I think that may be why this is taking so long. He wants to find someone who could cause issues for his offense thus cause issues for the new Bama & LSU offenses. There just ain't a ton of those available.Quote:
Originally Posted by ShotgunDawg
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I think that may be why this is taking so long. He wants to find someone who could cause issues for his offense thus cause issues for the new Bama & LSU offenses. There just ain't a ton of those available.Quote:
Originally Posted by ShotgunDawg
Well we started workouts this morning and from all accounts it was a wake up call for a lot of them. T shirts and shorts sucked at 20 degrees this morningQuote:
Originally Posted by OLJWales
The new S&C coach actually made them wear T shirts and shorts outside?? I like it.Quote:
Originally Posted by BuckyIsAB****
I saw Banks tweet that he liked what he heard from the S&C program this morning so I’m assuming that’s what he was talking about. I like it!! Kick their asses and get em in SEC shape!Quote:
Originally Posted by BuckyIsAB****
Brown is a badass. Leach knows what it takes to compete and it starts in January. He is a big S&C guyQuote:
Originally Posted by dawgday166
Well that just sounds dumb. Newberry needed to interview in Key West and on campus before he could figure out he didn't want to live in rural MS? Can he not look at a map and see where Starkville is located? If that was the reason, seems he could have told Leach that right off the bat before wasting everyone's time.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bothrops
Better hope not, because as of today every position filled that I know of is either a WSU bring along guy or Tony Hughes. We haven't hired anyone else that I know of and there are maybe 2 positions to fill (DC and LB coach).Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain Falcon
I think this may spook some of the big dawgs off. But Leach's coaching tree speaks for itself. He knows what he is doingQuote:
Originally Posted by maroonmania
Quick dumbass question for those who are aware of what's happening these days in Vegas.
What type of grocery options are there in Vegas for fresh seafood and shit? Nothing but frozen shit at Walmart?
Also, the casino in Philly, Silver Star. Do they still have that 4 star restaurant that allows unadulterated gluttony in seafood consumption? top notch shit and such? I did pay those guys a visit back in the late 90's and it was 1st rate.
What? He and the staff have been hitting the trail, meeting recruits and commits, extending a lot of offers...they are putting a lot of stock in recruiting.Quote:
Originally Posted by GreenheadDawg
Then they would have really hated playing baseball for the IB. I remember during pre-game warmups for one of the early season games, our guys were on the field practicing taking leads and diving back to the base and were kicking up water when they would dive and it was like 37 degrees out there. I've always wondered what was going through the other team's mind as they were bundled up in their dugout. I'm betting it was "We're about to get our asses kicked by these crazy mo-fos!"Quote:
Originally Posted by BuckyIsAB****
McBath may be one of the reasons we can't get a DC to commit to us.Quote:
Originally Posted by BuckyIsAB****
Word on the street at WSU was that he doesn't play well with others.
https://www.seattletimes.com/sports/...s-resignation/
Quote:
Halliday, still well-connected within the Cougars football program, said on a podcast episode that was published Tuesday. "They were at each other's throat like every day and after the UCLA game, Darcel, in the middle of practice, was just questioning everything Claeys was doing. So finally Claeys said, 'If you don't like the way I'm running things, I'll (expletive) leave.' Claeys called him on everyone's bluff and nothing changed."
This ain't good....at all. Just don't understand why Leach wouldn't take the assistant pool and go with a fresh start on D. At least hire the DC first!! Other than keeping Hughes of course.Quote:
Originally Posted by OneWhoWas
Or you have a disgruntled player talking crap. The DC was fired for sucking, not fights with other coaches. He gave up a 30 point lead and lost to UCLA by letting them score 67. Not buying the other crapQuote:
Originally Posted by HoopsDawg
And yet the DL coach Phelps, who coached under Claeys for years at Minn, has no problem staying with this staff including McBath and coming here. Word is the whole staff was having issues with his complex strategies for games and questioning him. They believed they needed to simplify the scheme and have players attacking more.Quote:
Originally Posted by OneWhoWas
Yeah watching how bad the WSU defense was this year you can see how one might question the DCs plans and execution.Quote:
Originally Posted by Really Clark?
Kinda sound like the JoMo of DC's lol
That's payback for me going to the Music City Bowl and having to watch that "effort" from the team.Quote:
Originally Posted by BuckyIsAB****
I feel like I'm even with them now.
