When it comes to Lebby....

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Originally Posted by Quaoarsking

Every single time someone says this, people have to be reminded that it wasn't until Lebby got to his 4th job that he put Briles onto the sideline. That's something that didn't come up in any of his 4 vettings, but will come up in his 5th. It's a bit of a red flag that maybe Lebby doesn't think that Briles really did anything all that bad.

Again, I'm willing to give Lebby a chance as long as it's crystal clear (as in fireable offense) that he doesn't pull that shit again. But the "he passed vetting 4 times so he automatically should a 5th time" argument just doesn't work when there's new information since the 4th vetting.

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There is no new information. If Art Briles was found not negligent, who the hell are we to say he was guilty of that?

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Originally Posted by Tater

I'm just letting you know two things. There's double digit women who made claims, several of them other student athletes. And the post you made is somehow your dumbest yet.

There was one case where the victim's story about coaches wasn't consistent across 8 years of testimony and so Briles was dismissed from the lawsuit but Baylor as an institution was still found culpable. There are several cases that we know settlements were made instead. Not every woman wants their name to be subject to a public trial. Especially for the most demoralizing and dehumanizing moment in their lives. This willfully sick and twisted post you made is disgusting. I look forward to never seeing another post of yours again.

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I’m still reading articles but haven’t read anything yet that shows Briles covered anything up. So far, it looks like he should have been more heavy handed with kicking players off, but that also doesn’t do anything for reshaping them which his texts clearly show he was trying to do. 99% of the incidents in the texts, from what I’ve read, were weed and booze related.

A person telling Briles that the Waco pd would “keep it quiet” isn’t him covering anything up. That’s not the same thing. In fact that’s what the pd should do. Make an arrest where warranted and let the judicial system take its course. They shouldn’t open their mouths at all about anyone arrested, football player or not.

He should’ve been more heavy handed with dismissals. It’s not his right or duty to have a press conference regarding allegations that are not proven to be legitimate at the time they occurred and when he was told of the allegations. You also don’t just kick someone off a team or out of school based on allegations. You get facts and then make the decision.

I say for HIS OWN benefit, to keep him from continuing to look insane, as well as possibly avoiding a stroke, how bout giving tater a short vacation from the board. I have no problem listening to his rambling , but I’d sure hate for him to have a complete nervous breakdown on a message board.

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Originally Posted by SPMT

I’m still reading articles but haven’t read anything yet that shows Briles covered anything up. So far, it looks like he should have been more heavy handed with kicking players off, but that also doesn’t do anything for reshaping them which his texts clearly show he was trying to do. 99% of the incidents in the texts, from what I’ve read, were weed and booze related.

A person telling Briles that the Waco pd would “keep it quiet” isn’t him covering anything up. That’s not the same thing. In fact that’s what the pd should do. Make an arrest where warranted and let the judicial system take its course. They shouldn’t open their mouths at all about anyone arrested, football player or not.

He should’ve been more heavy handed with dismissals. It’s not his right or duty to have a press conference regarding allegations that are not proven to be legitimate at the time they occurred and when he was told of the allegations. You also don’t just kick someone off a team or out of school based on allegations. You get facts and then make the decision.

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Truth!

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Originally Posted by CoachT14

He was not above their historical average. Pinkel played in the SEC Championship game in back to back years 2 years before Odom was hired. Come on at least be honest.

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Playing in the SECCG is not their historical average.

I'm not saying Odom is some great coach. However he is a sitting HC that actually wants our job. No other sitting HC with a comparable resume seems to want our job.

But..... enjoy the guy with a thin resume. Selmon did OU a solid. State gets an "offensive coach". We shall see how it works out. Hopefully it does for the good.

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Originally Posted by Maroonthirteen

Playing in the SECCG is not their historical average.

I'm not saying Odom is some great coach. However he is a sitting HC that actually wants our job. No other sitting HC with a comparable resume seems to want our job.

But..... enjoy the guy with a thin resume. Selmon did OU a solid. State gets an "offensive coach". We shall see how it works out. Hopefully it does for the good.

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The dude has been a P5 OC for 4 years. The same as Mullen.

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Originally Posted by Quaoarsking

Every single time someone says this, people have to be reminded that it wasn't until Lebby got to his 4th job that he put Briles onto the sideline. That's something that didn't come up in any of his 4 vettings, but will come up in his 5th. It's a bit of a red flag that maybe Lebby doesn't think that Briles really did anything all that bad.

