Norvell

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10-23-2019, 03:41 PM
ckDOG

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cooterpoot

Proven vs who? You guys can?t answer that, because they literally beat no damn body. I?ve already said if we take a G5 HC they should?ve at least won their damn shitty conference. What part of that did you not understand? Novell is who we?d go to if everybody else shot us down. At that point, you?d settle.

Hey if you aren?t willing to let competition of a shitty program against relative talent let HC talent shine through I can?t help you. And if you think Mike Norvell isn?t at the top of the list of known commodities in the prime of their years you are in for disappointment. What coaches would shut us down before we went to Norvell? Pipe dreams that meet your proven standard and maybe Fritz and Clark - both who shouldn?t qualify as proven either if we are going to discount crap conference HCs.
10-23-2019, 04:15 PM
timotheus

good thing we didn't have Memphis on the schedule this season.........
10-23-2019, 04:15 PM
Cooterpoot

Quote:

Originally Posted by ckDOG

Hey if you aren?t willing to let competition of a shitty program against relative talent let HC talent shine through I can?t help you. And if you think Mike Norvell isn?t at the top of the list of known commodities in the prime of their years you are in for disappointment. What coaches would shut us down before we went to Norvell? Pipe dreams that meet your proven standard and maybe Fritz and Clark - both who shouldn?t qualify as proven either if we are going to discount crap conference HCs.

I discount overall performance vs quality competition when it?s a crap conference. The guy has literally beaten no one. Give me a quality proven assistant at a top program over him. Name Novell?s big wins...and you guys bitches about Mullen not beating ranked teams and floundering vs top programs. This guy can?t even win a bowl game. Imagine us never winning a bowl game under a coach. We?d be raising hell.
We hired a guy that was demoted from OC at UConn. John Cohen 17?d up that ?search?. He looked at one year at Penn St. And considering the talent they had, they underperformed. Novell has won nothing. Absolutely nothing. Expand your vision and look around. There are plenty of good coaches willing to take $5M and this job. But Cohen went $3M on this chump we?ve got.
I’ll ask again, who has he beaten? You’re still sitting on your hands.
10-23-2019, 04:33 PM
Cooterpoot

A little more:

Wins over teams with winning records-
2016- 2
2017- 3
2018- 1
This year he has 3 but one is a SWAC team.
10-23-2019, 05:36 PM
Percho

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cooterpoot

I discount overall performance vs quality competition when it?s a crap conference. The guy has literally beaten no one. Give me a quality proven assistant at a top program over him. Name Novell?s big wins...and you guys bitches about Mullen not beating ranked teams and floundering vs top programs. This guy can?t even win a bowl game. Imagine us never winning a bowl game under a coach. We?d be raising hell.
We hired a guy that was demoted from OC at UConn. John Cohen 17?d up that ?search?. He looked at one year at Penn St. And considering the talent they had, they underperformed. Novell has won nothing. Absolutely nothing. Expand your vision and look around. There are plenty of good coaches willing to take $5M and this job. But Cohen went $3M on this chump we?ve got.
I?ll ask again, who has he beaten? You?re still sitting on your hands.

Was Moorhead, a quality proven assistant, when we hired him? Would the national talking heads have considered him, a quality proven assistant?

Here is 5 mil, who would you hire?

How long will he stay, if he can win the west in his first 5 years?

Should we just go ahead and order the rings when we hire him?
10-23-2019, 05:44 PM
ckDOG

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cooterpoot

I discount overall performance vs quality competition when it?s a crap conference. The guy has literally beaten no one. Give me a quality proven assistant at a top program over him. Name Novell?s big wins...and you guys bitches about Mullen not beating ranked teams and floundering vs top programs. This guy can?t even win a bowl game. Imagine us never winning a bowl game under a coach. We?d be raising hell.
We hired a guy that was demoted from OC at UConn. John Cohen 17?d up that ?search?. He looked at one year at Penn St. And considering the talent they had, they underperformed. Novell has won nothing. Absolutely nothing. Expand your vision and look around. There are plenty of good coaches willing to take $5M and this job. But Cohen went $3M on this chump we?ve got.
I?ll ask again, who has he beaten? You?re still sitting on your hands.

