Babe 17ing Ruth---

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Originally Posted by shoeless joe

But if he'd used steroids he could've still endured all those other things much longer and put up much more power stats

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That's why you have to judge players based on the era that they played in. No question that if Ruth had the advanced strength and conditioning that every player takes advantage of in MLB today he would have been even more of a beast. By the same token if Bonds plays in the 1920's he's probably still a 20 home run guy but nowhere near the 73 he hit or 700+ he hit for his career. And yeah- I know he would have been playing with Cool Papa Bell in the Negro Leagues but my point remains.

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Originally Posted by Todd4State

Exactly. All of this. How many players or athletes from the 1920's are still talked about to this very day?

If people think that Cohen was bad about bunting they should have seen baseball in the early 1900's-1920 or so.

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Yep they were basically playing with a rag ball.

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Originally Posted by Commercecomet24

Yep they were basically playing with a rag ball.

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And they were brown and dirty too. MLB only changed it because a SS for the Indians was killed because he couldn't see a ball hit off of the bat that struck him in the temple.

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Originally Posted by Commercecomet24

I will say this and it?s strictly a what could?ve been. If Mantle wouldn?t have had all the injuries and absolutely destroyed his body with booze and drugs he would?ve been the best ever. But it didn?t happen. Fun and a little bittersweet to speculate though,

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You a Mantle fan *******

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Originally Posted by dawgday166

You a Mantle fan *******

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You know it?s funny I hate the Yankees but the Mick and Brooks Robinson and Jim Palmer, were my first Baseball hero?s.

I honestly am a fan of any of the greats of the game regardless of if I hate their team lol

I met the Mick once and he was a super nice guy, very engaging and he wasn?t drunk.

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Originally Posted by Todd4State

And they were brown and dirty too. MLB only changed it because a SS for the Indians was killed because he couldn't see a ball hit off of the bat that struck him in the temple.

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Ray Chapman.

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Originally Posted by Commercecomet24

You know it?s funny I hate the Yankees but the Mick and Brooks Robinson and Jim Palmer, were my first Baseball hero?s.

I honestly am a fan of any of the greats of the game regardless of if I hate their team lol

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Never saw Mick play or many of his highlights. I read he was pretty good on D too tho. You reckon he in top 3 or 4 with Mays, Jones, Dimaggio maybe?

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Originally Posted by dawgday166

Never saw Mick play or many of his highlights. I read he was pretty good on D too tho. You reckon he in top 3 or 4 with Mays, Jones, Dimaggio maybe?

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Urban legend is DiMaggio was jealous of Mantle when the Mick first came up. Apparently one time there was a fly ball hit to the OF and DiMaggio didn't warn the Mick about a sprinkler head in the area and Mantle tripped over it and tore his knee up. Not sure how accurate that totally is.

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Originally Posted by Todd4State

Urban legend is DiMaggio was jealous of Mantle when the Mick first came up. Apparently one time there was a fly ball hit to the OF and DiMaggio didn't warn the Mick about a sprinkler head in the area and Mantle tripped over it and tore his knee up. Not sure how accurate that totally is.

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I think I heard something like DiMaggio was jealous of Mick. Not sure about the rest tho.

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Originally Posted by dawgday166

Never saw Mick play or many of his highlights. I read he was pretty good on D too tho. You reckon he in top 3 or 4 with Mays, Jones, Dimaggio maybe?

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I?m gonna say he was more talented than any of them, just on pure talent alone. He didn?t completely realize his full potential due to the injuries and boozing but talent wise absolutely! Mick was one of the fastest guys to ever play, he ran a 3.1 from lh box to first, had a cannon for an arm and probably had more pure power than any hitter ever. He hit balls further than anyone in history. He just didn?t take care of himself. What a shame. He knew it too. He talked about it a lot toward the end of his life.

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Originally Posted by Todd4State

Urban legend is DiMaggio was jealous of Mantle when the Mick first came up. Apparently one time there was a fly ball hit to the OF and DiMaggio didn't warn the Mick about a sprinkler head in the area and Mantle tripped over it and tore his knee up. Not sure how accurate that totally is.