Again, I'm willing to give Lebby a chance as long as it's crystal clear (as in fireable offense) that he doesn't pull that shit again. But the "he passed vetting 4 times so he automatically should a 5th time" argument just doesn't work when there's new information since the 4th vetting.

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The whole sideline uproar is dumb. He wasn't hanging out during the game giving Lebby pointers. It was well after the game when 95% of the people were gone and Briles came down with Lebby's entire family and other coaches families. I honestly wouldn't doubt that it had happened before - or that he'd visited offices or locker rooms after games - but this time someone happened to post a picture on Twitter so "people" had to make a thing of it.

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Originally Posted by BrunswickDawg

The whole sideline uproar is dumb. He wasn't hanging out during the game giving Lebby pointers. It was well after the game when 95% of the people were gone and Briles came down with Lebby's entire family and other coaches families. I honestly wouldn't doubt that it had happened before - or that he'd visited offices or locker rooms after games - but this time someone happened to post a picture on Twitter so "people" had to make a thing of it.

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Art went to Ark when KB was there. He's not been found negligent nor guilty of anything.

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Originally Posted by preachermatt83

I say for HIS OWN benefit, to keep him from continuing to look insane, as well as possibly avoiding a stroke, how bout giving tater a short vacation from the board. I have no problem listening to his rambling , but I’d sure hate for him to have a complete nervous breakdown on a message board.

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To be fair, if you gave Tater a timeout, you have to give a certain Lebby Cult leader a timeout also.

I've been watching some Lebby press interviews. He comes across as likable and well spoken. Much better than Arnett. He sounds good in interviews.

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Originally Posted by preachermatt83

I say for HIS OWN benefit, to keep him from continuing to look insane, as well as possibly avoiding a stroke, how bout giving tater a short vacation from the board. I have no problem listening to his rambling , but I’d sure hate for him to have a complete nervous breakdown on a message board.

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Whenever I think about attending church again, thinking maybe it's not full of hypocrisy still, I just have to look at your posts. If you are a typical "preacher" I'll continue to have my own relationship with the Lord and stay far away from religion.

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Originally Posted by Turfdawg67

Whenever I think about attending church again, thinking maybe it's not full of hypocrisy still, I just have to look at your posts. If you are a typical "preacher" I'll continue to have my own relationship with the Lord and stay far away from religion.

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My wife and I watch Charles Stanley and Billy Graham sermons on Sundays. We like this situation much better.

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Originally Posted by Turfdawg67

Whenever I think about attending church again, thinking maybe it's not full of hypocrisy still, I just have to look at your posts. If you are a typical "preacher" I'll continue to have my own relationship with the Lord and stay far away from religion.

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There will always be hypocrites in the church, there always has been and there always will be. That is not a valid reason to not attend church since scripture tells that:

[Proverbs] As iron sharpens iron, so one person sharpens another.
[Hebrews] not giving up meeting together, as some are in the habit of doing, but encouraging one another?and all the more as you see the Day approaching.

I'm sorry you are having this issue. I hope you find a good Bible believing church where you can grow spiritually.

In my neighborhood, we have a group of husbands that meet once a week for an hour of Bible study, maybe you can find/create a group like that if "church" in general upsets you.

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Originally Posted by DownwardDawg

To be fair, if you gave Tater a timeout, you have to give a certain Lebby Cult leader a timeout also.

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Just let em both keep going.... better to let it out than keep it bottled up.... we're mostly adults here... even if we don't always act like it..

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Originally Posted by Extendedcab

There will always be hypocrites in the church, there always has been and there always will be. That is not a valid reason to not attend church since scripture tells that:

[Proverbs] As iron sharpens iron, so one person sharpens another.
[Hebrews] not giving up meeting together, as some are in the habit of doing, but encouraging one another?and all the more as you see the Day approaching.

I'm sorry you are having this issue. I hope you find a good Bible believing church where you can grow spiritually.

In my neighborhood, we have a group of husbands that meet once a week for an hour of Bible study, maybe you can find/create a group like that if "church" in general upsets you.

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The church is full of sinners...

I fit in perfectly...

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Originally Posted by DownwardDawg

To be fair, if you gave Tater a timeout, you have to give a certain Lebby Cult leader a timeout also.

