Let's not screw this up, we have to hire Billy Napier, regardless of the EB result...

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11-21-2019, 11:41 AM
dantheman4248

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cooterpoot

And they’ve won 4 games, with a better defense.
Got to have some balance. You can’t be one dimensional without far superior talent.

They also have a way tougher OOC schedule (4-0 to 2-2 due to it). Going from 1 to 2 (god forbid 3) SEC wins is improvement on their end.
11-21-2019, 11:51 AM
tcdog70

with all that said and done--Hud's resume' is more impressive. he has more experience and more years to compare. He runs the exact offense that we are looking for. he doesn't require a 3 year turnaround-- he gets results immediately.
11-21-2019, 12:05 PM
Pipedream

Quote:

Originally Posted by tcdog70

with all that said and done--Hud's resume' is more impressive. he has more experience and more years to compare. He runs the exact offense that we are looking for. he doesn't require a 3 year turnaround-- he gets results immediately.

In what way, world, or universe is Hud's resume more impressive than Napier or Norvell? Hell McElwain has a more impressive resume than Hud (not condoning McE, he's bad).
11-21-2019, 12:06 PM
DeviousDawg

Quote:

Originally Posted by tcdog70

with all that said and done--Hud's resume' is more impressive. he has more experience and more years to compare. He runs the exact offense that we are looking for. he doesn't require a 3 year turnaround-- he gets results immediately.

I've been against it for years, maybe the familiarity made it seem like it would be settling. However, this debacle of the last 2 years has made me come to a realization, we know what will work here, why be cute and try to fix what ain't broke. RTGDF, can't say it enough. Hud would do just that. Not sexy, at all, but he has proven he can win time and time again. He's a great fit and has rejuvenated his coaching career at Austin Peay. Right now I would have Hud as 3rd on the list behind Norvell and Napier. If all 3 of those guys say no or can't come to an agreement, you might as well keep Moorehead, retain this years recruiting class, and try again next year.

Hud would do just fine here, undoubtedly better than what Moorehead has done.
11-21-2019, 12:44 PM
Dawgfan77

The beauty in all this is
A. This fan base is as united as we have been since 2014
B. If Napier turns us down (Highly doubt he would) then we can go get Hud

If we go the OC way Sark wouldn?t be a bad hire
11-21-2019, 12:57 PM
TrapGame

I'm fine with Norvell, Napier or Hud. I'm not a huge fanboy of Hud's but it may be time to offer him the captain's chair. If we pull Norvell, the rumors be damned, that will be seen nationally as a home run hire.
11-21-2019, 12:57 PM
Coursesuper

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dawgfan77

The beauty in all this is
A. This fan base is as united as we have been since 2014
B. If Napier turns us down (Highly doubt he would) then we can go get Hud

If we go the OC way Sark wouldn?t be a bad hire

If this is progressing like we think, they better have this already figured out. There have been more than five weeks between today and the Nuke of the TN performance, it better be damn near figured out by now.
11-21-2019, 01:03 PM
Irondawg

If you hired Napier would you be ok with him being HC and calling the plays? Worked ok for Mullen but it hasn't worked at all for Joe and I think it's always 50/50 if people can balance both. The positive is I assume Napier is already doing it at ULL.
11-21-2019, 01:19 PM
Tbonewannabe

Quote:

Originally Posted by Irondawg

If you hired Napier would you be ok with him being HC and calling the plays? Worked ok for Mullen but it hasn't worked at all for Joe and I think it's always 50/50 if people can balance both. The positive is I assume Napier is already doing it at ULL.

I would think the issues usually would show up in other ways and not the actual playcalling. Our actual playcalling under Joe is hot garbage. I think one thing is that head coaches have to figure out how to balance all the other needs of a head coach. I think it took Mullen a couple of years to know how to balance it. The good thing with Napier is that he has already called plays against SEC teams so the speed isn't going to overwhelm him.
11-21-2019, 01:31 PM
PGHBulldogBG

I’m fine with Napier but please no McE. We already saw that experience at Florida.
11-21-2019, 01:56 PM
ShotgunDawg

Quote:

Originally Posted by PGHBulldogBG

I’m fine with Napier but please no McE. We already saw that experience at Florida.

McE sucks. I can't believe anyone would consider him
11-21-2019, 02:09 PM
Percho

Quote:

Originally Posted by dawgday166

That be poor to me. Needs improvement from one year to next. He been there 4 years and only got it up to 6th out of 12. Top 3 would make me feel better.