Well Starkville isn't that bad honestly first of all. The reputation of Starkville as a college town is growing and it keeps getting better and better. I'm not sure what all we would do for a DC but a housing allowance and use of a private plane probably isn't out of the question if we feel like the guy is good enough to warrant it. I would imagine that a majority of the head coaches in the SEC either have a vacation home or just work in whatever college town they are employed in. As much as coordinators are starting to get paid it's only a matter of time before it's the same for them too.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bothrops
We don't need to worry about "optics". We need to worry about getting the best coach here. What did the "optics" look like when Napier and Judge turned us down....and then what are the "optics" now that we have hired Leach? Worrying about optics is how programs end up like Ole Miss.Quote:
Originally Posted by msstate7
Still plenty of good DC options out there. If a guy turns us down I'm not worried about it because I would rather have someone here that wants to be here and is OK with the set-up rather than have someone that doesn't fit or isn't happy. That applies beyond football when you're talking about jobs. Napier is a good example- I think now that we have kind of vetted out the process and can look back and how everything went down most are pretty happy with Leach and to me it sounds like Napier wasn't the best fit for us. Most likely would have ended up like Dan Mullen where we have a coach that would look to leave as soon as he had any kind of success here. Another example that comes to mind is Croom. I remember hearing that LT basically had to beg him to take our job and I believe Croom's daughter talked him into taking our job. The result was a guy that didn't really want to be here and looked down on us when compared to Alabama which automatically limited our ceiling because the buy in wasn't there at the head coaching level. That's what can happen with a bad fit.
It sounds to me like Newberry just wasn't a good fit for both. Doesn't make him bad- just means he doesn't fit. Honestly it's a little risky as far as chemistry to bring in a bunch of Leach guys and then a bunch of Newberry guys. Could have very well become offense vs defense sort of like the Bears had with Mike Ditka and Buddy Ryan. I know that worked out in 1985 but it's a recipe for division which usually doesn't work out.
Personally I would bring in Bateman because IMO he's the best fit for us. If that doesn't work out I ask Rocky Long to come in which I think will work at least short term because of his age but he also has head coaching experience and I think if he's given autonomy like Leach would do he would be very good here.
The other thing to remember here as far as optics go- Leach is obviously going to handle most of this from Key West. We're probably talking to people that our insiders have no clue about. They can't just show up to Harvey's and oh look there's Jay Bateman or whoever. The other thing is after the Egg Bowl Cohen has obviously put things on lock down as far as info getting out. The Napier stuff getting out created a lot of ill will when Moorhead was retained after the Egg Bowl. And may have interfered down the line as well. And then the media has been basically pretty limited since Horka's hit piece on Michael Story in August. In other words there's probably not a lot of info getting out right now. I'm guessing we'll hire someone in about a week or so though. I'll just have to endure the meltdown in the meantime- heck, we had people upset that our head coaching search lasted five days or whatever it was because Cohen "didn't have someone in place ready to go". Should be fun.**
Leach was going to have to find a new DC either way. I'm haven't heard if Roc Bellantoni is going to be on staff yet? I wonder if he wants the DC job and Leach wants someone else.Quote:
Originally Posted by Really Clark?
Three things:Quote:
Originally Posted by OneWhoWas
1) This interview was refuted by others, including staff and former players. After scoring 63 and losing, the coaches should be figuring it out intensely, but other reports denied any personal or abnormal bickering.
2) Connor Halliday had been out of the program for 5 years and has a history of me-first attention seeking interviews. Grain of salt is needed.
3) Tracy Claes dropped down to position coach at his next stop at UVA. If a DC position had been on offer anywhere, gotta assume he would have taken it. That does not speak to unfair treatment at WSU.
We should be careful as State fans reading too much into these types of sound bit s with the full story, especially when it is readily available.
Seems like that guy might be Rocky Long if that is what he is looking for.Quote:
Originally Posted by dawgday166
How do you think State fans would react to that hire? The first take optics might be that we missed and settled (that may be the perception on any hire that is not a household name now after the Newberry saga). But, on the other hand, the 3-3-5 was ahead of its time in many ways and the defense popularized by Joe Lee Dunn coming home 20 years later is an attractive prospect. I wonder if he might even be a candidate for an emeritus type consultant role off the field if Long were the pick.
So then give us the list of names you would be satisfied with.Quote:
Originally Posted by BuckyIsAB****
So you're concerned he isn't putting much stock in defense because it's taking longer than you would like?Quote:
Originally Posted by GreenheadDawg
If anything, that indicates a thorough process, one that is being taken seriously. If we just immediately brought someone in, that might indicate it wasn't being taken as seriously. It wouldn't lead to this insane pout fest from the fanbase, but it wouldn't necessarily indicate a better process.
And LOL on the people upset that he's bringing a couple guys from WSU. Sure, those guys were on a staff that didn't produce a very good defense this year. They were also on the staff that produced maybe the best defense Leach has ever had that helped Washington freaking State finish in the top 10.
What about Tim DeRuyter at Cal? What's opinions on him?
Got the PAC12 connection to Leach. He's had some solid defenses with a couple of mediocre ones mixed in but he's got tons of DC experience plus some SEC experience. But he already makes $800k though & he's from California.
