THE 2020 MSU Football Recruiting Talk Thread

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Originally Posted by justwin

If we take 5 wrs, you think we get both Adams & walley from diberville to go with ducking, Heath, and griffin?

I really think walley is a college wr star. How do you feel about him?

Adams is now a 3 star. Seems like if we throw 30+ tds this year to convince him to come, he was commuted once before. Needs to witness us throw successfully

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We need Adams to not qualify and go to Co-Lin. That's our best shot at ending up with him.

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Originally Posted by SmokeyDawg

When did I miss Cole Smith transferring?

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few weeks ago

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Originally Posted by Irondawg

Alright so how concerned are we that J. Brown went to the OM cookout instead of ours when he's a commit?

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Slightly. However, there are plenty of other options at LB should he flip.

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Originally Posted by ShotgunDawg

Expecting vs hoping for are 2 different things.

I think everyone wants to know the barometer it takes to be a "contender" and that is the barometer.

If we are going to take the next step, that is the step. 10 4/5 recruits every year

And FYI, in the 2018 there were 11 teams with that profile

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So... you want us to consistently be a top 12 recruiter? I am sorry, man, but that is just not going to happen.

Bama
Clemson
UGA
LSU
Ohio State
Florida
Texas A&M
Texas
Oklahoma
Florida State
Michigan
Auburn

Those are just schools on the top of my head that have significant advantages over us. It's just not realistic to expect to outrecruit or recruit on those teams' levels consistently.

What we need to do is consistently have top 20 classes with good players at key positions that fit what a good coaching staff wants to do.

The only way to have half of our roster be 4 stars or better is to go full Hugh Freeze.

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Originally Posted by Covercorner2

So... you want us to consistently be a top 12 recruiter? I am sorry, man, but that is just not going to happen.

Bama
Clemson
UGA
LSU
Ohio State
Florida
Texas A&M
Texas
Oklahoma
Florida State
Michigan
Auburn

And so. It's just not realistic to expect to outrecruit or recruit on those teams' levels consistently.

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You don't want us too?

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Originally Posted by Covercorner2

So... you want us to consistently be a top 12 recruiter? I am sorry, man, but that is just not going to happen.

Bama
Clemson
UGA
LSU
Ohio State
Florida
Texas A&M
Texas
Oklahoma
Florida State
Michigan
Auburn

And so. It's just not realistic to expect to outrecruit or recruit on those teams' levels consistently.

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Exactly. It's not like we don't want to be one of these teams. But realistically we aren't even remotely close to the prowess of these teams.

The dollars required to get into this territory are far beyond what our university has and what our alumni are willing to shell out. People on here have said repeatedly that it's not a money issue. That's a damn lie to make themselves feel better. We will always have a ceiling unless we can find a way to put $20-30 million more into athletics per year. That's just the way it works.

Realistically we can aim for Top 20 at our current level. But it gets very exponential from that point on. The growth required to go from 20 to 15 is a lot more than the growth from 40 to 25. We are never going to recruit at those levels until we get substantial, sustainable, yearly capital investment far beyond what we do now.

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Originally Posted by ShotgunDawg

You don't want us too?

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Yes, but there are a lot of things in this world I want that I am realistic and understand I will probably never obtain.

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Originally Posted by MetEdDawg

Exactly. It's not like we don't want to be one of these teams. But realistically we aren't even remotely close to the prowess of these teams.

The dollars required to get into this territory are far beyond what our university has and what our alumni are willing to shell out. People on here have said repeatedly that it's not a money issue. That's a damn lie to make themselves feel better. We will always have a ceiling unless we can find a way to put $20-30 million more into athletics per year. That's just the way it works.

Realistically we can aim for Top 20 at our current level. But it gets very exponential from that point on. The growth required to go from 20 to 15 is a lot more than the growth from 40 to 25. We are never going to recruit at those levels until we get substantial, sustainable, yearly capital investment far beyond what we do now.

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It's not just money, though. We don't have the tradition, clout, town, state, etc. to compete. It's not a "poor old State" take, it's simply an honest take. Obviously you don't just accept those facts and throw in the towel. You work harder than the others to try to even the playing field, but you also have to be realistic. Otherwise you will never be satisfied or you end up on probation.

You can win big at Mississippi State without having top 10 classes every year. It happened in 2014. I know we lost to Ole Miss and Bama, but damn we went to the Orange Bowl and didn't nuke the program in the process...

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Originally Posted by Covercorner2

It's not just money, though. We don't have the tradition, clout, town, state, etc. to compete. It's not a "poor old State" take, it's simply an honest take. Obviously you don't just accept those facts and throw in the towel. You work harder than the others to try to even the playing field, but you also have to be realistic. Otherwise you will never be satisfied or you end up on probation.

You can win big at Mississippi State without having top 10 classes every year. It happened in 2014. I know we lost to Ole Miss and Bama, but damn we went to the Orange Bowl and didn't nuke the program in the process...

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Dude you deserve some rep! Really good take. 100% agree.

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Originally Posted by Covercorner2

It's not just money, though. We don't have the tradition, clout, town, state, etc. to compete. It's not a "poor old State" take, it's simply an honest take. Obviously you don't just accept those facts and throw in the towel. You work harder than the others to try to even the playing field, but you also have to be realistic. Otherwise you will never be satisfied or you end up on probation.

You can win big at Mississippi State without having top 10 classes every year. It happened in 2014. I know we lost to Ole Miss and Bama, but damn we went to the Orange Bowl and didn't nuke the program in the process...

