Not to mention Stans had been here like 12 years. I think he was given plenty of chances. And Stans wasn't just fired for Ws and Ls anyway, a lot more to that story.
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Not to mention Stans had been here like 12 years. I think he was given plenty of chances. And Stans wasn't just fired for Ws and Ls anyway, a lot more to that story.
8 wins should be expected.Quote:
Originally Posted by MadDawg
And do you all not remember who started that BS line of thinking and constantly posted it over the first half of the season last year?Quote:
Originally Posted by Tbonewannabe
Long thread.. Some good. Some bad. Some weird..But lots of fun reading the back and forth.
Until the SEC or NCAA does something about the huge revenue disparity, averaging an 8-4 season is not realistic.Quote:
Originally Posted by DownwardDawg
You know, the definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results.Quote:
Originally Posted by CadaverDawg
yeah, we should definitely try your approach instead. Let's hire a coach and give him free reign for no less than 20 years. No matter what the results. Seems entirely logical and well thought out.Quote:
Originally Posted by Madkinmecrazy
While you're defining words, can you define "troll"?
I'm glad you know one of Huds relatives, I hope that makes you feel super special.Quote:
Originally Posted by DownwardDawg
My point is that our fan base doesn't give a shit how many of his relatives you know or how much he likes Mississippi. We'll run him out of town after a down year too, and we'll question why we ever hired someone so inept. We'll make up some dumbass excuses about how Stricklin is ruining the program and Bracky makes us lose football games.
Our problem, as a fan base, is that we can't accept reality. We are having a bad year. It's not all because of Mullen. It's not all because of Bracky (he probably saved us from lost schollys). Its not going to get better by cleaning house and starting over with a guy that is completely unproved outside of the Sunbelt.
Tell Hud's cousins I say hello.
your username is terrible and your posts are terrible. we have probably the most patient and non-delusional fan base in the country. The fact that we can have a 9 page thread debating Mullen's job security proves that. There's not another team in the SEC that would keep him if he finishes 4-8 this year. He only has 1 year in 5 to hang his hat on and that was 3 years ago.Quote:
Originally Posted by Madkinmecrazy
I didn't say 20 years, I just said that you don't fire a coach after one losing season.... especially after 3 straight bowl games that followed some of the worst years in MSU football history.Quote:
Originally Posted by PMDawg
Mine from the Pack -- but applicable here.
If Mullen finishes this year 5-7, he will be 34-29(.540) overall. In terms of SEC games, he would be 15-25(.375).
We are 536-535-40(.501) all-time on the field. In terms of SEC games, it is 200-368-18(.358) on the field.
Mullen is only 3.9% above our historical average in all games -- and only 1.7% above our historical average in SEC games.
By the purest of numbers(on-field results), Mullen hasn't "elevated us a tier" at all. He's been average -- even by our own lowly historical standards.
Man this thread has really turned into some serious personal attacks which is why many left Six Pack Speak.
There is absolutely nothing patient and non-delusional about demanding that the most successful coach in recent history be fired after 3 back-to-back-to-back bowl appearances because of a single down season.Quote:
Originally Posted by HoopsDawg
If you choose to ignore all of the FACTS that engie has posted in this thread, then there is nothing I can say.Quote:
Originally Posted by Madkinmecrazy
No, he THINKS he is arguing against it....but in reality, KEEPING Mullen will be history repeating itself because we will be allowing him to ruin everything he has built up. Going against our shitty history would be to see that we are trending downwards, admit it, thank him for his services, and hire an up and comer like Hudspeth that can recruit better than Dan. THAT would be not repeating history.Quote:
Originally Posted by MadDawg
That's what some of our fans don't understand. It's not the firing a coach every 5 years that has kept us from never maintaining success....it's the allowing coaches to stay 1-2 years TOO LONG, and allowing them to ruin all positive momentum. That's why every damn coach we have is stuck in rebuild mode for their first few years. That's also why we never can get a really good coach to come in here. If we would actually watch what is happening not he field and make a change while the cupboard is still full...we could actually propel the program out of this endless cycle of build/rebuild that we've been in for 80 years
Exactly.Quote:
Originally Posted by HoopsDawg
And don't be surprised if several of these Mullen defenders are ole miss trolls. After all, they DO want Mullen to stay....which clearly says "all is well", right?
Can you type this any bigger, since a lot of people really need to read it. Waiting to long to pull the trigger on a coach is every bit as bad as pulling it too early. Let me compatre our football program to my health. When I feel sick, I wait a little while. If I don't feel better, I go to the Dr. I don't wait until I am half-dead to do something about it. We've waited that little while. We know the program isn't getting better. We started feeling the twinges in 2011, felt a little better, then the bottom fell out at the end of 2012. Why wait until UK and Arkansas are both better than we are to make a change?Quote:
Originally Posted by CadaverDawg
People. He's had time. This is not a knee jerk reaction. Since 2011, our team has not gotten one tiny bit better, and has actually gotten progressively worse. Mullen's 2011 team--which finished 7-6-- would have beaten the breaks off of the 2012 and 2013 squads. How can you explain this away?
