Not 750K.Quote:
Originally Posted by LC Dawg
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Not 750K.Quote:
Originally Posted by LC Dawg
According to USA Today, the MSU assistant coach compensation pool is $3.6 million...last in the SEC. As a comparison, TSUN?s pool is $5.1 million. However, we are spending $60 million on baseball. Maybe we should have spent $50 million on a great baseball stadium and pumped $2 million per year more into the football assistants who were doing a great job. Especially since football is the revenue driver. And I?m a baseball guy.
Again, we didn't lose him bc of money. As w most every coach we've ever lost.Quote:
Originally Posted by Cooterpoot
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Originally Posted by Backspin
I agree our assistant coaches need more money, but if we have an assistant coach who Bama wants, and our coach, being offered by Bama, has mutual feelings about moving to Tuscaloosa, then you can forget ir on the money thing. So yeah we need to supplement our assistant coaches, but that is not going to prevent things like this.
Screw that. Extra 10 mill well spent.Quote:
Originally Posted by Backspin
We didn’t lose him to a promotion either. You guys can accept it to be true if you want. He’s just paid better.Quote:
Originally Posted by Homedawg
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Originally Posted by Homedawg
Well, it's kind of about money.
The only way for us to have the stability that it seems like a lot of our fans want to have at the rate that we are paying would be to hire a MSU grad that loves MSU above all else except God and to hire a staff that has the same feelings about MSU. Kind of like Cohen for us in baseball. Unfortunately there isn't really what I would consider a qualified coaching candidate on the horizon like that.
That said I would like to see us hire someone that is from Mississippi next time as our coach and see how that goes. I bet our fans would accept them more easily than someone from the North.
Crazy thing is, 98% of you would do the EXACT same thing... The other % would just be the rare exception.
FTFYQuote:
Originally Posted by Hambone
He didn't go to Bama for less money, I guarantee you that. It was bare minimum equal to what we offered him to stay, but likely more. And therein lies the problem....if you pay the man upfront what you felt he is worth on his way out the door, you might not have people snooping around to begin with. We try to be cheap until it's too late.Quote:
Originally Posted by Homedawg
In other words, if we threw out a $750k matching offer after Bama did, well of course he leaves....but if we extend him for $750k right after or during the season, it makes a statement that you better be ready to pay for Baker if you try to get him, and most would steer clear. But when they look and see he's making $350k while coaching up the best DL in the country, you might as well have a neon sign above his head saying "Priced To Move!"
Of pay we're exacrly the same he'd still be gone. No different than Geoff Collins.Quote:
Originally Posted by HoopsDawg
One of the reasons I like EliteDawgs is the fact that there are opinions that aren't all sunshine and flower posts. I stay away from GenesPage when bad stuff happens for that reason.
Guys, it's okay to melt a little. We all want what's best for MSU and some aren't satisfied with mediocrity. And that's okay.
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Originally Posted by CadaverDawg
He accepted the extension agreement (negotiation) so he must have thought that was an acceptable deal, at that time. You don't over pay if a person accepts an offered contract. That's not a good business practice and Cohen definitely isn't going to to do that. Then Bama comes a calling and offers him an assistant position. He takes the Bama position because he feels it is in the best interest of his family, and his future expectations and goals. I don't know if Baker wants to be a DC or some day be a head coach, but getting in the Saban coaching tree sure has worked for some who wanted to move up to a coordinator or head coach. Again I think our assistant coaches need higher salaries to at least meet the average in the SEC if not higher, but if there is mutual feelings on a move to Tuscaloosa then Bama will win.
Maybe they want to go somewhere they can do the same job, but get better results. More W's. Work the same level, without all the negativity and grief from losing every other week. At Bama, you may not have to lose once.
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Originally Posted by KOdawg1
You call this a little melt?**
People are acting like our football program is going to collapse because Alabama hired our d-line coach.
I assure you Bama has their share of negativity and grief from their fans. And it's probably worse than MSU when you take into account the nitpicking things that their fans bitch about and the fact that they win anyway. It would be like me bitching that we only beat someone 56-0 instead of 63-0 and we failed because we didn't win the National Championship.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bothrops
Most of the coaches don't give a rats ass what we think or say about them.
If replacing coaches and staff chemistry weren't that important then Saban wouldn't have had his ass handed to him so badly this past year. And if SEC refs weren't helping him out ... he'd probably have lost more than just 2 games over last 2 years too.Quote:
Originally Posted by Todd4State
To me our better chances are trying to emulate Dabo ... which means staff continuity.
Not saying our program is going to collapse, but Pickering plus Young would've been a step forward to something better. I'm personally saying bye-bye to Young and ain't totally convinced Pickering ain't in jeopardy yet. And staff continuity and chemistry on the D staff could've helped a lot too. AND ... unlike you I don't have complete faith in Joe on the O side of the ball just yet.
Plus, Saban just got a really good coach and recruiter from all I've read and ... those don't seem to be a dime a dozen. I do sorta trust Shoop to have good ideas about replacements tho.
More than anything tho ... I'm just sick of Saban and his bullshit. Now if we get a great Dline coach and recruiter, Pickering and Young, then I melted for nothing.
I know people are mad, but you can not fault a coach.
Just look at our own fan base. You guys would turn out a coach in a year if you could. You talk about it with JoMo. If it betters him or his family, I'm not faulting him because like I said.... fickle fans.