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So we have to define what winning "big" is here because I think that disconnect is what is driving this conversation. Can we win 10 games recruiting like we have in the past 10 years and look to be for the immediate future (i.e. top 25 average class)? Absolutely. No question about it. Can we win the West recruiting like that? Absolutely not. It's just that simple. If everyone is ok with the fact that there is a hard ceiling on the program because of the recruiting aspect then I think that's a healthy way to view things, but if you're like me and others who strive and hope and want for more than that then it's really difficult to accept that 10 wins is the absolute best we can be. If the question is posed-"how does State win the west?"-the answer is-you have to have a roster comprised of 43+ 4/5* recruits. This isn't some crazy number people are just making up out of thin air-there's science behind it.

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Originally Posted by Pipedream

So we have to define what winning "big" is here because I think that disconnect is what is driving this conversation. Can we win 10 games recruiting like we have in the past 10 years and look to be for the immediate future (i.e. top 25 average class)? Absolutely. No question about it. Can we win the West recruiting like that? Absolutely not. It's just that simple. If everyone is ok with the fact that there is a hard ceiling on the program because of the recruiting aspect then I think that's a healthy way to view things, but if you're like me and others who strive and hope and want for more than that then it's really difficult to accept that 10 wins is the absolute best we can be. If the question is posed-"how does State win the west?"-the answer is-you have to have a roster comprised of 43+ 4/5* recruits. This isn't some crazy number people are just making up out of thin air-there's science behind it.

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Absolutely not? We were 6 points from winning the West in 2014....

But, with that said, yes, I would be OK with 10 win seasons and NY6 bowl games....

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Originally Posted by Pipedream

So we have to define what winning "big" is here because I think that disconnect is what is driving this conversation. Can we win 10 games recruiting like we have in the past 10 years and look to be for the immediate future (i.e. top 25 average class)? Absolutely. No question about it. Can we win the West recruiting like that? Absolutely not. It's just that simple. If everyone is ok with the fact that there is a hard ceiling on the program because of the recruiting aspect then I think that's a healthy way to view things, but if you're like me and others who strive and hope and want for more than that then it's really difficult to accept that 10 wins is the absolute best we can be. If the question is posed-"how does State win the west?"-the answer is-you have to have a roster comprised of 43+ 4/5* recruits. This isn't some crazy number people are just making up out of thin air-there's science behind it.

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Or you could get incredibly lucky with pretty much all your 4-stars hitting and get guys like slay, banks, McKinney, sweat, dak, Preston smith, Jenkins, etc, on the same team. Even then, we'd need need some stars to line up. So, yeah, your path is much more likely, but I think both are extreme long shots

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Originally Posted by msstate7

Or you could get incredibly lucky with pretty much all your 4-stars hitting and get guys like slay, banks, McKinney, sweat, dak, Preston smith, Jenkins, etc, on the same team. Even then, we'd need need some stars to line up. So, yeah, your path is much more likely, but I think both are extreme long shots

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At State you have a better chance of getting "lucky" with top 20-25 classes than having multiple consecutive years of top 10-12 classes (without going on probation).

Why, oh why, can our fans never be happy? Why do we hate ourselves?

I think Mullen had a great idea to offset the talent disadvantage with experience, red shirting. I hope we keep it

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Originally Posted by yjnkdawg

He will never figure out what you are referring to, Ari. Some people wonder why there was another recruiting thread created.. The reason was because a few posters hijacked this thread for their own personal agenda, and you had to scroll through so much unrelated crap to get to the actual pertinent information on 2020 MSU football recruiting.

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Where is this "other recruiting thread" you speak of? That sounds like the one I'd like to read.

We don’t have to recruit in the top 12. We have to hit on our targets at the right position. We have to have a good quarterback. We have to have good receivers. We have to be good up front on defense and adequate up front offensively. Everyone else can be masked to an extent if you are good at those positions in today’s game.

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Originally Posted by Jarius

We don’t have to recruit in the top 12. We have to hit on our targets at the right position. We have to have a good quarterback. We have to have good receivers. We have to be good up front on defense and adequate up front offensively. Everyone else can be masked to an extent if you are good at those positions in today’s game.

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Even then, we'd have to hope auburn, aTm, LSU, and Bama miss on those positions bc they'll have much better supporting casts and depth bc of recruiting success

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Originally Posted by msstate7

Even then, we'd have to hope auburn, aTm, LSU, and Bama miss on those positions bc they'll have much better supporting casts and depth bc of recruiting success

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Again, our play against 3 of those 4 schools over the past 5 years shows that they don't have a better supporting cast because of their recruiting success. They have been continually ranked higher, and yet we are 4-1 against A&M, 3-2 against Auburn and 2-3 against LSU (with 2 losses that could have been wins). So, where is this mythical proof that they are so far beyond us that we can't compete with our current recruiting? Can we improve our recruiting? Always. And Moorhead has been showing that so far.

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Originally Posted by msstate7

Even then, we'd have to hope auburn, aTm, LSU, and Bama miss on those positions bc they'll have much better supporting casts and depth bc of recruiting success

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Yes, you can be a really good team with this formula, but you aren't winning the SEC West unless you have a certain number of blue chip prospects. It hasn't been done since 2006 Arkansas and only 3 times in almost 30 years. Lighting would have to strike the same spot about 6 times in a row. The fact that everything lined up for us so well in 2014 and we still couldn't get it done just shows how near impossible it is (with the current recruiting performance). I think we are recruiting well and taking some chances on guys that have great upside, but the math/science is indisputable on what kind of raw talent it takes to win the West and if anyone is arguing against it they're essentially shaking their fist at the sun.