Need to take in account coach turnover. People are hiring his coaches.
11-21-2019, 03:02 PM
tcdog70

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pipedream

In what way, world, or universe is Hud's resume more impressive than Napier or Norvell? Hell McElwain has a more impressive resume than Hud (not condoning McE, he's bad).

he won at ULL-NorthAL and now APeay. That is 3 schools that sucked till he came along. Plus when He was on our staff-he was very good. name me 3 Schools that sucked that Napier and Norvell has turned around.
11-21-2019, 03:04 PM
FriarsPoint

Quote:

Originally Posted by tcdog70

he won at ULL-NorthAL and now APeay. That is 3 schools that sucked till he came along. Plus when He was on our staff-he was very good. name me 3 Schools that sucked that Napier and Norvell has turned around.

In all fairness, Hud left a mess at ULL and Napier turned it around in 1 year.
11-21-2019, 03:20 PM
MrKotter

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pipedream

In what way, world, or universe is Hud's resume more impressive than Napier or Norvell? Hell McElwain has a more impressive resume than Hud (not condoning McE, he's bad).

How is Norvell?s more impressive? Both have done well in their leagues with the difference being Hud wins his bowl games and Norvell has gone winless
11-21-2019, 03:25 PM
ShotgunDawg

Quote:

Originally Posted by DeviousDawg

I should say this, if you can get Norvell you take him, but he would have to accept before the end of this regular season, behind closed doors of course, which means he would have already accepted by now in private. You have to keep in mind that we will not be the only school looking for a coach, and while we love Mississippi State, someone with no connections to our school does not view our school and football program the way we do. It is what it is, Arkansas is probably even a better job than ours to a completely non biased observer, I'm not saying it is, just saying it could and probably is viewed that way. We can't sit around and wait for Norvell to try and leverage our offer into a better one somewhere else. If we do that we would not only miss out on Norvell, but also the rest of our top 5 choices.

Here is what I would do if I were Cohen(and its probably already happened), I would offer Norvell his asking price as long as its $6M or less(I would always rather us have to find money to pay a good coach, than save money and have a shite coach. We could pay Mullen $6M, so we can pay someone else at or just below that, the money a good coach would help bring into the program, school, and community as a whole would far outweigh the $2M or so we would save annually by hiring a shite coach, this is the SEC, money should never be the problem, EVER.) Anyway... I'd throw $6M at Norvell, and tell him you are our #1, we would love to have you and be the last job you ever take, however, we are giving you 48 hours to talk to your family and advisors, and give us a decision in writing. If he hasn't accepted within 48 hours, I tell him good luck but we have to move on. If he doesn't accept $6M within a reasonable time from of 48 hours, he was never gonna accept it. I think Cohen has learned this lesson and will give the long shot big name guys atop the list offers, but shot clocks too. We can and will be played by coaches and their agents, its the way it works. It's as simple as this, offer what they want as long as it is let's say $6M or less(we can easily make that work, now is not the time to be frugal), give them no more than a couple days to decide, if they haven't accepted within that time frame, move on. If you dick around trying to get guys out of your league, you end up losing out on a chance with the realistic guys in the middle of your list, and end up settling for someone who wasn't even on the initial list. You see this happen every year over and over again, usually to schools that perceive themselves as a program 2-3 levels above what they are in reality. Yes, I think we are capable of hiring "the guy" type coaches, like top tier coaches, however, I think we have to find them just before they became "the guy". Give Napier a couple years and we might be laughing at the thought of us thinking he would want to be our coach.

When Norvell's 48 hours is up, I would throw $4.5M at Napier with plans to have him at $6M by 2023 if he meets his annual goals, I would then give him until December 1st to decide, with the understanding that other offers may be made between now and then, so if he wants it, the sooner he accepts it, the better, for both parties. This guy would get us back on track, he has shown he has the ability to be (maybe) an elite recruiter, he also has learned to coach from the best and runs the gd football, and at an elite level.

