Sunday Morning Thoughts

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09-10-2023, 12:08 PM
the_real_MSU_is_us

Quote:

Originally Posted by BlackSailsDawg

Sure. This season, he has had 2 TDs where the ball traveled in air over 20 yards.

in 2022, He had 9 TDs where the ball traveled 20 yard in air or more. Between 10-19 yards in air, 15 Tds. A total in those ranges of 24 TDs. That means 38% was deep ball throws that resulted in TD.

2021... 10 TDs of 20 or more in air. and 12 between 10-19 yards. About 50% of the TDs were deep shots.

In 2020, Rogers never threw a TD that was 20 or more yards. Not 1. and had only 8 that was 10-19.

Can you share the source for the stats so we can compare his numbers to others?
09-10-2023, 12:27 PM
Coach34

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lord McBuckethead

I would skip Wright and go with Parson unless his injury from HS is still an issue. What do we gain with Wright over Parson?

Wright being the QB next year is what
09-10-2023, 12:29 PM
BlackSailsDawg

Quote:

Originally Posted by the_real_MSU_is_us

Can you share the source for the stats so we can compare his numbers to others?

What does comparing him to others have to do with his ability to score on deep shots?

PFF
09-10-2023, 12:36 PM
the_real_MSU_is_us

Quote:

Originally Posted by BlackSailsDawg

What does comparing him to others have to do with his ability to score on deep shots?

PFF

I am claiming WIll is not a good deep ball thrower. You respond with raw stats. Those stats are meaningless without knowing what other QBs do.

Please copy and past the link since you already found it
09-10-2023, 01:22 PM
MBDawg601

We need a portal QB for next year. Enough screwing around. We need someone that can spin it and has some form of athletic ability.

I don't think we have that guy on our roster. Tulanes back up looks better than any of our guys.
09-10-2023, 01:30 PM
TrapGame

Quote:

Originally Posted by MBDawg601

We need a portal QB for next year. Enough screwing around. We need someone that can spin it and has some form of athletic ability.

I don't think we have that guy on our roster. Tulanes back up looks better than any of our guys.

We need to see Mike Wright actually run the offense instead of handing it off and making a few runs before we go portal.
09-10-2023, 01:43 PM
MBDawg601

Quote:

Originally Posted by TrapGame

We need to see Mike Wright actually run the offense instead of handing it off and making a few runs before we go portal.

I pray it happens, but it doesn't seem like it will this year. I think Mike Wright wouldn't do any worse than will, but adds another element with his legs.
09-10-2023, 01:46 PM
BlackSailsDawg

Quote:

Originally Posted by the_real_MSU_is_us

I am claiming WIll is not a good deep ball thrower. You respond with raw stats. Those stats are meaningless without knowing what other QBs do.

Please copy and past the link since you already found it

The raw stats is all thats needed. This isn't a comparison of QBs. No other QB from other teams will be a QB at MSU this season. All Rogers has to do to keep defenses more honest is to throw it deep. If 30% ends up completed then the defense will respect it. That fact that almost 50% of the TDs were 20 yards plus is enough to prove the point.

The only reason a defense will not respect it is if there are no attempts or there are no completions. We are seeing a lack of passing attempts and became 1 dimensional. That's play calling. For your comparison though...

Here is Bryce Young.

2021: 14 TDs in the 20 plus... along with 4 ints. 9 TDs in the 10 - 19 with 2 ints. 4 more TDs with the playoff system games included. That's 3 extra games
2022: 5 TDs in the 20 plus. 13 Tds in the 10-19 range. Rogers had more passing TDs in the deep range and in the 10-19 range.

https://premium.pff.com/ncaa/teams/2...passing-detail
09-10-2023, 04:15 PM
FISHDAWG

Quote:

Originally Posted by HancockCountyDog

We get zero pressure from our DL. If we dont blitz, we cant get pressure. Its that simple.

And how did that work out for us ? Like I said - we paid the price for it. You don't have to send both at the same time, use a combination of positions like a weak side corner or free safety as well but it looked to me like more damage was done by uncovered backs or tight ends in the flat
09-10-2023, 04:35 PM
the_real_MSU_is_us

Quote:

Originally Posted by BlackSailsDawg

The raw stats is all thats needed. This isn't a comparison of QBs. No other QB from other teams will be a QB at MSU this season. All Rogers has to do to keep defenses more honest is to throw it deep. If 30% ends up completed then the defense will respect it. That fact that almost 50% of the TDs were 20 yards plus is enough to prove the point.

The only reason a defense will not respect it is if there are no attempts or there are no completions. We are seeing a lack of passing attempts and became 1 dimensional. That's play calling. For your comparison though...

Here is Bryce Young.