At Cal the last 3 years: 2019= 32nd scoring defense (21.9 PPG), 2018= 22nd scoring defense (20.1 PPG), 2017= 78th scoring defense (28.4 PPG)
At A&M for 2 years: 2011= 70th scoring defense (28.2 PPG), 2010= 34th scoring defense (21.9 PPG)
At Air Force for 3 years: 2009= 10th scoring defense (15.7 PPG), 2008= 42nd scoring defense (22.2 PPG), 2007= 23rd scoring defense (21.1 PPG)
Just a name to throw out there.
Would be a home run hire and a good fit. Has head coaching experience so he should be able to handle the autonomy part well.Quote:
Originally Posted by HailStateSZN19
Rosie threw out the name Zach Arnett to keep an eye on this morning. Been SDSU's DC/LB the last 2 years learning under Rocky Long. Played at New Mexico under Rocky as well. Got hired as Syracuse's DC not too long ago this month.
Main concern there has to be how much of the defense the last 2 seasons has Arnett actually run? I would imagine Rocky does most of the heavy lifting there right? They had the #2 scoring defense in the country this year at SDSU.
Bateman turned down our job as well. Sounds like our main targets aren't interested.
Quote:
Originally Posted by GreenheadDawg
If CML wasn't putting much stock in defense then he would have given all his defensive staff a good raise to come here, and then call it a day. CML wants to win here period. He wants the coaches around him who he thinks gives him the best opportunity to that. He also wants the best players, on the field, who he feels will also give him the best chance to win whether that be a freshman, senior, a player from the transfer portal, etc. So CML knows you need to have a good defense in the SEC to accomplish what he wants, our coaches want, our administration wants, and our fan base wants.
Well this is getting disappointing. We're on at least 3rd choice nowQuote:
Originally Posted by KOdawg1
It's pretty sad. That's why I wish Leach would have found a DC and let him make the staff hires. No big-time DC is going to agree to come here with half of his staff already assembled with guys he may or may not know from a shitty defense.Quote:
Originally Posted by msstate7
I doubt that's the reason.Quote:
Originally Posted by KOdawg1
My guess is DCs are hesitant to work for Leach. It would be interesting to see if he's always had a little trouble finding a DC.
I realize how MSU have the inferiority complex of thinking this is about us, but it may be more about Leach.
either way, hopefully he just finds the right guy. Mullen changed almost every year. We'll be fine
Quote:
Originally Posted by KOdawg1
DC's do not make all the staff hires on the defensive side, whether some on this board think they do or should. They may have some input, but the final call is the HC's decision. They may bring one or two coaches with them. The HC is the one who has the overall ultimate responsibility for wins. The problem with WSU's defense was their DC and he was let go.
RelaxQuote:
Originally Posted by KOdawg1
This.Quote:
Originally Posted by yjnkdawg
We'll be fine. I honestly feel like DCs are a dime a dozen. Just have to avoid the Sirmon type hire.
I mean, Dave Aranda just got a head coaching job with the 31st ranked defense that had NFL personnel at every position
This is the latest red herring people have decided to come up with. No defensive coordinator has the authority to make his own staff hires. Todd Grantham didn’t make his own staff hires when he was hired. Neither did Bob Shoop. Neither did Manny Diaz, Geoff Collins, Chris Wilson, and Carl Torbush.Quote:
Originally Posted by KOdawg1
It simply doesn’t happen. Guess what. When LSU hires a defensive coordinator, that person is also not going to make all the defensive staff hires.
Agree. Take Shoop for example. When he had NFL talent all over the field he was number 1 in the nation. When he didn't we were 73 in the nation. Just get someone that halfway knows what they are doing. As stated, just don't make a Sirmon hire.Quote:
Originally Posted by ShotgunDawg
4thQuote:
Originally Posted by msstate7
It was just a matter of time for some on here. So here we go again I guess. :(
https://media.giphy.com/media/xTiIzL...RYrK/giphy.gif
Yeah. There is a needed competence level that you can't go below.Quote:
Originally Posted by msudawg1200
I feel like there are 3 levels of DCs.
1. Saban, Belichick, Rhule, Venables, etc. This level is small & these guys make a big difference. Although Clemson & Bama gave up more points to LSU than us.
2. About 90% of DCs. Competent. Success depends almost completely on talent. Puts players in correct positions. Nothing special.
3. Peter Sirmon & Ron Cooper. They only make up about 5% of the hirable pool of candidates, but just avoid these guys.
If Leach can just land one of the 90% of average DCs along with his offense, we'll be fine & win games. Hopefully through that, he may eventually be able to hire a level 1 DC. FWIW, I'm not sure if Newberry or Bateman are of the level 1 variety. My guess is that they are not.
Doesn't matter except to fan egos. In which in this case, it probably has more to do with the uncomfortable nature of working with Leach than it is about working at MSU.Quote:
Originally Posted by HoopsDawg