Napier is the right fit in all the places that Moorehead was not. Our program has slid the past 2 years, but luckily our talent level has not as we have recruited at the same or even better level than we were under Mullen. This means the right fit could step in and have us back competing as early as next year. What's even better is that Napier has shown that he can install, and successfully run his offense at a high level in year 1, he has done this everywhere he has been, in year 1. I would be ecstatic if we could pull Norvell, but I do have some questions, whereas with Napier I have less. However, I believe Norvell's ceiling may be a tad bit higher than Napier's, but at this point that's nothing more than a semi-educated guess. Norvell = SEXY pick with a few question marks; Napier = realistic & perfect fit. I'd be more than happy with both, offer both their asking price, with a shorter leash on Norvell. If they both don't accept pretty much on the spot, they never were, so you move on. Cohen is going to get it right this time, I trust him. He's our guy and he is learning from his mistakes, while recognizing what and where it went wrong. I'm pretty confident Norvell or Napier is our next guy, and judging by today's onslaught of "prepare for Moorehead's firing" talking points from MSU's chosen talking heads, it seems like someone has accepted. I am 100% guessing here, but I wouldn't be surprised if that were case. I do feel bad for Joe, great guy, just not our guy. He will land on his feet making 7 digits somewhere as an OC. Some guys just don't have what it takes internally to be a HC, Moorehead is example #1. I can only thank him for bringing in some good recruiting classes, comparatively, and giving us his best shot.

Yup Yup Yup
11-21-2019, 09:24 PM
BhamDawg205

Quote:

Originally Posted by Todd4State

I think he would improve our recruiting because he has seen how Saban does it. That's what happened at Georgia when Smart took over and copied the same formula. Alabama has a system for selling their program to players- and I'm talking about legally here.

Napier currently has the number one class in the Sun Belt right now. And if ULL can implement his recruiting machine MSU can certainly do it too.

Well Alabama does sell itself, but those black Charger swag bags don't hurt either
11-21-2019, 09:40 PM
OLJWales

Devious Dawg is Napier's wife or part time squeeze. Either way, I'm sold. Hire the dude.
11-21-2019, 10:03 PM
Cooterpoot

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dawgfan77

The beauty in all this is
A. This fan base is as united as we have been since 2014
B. If Napier turns us down (Highly doubt he would) then we can go get Hud

If we go the OC way Sark wouldn?t be a bad hire

Hud ain’t on our list.
11-21-2019, 10:05 PM
DeputyDawg94

Quote:

Originally Posted by ShotgunDawg

McE sucks. I can't believe anyone would consider him

Only if he could 17 a land shark every year. ***
11-21-2019, 10:08 PM
Todd4State

Quote:

Originally Posted by BhamDawg205

Well Alabama does sell itself, but those black Charger swag bags don't hurt either

Saban improved Alabama's recruiting with his system of recruiting. Georgia copied it under Smart and they immediately improved in recruiting. Even more impressive and relevant- ULL copied the same Alabama model and now has the best class in the Sun Belt and is on a path to winning 10 games.

If we want to maximize our recruiting- Napier IMO is probably the best way to do it. And of course I'm talking about legally. Hud of course would do well with recruiting also. But Napier's system may be more sustainable. And Norvell I think would recruit well also- but I just think that Napier is probably the best way to go.
11-21-2019, 10:10 PM
HailStateSZN19

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cooterpoot

Hud ain’t on our list.

Who exactly is on our list aside from Napier? Is our admin willing to go after Norvell with all his “rumored baggage”? Napier is obviously the main one being thrown around but you had said either in this thread or another that Napier was just a smoke screen (if I remember correctly). So who exactly is on our list at this point?
11-21-2019, 10:16 PM
Cooterpoot

Quote:

Originally Posted by HailStateSZN19

Who exactly is on our list aside from Napier? Is our admin willing to go after Norvell with all his “rumored baggage”? Napier is obviously the main one being thrown around but you had said either in this thread or another that Napier was just a smoke screen (if I remember correctly). So who exactly is on our list at this point?

Can’t answer that, but Hud isn’t. At least not the primary list. We’d have to go through a bunch of folks to get to Hud. Norvell isn’t either. Got to wait and see who is available. I was told Napier isn’t the top guy but I’m questioning that if Norvell isn’t an option.
11-21-2019, 10:16 PM
Todd4State

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cooterpoot

Disagree. If 7 wins a year is your goal, then great. But to advance, our offense must advance as well. Football has become more of a passing game. That?s not changing anytime soon. And if OM can recruit good WRs, there?s no excuse for us. Hell, most HS teams in MS now run the spread. Look at all the MS kids we missed on at WR.

I agree with this. MSU fans are so incredibly black and white. "Well this coach did this and we didn't like him so we should never ever try to do that again." It could be bunting, zone defense, passing, running, whatever.

Then people are mad when we can't compete with Alabama because we have no prayer because we can't throw the ball. Like two years ago. Now it's HAND THE DAMN BALL OFF EVERY TIME! Even though we're like third in the SEC in rushing and have I think over 100 more rushing attempts than pass attempts.

