Would You Go to a Football Game Today

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Originally Posted by Ezsoil

Yo homes I protect myself so I don't have to concern myself with what others do......and I do know several people who have very compromised health situations where this virus would be a death sentence...so they are taking personal responsibility for their health and self isolating...it's hard but it's the reality of their health situation. Personal responsibility...what a concept....

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You use the words "personal responsibility" but are readily admitting that you will do exactly the opposite. Interesting.

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Originally Posted by Liverpooldawg

Are they comfortable with the choice you made for them?

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https://media1.tenor.com/images/8107...temid=14478578

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Originally Posted by Liverpooldawg

Exactly. Very well said. In my case, I'm slightly at risk if I get it. The problem is my wife is highly at risk. She has to work, and much of it can't be done at home. She is a essential worker in an essential field. She isn't at much risk of exposure the way her work is set up. On the other hand I'm at extreme risk of getting by the nature of what I do. I'm also in a essential field. We can cut back what we do, but we can't cut it out completely and it is impossible to do at home. It's people like me and my wife that fools who show no responsibility are by their choices putting at risk. They are choosing for us. We have no choice.

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So it's others' fault that you have wisely chosen to stay in (due to your circumstances) other than when each of you has to go to work?

Even though your job or whatever you do puts you at extreme risk of being exposed?

Did you read what you typed?

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Originally Posted by gtowndawg

The evidence shows this is nothing to worry about for 98% of people. I'm not worried for myself or my family. I don't listen to the hysteria, I look at the evidence and talk to my friends in the medical community (one of which is the director for a major hospital chain in the South). I doubt my Dad will go (he's older and has a heart issue) but he's the first one to say get out there and don't worry about it. I'm not going to lick the handrails at the games or anything like that but I'm certainly not going to live my life based on hypothetical what if's that make little to no sense (and the evidence is starting to debunk anyway). Heck, I'm far more concerned about the drive to the game. Sorry, we just see it different. Not going to argue about it though. That's what the COVID thread is for.

edited: I'm sure you guys are great Bulldogs, obviously I wish you nothing but great health and professional success. I want to be clear on that one.

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Careful. People will start throwing out hypothetical graphs and charts and crucify you telling you that numbers don't lie for suggesting they are in fact hypothetical what if's.

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Originally Posted by StateDawg44

So it's others' fault that you have wisely chosen to stay in (due to your circumstances) other than when each of you has to go to work?

Even though your job or whatever you do puts you at extreme risk of being exposed?

Did you read what you typed?

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You obviously didn't. If you go to the game and get it and then have to use my services then by going to the game you put me at risk. You made the choice for me. I had no input at all. If I get it from you then the odds of my at risk wife having a real problem are pretty high. You guys' stance is I can do whatever the heck I want to and it affects no one but me. That just isn't true.

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Originally Posted by StateDawg44

So it's others' fault that you have wisely chosen to stay in (due to your circumstances) other than when each of you has to go to work?

Even though your job or whatever you do puts you at extreme risk of being exposed?

Did you read what you typed?

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Yeah but he's not putting anyone in danger because he HAS to go*****

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Originally Posted by Homedawg

Yeah but he's not putting anyone in danger because he HAS to go*****

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I do have to go in certain circumstances. No choice. But hey, as long as you can go have fun at a football game then who cares about that.

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Originally Posted by Liverpooldawg

You obviously didn't. If you go to the game and get it and then have to use my services then by going to the game you put me at risk. You made the choice for me. I had no input at all. If I get it from you then the odds of my at risk wife having a real problem are pretty high. You guys' stance is I can do whatever the heck I want to and it affects no one but me. That just isn't true.

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Lulz. No, it's pretty clear cut what you said. Not a complex statement at all.

I guess you should just quit your job and find a new one that doesn't put you at such high risk.

Oh wait, you can't get a new one because nowhere is hiring.

Guess you won't do that so we should all just bow down to your requests.

