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Story I was told is that Errol & Murphy were loafing at practice & Arnett tore them a new one while calling them a few names. Murphy quit & Malik Heath called at Errol & put him in his place. Errol quit as well but came backQuote:
Originally Posted by DeltaChicagoDog
This story fell apart when you said Malik put Errol in his place.Quote:
Originally Posted by ShotgunDawg
That was actually the most factual part from what I heardQuote:
Originally Posted by HancockCountyDog
It’s been 5 games.. and a ****ed up college sports year since the spring ..
May it works out maybe it doesn’t... let’s get a normal year or 2 in the books and see what happens.
Look on the bright side .. if it doesn’t work out with CML , he won’t be the only one that won’t be here..
I can come up with a story too.Quote:
Originally Posted by ShotgunDawg
I had heard another name as the other one who quit, but the rest of your story is pretty much verbatim what I was told.Quote:
Originally Posted by ShotgunDawg
Damn, strongQuote:
Originally Posted by HancockCountyDog
Leach sucking and joe having a culture problem are not mutually exclusive. Both can be true.
Hancock's point is a good one though... is the drug/culture problem limited to just the offense? The defense has been good all year. The offense's drug/culture problem seemed to coincide with opposing defenses going to a 3-8Quote:
Originally Posted by confucius say
The culture problem is more that when things go south and get tough, people quit. Everybody can be positive and go hard when things are going well. Struggles reveal character. I'm not sure anyone is blaming the offense's struggles solely on culture. That'd be foolish.Quote:
Originally Posted by msstate7
The offense, culture aside, sucks bc we don't have the personnel to run the air raid (or any offense really). We have a true freshman qb who may or may not be good in time, two true freshmen rb who don't make people miss or break tackles, average (at best) receivers, and slow footed OL who can't pass block without help.
The real question is whether it is possible to get the types of players here needed to execute this system efficiently enough to go 7-5,8-4. Maybe leach can do it, but he ain't got it now regardless of culture.
I think Marks and Johnson will be good. It's kind of hard to make people miss when we won't let them get to the corner and get going. Marks has the ability to have some playmaker type runs if he could ever get into open field. It's hard to get in open field when they're the checkdown option on passes and we're running draws in the run game with a line that can't block.Quote:
Originally Posted by confucius say
Yep. About as bare an offensive cupboard as I've ever seen on almost any SEC team.Quote:
Originally Posted by confucius say
Not equating the two and dang sure didn't sniff college ball, but what you described, that's what we called practice, minus people quitting. But we were kids and most of us weren't raised or encouraged to have a voice when the adults talked. But if you're 22 or whatever and have a kid, I can see being less inclined to take sh*t off someone.Quote:
Originally Posted by ShotgunDawg
Still...Like HST said, "if you buy the ticket, take the ride." Quit when the season's over.
One thing is for sure, the guys who stick around will know who they can depend on when the chips are down and will believe in the colors they wear. A lot of these players have options and, if nothing else CML owes it to them (and fans who make $5m a year possible) to put a product on the field that will make the experience worth it. Expecting three full years or whatever to accomplish this...in 2020 SEC...looks like we'll find out the hard way if that's a grandiose/entitled expectation. It would help a lot if we looked competent in the meantime.
And yet, 632 yards and 44 points vs in game 1 before Arkansas handed out the book.Quote:
Originally Posted by dawgday166
The worst thing State did this year was beat LSU.Quote:
Originally Posted by msstate7
People would rather we lose games than admit that Leach's system may have pretty big problem.Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt3467
Its bizarre.
Bro you need to sit this one out...Quote:
Originally Posted by ShotgunDawg
We have so many things going on right now. Just to name two. We have a coach that's stuck in the 90s way of thinking and discipline who would rather be at his home in the keys than recruit, hold camps or act like he gives a shit about players. So much more I could say about this
Two we have a micromanager as an AD who is also pushing a narrative right now and dividing the Ath dept as a whole.
