Look, Ray could have played Daniels this year and won 6-8 SEC games

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Originally Posted by NewTweederEndzoneDance

Vandy is a perennial tournament-caliber team that struggled this year due to a lot of injuries. They are still coached by a good coach that has been there for years building that program, and are not in rebuilding mode. I didn't bring them up to compare our programs, I brought them up as part of the point that no one wins with 7-8 total players.

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but they are still a significantly better team than us by overall record, by conference record, and even moreso when you consider SoS. yeah, sure no one "wins" (and by wins i'm assuming you mean wins big, at least NCAA bubble level season) with 7 or 8 active players, sure i'll grant you that. BUT NO ONE THAT'S BEEN SKEPTICAL OF RAY'S JOB THUS FAR ACTUALLY EXPECTED US TO COMPETE FOR THE NCAA THIS YEAR. so that's a moot point. most of us questioning ray thought we should be around vandy's level in the W and L columns this year to show us that things are heading in the right direction (~.500 overall record, 7 conference Ws), but despite a much much weaker schedule, we are significantly off vandy's pace.

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Originally Posted by engie

So, we'll go ahead and throw your hat in the "sell your soul for a few more wins in year 2 of a rebuild that still doesn't get us even close to the postseason" crowd then...

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That type of stupidity is amazing. People that think Daniels should have played this year probably have trouble figuring out how to get out of a room if the door closed

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Originally Posted by NewTweederEndzoneDance

Vandy is a perennial tournament-caliber team that struggled this year due to a lot of injuries. They are still coached by a good coach that has been there for years building that program, and are not in rebuilding mode. I didn't bring them up to compare our programs, I brought them up as part of the point that no one wins with 7-8 total players.

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I guess Vandy didn't get the Memo that your only supposed to win 3 conference games with 8 scholarship players

Borchet is gone, how do we know Daniel will be as good as Borchert? Borchert had better JUCO credentials. He was probably our best three point shooter. We suxed big time with Borchert why will it be different with Daniel? The only place where Ray can improve our team will be at the guard position and just who has he signed to make us better at the guard position. The big 6'11" guy might can help Ware out, I hope so. Houston and Black will furnish some depth. Houston might be Rays best recruit. Dunlap is small but he can shoot, Let's hope Ray can figure out how to get him some shoots. Fred and the Chicken will continue to be our best players and they are flawed offensively. With a full roster maybe we will be a pressure defensive team that covers up our pitiful offense.

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Originally Posted by engie

So, we'll go ahead and throw your hat in the "sell your soul for a few more wins in year 2 of a rebuild that still doesn't get us even close to the postseason" crowd then...

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fwiw, not ever ray skeptic thinks we should have played daniels half a season. that would be very short sighted and likely not made much difference in the final outcome of the season. especially since we don't even know if daniels is a difference maker at all. so let's not group all ray skeptics into the some short-sighted reactionary group, just like it's unfair to group all of us into the the "hope rick ray fails" group and the stans lovers group.

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Originally Posted by tcdog70

Borchet is gone, how do we know Daniel will be as good as Borchert? Borchert had better JUCO credentials. He was probably our best three point shooter. We suxed big time with Borchert why will it be different with Daniel? The only place where Ray can improve our team will be at the guard position and just who has he signed to make us better at the guard position. The big 6'11" guy might can help Ware out, I hope so. Houston and Black will furnish some depth. Houston might be Rays best recruit. Dunlap is small but he can shoot, Let's hope Ray can figure out how to get him some shoots. Fred and the Chicken will continue to be our best players and they are flawed offensively. With a full roster maybe we will be a pressure defensive team that covers up our pitiful offense.

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Tookie is probably his best so far. Hope he sticks with us.

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Originally Posted by dawgs

fwiw, not ever ray skeptic thinks we should have played daniels half a season. that would be very short sighted and likely not made much difference in the final outcome of the season. especially since we don't even know if daniels is a difference maker at all. so let's not group all ray skeptics into the some short-sighted reactionary group, just like it's unfair to group all of us into the the "hope rick ray fails" group and the stans lovers group.

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I wasn't trying to "group" everyone in with my statement at all. There are logical, completely fair points of view that are skeptical right now. Yours is one of those views IMO. Hence how I'm still seeing and responding to your posts right now, unlike many in this thread -- that have made my reading experience at Elite infinitely more enjoyable since I hid them.

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Originally Posted by tcdog70

Borchet is gone, how do we know Daniel will be as good as Borchert? Borchert had better JUCO credentials.

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Not defensively. I think we could bring someone in handicapped to play D as well as Borchert. Playing basketball is not just about shooting it

You guys are acting like Daniels is Malik Newman. It's usually the best idea to actually use the players you had originally planned for. We are probably not the worst power6 conference in the nation if Ray manages to convince Steele to play, Lewis to stop smoking weed, Daniels to pass algebra, Applewhite to not quit and doesn't tie up a scholarship in Ndoye this year. That's 5 players. An entire lineup able to play at once. More than a third of his roster. To give Ray a total pass on this is ridiculous.