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No sense in doing the bans. This conversation has a shelf life.

Either we hire Lebby and several people including myself stop supporting State until (in this timeline hopefully) Selmon is at OU in 3 years as AD, Lebby is an NFL HC having left after taking State to a Natty. Or whatever circumstance rids State of filth.

Or we don't hire Lebby and the conversation ends.

No one on this board is threatening anyone. We're arguing passionately and those of us who knows to use the ignore feature are utilizing it appropriately. Some of us are saying disgusting opinions that we hold and now we know what people value, but banning them doesn't change those opinions. The only way is through repeated discussion.

I point to SPMT as someone that was initially in the Lebby camp actually having positive discourse and attempted research.

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Originally Posted by SPMT

I’m still reading articles but haven’t read anything yet that shows Briles covered anything up. So far, it looks like he should have been more heavy handed with kicking players off, but that also doesn’t do anything for reshaping them which his texts clearly show he was trying to do. 99% of the incidents in the texts, from what I’ve read, were weed and booze related.

A person telling Briles that the Waco pd would “keep it quiet” isn’t him covering anything up. That’s not the same thing. In fact that’s what the pd should do. Make an arrest where warranted and let the judicial system take its course. They shouldn’t open their mouths at all about anyone arrested, football player or not.

He should’ve been more heavy handed with dismissals. It’s not his right or duty to have a press conference regarding allegations that are not proven to be legitimate at the time they occurred and when he was told of the allegations. You also don’t just kick someone off a team or out of school based on allegations. You get facts and then make the decision.

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I think where we differ here is that while 1 allegation against one player in 1 year can be dismissed as a rogue incident. And 2 allegations against 2 players in 2 different years can be a coincedence. 15+ allegations against 15+ players across 4+ years is a clear either pattern of encouragement at worst or lack of institutional control at best. One of the damning quotes on Art's leadership qualities and a thing that applies culpability down the line is "I delegated down and I shouldn't have. And I had a system where I was the last to know, and I should have been the first to know.

That quote coupled with Jeff Lebby's adamant stance that Art did nothing wrong. (Meaning Art was right to delegate down, and Jeff was in that group that was delegated down to, lest we forget one of the allegation was against a RB that Lebby coached.)

Further, there's this from the initial 2016 WSJ story: "In at least one of the cases, regents said, Briles knew about the complaint but didn't alert police or the proper Baylor officials." That's the same reason Joe Paterno's
statue was taken down at Penn State.

I think the Deshaun Watson case here is a good example to review. And I want everyone to personally ask themselves honestly this set of questions. Remember, you are not a court of law. You can answer that you want to defer to the court of law, but you are a person that can have an opinion.

How many Rape Allegations or Settlements Outside of Courtdoes it take for you to not want to be associated with a person. Whether that's as your friend, your football coach, your QB? Not a conviction. Either ongoing investigation or something settled outside of court.

Is it 1? 2? 5? 10? 20? 50? 100? 1000?

For me, It's 2. One time can be spite and I'm willing to let it play out. Two separate and no common agenda? Yea it's probably on you. 20+? I'm supposed to believe it's a Witch Hunt? L O ****ing L. That's my thoughts. Think the exercise through. You don't have to answer to the board. But do answer it for yourself.

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Originally Posted by Tater

No sense in doing the bans. This conversation has a shelf life.

Either we hire Lebby and several people including myself stop supporting State until (in this timeline hopefully) Selmon is at OU in 3 years as AD, Lebby is an NFL HC having left after taking State to a Natty. Or whatever circumstance rids State of filth.

Or we don't hire Lebby and the conversation ends.

No one on this board is threatening anyone. We're arguing passionately and those of us who knows to use the ignore feature are utilizing it appropriately. Some of us are saying disgusting opinions that we hold and now we know what people value, but banning them doesn't change those opinions. The only way is through repeated discussion.

I point to SPMT as someone that was initially in the Lebby camp actually having positive discourse and attempted research.

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I'm certainly not advocating bans. I was "just sayin"

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Originally Posted by DownwardDawg

I'm certainly not advocating bans. I was "just sayin"

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Yea, I was definitely replying more to the guy you replied to and expanding upon your response.

Me opening this thread to see Tater continuing the same tired back and forth....

We get it...hire Lebby, you're out. Got it.

https://media.tenor.com/wBCnw42BwnYA...in-and-out.gif