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Originally Posted by Liverpooldawg

You are dead wrong there. As it stands now, and that was the question, if you are part of a crowd you are putting others at risk. That's what most people can't seem to get through their heads, it's not about you.

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You can choose to get it now or you can choose to hole everyone up and kill the economy and then still end up giving everyone the virus anyway. The sooner you come to grips with the fact that most people are going to get this the sooner you Can stop perpetuating this bull shit. People wanting to close everything down until we have “a cure” are the selfish ones because they can’t see anything that isn’t 2 feet in front of them. If old people are scared to get the virus, old people can quarantine themselves. If you work with old people, quarantine yourself. Everyone else needs to do what they do on a daily basis so we can all get this and move on with our lives.

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Originally Posted by StateDawg44

Lulz. No, it's pretty clear cut what you said. Not a complex statement at all.

I guess you should just quit your job and find a new one that doesn't put you at such high risk.

Oh wait, you can't get a new one because nowhere is hiring.

Guess you won't do that so we should all just bow down to your requests.

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Yeah, lets get people to quit their jobs and stay home so you can go to a football game.

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Originally Posted by Liverpooldawg

Yeah, lets get people to quit their jobs and stay home so you can go to a football game.

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Then you are a risk also in your own eyes. Cant have it both ways.

You can't throw your blanket statements accusing "fools who show no responsibility" of being the problem and try to limit it to just one event to fit your opinion.

Although, you've already proven you are going to point fingers at others to fit your own needs.

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Originally Posted by Liverpooldawg

You use the words "personal responsibility" but are readily admitting that you will do exactly the opposite. Interesting.

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How am I doing the exact opposite? I am controlling that which I can control.....that IS the definition of personal responsibility...having "you people " tell me how i should interact with the world is quite interesting....

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Originally Posted by Liverpooldawg

Yeah, lets get people to quit their jobs and stay home so you can go to a football game.

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Here's the way I see it, we can have football and I will be exposed, if I haven't already. And you can stay at home and go to work and you will be exposed, if you haven't already. OR we can not have football and the exact same thing will happen. We will both be exposed at some point. I"ll choose option A. You choose option B. And you can choose option B and bitch about me choosing option A, which made zero difference is us both getting exposed at some point.

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Originally Posted by Homedawg

Here's the way I see it, we can have football and I will be exposed, if I haven't already. And you can stay at home and go to work and you will be exposed, if you haven't already. OR we can not have football and the exact same thing will happen. We will both be exposed at some point. I"ll choose option A. You choose option B. And you can choose option B and bitch about me choosing option A, which made zero difference is us both getting exposed at some point.

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I can't rep this enough.

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Originally Posted by Homedawg

Here's the way I see it, we can have football and I will be exposed, if I haven't already. And you can stay at home and go to work and you will be exposed, if you haven't already. OR we can not have football and the exact same thing will happen. We will both be exposed at some point. I"ll choose option A. You choose option B. And you can choose option B and bitch about me choosing option A, which made zero difference is us both getting exposed at some point.

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And if the survival rate % of this virus was a paternity test result, we’d all be paying child support. Even the old people.

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Originally Posted by Todd4State

The only thing that can "beat" this is a vaccine or herd immunity. Staying inside and quarantining ourselves also may make the disease worse in the long run because it could cause the disease to last longer. There are advantages to exposure. There are disadvantages to quarantining ourselves for a long period of time too.

The bottom line for me is if you feel OK going out and doing things- do it. If you feel guilty about maybe getting someone sick or don't feel safe to go out- then don't.

But it's not anyone else's place to tell someone that they are being "selfish" or put them on a big guilt trip because they want to go out and live their life. It's also not my place to tell someone that doesn't feel safe that they don't have the right to stay inside. So yeah- it goes both ways.