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Originally Posted by Dawg61

You guys are acting like Daniels is Malik Newman.

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No, we are pointing out that Daniels is better than Borchert. We are pointing out that having him for the next 2 years is way more valuable to the program than wasting him in a meaningless year. We are building the program for the long haul- not some quick fix. We now have out starting frontcourt for the next 2 years set.

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Originally Posted by Coach34

No, we are pointing out that Daniels is better than Borchert. We are pointing out that having him for the next 2 years is way more valuable to the program than wasting him in a meaningless year. We are building the program for the long haul- not some quick fix. We now have out starting frontcourt for the next 2 years set.

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I'm glad Daniels is better than Borchert. No more saving scholarships and players till next year planning though. That's been done for two years now. 3rd year have the roster full of ELIGIBLE players and quit saving the last scholarship. Somebody needs to hand out some "love" to an eligible transfer or three too. Tennessee added the PG from Memphis this year and GTech added their starting PG as well. Players are out there. 400 of them transfer every single year.

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Originally Posted by Coach34

No, we are pointing out that Daniels is better than Borchert. We are pointing out that having him for the next 2 years is way more valuable to the program than wasting him in a meaningless year. We are building the program for the long haul- not some quick fix. We now have out starting frontcourt for the next 2 years set.

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Now how do you know he is better than Borchert? That is just some more of your spin and looking into the crystal ball.
So far your predictions have been a big fail. What have you predicted that has actually proven to be true? Daniel might be better than Borchert but we will have to wait and see.

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Originally Posted by Dawg61

I'm glad Daniels is better than Borchert. No more saving scholarships and players till next year planning though. That's been done for two years now. 3rd year have the roster full of ELIGIBLE players and quit saving the last scholarship. Somebody needs to hand out some "love" to an eligible transfer or three too. Tennessee added the PG from Memphis this year and GTech added their starting PG as well. Players are out there. 400 of them transfer every single year.

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In this post, you advocate (like you have previously) for a full roster next year (and rightfully so). Yet, you want us to grab a transfer (also a good idea), who by definition, would have to sit out a year. So which is it? You can't have 13 eligible players and a scholarship devoted to a non-eligible transfer player.

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Originally Posted by Coach34

Not defensively. I think we could bring someone in handicapped to play D as well as Borchert. Playing basketball is not just about shooting it

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You are correct, we don't need to score just play defense. Oh wait, we tried that and lost 14 in a row. Those games we score 45 points in, you better have some badass defense. So far RR 's team can't play either offense or defense. I guess if we could play one or the other , shit that would be an improvement .

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Originally Posted by Coach34

Playing basketball is not just about shooting it

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Yes, and apparently our team likes to demonstrate this concept to us in most every game.

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Originally Posted by Brad Stevens

In this post, you advocate (like you have previously) for a full roster next year (and rightfully so). Yet, you want us to grab a transfer (also a good idea), who by definition, would have to sit out a year. So which is it? You can't have 13 eligible players and a scholarship devoted to a non-eligible transfer player.

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Both transfer players I referenced were eligible immediately this year. So that's the type of transfer I'm talking about. Not the ones that have to sit out a year.

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Originally Posted by tcdog70

Now how do you know he is better than Borchert? .

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I've had 2 people that know basketball tell me he was. One thinks he's better than Ware

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Originally Posted by Dawg61

GTech added their starting PG as well.

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Trae Golden sucks. The fact you think that would be a good transfer for us just further confirms my thoughts about your basketball knowledge. It is amazing the amount of crap you've thrown against the wall in this whole thing.

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Originally Posted by smootness

Trae Golden sucks

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He's better than any PG we are putting on the floor. It'd take Bloodman eight years to get as many wins as Golden has.

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Originally Posted by Coach34

I've had 2 people that know basketball tell me he was. One thinks he's better than Ware

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Went to the Callaway game tonight. First, Laurel gave them all that they had. Great game - Callaway won in OT w/o MN scoring a point. Rick Ray was at the game. Seems to be a sharp guy - wearing his MSU maroon shirt and matching maroon shoes. What bothered me is he stood by himself most of the game. People must not know him, as nobody really approached him to talk. He sat with Coach Williams and talked to him most of the game. Here is what I heard from some good sources (one of them a well-known coach). 1) A State asst coach told one guy that Daniels may be our best player right now. 2) The kid from Montgomery is the real deal - can play SEC ball. 3) Dunlap and Black are not SEC players. Dunlap is too small and cannot play the point, and Black cannot score. Neither had good senior years according to this coach. Jackson State will sign 2 guards that are better than Dunlap. And, when JSU played us this year, they were equal to us at every position.