"Bowl games" is window dressing BS to prop him up -- when NOTHING about that accomplishment can be compared to previous MSU coaches.Quote:
Originally Posted by Madkinmecrazy
- When Bellard took over here, there were 12 total bowl games -- meaning you had to finish in the top 24 to go: Rose, Orange, Sugar, Fiesta, Sun, Cotton, Gator, Citrus(Cap1), Liberty, Peach(ChickFilA), Independence, Holiday
- When Jackie took over here, there were 15 total bowl games -- meaning you had to finish in the top 30 to go: The above plus Hall of Fame(Outback), Copper(Buffalo Wild Wings), and Tangerine(Russell Athletics).
- When Croom took over here, there were 27 total bowl games.
- When Mullen took over here, there were 33 total bowl games. In his second year, 2 more were added: Heart of Dallas and Pinstripe Bowl. Taking the total number to 35.
- In 2014, there is expected to be 4 more bowls added: Bahamas, Boca Raton, Miami Beach, and Camellia bowls.
We're staring at 78 of 126 FBS teams playing bowl games next year.
By previous standards -- Mullen has had ONE bowl team here in 5 years.
I thought one of the most interesting comments in this thread was that Croom had 10 SEC wins in 5 years, Mullen has 14 (with 3 more games this year).
Croom's 10 SEC wins were against teams that had a combined 57-66 record (.463)
Mullen's 14 SEC wins were against teams that had a combined 65-105 record (.382): includes UK's 2-7 record so far this year.
UK and OM account for EIGHT of Mullen's 14 wins. Basically the difference between the two right now is that Mullen has been able to beat OM and UK (Croom only won 4 vs. those two)....and they sucked just as hard - losing records for UK in 04 and 05, OM in 04, 05, 06, 07. Plus Mullen has been able to beat non-conference patsies that we should have been beating all along....including 5 FCS teams.
At the end of the day Mullen's best team was the 2010 team; It was his best team because the defense had 7-8 NFL players on it. We won't have that much talent on our defense or offense every year. He has to figure out how to get to 8-9 wins without all of that talent - or he has to get that type of talent to Starkville.
It can be done, the current team is talented, but the bone headed decisions have to stop;
+1Quote:
Originally Posted by The Croom Diaries
I don't see how someone like Goat can look past this. Then again, im pretty sure he is bi-polar so give him a week and he will probably be agreeing with us.
I didn't realize how big the difference was in the SEC wins, but this is extremely telling. Ignoring the level of competition that our coach was able to defeat would be like what the bears did with Nutt. They ignored the fact that LSU in 08-09 was downright average (8-8) SEC record during those years, and just focused on the record. What happened next was the 2010 and 2011 seasons;
UK was a bowl team a few times during Croom's years.Quote:
Originally Posted by The Croom Diaries
Mullen also had the best pair of corners in college football last year and only beat one team with a winning record (MTSU).Quote:
Originally Posted by HancockCountyDog
One of the Foundation members said Mullen would be back next year. He said buyout money is a real issue at this time and he is one that they would call.
5 seasons in... 6th season coming more than likely, and we're talking about 6 wins with that schedule...?
I hate to break this to some of you... It doesn't take 6 years to build a program... If he hasn't done it by now, he won't ever do it IMO... I'm not saying Mullen can't make us a 6 or 7 win team on a regular basis, but that's not good enough for me long term.
I see both sides of the story here... On one hand, you look bad if you fire a coach has has done better than most coaches have here... I can somewhat understand the mindset of giving him a chance to turn things around... On the other hand... Why is he having to turn things around in years 5 and 6...? Why is our recruiting so blah in year 5/6...? Shouldn't Mullen have great relationships with these kids considering how bad TSUN was for those 2 years(these kids now were sophomores)...?
All this talk about never being able to keep or find a coach if we fire a decent one for a bad year is nonsense... You can get just about anyone to coach for the right $... Period... There isn't an OC from most major schools, or a HC from CUSA/Sunbelt/Mac in the country that would turn down an SEC gig, and that's where we find our coaches anyway... GTFO with all that nonsense... On top of all that... What coach goes into a job thinking he could fail, and fears job security... That's right, coaches who aren't worth a shit(or don't believe in their ability)... If we get turned down by a coach, because he thinks 5 years isn't long enough to build a program, we don't want him anyway...
It comes down to this... The AD is suppose to do what is best for our MSU in Athletics, regardless of what the media says(or even what our fans say)... If He's keeping Mullen because he thinks it best, so be it, but he will pay the consequences.... If he's keeping Mullen because we may or may not be able to attract a coach here, because those coaches fear being fired 6 years down the road... He should quit his ****ing job right now, because he isn't doing it right... Any AD worth a shit would have a short list of coaches ready RIGHT NOW... He should have already contacted people about interest levels, to make sure the list is possible...