Your story isn't true
agree with this. that first game we didn't have those issues. the issues started after they figured us out and everyone started getting frustrated and then leach takes it out on the boys for getting frustrated and voicing their opinions. the problem here is that the SEC figured Leach out real fast had success and Leach hasn't adapted the offense in any form to help his team be successful. players get naturally frustrated with that. They voice their opinions which they shouldn't since they are the players. we can do that as fans. but leach is already telling some of us off for criticizing him. That worked out great for the last guy right? i don't think he should be fired yet because he has a track record, but every school and conference is different and there are a lot of variables.Quote:
Originally Posted by HancockCountyDog
Yep, people seem to forget this. Our no talent team was able to set SEC record. It can't be that bad.Quote:
Originally Posted by msstate7
Back to Errol, he has a lazy streak in him. He has gotten slower and heavier since he got here. This is why he will not make it at the next level. Really disappointing, he was a monster his freshman year.
Yep as others have said, this ain't just a Joe problem, Leach has his issues too. Yeah I know he gets a pass with all the excuses being offered up, but he has some major issues too. Both are true of our team - players, present and past coaches.
Yep and we'll be told in Starkville to kick rocks and pound sand or worse at the press conference.Quote:
Originally Posted by DownwardDawg
We caught LSU cold coming off their Natty, they suck, they played man D, but they still got pressure quite a bit. I knew then our Oline might struggle against some teams this year. Our center was really struggling some that day a good bit.Quote:
Originally Posted by msstate7
Reads for 8 man zone for QB & WRs to be on same page are much more intricate than man. Need lots of practice. I'm just suggesting to hang tough and give it some time before we try to change Leach or what he's doing. This ain't his 1st rodeo.
As for leadership, he must have something going for him for all the coaches to follow him around and wanna coach for him. Spurrier Jr at a minimum could probably work anywhere in country he wants to.
May have a problem and does have a problem are two different things. We'll find out next year and the year after.Quote:
Originally Posted by HancockCountyDog
Maybe but lots of holes in your logic.Quote:
Originally Posted by Todd4State
We were not terrible on O the past however many years until Joe and Leach so maybe it is them. We have never been this bad on O so is it MSU or coach?
Neither of those coaches have been HC in SEC either so that has some merit as well.
Nailed it. If it takes that long then we are basically paying 15 mil a year to win 7 games in year 3. What a deal.Quote:
Originally Posted by was21
I'm of the same opinion ... I think that the players saw how Leach was going to operate early on and we lost two defensive starters before the season even began (who blamed it on a stupid tweet that wasn't bad at all) ... I think we lost the true malcontents before the LSU game and we were all supportive of Leach at the time .... now I think this has morphed into a different kind of discontentment - one of frustration- by the players and fans as well. It's borne from frustration as they are taking 100% of the blame with little or no apparent blame going to their #1 leader the HC himself. If Leach doesn't adapt to SEC defenses he at least better adapt to SEC player ego somewhat - I'm not saying give them the keys to the car but he could soften somewhat .... I think this frustration is what got K Hill and some others ..... You just can't label this many as malcontent - there has to be a reason not named JoMoQuote:
Originally Posted by trojandawg
I think Mullen understood this and this might be why he wore those stupid ass shoes sometimes ... point remains that after leaving the house / parents for the first time in their young lives the next logical place to look for leadership-insight-advice- or whatever - would naturally be their head coach and they seem to be running into a marine drill sergeant ...... and for all you hard asses about to wail away at me - this isn't boot camp
You, 7, 77, 28, Hoops, 34, and others are rabid anti leachers and have been for as long as I can remember. I'm sure you guys literally salivate at having more excuses by the day to throw the man with a proven track record under the bus. Ignore the fact he didn't have a spring, summer, and limited fall to install his offense; which btw is plenty different than first year coaches at other schools because his offense is drastically different and akin to bringing the triple option in without a practice. The obvious issues this team has had with players that want to be babied and allowed to run the show has been a huge problem. Anyone with a brain and any sympathy shouldn't want to fire a man 4 games into the season with the record Leach has under the circumstances he's given. I don't care if his salary is 5mil or 25mil no one knew the degree of difficulty this year and season would present. Leach will win here if given time to adequately install his system and bring in his players.Quote:
Originally Posted by HancockCountyDog
Yep, agree. The leader can hand out the tough talk but we the leader doesn't accept his own part of it, you have no credibility and you lose the organization or locker room. That is where we are, a real bad place to be because some change must happen at top with a different approach and attitude as well. Not saying fire him now, but he must show some adaptation. Adjust or go home - on both sides.Quote:
Originally Posted by FISHDAWG
We have no choice but to stick it out. I do think constantly attacking a 8 man zone defense with 5 receivers is gonna be tough though. If we can't run a team out of that, I think we will struggle to sustain drivesQuote:
Originally Posted by dawgday166
This is the best post in the entire thread. All that needs to be saidQuote:
Originally Posted by HancockCountyDog
Oh I agree they will both be good.Quote:
Originally Posted by StarkVegasSteve
Articles like this concern me...
https://cbssportsradio.radio.com/art...work-in-the-se
Jimmy lake saying he never had to make an adjustment to stop leach bc leach wouldn't adjust worries me.