As to no competition clauses. Hard time getting them to hold up in court.
Wrong. You DO overpay when you can't keep coaches in today's landscape. Of course he accepted the deal, he hadn't been offered a better one at the time. Had we paid up, they may not even come knocking, who knows.Quote:
Originally Posted by yjnkdawg
I don't fault Baker. I fault the men signing his checkQuote:
Originally Posted by Coach007
Why do we think the solution to every problem we have is 'Cohen needs to pay more.' We have limited resources, more limited than any other program in the conference. Pretending we can compete with the top programs by doing the same thing they do is foolish.Quote:
Originally Posted by CadaverDawg
Read. I didn't say that was the solution to every problem....but it is for some, like Baker. The key is not trying to get in a bidding war by being proactive with paying your best coaches. Play offense, not defense like our cheap ass AD's do. $400k more is something we can afford in order to maintain the top DL in the country, no??Quote:
Originally Posted by smootness
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Originally Posted by CadaverDawg
If Saban wanted him, Bama would have definitely come knocking. Saban may not get everything he wants concerning the Alabama Football Program, but he doesn't miss on much. But how do you come up with a formula to over pay somebody but not actually way over pay them, when you have no clue that a program like Bama will come after your DL Coach, and don't know what their salary package offer will be? Again, whether we want to believe, or admit it, on the national scene, a DL assistant coaching position at Bama is a more prestigious coaching position than one with us. It is what it is.
That?s hilariousQuote:
Originally Posted by RougeDawg
Our D was #1 in the nation, and Baker was recruiting his ass off....overpay by enough that it doesn't matter. I bet Clemson feels like they got pretty good ROI on their overpaying of Venebles. If you truly want to take a next step, if you truly want to be a Clemson one day...You HAVE to lock down your best guys. You don't have to overpay everybody, just be strategic by knowing who is truly the glue to your #1 Defense and pay their ass handsomely. It's not hard. Nobody on O (maybe Johnson for recruiting) should have gotten a penny raise, so making substantial raises for guys like Baker shouldn't have been hard. Stop making excuses...we aren't Huge money but we aren't Southern Miss eitherQuote:
Originally Posted by yjnkdawg
I figure it has way more to do with JoeMo. I mean, I'm sure it's completely coincidental 4 of our 5 best coaches have all jumped off the SS Moorhead at their first opportunity.Quote:
Originally Posted by CadaverDawg
You're right, Cohen needs to do his job. But it starts with getting rid of Sylvester Moorhead. But your point about increasing our assistant pay is accurate, too.
I don't think Moorhead is going to be successful, but Baker supposedly turned down Florida and LSU before signing the extension.Quote:
Originally Posted by War Machine Dawg
I agree, we were probably paying him pretty competitively for most normal college football programs, heck, even competively for the SEC, but when you compete with Bama you are basically competing with an NFL franchise with unlimited resources. I do think overall we should bump our assistants' pay WHERE there is someone that our HC wants to do all we can to not lose. We certainly should have, at a minimum, our assistant pay in line with what OM has, but none of that will ever stop us from losing an assistant that Bama comes after because we can't afford to pay on that scale as a norm.Quote:
Originally Posted by yjnkdawg
And if our Dline would have come out and played crappy this year under Baker everybody would be bitching how stupid Cohen was for overpaying the DL coach. Not saying paying coaches what their worth is wrong. Just saying your scenario of overpaying could work the other way too.Quote:
Originally Posted by CadaverDawg
You got that right!! LT 2.0. We have low balled every coach in our entire program with the exception of VicQuote:
Originally Posted by CadaverDawg
Preach brother!!! #SinkingShipQuote:
Originally Posted by War Machine Dawg
You don't do it unless they're proven...Baker is proven, and you could have even done it after the season and been fine. It only works against you if you arent paying attention.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bdawg
I do agree we need to pony up for good coaches. But is money the sole reason for him leaving? He is leaving though, right?Quote:
Originally Posted by CadaverDawg
He isn't leaving for less money, that's for sure. It's always about the money in my opinion. Sure, Bama & Saban are great, but you still aren't taking a pay cut to go there.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bdawg
God I liked it when you were on hiatus. Go back to your Coach 34 strike, please.Quote:
Originally Posted by preachermatt83
Per Steve, we offered Huff a long extension (to 2022) and more money but it was the Bama opportunity. Piroli was offered more but really wanted to go and work with Bruce again. Baker was offer a match, then offered to exceed Bama’s offer at the time but he also thought the opportunity for advancement was too good to pass up
Piroli I get.Quote:
Originally Posted by Really Clark?
Huff I get to some extent but he's a climber that won't show loyalty to anyone. He needs to watch who he follows on twitter.
Baker - Complete sell out. Would rather get something for free than build that something special. Was lying to our recruits last night about staying.
I read that and also that he had already accepted offer last night too. He probably should've just been honest and excused himself from the whole recruiting deal last night, or made some excuse and just left while telling Joe & Shoop why. That's another thing that pissed me off about this ... Saban's ass could've offered sooner or waited until late today or early tomorrow to offer IMO. I think this was calculated to some degree by Saban.Quote:
Originally Posted by ShotgunDawg
Why not hit ignore? It would be like I'm not even here.Quote:
Originally Posted by Turfdawg67