Story.

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Originally Posted by StarkVegasSteve

AGREED. Every fan base does it but it seems ours takes it to a new level. I mean I get appreciating the players but our fan base sometimes idolizes players. It's really bad with baseball, but it happens in every sport.

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Ha we do the opposite too. Many said they saw enough of MVB after the third drive and wanted Parson in

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Originally Posted by StarkVegasSteve

These kids are being paid to play. You can't really care if it upsets him. This is a problem with our fan base, we want to idolize players after one performance. We did with Rogers, we did it Thompson, with did it with Dam Williams. This is the new age. If they don't want to compete, then leave. We all talk about this is the NFL, well hell, treat it like that. If he doesn't want to compete then yes, you pack his bags for him. Also, how do we know Arnold would fail? Burrow couldn't see the field at OSU he was so down the depth chart. Murray couldn't stay on the field at A&M. You have to make your team better these days. And if that kid makes us better, then you go get him. You have to stockpile talent to compete. Again, like I have said repeatedly, don't overpay for the kid if Van Buren looks good down the stretch. But don't just stick with the kid because he started for you this year and is a Freshman. Hell a lot people don't realize, or want to bury their head in the sand to the fact that, Leach wanted to replace Rogers at the end of 20. That's why Abraham was brought in. Of course then the freak injury happened and he was never able to play for us. The point is, if a coach thinks a kid can make you better, you have to go get him. End of Story.

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I dont care if it upsets them.

My goal is not to run off a good QB, replacing him with a worse QB. If Arnold is better than MVB, great, bring him in.

The end of my stance.

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Originally Posted by cheewgumm

I dont care if it upsets them.

My goal is not to run off a good QB, replacing him with a worse QB. If Arnold is better than MVB, great, bring him in.

The end of my stance.

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So, Lebby shouldn't bring in a 5* QB he recruited to Oklahoma b/c he wants to come play for him at State?

Littrell is the problem at Oklahoma, not Jackson Arnold.

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Originally Posted by TrapGame

So, Lebby shouldn't bring in a 5* QB he recruited to Oklahoma b/c he wants to come play for him at State?

Littrell is the problem at Oklahoma, not Jackson Arnold.

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Again, our fan base gets too caught up in kids. He had a good game and now we're acting like he's the second coming. A list of Mississippi State QBs that had good games and ended up nothing burgers: Aries Nelson, Kyle York, Josh Riddell, Damian Williams, Keyteon Thompson, Tommy Stevens, KJ Costello.....the list could go on.

Is the kid good? Yes. Is he still REALLY raw? Yes. He can throw the deep ball really well, but you can ask anyone around the program and most thought he wouldn't be ready to take the reigns until his RS Sophomore season.

If you HAVE THE CHANCE to bring in Arnold, you do it. If you have the chance to bring in Preston Stone at SMU, you do it. If you have the chance to bring in Emmett Brown at SJSU, you do it. If you have a chance to increase the talent on your team, YOU DO IT. Period. End of Discussion. I mean should we tell Kamario Taylor to look elsewhere because Van Buren looked good? No. It's the same situation with a transfer.

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Originally Posted by StarkVegasSteve

Again, our fan base gets too caught up in kids. He had a good game and now we're acting like he's the second coming. A list of Mississippi State QBs that had good games and ended up nothing burgers: Aries Nelson, Kyle York, Josh Riddell, Damian Williams, Keyteon Thompson, Tommy Stevens, KJ Costello.....the list could go on.

Is the kid good? Yes. Is he still REALLY raw? Yes. He can throw the deep ball really well, but you can ask anyone around the program and most thought he wouldn't be ready to take the reigns until his RS Sophomore season.

If you HAVE THE CHANCE to bring in Arnold, you do it. If you have the chance to bring in Preston Stone at SMU, you do it. If you have the chance to bring in Emmett Brown at SJSU, you do it. If you have a chance to increase the talent on your team, YOU DO IT. Period. End of Discussion. I mean should we tell Kamario Taylor to look elsewhere because Van Buren looked good? No. It's the same situation with a transfer.

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I'm not "caught up in the kids".

Our fanbase is usually right about stuff, so I'll trust it....again.

Welcome aboard, Arnold. goodbye MVB.

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Originally Posted by cheewgumm

I'm not "caught up in the kids".

Our fanbase is usually right about stuff, so I'll trust it....again.

Welcome aboard, Arnold. goodbye MVB.

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I don't think MVB transfers. He was literally committed to Oregon and decommitted to come play for Lebby. Arnold, Stone, Mateer, Brown, etc. is only going to be here one year. You still get MVB as a RS Sophomore just like the plan always was. Nothing has changed. And hey, the kid may beat Arnold, Stone, Mateer, Brown, etc. out. Or hell, Kamario Taylor could come in and beat them both out.

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Originally Posted by cheewgumm

I'm not "caught up in the kids".

Our fanbase is usually right about stuff, so I'll trust it....again.

Welcome aboard, Arnold. goodbye MVB.

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If MVB can't take Arnold, or any other QB, coming in then he ain't it. Nobody should be guaranteed a spot. You work your ass off for it every day.

Sounds good. Hopefully we have a new 5 star qb.

Cowboys should sign Tom Brady as well. Dak needs some competition. It would do him good.