Says the person who more than anyone railed on joe's culture and the smoke from weed billowing through the halls of the hotel the night before TN last year.Quote:
Originally Posted by Coach34
Again, leach sucking and inheriting a huge culture problem are both things that can be true.
You might be right. My point is tho that I don't think we can really tell for sure one way or the other right now. Too much flux in program with weeding out and whatnot, plus youth/experience/lack of talent on offensive side of ball. I get frustrated too. I just prefer settling out the base concepts with the team and getting them good at what Leach does 1st, then adjusting from there.Quote:
Originally Posted by msstate7
I don't think we've got the team really familiar enough and experienced enough with what Leach does yet. A true Fr QB has to come to LOS and make an audible (quite a bit in Leach's offense) into the right play call for what he's seeing. And the WRs have to be on same page with him.
No one else's offense runs quite like that (except maybe LSU last year and Clemson quite often). Saban always has a game manager has he not. Saban has philosophy (still) to control what offense does pretty tightly. New coaches in SEC are also like that. Kirby is like that too. Leach's QBs are more than game managers. At some point tho he may have to adjust down the road.
As far as coaches raising hell with players, I imagine Saban still does it as bad as Arnett did the other day cause Saban is about as bad as it gets from that standpoint. He may have toned it down a little, but I figure he can still go on some pretty good tirades.
Yes -- and when the "leader" demands accountability, but doesn't even work as hard/as many hours as Moorhead and Mullen, of course the players who saw those coaches will become "malcontents" when the offense doesn't work.Quote:
Originally Posted by R2Dawg
There are "anonymous" coaches in SEC said same thing about Mullen too. One probably was Kirby. What just happened there? Took a damn good while tho.Quote:
Originally Posted by msstate7
I tend to agree with C34 a good bit on football. Not so much this time around.Quote:
Originally Posted by confucius say
However, when he goes to a school and has a bad year it do seem to be talent related for some reason. When they're doing really well, it do tend to be offensive design/brilliance related. *****
Watch the blowback on this post *******
Jimmy lake wasn't anonymous though. He flat out said itQuote:
Originally Posted by dawgday166
Not a damn soul on this board knows how this will go the next couple years. You can have a opinion (guess what, we all question if it'll pan out) but you don't know. And by the way, we've lost at least 4 defensive players, so this isn't limited to offense. We're going to lose more on both sides. Next year won't see all the transfers but it'll be a struggle. Year three should see a jump (should). Does anyone like what John Cohen did here? Basically hitting the restart button? Hell no! But bitching about it everyday won't change a damn thing. The program has lacked direction since 2015.
I don't expect to win another game this year. That's a damn shame! We had better talent than a two win team- If we were in a similar scheme as Mullen's. But, the restart was hit, so here we are.
17 you John Cohen! 17 you! Even if it works out, we have to wait three damn years minimum, That's a shitty decision by a shitty AD.
The LSU game was smoke and mirrors. No one should be using that as a measuring stick of success. We all knew LSU wouldn't be the juggernaut they were a year ago but no one knew they'd be garbage and 2-3.
How bout vandy? We had 204 total yards vs them. Are they more talented than us? We haven't broke 300 yards of offense in a month. We haven't avg 4 yds/play in a month. In Moorhead's 26 games, he avg'd less than 4 yds/play in 2 games (Kentucky and Florida in 2018). Leach has done it 4 straight gamesQuote:
Originally Posted by Matt3467
ETA... here's the 4 teams that have held us under 4 yds/play and their avg allowed per play:
Kentucky 5.04
aTm 5.56
Bama 5.41
Vandy 7.03
No one else avg'd less than 6.7 per play vs vandy