2021: 14 TDs in the 20 plus... along with 4 ints. 9 TDs in the 10 - 19 with 2 ints. 4 more TDs with the playoff system games included. That's 3 extra games
2022: 5 TDs in the 20 plus. 13 Tds in the 10-19 range. Rogers had more passing TDs in the deep range and in the 10-19 range.

https://premium.pff.com/ncaa/teams/2...passing-detail

LOL you know damned well you can't determine if a player is good without comparing them to their peers lol. Lemonis won baseball games last year, he must me a really good coach right? but when you compare his wins to the rest of the SEC's wins, he finished 13th. The fact you want to keep this to just raw numbers with no comparison to other SEC QBs shows you know he can't stack up.

I don't pay for PFF premium so can't look up the real comps (KJ jefferson for one, since his name has been brought up here).

Once again you show you're not interested in honest discussion, but solely in defending Will. If the truth supports will you'll say that, but if the truth doesn't support Will you'll go so far as to say there's no point in comparing QBs because "No other QB from other teams will be a QB at MSU this season". By that logic we can never say if any player at any position is better/worse than a player on a another team. This is how far you'll go to defend Will.

Is it a family relation, or just a personal friendship?
09-10-2023, 04:35 PM
Fader21

I was at the game, Arnett called most of the defensive plays, he was at least signaling them in so I don't think he has truly given up play calling duties.
09-10-2023, 04:53 PM
FISHDAWG

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fader21

I was at the game, Arnett called most of the defensive plays, he was at least signaling them in so I don't think he has truly given up play calling duties.

CZA's own quote .... "I don't call the defense- I only signal the calls in ... the coordinators have studied film and formulated the plan... I'm busy doing head coaching "
09-10-2023, 05:01 PM
BlackSailsDawg

Quote:

Originally Posted by the_real_MSU_is_us

LOL you know damned well you can't determine if a player is good without comparing them to their peers lol. Lemonis won baseball games last year, he must me a really good coach right? but when you compare his wins to the rest of the SEC's wins, he finished 13th. The fact you want to keep this to just raw numbers with no comparison to other SEC QBs shows you know he can't stack up.

I don't pay for PFF premium so can't look up the real comps (KJ jefferson for one, since his name has been brought up here).

Once again you show you're not interested in honest discussion, but solely in defending Will. If the truth supports will you'll say that, but if the truth doesn't support Will you'll go so far as to say there's no point in comparing QBs because "No other QB from other teams will be a QB at MSU this season". By that logic we can never say if any player at any position is better/worse than a player on a another team. This is how far you'll go to defend Will.

Is it a family relation, or just a personal friendship?

You asked for a comparison. I gave it with a link. According to that Rogers was more productive than Bryce Young.
09-10-2023, 05:05 PM
Joebob

Not much to add that hasn't already been said. I'll throw in though that throwing 15 times in regulation on a night where we only averaged 3.7 yards per run is just mind boggling, almost as much as giving Whittemore no touches on the same night. WTF?
09-10-2023, 06:45 PM
CaptainObvious

Quote:

Originally Posted by EdwardDrayton

Think we saw we averaged 5.3 yards per attempt last season. 130th in the FBS. Maybe he can throw downfield? But it's clear he's not doing so consistently.

We're not for or against Will. We just want the personnel on the field that gives us the best chance to win. We seem to be trying to mollify EVERYONE with our approach. That is deadly.

Yards per attempt is a useless stat to me. Too many variables to put that stat squarely on the QB. Dropped passes, passes receivers get their hands around but are too weak to hold onto when the defender hits them or reaches in. The offensive line can?t protect and QB has to throw it away or rush his throw. The RB misses a block on the extra rusher or blitzer.
09-10-2023, 06:51 PM
the_real_MSU_is_us

Quote:

Originally Posted by CaptainObvious

Yards per attempt is a useless stat to me. Too many variables to put that stat squarely on the QB. Dropped passes, passes receivers get their hands around but are too weak to hold onto when the defender hits them or reaches in. The offensive line can?t protect and QB has to throw it away or rush his throw. The RB misses a block on the extra rusher or blitzer.

By this logic no stat matters at all. name me a stat that isn't somewhat dependent on the perforce of others?

RB rushing doesn't matter because the OL may miss a block.

DB giving up a lot of TDs doesn't matter because maybe the DL was giving the QB a lot of time.

Defense allowing a lot of points doesn't matter because maybe the offense sucked and created bad field position for the D.
09-10-2023, 07:55 PM
BlackSailsDawg

Quote:

Originally Posted by CaptainObvious

Yards per attempt is a useless stat to me. Too many variables to put that stat squarely on the QB. Dropped passes, passes receivers get their hands around but are too weak to hold onto when the defender hits them or reaches in. The offensive line can?t protect and QB has to throw it away or rush his throw. The RB misses a block on the extra rusher or blitzer.

Not just that, but Great WRs can break one and add to the Y/A. All of Bama's WRs did it last year and the year before.

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