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Shoop was never here under Mullen. I think you are thinking of Grantham. Or maybe Manny 1Quote:
Originally Posted by Op4isabitch
Also, Shoop being good is a fallacy. Any of us could have coordinated that 2018 D and it would have been elite. Sweat on one side, Simmons in the middle, and Gerri Green on the other. Corey Thomas would sub in there as well. Then you had Errol and Willie at LBs with the heat seeking missile Jonathan Abram in the backend along with Dantzler
You’re correct I was thinking of TG. Thank you.
He better send like 100 kids in the portal cans of swag juice to come here. lolQuote:
Originally Posted by BigDawg81
Sorta true and sorta false.Quote:
Originally Posted by StarkVegasSteve
Coordinate 2018 D to a top 10 D ... Sure. To #1 ... Not too many DCs would've done that. Or shut Tua down in TTown when he had been lighting everyone else up.
How we easily forget Peter Sirmon.Quote:
Originally Posted by StarkVegasSteve
I get your point, but you're mistaken if you don't think he did a good job that year. There is having a good defense with that talent, then there is what he did. We gave up 13.2 ppg that year, a full 2.5 ppg better than UGA's defense this year.Quote:
Originally Posted by StarkVegasSteve
Now you are just making me made at JoMo all over again for the way he wasted that defense with such a craptastic approach to offense.Quote:
Originally Posted by Anonymous
Jon Cooper will be the OL Coach.
This seems underwhelming. I know he's got previous experience as a TE coacH at UCF and some other experience as well.Quote:
Originally Posted by ScoobaDawg
But I feel like we should have been able to do a little better here.
Not sure what to make of this.
It simply comes down to knowing the offense I believe. As long as the head guy is good on it it is what it is. Hevesy got demoted and was a go coach here. A dick but a good coach.Quote:
Originally Posted by MetEdDawg
I'm going to trust....doing some more digging. Yes he meet Libby at UCF, when Heupel was the head coach. The OL coach there was Glen Elarbee, who has twice been a finalist for the Broyles award. Elarbee followed Heupel to UT. Cooper moved on to Arkansas and was fired after one of being the TE coach, which seems pretty weird....in the 1st year of Pittman and Broyles. Then the OL Coach For Western Carolina dies from Covid-19 and Cooper is hired on Sept 1st 2021 to the OL Coach....which he noted he always wanted to be instead of a TE Coach. They went 4-7 that year. He then moved on to OU as an offensive analyst, teaming up with Lebby again. From there he went to UNT and their spread offense for a year under Eric Morris.Quote:
Originally Posted by MetEdDawg
Best pedigree? No. but it's someone Lebby knows and knows his system. I would feel better if Clements come in and was the OC and OL coach and Cooper was either TE or another split of the line type deal.
Say we're poor all you want. Arnett (a guy with significant fewer connections vs Lebby) was able to:
Hire the WR coach from Utah, hire the OL coach from Syracuse, hire another OL coach that had been an OL coagc at other SEC schools (yes Friend sucks but he had a resume), bring back Turner, bring in an experienced SEC RB coach as an analyst (Knox), and that's off the top of my head. And Arnett did it with a smaller assistant pool.
Arnett and Moorhead were able to bring in sitting P5 on field coaches. Don't tell me Lebby can't because of money
I understand there's a long way to go. Point is, these early returns are not good
aGAIN- our football budget is in the bottom of the SEC. That didnt suddenly change just because we fired Arnett. What were you guys expecting?
This is very dumb.Quote:
Originally Posted by StarkVegasSteve
We had 3 first round draft picks. So did Clemson, so did Alabama. But they had more defenders drafters late, and they had more drafted in the next few years. Ie, Clemson and Bama had the same elite talent but more talent and depth behind them. Moreover, Clemson and Bama had elite offenses helping them out too- ours did it with a 3 and out as their only rest. Lastly, Lupoi and pretty good DCs in their own right.