The problem is somehow the focus has shifted from what flattening the curve was supposed to do and was intended to do which was not overwhelm the health care system so that we wouldn't be in a situation where we would have to pick and choose who gets a vent and who doesn't and make decisions like that. I'm in a hot spot and we haven't had to make those decisions. I'm very thankful for that. And here's the reality- yes, as we open things up there will be a spike. And the media will freak out and I probably won't be able to get toilet paper. But because we flattened the curve at least the people that need vents and things like that our healthcare system won't be overwhelmed and we will have actually saved lives because we won't have to make those difficult decisions. And I do envision that it won't be as bad as the first wave simply because more people have antibodies built up.

Somehow it has gotten to be we just need to stay inside until we wake up and this is gone- even if it takes years. And that's not the right way to approach this to beat it. You talk about it being a war- it's pretty rare to win a war by just hunkering down the entire time.

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Originally Posted by Leeshouldveflanked

If you are older than 60 or have pre-existing conditions stay at home. The mortality rate based on positive Covid cases for those under 60 is .004.... if you throw in the non symptomatic people who haven?t been tested, it will be even lower.

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Originally Posted by Liverpooldawg

Yeah, lets get people to quit their jobs and stay home so you can go to a football game.

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How does me choosing to attend a game that you don't want to attend affect you?

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Originally Posted by StateDawg44

Then you are a risk also in your own eyes. Cant have it both ways.

You can't throw your blanket statements accusing "fools who show no responsibility" of being the problem and try to limit it to just one event to fit your opinion.

Although, you've already proven you are going to point fingers at others to fit your own needs.

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My risk is one I am required to take to do a necessary job. You want to risk everybody so you can go to a ballgame.

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Originally Posted by Ezsoil

How am I doing the exact opposite? I am controlling that which I can control.....that IS the definition of personal responsibility...having "you people " tell me how i should interact with the world is quite interesting....

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You are taking personal responsibility only up to where it affects you. You refuse to even acknowledge that you personally might be responsible for harming others. You are actually taking no real personal responsibility for your actions whatsoever. If you were really taking responsibility for your actions no one would need to tell you what to do, you would already be doing it.

Yep. without hesitation

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Originally Posted by Liverpooldawg

My risk is one I am required to take to do a necessary job. You want to risk everybody so you can go to a ballgame.

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You. Are. Going. To. Get. This. Virus. No. Matter. What. Especially. If. You. Are. Essential. And. Already. Working. In. The. Public.

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Originally Posted by Ezsoil

How does me choosing to attend a game that you don't want to attend affect you?

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You have no symptoms but you go to your game. You infect the people you come in contact with. Monday one of them needs my services but he isn't symptomatic yet. You probably just gave it to me. By the time it's over you are the direct cause of an outbreak that sickens hundreds, all over a ballgame. Doing it because you have to be at work or out buying groceries is one thing, doing it because of a ballgame is something else. Its why I don't think you will see fans at games this fall, even if they ARE played. This thing is going to have to recede significantly before that happens. It is showing no sign of it yet even with the restrictions.

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Originally Posted by Jarius

You. Are. Going. To. Get. This. Virus. No. Matter. What. Especially. If. You. Are. Essential. And. Already. Working. In. The. Public.

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I accepted that back in January when I first read about it. Some of you don't know the difference between concern for others and fear. I've already been very closely exposed at least once. I was lucky that time. It won't last forever now that things are ramping up. That doesn't mean I automatically think everyone else should too like most of y'all. Y'all have already made it very plain that a football game is more important to you than the old folks you know.

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Originally Posted by Liverpooldawg

I accepted that back in January when I first read about it. Some of you don't know the difference between concern for others and fear. I've already been very closely exposed at least once. I was lucky that time. It won't last forever now that things are ramping up. That doesn't mean I automatically think everyone else should too like most of y'all. Y'all have already made it very plain that a football game is more important to you than the old folks you know.

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What we have made clear is that everyone is going to get it anyway, so not having football game crowds is absolutely pointless unless the hospitals are going to be overwhelmed by patients because of large events. Not having large events isn’t going to save lives.

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Originally Posted by Liverpooldawg

My risk is one I am required to take to do a necessary job. You want to risk everybody so you can go to a ballgame.