I?ll rehash his record that is easily verified after you give names of more proven coaches that we can actually hire at MSU.
10-23-2019, 06:03 PM
Cooterpoot

Quote:

Originally Posted by Percho

Was Moorhead, a quality proven assistant, when we hired him? Would the national talking heads have considered him, a quality proven assistant?

Here is 5 mil, who would you hire?

How long will he stay, if he can win the west in his first 5 years?

Should we just go ahead and order the rings when we hire him?

SI loved him. But nobody looked at him. They went off that one big year. Never go after one big year. And you obviously missed my statement about him being demoted in his previous big job.
Who cares if a coach stays 4/5 years o 10 years. That doesn’t matter.
Still waiting on you guys to tell me who worth talking about Novell has beaten. Moorhead has as many wins vs winning record teams as Norvell in a year and a half that he had in two years and only one less than him in three years.
10-23-2019, 06:05 PM
Cooterpoot

Quote:

Originally Posted by ckDOG

I?ll rehash his record that is easily verified after you give names of more proven coaches that we can actually hire at MSU.

That’s what I thought. You chimed in and got nothing. I mean, this thread is about Norvell, not me. I’ll give my list when we get to that point. We’ll see who is out there and realistic. But Norvell has done nothing. If you want to be one of those State fans that think we can’t do this or that, well, you’re part of the problem. I go in another direction and circle back if we miss. Schools haven’t been beating down Norvells door.
I’ve told you why I don’t think he’s the guy. And I proved numbers to back up my position. I’m waiting for you to tell us why he’s the guy. Something other than, he’s the best we can do or he’s a good coach (without something significant to prove it).
10-23-2019, 06:22 PM
ckDOG

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cooterpoot

That?s what I thought. You chimed in and got nothing. I mean, this thread is about Norvell, not me. I?ll give my list when we get to that point. We?ll see who is out there and realistic. But Norvell has done nothing. If you want to be one of those State fans that think we can?t do this or that, well, you?re part of the problem. I go in another direction and circle back if we miss. Schools haven?t been beating down Norvells door.
I?ve told you why I don?t think he?s the guy. And I proved numbers to back up my position. I?m waiting for you to tell us why he?s the guy. Something other than, he?s the best we can do or he?s a good coach (without something significant to prove it).

Jesus Christ. He?s 32-15 with an excellent offense that has excelled despite losing NFL talent during his tenure. Their last 3 coaches over 15 seasons were 78- 106. Fuente was barely 500. You have to look at coaches relative to their environment bc we don?t have a blank check and can?t pluck an elite coach away from a premier program where it?s a no doubter.

Being grounded in reality doesn?t hold us back. Again....who are your prospects? Assume we pay 5 million a year. Who can we sign that is a slam dunk proven hire?
10-23-2019, 08:30 PM
Coach34

Norvell may not be the answer or a good SEC coach- but he is better than what we have now
10-23-2019, 10:28 PM
timotheus

That's what I'm talking about. How many teams with winning records has Jomo beaten last and this season? Hell, its a good thing we didn't have memphis on our schedule or Norvell would have another win against a team with a losing record.
10-23-2019, 10:50 PM
dawgs

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cooterpoot

SI loved him. But nobody looked at him. They went off that one big year. Never go after one big year. And you obviously missed my statement about him being demoted in his previous big job.
Who cares if a coach stays 4/5 years o 10 years. That doesn?t matter.
Still waiting on you guys to tell me who worth talking about Novell has beaten. Moorhead has as many wins vs winning record teams as Norvell in a year and a half that he had in two years and only one less than him in three years.