For Shoop to have. A better defense than Clemson or Bama was impressive as hell.
So we were able to bring in P5 assistants last year but this year we can't because our budget is at the bottom of the SEC?Quote:
Originally Posted by Coach34
And this is why the Bulldog Club is still relevant, IMO.
Moorhead hired the OL coach from Duke, brought the RB coach from PSU with him, and hired the Packers WR coach to the same position.Quote:
Originally Posted by Coach34
Arnett hired the sitting OL coach from Syracuse and WR coach from Utah.
But now the best we can afford is a guy with 1 year of G5 experience who was fired after 1 season from his only P5 job?
You're not making sense
I know we are 9 months from our next game and there's not shit else to talk about, but maybe, as a fan, who gives a shit who our O-line coach is?
It's always been that way and probably always will be. Bulldog Backer (there is a name you haven't heard in a while) told me he was at one of Mullen's radio shows at Harvey's and during commercial break someone at the table asked Mullen about the difference between MSU and Bama. He said Mullen told them "We have Fletcher Cox and Josh Boyd and they're pretty good. Well, Alabama and LSU have 6 or 7 Fletcher Cox's and Josh Boyd's."Quote:
Originally Posted by the_real_MSU_is_us
Arnett didn?t hire the WR coach from Utah. That was a forced hire as was David Turner. That was Brad?s doing. Just like bringing Knox back.Quote:
Originally Posted by the_real_MSU_is_us
Also Getsy was the ?assistant WR coach? btw and left after a year because he couldn?t stand that Joe didn?t have structure.
I do find it strange that we hired an OL coach and DL coach without hiring an OC and DC first.Quote:
Originally Posted by chef dixon
I am telling you all what I was told by multiple guys on at 18 defense, 2 of which being 1st round picks. Shoop did not have much to do with any of it. Brian Baker played almost as big of a role as Shoop. They told Shoop all he ever had to do was blitz 4 and they would get to the QBQuote:
Originally Posted by the_real_MSU_is_us
I'm not saying Moorhead was a good coach. I did say that Arnett hired those people, but I do t really care if it was him or Peterson.Quote:
Originally Posted by BankerDog
Point is, we were able to pay these assistants enough for them to come here. Like real coaches that had experience at the p5 level coaching the position groups we hired them to coach here.
If we could afford it 6, 4, and 1 year ago, we can afford it now too.
The question is, why are we bringing analysts and a OL coach with no P5 experience? Is it because nobody wants to work for Lebby? Because he refuses to hire anyone he isn't friends with? Or because he genuinely believes these guys will be better coaches if given the chance than the sitting P5 coach alternatives? Charitable answer is that last one, but it does seem like a stretch doesn't it?
Is it so much about who we “could hire” back then or is it more about who Lebby wants to hire?
The OC isn't the OC so that doesn't matter. And coaches hire position coaches all the time wo having coordinators first.Quote:
Originally Posted by NCDawg
How about trust the guy in his decisions until you don?t have a reason to? Friend, Schdmit, Brock, Dewhurst had previous experience-how did their units look this year? Bump did too-how did they look? Barbay?Quote:
Originally Posted by the_real_MSU_is_us
Give the guys a chance. Half the people on this board hated Hev but those same people are now 1) Talking about how he was decent recruiter and 2) a great coach after years of talking how bad he was. Give the guys a chance to coach a unit before questioning a hire.
I agree with this and nowadays am a "wait and see" guy myself.Quote:
Originally Posted by BankerDog
However, right now my skepticism is growing due to one main reason.
In Barbay's and Selmon's PC, Barbay was talking up our football program and stated that there were many coaches who had reached out to him and were interested in a job on his staff.
Right now it's not looking like that is necessarily the case. But I'll continue to wait and see for 2 or 3 or so years.
It does kinda make me nervous tho cause Barbay made assurances that he adapted offenses to personnel depending on their skill sets, which he didn't seem to do this year.