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So I guess you didn't like my response. Thus no comeback.

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Originally Posted by Homedawg

Here's the way I see it, we can have football and I will be exposed, if I haven't already. And you can stay at home and go to work and you will be exposed, if you haven't already. OR we can not have football and the exact same thing will happen. We will both be exposed at some point. I"ll choose option A. You choose option B. And you can choose option B and bitch about me choosing option A, which made zero difference is us both getting exposed at some point.

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If it was just YOU at the football game then fine. I'd suggest you take a look at what the Liverpool Echo has to say about the A. Madrid @ Liverpool game back in March. That match should never have been held. It's not just the game, it's everything that went with such a mass attended event. At work we are going to extreme lengths to try to prevent spread. We have been issued regulations by the government right down to how the toliet can be used and what we wear home, and it's a very small number of people involved in delivering a vital service. It's not even remotely the same thing. It makes you look more than a bit ..........I won't go there.

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Originally Posted by Liverpooldawg

You have no symptoms but you go to your game. You infect the people you come in contact with. Monday one of them needs my services but he isn't symptomatic yet. You probably just gave it to me. By the time it's over you are the direct cause of an outbreak that sickens hundreds, all over a ballgame. Doing it because you have to be at work or out buying groceries is one thing, doing it because of a ballgame is something else. Its why I don't think you will see fans at games this fall, even if they ARE played. This thing is going to have to recede significantly before that happens. It is showing no sign of it yet even with the restrictions.

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Dude, I'll have a mask, glasses and gloves on....I'll be protected...if others aren't protected, don't blame me for them getting a virus...if you don't protect yourself, don't blame me if you get the virus....

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Originally Posted by Jarius

What we have made clear is that everyone is going to get it anyway, so not having football game crowds is absolutely pointless unless the hospitals are going to be overwhelmed by patients because of large events. Not having large events isn’t going to save lives.

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Large events mean large spikes . See the Liverpool Echo today. Y'all have made it very clear where your priorities are. Lives don't matter, football does. I love sports and missi it terribly, but some things are more important. You can live without sports.

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Originally Posted by Liverpooldawg

If it was just YOU at the football game then fine. I'd suggest you take a look at what the Liverpool Echo has to say about the A. Madrid @ Liverpool game back in March. That match should never have been held. It's not just the game, it's everything that went with such a mass attended event. At work we are going to extreme lengths to try to prevent spread. We have been issued regulations by the government right down to how the toliet can be used and what we wear home, and it's a very small number of people involved in delivering a vital service. It's not even remotely the same thing. It makes you look more than a bit ..........I won't go there.

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Clearly you didn't read a word I said. And you don't know what you are talking about. The point of slowing the spread was for hospitals. Nobody has said jack about "preventing " the spread. I suggest this if you want to be sure you are sure you don't get it, or prevent it, in you words, lock yourself at home for about, oh maybe the rest of your life. It ain't going away.

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Originally Posted by Ezsoil

Dude, I'll have a mask, glasses and gloves on....I'll be protected...if others aren't protected, don't blame me for them getting a virus...if you don't protect yourself, don't blame me if you get the virus....

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Lol, I bet you actually believe that don't you. You don't wear a mask in public to protect yourself, unless it's an N95 and you better not be burning one of those so you can sit and watch a ballgame.). It protects others from you. Gloves are no better than your bare hands (for protection from respiratory viruses) unless you fully understand exactly what they do and, more importantly, don't do for you. Your comment says you in no way have any concept of that.

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Originally Posted by Liverpooldawg

Large events mean large spikes . See the Liverpool Echo today. Y'all have made it very clear where your priorities are. Lives don't matter, football does. I love sports and missi it terribly, but some things are more important. You can live without sports.

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And for the last time, people are going to die. It sucks. But slowing it doesn't stop death but you can't comprehend that. But glad you get a paycheck since you're so essential. Lots on here dont and I'm not talking about me.