I just rambled, but I don't care... **** it, I'm going live...
Yeah it basically boils down to will Mullen go to a bowl game next year? Yes...he will probably win 7 games or so next year and we will go bowling.Quote:
Originally Posted by jimbo352
But...could pretty much any coach we would be able to hire go to a bowl game next year with that schedule? Yes. And maybe even better. I would like to risk it.
Damn, reading that makes it even more pathetic than I already thought it was. Thanks for the numbers Croom DiariesQuote:
Originally Posted by The Croom Diaries
UK and OM during Croom years: 4 bowl games in 10 combined seasons (3 UK, 1 OM).Quote:
Originally Posted by Tbonewannabe
UK and OM during Mullen years: 5 bowl games in 10 combined seasons (2 UK, 3 OM).
I'm sure it would be...5MM or so is nothing to sneeze atQuote:
Originally Posted by Madisonmd
And at least Croom's recruiting got better as he went on.Quote:
Originally Posted by CadaverDawg
TrueQuote:
Originally Posted by Eric Nies Grind Time
Thats the message being put out there so when Dan leaves for another school at the end of the year it won't look like we forced him out and that we had intentions of bringing him back.
have you forgotten the recent upsets by ole miss and vanderbilt? were there not huge revenue disparites between bama and MSU when sherill kicked bama's ass 3 out of 4 years ? how did croom beat bama?Quote:
Originally Posted by Quaoarsking
these big revenue guys got there by DEDICATING themselves to winning and not whining
the low revenue teams in this conference get HUGE wealth re-distribution money from the big guys... we benefit HUGELY.... asking for more is just bellyaching
while at Tech, tubberville tried to tell the big 12 to do revenue sharing like the SEC if they wanted the conference to survive...believe me, if you want to see something much worse, check out what it would be like if we were in another conference... the SEC is VERY friendly to the lower tiered teams when it comes to revenue sharing
sit back and watch ky, VU, upig and ole miss do the right thing and bypass us because they are committed while we sit back and whine....
let's go ahead and turn another player into the SEC for asking for money while were at it since that worked out so damn good before
let's look at our own damned faces in the mirror before we start bitching about other people's money for a second and maybe we can make some progress
on average, private school students get 4 X the education as a public school student and the govt spends 4 X the money on each student compared to what parents spend on a private school student but the private school student graduates and is ready for the IVY league while the public school student can't fill out a job application despite the fact that his/her education cost 4 X more.....
bottom line: money is not always the answers to failure; dedication to improvement and hard work is
If Mullen doesn't beat Bama tomorrow his record vs. FBS teams would be 28-29.
4-0 Non-conference.Quote:
Originally Posted by MadDawg
4-4 in the SEC.
That's 8 wins, and bowl is typically a toss up as far as whether we win or lose.
So, yes- as long as we don't try to get brownie points for the most difficult schedule in America every year, we can do that.
I agree. And I am perfectly fine with occasionally having a 7-5 record and a bowl win to achieve that 8th. So that means we could go 4-0 OOC and 3-5 in the SEC and win a bowl occasionally. It's not like we are asking for 11-2 after a bowl game....we're asking for .500 or even a game below .500 in the SEC, and 4 wins over lesser opponents. If that is "asking for too much", then we have some serious issues.Quote:
Originally Posted by Todd4State
That is too much for our program. We are not going to average 8 wins under any coach. Especially when we are playing 5 Top 15 teams per season. For all the dick sucking Freezus gets, he has a legit chance to finish 3-5 in the SEC this year and 7-5 overallQuote:
Originally Posted by CadaverDawg
Can we win 8-9 games at times? Absolutely. But to average 8 wins over 4-5 year period? No ****ing way. Not at Miss State
I just said 7-5 was acceptable. And why is it "no ****ing way"? Why can't we beat JSU, Troy, UAB, MTSU every year, plus 4 of the following Kentucky, Vandy, Arkansas, Ole Miss, Auburn, A&M, LSU?Quote:
Originally Posted by Coach34
We beat UK, you say we should easily beat Arkansas, and you think we will beat Ole miss. Ole miss beat Vandy and LSU and you think we are as good as Ole miss. So why can't we win 4 SEC games per year? This goes against everything you've been saying.
I'm not saying we HAVE to win 8....but shooting for 7-8 each year is not "asking for too much". Unless we're a bunch of woe is us pussies, which I'm beginning to think a majority of our fans are.
If we play Oklahoma State every year, then no it's not.Quote:
Originally Posted by Coach34
But we can beat Jackson State, Tulane, South Alabama and Middle Tennessee State every year.
We can beat Kentucky, Arkansas and Ole Miss this year. Pull off an upset- even a mild one like Auburn or Texas A&M and there's 4-4. And then win the bowl. Even without the upset, that's 8-5.