I'm optimistic about Cooper after listening to an interview with him. I think it's import that he and Lebby are familiar with the offense which is the case obviously.
I also like the fact that Cooper has been with Charley Pell at Western Carolina and North Texas with Eric Morris so he has some modern Air Raid experience that could add some ideas to Lebby's offense.
On the surface I think Cooper will be a good recruiter.
But the thing no one is talking about is Lebby bringing in Matt Holocek. That's a really big coup as far as QB coaches go.
The big difference between Barbay and Lebby is Barbay didn't really have a defined identity that he could clearly communicate. That was a huge red flag for me. We know what Lebby is going to do. There is no question about that.Quote:
Originally Posted by dawgday166
Also Barbay had never really called plays on his own and had never worked for a non offensive head coach who was there for oversight. Lebby coached under Brent Venables so there is no question when I watch Oklahoma film it's Lebby calling the plays.
Lebby's influences are also night and day compared to Barbay. Briles, Heupel and Kiffin compared to former Iowa OC Greg Davis and Larry Kueck.
All good points but I was sorta comparing stating something which actually isn't or doesn't turn out to be true. Not sure if that is the case with regard to Lebby's statement on coaches wanting to come here or not just yet, but so far it doesn't appear to be shaping up that well.Quote:
Originally Posted by Todd4State
We'll see what happens tho.
Obviously I hope these hires work out and have trust that Lebby knows what he's doing. That said:
1) this is a message board, we're allowed to state our concerns as well as praise the hires.
2) C34 is saying we're too poor to hire people with good resumes. My comments are more about calling that narrative out than it is criticizing Lebby. These hires are concerning on paper but they may be great hires in reality... but we absolutely can afford to hire a P5 onfield coach as our last 3 new HCs did just that
We're going to have to hunker down at this point IMO. A lot of (most) candidates are going to be coaching in bowl games. This staff won't be complete until January if I had to guess.Quote:
Originally Posted by dawgday166
The QB coach is someone we should be very excited about. He's developed guys into first round picks. And he has been with Lebby for awhile. Cooper is coming from North Texas who did not make a bowl. The other two hires are Bumphis and Turner who are MSU guys which I'm Ok with. We need to keep some guys for recruiting continuity and to help Lebby get re-acclimated to the area.
If Holocek is on the field- which may or may not be the case, Dan and Leach both had QB coaches that were off the field staff and I'm pretty sure Holocek was off the field at Ole Miss- then we have about half of our offensive staff completed. All we need is a RB and a TE coach. With Lebby being the OC then we could potentially do some other things as well. Like have Holocek off the field and hire an outside receivers coach and let Bumphis coach slot/inside receivers.
Actually, not having an OC should allow us to overspend on a DC. I don't think we have the money constraints that some are touting. We've historically attracted elite DC's even during 1980's Felker MSU (Jim Carmody). I'd rather us take our time and get an elite guy rather than knee jerk reaction hire Geoff Collins. Especially given the fact that our last staff was put together very quickly and we see how that turned out. Other than OC which we had trouble hiring in part because we essentially put their staff together before we even interviewed them. I could definitely see us offering at least 1.5 million if we wanted to a DC.
I think Holocek is going to be off the field.Quote:
Originally Posted by Todd4State
Apparently Cooper won't be the OL coach. I won't link Football Scoop, but we are set to hire Cody Kennedy away from Arkansas.
well well
Cody Kennedy is good hire. Granted, Arkansas OL did not light the world on fire this year but he is highly regarded in the industry. Had a great run game at Tulane with Fritz.
Interesting. Arkansas O line was horrible this year. Couldn't block water. Maybe it was talent?Quote:
Originally Posted by DCdawg
Nevermind then. LOL.Quote:
Originally Posted by DCdawg
Very possible. And I'm fine with that recruiting QB's is a different animal.Quote:
Originally Posted by CoachT14
It was going from Briles to Enos. The three years Briles was there they had a pretty damn good OL.Quote:
Originally Posted by DownwardDawg