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Originally Posted by StarkVegasSteve

Again, our fan base gets too caught up in kids. He had a good game and now we're acting like he's the second coming. A list of Mississippi State QBs that had good games and ended up nothing burgers: Aries Nelson, Kyle York, Josh Riddell, Damian Williams, Keyteon Thompson, Tommy Stevens, KJ Costello.....the list could go on.

Is the kid good? Yes. Is he still REALLY raw? Yes. He can throw the deep ball really well, but you can ask anyone around the program and most thought he wouldn't be ready to take the reigns until his RS Sophomore season.

If you HAVE THE CHANCE to bring in Arnold, you do it. If you have the chance to bring in Preston Stone at SMU, you do it. If you have the chance to bring in Emmett Brown at SJSU, you do it. If you have a chance to increase the talent on your team, YOU DO IT. Period. End of Discussion. I mean should we tell Kamario Taylor to look elsewhere because Van Buren looked good? No. It's the same situation with a transfer.

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All of this!

Just hope Kamario Taylor signs with Us. he can do it all. 6'4" 215 now. can run and throw.

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Originally Posted by tcdog70

Just hope Kamario Taylor signs with Us. he can do it all. 6'4" 215 now. can run and throw.

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He's locked in. Jeff took care of that one.

I've seen him live the past 2years but only on video this season and he simply does some things that are almost not human. I think he's a once in about every 40 yr type athlete who will make a different the moment he steps onto the field.

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Originally Posted by StarkVegasSteve

Again, our fan base gets too caught up in kids. He had a good game and now we're acting like he's the second coming. A list of Mississippi State QBs that had good games and ended up nothing burgers: Aries Nelson, Kyle York, Josh Riddell, Damian Williams, Keyteon Thompson, Tommy Stevens, KJ Costello.....the list could go on.

Is the kid good? Yes. Is he still REALLY raw? Yes. He can throw the deep ball really well, but you can ask anyone around the program and most thought he wouldn't be ready to take the reigns until his RS Sophomore season.

If you HAVE THE CHANCE to bring in Arnold, you do it. If you have the chance to bring in Preston Stone at SMU, you do it. If you have the chance to bring in Emmett Brown at SJSU, you do it. If you have a chance to increase the talent on your team, YOU DO IT. Period. End of Discussion. I mean should we tell Kamario Taylor to look elsewhere because Van Buren looked good? No. It's the same situation with a transfer.

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Had to look up Nelson since I haven't heard of him but when did Kyle York have a good game? The others I can see but York is an odd one. Omarr Conner maybe.

Didn't York play only due to Fant being suspended?

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Originally Posted by cheewgumm

Sounds good. Hopefully we have a new 5 star qb.

Cowboys should sign Tom Brady as well. Dak needs some competition. It would do him good.

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Dak doesn't need competition. He needs a supporting cast.

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Originally Posted by Matt3467

Had to look up Nelson since I haven't heard of him but when did Kyle York have a good game? The others I can see but York is an odd one. Omarr Conner maybe.

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I meant Mike Henig. Sorry for that one. Got my early 2000s MSU QBs mixed up on that one. Also did y'all know it was Henig and not Hening? I've been saying Hening for the last like 16 or 17 years.

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Originally Posted by Matt3467

Had to look up Nelson since I haven't heard of him but when did Kyle York have a good game? The others I can see but York is an odd one. Omarr Conner maybe.

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Didn't York have a good game against Ark or someone like that?

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Originally Posted by StarkVegasSteve

I meant Mike Henig. Sorry for that one. Got my early 2000s MSU QBs mixed up on that one. Also did y'all know it was Henig and not Hening? I've been saying Hening for the last like 16 or 17 years.

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Those years really take me back. Boy did we suck but I enjoyed watching us anyway.

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Originally Posted by Tbonewannabe

Didn't York have a good game against Ark or someone like that?

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Looking at the game logs here: https://www.sports-reference.com/cfb...ork-1/gamelog/

Maybe the Memphis game although he did have a career high 2td passes in a loss vs Ark that year.

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Originally Posted by Matt3467

Those years really take me back. Boy did we suck but I enjoyed watching us anyway.

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To this day I don't know how I did that sober. We were AWFUL. Like offensive ineptitude the SEC hasn't seen since.

Didn't York start b/c Mike Henig got hurt and he actually could make a forward pass that wasn't intercepted or five yards off target?

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Originally Posted by cheewgumm

Sounds good. Hopefully we have a new 5 star qb.

Cowboys should sign Tom Brady as well. Dak needs some competition. It would do him good.

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You are seriously equating a NFL QB that his team has committed $200+ mm to a QB room at a lower tier SEC school with a true frosh Qb who has 2 whole starts under his belt?

We REALLY do have one of the dumbest fan bases in Murica

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Originally Posted by TrapGame

Didn't York start b/c Mike Henig got hurt and he actually could make a forward pass that wasn't intercepted or five yards off target?

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When I say I've tried to block out 2002-2008 from my mind I mean it. Unfortunately I have almost a photographic memory so I'll never be able to get Maine, Cadillac and Ronnie Brown running all over us, Pat White and Steve Slaton running all over us, 3-2, or Troy State out of my head.