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Yeah it?s in micks auto biography. DiMaggio couldn?t handle the new kid with all the talent. Ignored Mickey and refused to offer any advice to him. DiMaggio had an agreement that he would always be announced as the greatest yankee ever. Great player but very egocentric.

If we say defensively Mick > Andruw we'll get State7 back over heah on this thread LOL.

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Originally Posted by dawgday166

If we say defensively Mick > Andruw we'll get State7 back over heah on this thread LOL.

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Dang dude that?s hilarious! Mick was way faster than Andruw before his injuries and had a better arm. But after the injuries and over a whole career druw was way better defensively. Mick had more talent but druw has the stats and production defensively which is what counts

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Originally Posted by Commercecomet24

Dang dude that?s hilarious! Mick was way faster than Andruw before his injuries and had a better arm. But after the injuries and over a whole career druw was way better defensively. Mick had more talent but druw has the stats and production defensively which is what counts

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From everything I?ve read about Mick, and his early footage, he was almost Bo Jackson like. He had elite speed, power, arm. The knee injury was his rookie season if I?m not mistaken, so he lost that tool almost immediately and was still arguably the best CF of the era. He hit a documented 656 ft HR at age 19. He was the greatest ?what if? in baseball history and still put up unreal numbers.

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Originally Posted by ShotgunDawg

Barry Bonds is/was better.

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Barry was/is a druggie. End of story.

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Originally Posted by BrunswickDawg

From everything I?ve read about Mick, and his early footage, he was almost Bo Jackson like. He had elite speed, power, arm. The knee injury was his rookie season if I?m not mistaken, so he lost that tool almost immediately and was still arguably the best CF of the era. He hit a documented 656 ft HR at age 19. He was the greatest ?what if? in baseball history and still put up unreal numbers.

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You?re Right about all that, Brunswick. Very good comparison to Bo. He really was genuinely a 5 tool guy. He hit more hrs over 600 feet than anyone that ever played. Lol there?s a whole website dedicated to it. Most folks don?t know but he was the number 1 RB recruit in the country and was committed to play at Oklahoma. He was the ultimate of power,speed and arm. Just a shame that the injuries and partying cost him so much. And he played through a ton of those injuries. I don?t think he ever took the field 100% healthy after his rookie year.

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Originally Posted by Todd4State

Urban legend is DiMaggio was jealous of Mantle when the Mick first came up. Apparently one time there was a fly ball hit to the OF and DiMaggio didn't warn the Mick about a sprinkler head in the area and Mantle tripped over it and tore his knee up. Not sure how accurate that totally is.

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If i'm remembering correctly mantle insinuated that he could've easily caught that ball and DiMaggio called him off late and mantle had to lay off oddly which caused him to hit the sprinkler head even more oddly leading to what doctors now say was prolly a torn ACL. So he most likely played his entire career with that torn ligament in his knee.

"All my Octobers" is a great read about his injuries and his many World Series. I read it as a kid but a lot of stuff in that book sticks with me.

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Originally Posted by shoeless joe

If i'm remembering correctly mantle insinuated that he could've easily caught that ball and DiMaggio called him off late and mantle had to lay off oddly which caused him to hit the sprinkler head even more oddly leading to what doctors now say was prolly a torn ACL. So he most likely played his entire career with that torn ligament in his knee.

"All my Octobers" is a great read about his injuries and his many World Series. I read it as a kid but a lot of stuff in that book sticks with me.

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That book is the best on Mick! The Mick is second.

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Originally Posted by ShotgunDawg

You can go either way but I take Bonds.
We don't know if Chipper used PEDS, Vlad, Hoffman, etc. We simply don't KNOW, but I truthfully believe that if you were building a baseball team from scratch with any one person to ever grace planet Earth, you would choose Barry Lamar Bonds.

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Bonds wasnt that guy before steroids.

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Originally Posted by Coach34

Bonds wasnt that guy before steroids.

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Truth. He was great but he hit another level after steroids/hgh.