If we wait for more than 1-2 good years to provide a large enough sample size to ascertain a coordinator's abilities across multiple player cycles (vs. capitalizing on an elite group over 2 years like Moorhead did), then someone else is gonna have hired them already or they are waiting for a program bigger than the Mississippi state's of the CFB world (venables).
10-23-2019, 10:54 PM
dawgs

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cooterpoot

That’s what I thought. You chimed in and got nothing. I mean, this thread is about Norvell, not me. I’ll give my list when we get to that point. We’ll see who is out there and realistic. But Norvell has done nothing. If you want to be one of those State fans that think we can’t do this or that, well, you’re part of the problem. I go in another direction and circle back if we miss. Schools haven’t been beating down Norvells door.
I’ve told you why I don’t think he’s the guy. And I proved numbers to back up my position. I’m waiting for you to tell us why he’s the guy. Something other than, he’s the best we can do or he’s a good coach (without something significant to prove it).

You didn't prove numbers, you provided evidence to support your position. Just as I countered with evidence that losing in the 2017 AAC championship to UCF in OT shouldn't eliminate a coach from our search. Based on your statements, if Norvell had won that game he'd be a wonderful candidate. That's a mighty fine line to me that probably has more to do with some 2* no name kid dropping a pass or missing a tackle than actual coaching acumen.

Norvell may or may not be a good P5 coach, maybe there's substance behind the rumors, but all I'm saying is your reasoning for eliminating him from consideration is pretty flimsy when you consider the context.
10-23-2019, 11:04 PM
Todd4State

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cooterpoot

Better than his. How does his schedule compare to ours?

You can't look at the schedule because he doesn't have the OPPORTUNITY to play a schedule like ours. If he's dominating that league and he's finishing second to what amounts to the Alabama of G5 schools he's probably a pretty good coach.
10-23-2019, 11:06 PM
Todd4State

Quote:

Originally Posted by dawgs

If we wait for more than 1-2 good years to provide a large enough sample size to ascertain a coordinator's abilities across multiple player cycles (vs. capitalizing on an elite group over 2 years like Moorhead did), then someone else is gonna have hired them already or they are waiting for a program bigger than the Mississippi state's of the CFB world (venables).

Exactly. We have to take some risk with any coach or risk missing the boat completely.
10-24-2019, 05:29 AM
basedog

Quote:

Originally Posted by Todd4State

Exactly. We have to take some risk with any coach or risk missing the boat completely.

Yes ^^^^^^

It can be done hiring a good Coach, but odds or slim, history tell us. I'd still ask Bret Venable and I do think he would be a risk.
10-24-2019, 08:51 AM
Cooterpoot

Quote:

Originally Posted by Todd4State

You can't look at the schedule because he doesn't have the OPPORTUNITY to play a schedule like ours. If he's dominating that league and he's finishing second to what amounts to the Alabama of G5 schools he's probably a pretty good coach.

He’s lost to every decent team he’s played out of conference. That’s all I need to know.
10-24-2019, 08:52 AM
Cooterpoot

Quote:

Originally Posted by Coach34

Norvell may not be the answer or a good SEC coach- but he is better than what we have now

Hell, you’d be better than what we have now.
10-24-2019, 08:53 AM
Cooterpoot

Quote:

Originally Posted by ckDOG

Jesus Christ. He?s 32-15 with an excellent offense that has excelled despite losing NFL talent during his tenure. Their last 3 coaches over 15 seasons were 78- 106. Fuente was barely 500. You have to look at coaches relative to their environment bc we don?t have a blank check and can?t pluck an elite coach away from a premier program where it?s a no doubter.

Being grounded in reality doesn?t hold us back. Again....who are your prospects? Assume we pay 5 million a year. Who can we sign that is a slam dunk proven hire?

His excellent offense struggled to put up points vs shitty OM. But we all know where each of us stand on him. So I’ll let it go.
10-24-2019, 09:34 AM
AROB44

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cooterpoot

Hell, you?d be better than what we have now.

No!!!!

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