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Originally Posted by Homedawg

Clearly you didn't read a word I said. And you don't know what you are talking about. The point of slowing the spread was for hospitals. Nobody has said jack about "preventing " the spread. I suggest this if you want to be sure you are sure you don't get it, or prevent it, in you words, lock yourself at home for about, oh maybe the rest of your life. It ain't going away.

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I read it. The slowing of the spread is EXACTLY what I'm talking about. Y'all don't even understand this enough to really discuss it. See the Echo today to see what a game can do to accelerate the spread. Y'all don't want to hear this because you want to go to the game no matter what. You have made this perfectly plain. It's all about you and your fun.

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Originally Posted by Liverpooldawg

I read it. The slowing of the spread is EXACTLY what I'm talking about. Y'all don't even understand this enough to really discuss it. See the Echo today to see what a game can do to accelerate the spread. Y'all don't want to hear this because you want to go to the game no matter what. You have made this perfectly plain. It's all about you and your fun.

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My stance has ZERO to do w a game. It has everything to do w having a country left to live in. We are really close to economic disaster. We don't have two years plus to keep the growth slow. Hell we don't have two more months. But it's too hard for you to see mr essential. And yeah I do understand it. I understand completely it's just doesn't mirror your thoughts.

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Originally Posted by Liverpooldawg

I read it. The slowing of the spread is EXACTLY what I'm talking about. Y'all don't even understand this enough to really discuss it. See the Echo today to see what a game can do to accelerate the spread. Y'all don't want to hear this because you want to go to the game no matter what. You have made this perfectly plain. It's all about you and your fun.

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You're exactly damn right. Some of us, and by the looks of it a large majority of us, want to go to a game. We want to be back around friends that we care about supporting a team that we love to cheer and bitch about on a daily basis. Some of us are looking forward to normal. And to be honest, it doesn't really matter what you, me, or anyone on this board thinks about when/if we should attend a sporting event. There's people that are paid quite handsomely to make those decisions. And if they decide that it's safe to be there then you can bet your ass I'm going to be there. But here's the thing with you saying that WE don't really know enough to discuss it, if you know so much then why aren't you the one making those decisions, why aren't you the one up at press conferences giving us updates. YOU'RE NOT. You're just like the rest of us, you have an opinion and you want to voice it, that's fine. But calling people out on their opinions and how they feel on a subject is completely over the line.

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Originally Posted by Homedawg

My stance has ZERO to do w a game. It has everything to do w having a country left to live in. We are really close to economic disaster. But it's too hard for you to see mr essential. And yeah I do understand it. I understand completely it's just doesn't mirror your thoughts.

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Yeah if this goes much longer there ain't gonna be much left. I've got friends on the verge of losing everything they've worked there whole lives for because of a bug that 98+% will survive and majority won't even need medical treatment. This virus won't be a drop in the bucket compared to the economic devastation and lives shattered because of this shutdown.I guess those of us that want things flowing again will be labeled murderers next. Smh.

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Originally Posted by Homedawg

And for the last time, people are going to die. It sucks. But slowing it doesn't stop death but you can't comprehend that. But glad you get a paycheck since you're so essential. Lots on here dont and I'm not talking about me.

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You can't comprehend that slowing the spread DOES prevent deaths. The longer we have to figure it out the more we can save. It's already happening to some degree. Y'all have made it plain you don't care. By the way, I'm NOT getting enough of a paycheck to sustain my business, which I own. Emergency stuff doesn't pay the bills. Another couple of months and I go under. I totally understand the other side. I just don't get people being so uncaring about mass death. I especially don't get it over something that is essentially entertainment. Mass events are not going to happen under current conditions. I want the same things you want, and preventing (or using the only word you seem to be able to understand, slowing) the spread as much as we can to allow for medical advancement is the only real way it is going to happen. If it doesn't change through a vaccine or treatment we won't see masss attended events for at least 18 months. By that time it will have killed enough and sickened enough that maybe it will subside on its own. The thing is, we don't even know if herd immunity is possible. The track record of viruses like this one is not encouraging. It's probabaly going to behave like the flu, except it is more contagious and kills more. I personally think the best case is a vaccine that works about like the one for flu.