The best offense we had was 2014 when we were actually able to run and pass effectively. And we CAN replicate that. But we can't do it by being lazy in recruiting like Dan and we can't have a coach that doesn't prepare the team well like Joe. Those are MUCH more pressing issues than our offensive balance. Which has been a hell of a lot better than the defense or special teams this year if we're actually being honest and looking at the stats.
11-21-2019, 10:21 PM
HailStateSZN19

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cooterpoot

Can’t answer that, but Hud isn’t. At least not the primary list. We’d have to go through a bunch of folks to get to Hud. Norvell isn’t either. Got to wait and see who is available. I was told Napier isn’t the top guy but I’m questioning that if Norvell isn’t an option.

Gotcha. Thanks for the response Cooter.
11-21-2019, 10:21 PM
Todd4State

Quote:

Originally Posted by HailStateSZN19

Who exactly is on our list aside from Napier? Is our admin willing to go after Norvell with all his “rumored baggage”? Napier is obviously the main one being thrown around but you had said either in this thread or another that Napier was just a smoke screen (if I remember correctly). So who exactly is on our list at this point?

See, that's why I think we're getting Napier. Cohen isn't going to want to take a chance on having another Cann situation with out biggest money making sport. Unless the cigar boys are willing to give him a pass since they're the ones picking the coach this time- which is plausible. I have a feeling that Hud is essentially like Orgeron was to LSU's last search where they missed on Tom Herman and they needed someone to take the job instead of dragging things out. He's probably our parachute this time around. We know he'll take the job if something happens like Dan to Tennessee a couple of years ago.
11-21-2019, 10:23 PM
Noxdog

THIS

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cooterpoot

Hud ain?t on our list.

THIS
11-21-2019, 10:25 PM
Cooterpoot

I think more names will come out if we lose the egg. I?m not convinced we?ll be looking for a coach if we win the egg.
Unless Joe got another job.
11-21-2019, 10:33 PM
HailStateSZN19

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cooterpoot

I think more names will come out if we lose the egg. I?m not convinced we?ll be looking for a coach if we win the egg.
Unless Joe got another job.

With no inside info, I’d expect us to keep him if we get to 6 wins and go bowling & that’s just my opinion. Unless he leaves on his own which I still just don’t see happening. Although, the Schiano-Rutgers deal seems to have hit a bump in the road and some people may not want Schiano hired at Rutgers. But still probably ends up being him so other than that job, where would Joe even leave for? It’ll be interesting to see what new names emerge as possibilities closer to the EB, especially during if we’re getting beat and after the game if we go on to lose.
11-21-2019, 10:54 PM
BrunswickDawg

Quote:

Originally Posted by tcdog70

he won at ULL-NorthAL and now APeay. That is 3 schools that sucked till he came along. Plus when He was on our staff-he was very good. name me 3 Schools that sucked that Napier and Norvell has turned around.

I wouldn't put UNA in the same "suck" category as ULL and AP. They are one of the better DII programs over the past 40 or so years. They made a bad hire between Wallace and Hud that went 20-21 over 4 seasons, but outside of that they've won about 70% of their games since the early 1970s and have multiple Nattys. They even gave us Bobby Wallace - the 1990s version of Hud.
11-21-2019, 11:25 PM
Todd4State

Quote:

Originally Posted by HailStateSZN19

With no inside info, I’d expect us to keep him if we get to 6 wins and go bowling & that’s just my opinion. Unless he leaves on his own which I still just don’t see happening. Although, the Schiano-Rutgers deal seems to have hit a bump in the road and some people may not want Schiano hired at Rutgers. But still probably ends up being him so other than that job, where would Joe even leave for? It’ll be interesting to see what new names emerge as possibilities closer to the EB, especially during if we’re getting beat and after the game if we go on to lose.

Don't discount the possibility of him becoming an OC again. Penn State would probably take him right now. And if James Franklin goes somewhere else I would say there is a good chance Joe could be the OC wherever that is.
11-22-2019, 12:12 AM
Irondawg

What if Texas gets antsy and fires Tom Herman? Unlikely but they've done stranger things.

Rutgers is still a possibility for Joe but there's a chance that another midwest/NE team opens up and we can part somewhat amicably.