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Originally Posted by Commercecomet24

Yeah if this goes much longer there ain't gonna be much left. I've got friends on the verge of losing everything they've worked there whole lives for because of a bug that 98+% will survive and majority won't even need medical treatment. This virus won't be a drop in the bucket compared to the economic devastation and lives shattered because of this shutdown.I guess those of us that want things flowing again will be labeled murderers next. Smh.

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Perfectly said. But if we go out to quick it will spike***

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Originally Posted by StarkVegasSteve

You're exactly damn right. Some of us, and by the looks of it a large majority of us, want to go to a game. We want to be back around friends that we care about supporting a team that we love to cheer and bitch about on a daily basis. Some of us are looking forward to normal. And to be honest, it doesn't really matter what you, me, or anyone on this board thinks about when/if we should attend a sporting event. There's people that are paid quite handsomely to make those decisions. And if they decide that it's safe to be there then you can bet your ass I'm going to be there. But here's the thing with you saying that WE don't really know enough to discuss it, if you know so much then why aren't you the one making those decisions, why aren't you the one up at press conferences giving us updates. YOU'RE NOT. You're just like the rest of us, you have an opinion and you want to voice it, that's fine. But calling people out on their opinions and how they feel on a subject is completely over the line.

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i have just seen so much here that is blatantly contrary to the science. Its hard not to ....go over the line. Take the guy above who says he is protected because he is wearing gloves and mask..........unreal.

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Originally Posted by Homedawg

Perfectly said. But if we go out to quick it will spike***

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I think I'm gonna name my next dog spike or covid just for the heck of it lol!

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Originally Posted by Liverpooldawg

You can't comprehend that slowing the spread DOES prevent deaths. The longer we have to figure it out the more we can save. It's already happening to some degree. Y'all have made it plain you don't care. By the way, I'm NOT getting enough of a paycheck to sustain my business, which I own. Emergency stuff doesn't pay the bills. Another couple of months and I go under. I totally understand the other side. I just don't get people being so uncaring about mass death. I especially don't get it over something that is essentially entertainment. Mass events are not going to happen under current conditions. I want the same things you want, and preventing (or using the only word you seem to be able to understand, slowing) the spread as much as we can to allow for medical advancement is the only real way it is going to happen. If it doesn't change through a vaccine or treatment we won't see masss attended events for at least 18 months. By that time it will have killed enough and sickened enough that maybe it will subside on its own. The thing is, we don't even know if herd immunity is possible. The track record of viruses like this one is not encouraging. It's probabaly going to behave like the flu, except it is more contagious and kills more. I personally think the best case is a vaccine that works about like the one for flu.

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So we don't know if herd immunity is possible and if a vaccine will work. Your words. But let's sit around and destroy the country. And AGAIN, this has nothing to do w mass entertainment or football or whatever. Guess you don't care about the thousands that wont be able to afford to eat or kill themselves then either. Works both ways. And you can agree w this or not but if our food and farming situation doesn't improve and improve quickly, nobody will be able to afford to plant a crop or find any meat to eat. We have to go. NOW.

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Originally Posted by Homedawg

So we don't know if herd immunity is possible and if a vaccine will work. Your words. But let's sit around and destroy the country. And AGAIN, this has nothing to do w mass entertainment or football or whatever. Guess you don't care about the thousands that wont be able to afford to eat or kill themselves then either. Works both ways. And you can agree w this or not but if our food and farming situation doesn't improve and improve quickly, nobody will be able to afford to plant a crop or find any meat to eat. We have to go. NOW.

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Yes yes yes! Here's something I've been following. With the global shutdown, predications are showing by the end of the year 250 million will be in danger of starving to death if the food supply chain is not started back and soon. So what do we do with those 250 million? Just say sorry folks we couldn't go to work because of a bug with 98% survival rate. Everyone's so focused on the damn virus they're not considering all the repercussions of the shutdown.