I'm not sure I'm in love with Napier but it's true that he couldn't be worse that the results we've got thusfar.
11-22-2019, 12:18 AM
HailStateSZN19

What about this name and haven’t seen it posted yet: Justin Fuente? Rumor has it he’s not too happy over at VT and may be looking to get out even though they’re 7-3 this year. Don’t know if that’s factual but there is a rumor on that. Built Memphis into what it is today and handed it over to Norvell to carry on. He’s won at Memphis and aside from 6-7 last year at VT, he’d won 9 in 2017 and 10 in 2016.
11-22-2019, 06:50 AM
ShotgunDawg

Quote:

Originally Posted by HailStateSZN19

What about this name and haven’t seen it posted yet: Justin Fuente? Rumor has it he’s not too happy over at VT and may be looking to get out even though they’re 7-3 this year. Don’t know if that’s factual but there is a rumor on that. Built Memphis into what it is today and handed it over to Norvell to carry on. He’s won at Memphis and aside from 6-7 last year at VT, he’d won 9 in 2017 and 10 in 2016.

He's been pretty bad at VT. They're like watching paint dry.

He'll have to go to Saban's quality control school before getting another chance.
11-22-2019, 08:21 AM
Really Clark?

Quote:

Originally Posted by ShotgunDawg

He's been pretty bad at VT. They're like watching paint dry.

He'll have to go to Saban's quality control school before getting another chance.

Bad? Winning 64% of his games at VT is bad? 10, 9, 6 wins the last 3 years and 7-3 right now with Pitt and Virginia left to play. Could end up with 9 wins again this year. His last 2 years at Memphis was 10 & 9 wins. If for some reason VT was to let him go, he would have multiple offers as HC
11-22-2019, 08:28 AM
ShotgunDawg

Quote:

Originally Posted by Really Clark?

Bad? Winning 64% of his games at VT is bad? 10, 9, 6 wins the last 3 years and 7-3 right now with Pitt and Virginia left to play. Could end up with 9 wins again this year. His last 2 years at Memphis was 10 & 9 wins. If for some reason VT was to let him go, he would have multiple offers as HC

I mean, you may be right but I've watched them a good bit and they're more stale than a 5 day old hot dog left out.

With any ACC coach right now, it's important to look at their schedule to see who they have beaten. That's the worst power 5 conference known to man right now.

The Orange Bowl has a big problem this year because there may not be a 2nd ACC team in the CFP top 25 for them to take for their bowl game and no one knows there selection rules if there is no ACC team to take.
11-22-2019, 08:46 AM
timotheus

If VT is a 5 day old stale hot dog with 7 current wins, I can only imagine what MSU is with JoMo guru. Please tell us.
11-22-2019, 08:51 AM
Really Clark?

Quote:

Originally Posted by ShotgunDawg

I mean, you may be right but I've watched them a good bit and they're more stale than a 5 day old hot dog left out.

With any ACC coach right now, it's important to look at their schedule to see who they have beaten. That's the worst power 5 conference known to man right now.

The Orange Bowl has a big problem this year because there may not be a 2nd ACC team in the CFP top 25 for them to take for their bowl game and no one knows there selection rules if there is no ACC team to take.

I hear ya but it’s not like he is way off of Beamer’s win percentage at VT. .640 Fuente .662 Beamer. And he has a shot at 9-10 wins this season. I agree their schedule is weak and 2 FCS teams on schedule this year is bad. But all he can do is beat the teams in schedule.

I’m not saying Fuente is great or they playing at an incredibly high level, but bad is severely down playing his career at VT. That’s not a fair statement. And he was considered one of the hottest names in coaching coming out of Memphis...does that give people pause on Norvall?
11-22-2019, 09:13 AM
ShotgunDawg

Quote:

Originally Posted by timotheus

If VT is a 5 day old stale hot dog with 7 current wins, I can only imagine what MSU is with JoMo guru. Please tell us.

I've made my thoughts on Moorhead known.
11-22-2019, 09:42 AM
RiverCityDawg

Quote:

Originally Posted by Really Clark?

I hear ya but it’s not like he is way off of Beamer’s win percentage at VT. .640 Fuente .662 Beamer. And he has a shot at 9-10 wins this season. I agree their schedule is weak and 2 FCS teams on schedule this year is bad. But all he can do is beat the teams in schedule.

I’m not saying Fuente is great or they playing at an incredibly high level, but bad is severely down playing his career at VT. That’s not a fair statement. And he was considered one of the hottest names in coaching coming out of Memphis...does that give people pause on Norvall?

I think we could do A LOT worse than Fuente (we're experiencing it now), but I think what fans may feel like they're getting with him is a known ceiling. It's probably a pretty high floor, but the ceiling is that's he's good, but not great. I think Fuente would be much safer than Napier (for example), but it feels like Napier is rising so fans think maybe we'd be catching something on the way up that could be really great. Again, not that it makes him a better choice, I just think that's why you get "meh" responses on Fuente.

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