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Works for me... Or at least a package both in backfield and Hill motions to the slot. That formation alone could lead to screens, jet sweeps and more. That gives Hill touches in space. Gives us a reliable pass blocker in the backfield. JoMo hint hintQuote:
Originally Posted by msbulldog
It's interesting to me that some people railed on Mullen for playing seniority/experience over talent and citing pass blocking as a reason the more talented running back wasn't getting snaps, yet now we have a thread full of people wanting the less talented senior running back that is only better at pass blocking to be playing over the more talented guy. I'm sure it is a different group of people, so I'm not suggesting that minds have changed, just pointing out the difference in viewpoint.
Kylin is quicker, faster, stronger, a more talented runner, a more explosive receiver and apparently more accountable off the field. Aeris is tough as nails, a great pass blocker who is more experienced, but otherwise brings nothing as a runner that Kylin doesn't. Aeris will make a 0 yard gain 4 yards every time, but sometimes he'll also make a 12 yard gain only 4 yards.
I think the upside Kylin gives as a ball carrier and playmaker is worth the downgrade in pass blocking. Clearly many in this thread do not, and I respect that opinion though I disagree.
Just an interesting fan dynamic...
I like the idea of playing both at the same time, sometimes in the backfield together, some in the slot, motion in and out of the backfield regardless if it’s a run or pass. Scouts are going to tell our staff that Hill is going to have to improve in pass pro if he wants to play in the NFL. The staff will relay that message to him this year, if it hasn’t been mentioned already.
My opinion is it’s a fvcking waste of talent to not have a running game and a short passing game with those 2 in the game simultaneously. It completely amazes me that coaches get paid so much to deliver so little when the talent is right there in front of them. Just no imagination or creativity especially in short yardage or goal line situations. I digress.
Kylins numbers aren't any better than Aries's though. That's the point people are making.Quote:
Originally Posted by RiverCityDawg
he will make a 12 yarder into a 4 yarder--what are you basing that on. some stat you have found--eye test--what? I have not seen it.Quote:
Originally Posted by RiverCityDawg
Number don't always tell the truth. For example, Aeris had 2 carries last week. One was the 29 yard TD late in the 3Q straight up the middle through a wide open hole. Good run, but I think everyone would agree that Kylin or Gibson could have made that play. His only other carry was a 13 yard draw on 3rd and 39. A 13 yard carry is great, but they were playing everyone back and conceded the yardage to get the stop. So he ends the game with a 21 yard average. Is he better than Kylin because Kylin only had 4ypc? Of course not. Now it doesn't mean he's NOT better either. Honestly we don't get either enough carriers for the stats to be reliable on this. Since numbers aren't telling the story, you basically have to make an eye test evaluation.Quote:
Originally Posted by Cooterpoot
So, how many non-pass blocking plays this year have you seen Aeris make that you thought Kylin would/could not have made? I haven't seen any. Think of how many plays Kylin has made that Aeris likely couldn't have made? The first play of the season, the TD catch last week. A couple of the runs against KSU. Many of the outside runs and sweeps against Auburn.
Again, pass blocking aside, I don't see how anyone can watch the 2 without bias and say that Kylin is not clearly the more talented runner/receiver. If that's true, you have to admit you would be losing some of Aeris is playing more over him. At that point becomes a subjective debate on the value of Aeris's pass blocking vs Kylin's superior skill as a runner/receiver.
Nothing against Kylin but he's not breaking long runs and putting up big numbers. He's getting double the carries but he's not putting up better numbers with them. The difference between the two in skill level isn't being taken advantage of. If that's going to be the case, give Aries touches. If we were actually running Jo's offense, Kylin would be great I think. But we're not running his offense.
What has shown us Kylin is better or more explosive than Aeris. Sure, he looks shiftier. I said this before the season, Aeris rarely if ever get tackled for a loss. Aeris picks up blocks. Aeris also probably has just as man 10+ yard runs as Kylin and Kylin is getting 2x the amount of carries. If we are going to go with Kylin, that dude needs to be all over the field. Motioned all over the place to form mismatches. I really want him to get the Saquon treatment in our offense. Hell, let him throw it too.
Kylin 10+ yard rushes 15, 20+ yard rushes 3 on 81 carries. Ares 11 and 2 on 48 carries. Aeris has higher percentage of explosive runsQuote:
Originally Posted by Lord McBuckethead
They both bring different things to the table and both should be used. I'm just pointing out that at this point they are both similar in production and that's not that clear that one is better than the other.Quote:
Originally Posted by BhamDawg205
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Originally Posted by msbulldog
And that this is how you solve the situation. I would imagine that both Hill and Aeris are among our top five most productive skill players. Get them on the field.
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Originally Posted by Thick
I think with the spread systems that are so prevalent nowadays a lot of coaches have forgotten that you can get a lot of production with two good running backs. I remember Auburn using Ronnie Brown and Cadillac Williams both in the same formation at times when they were running the WCO. Aeris blocks well enough to function as a de facto FB but he can run and catch like a tailback. That's a luxury. And on top of it Hill catches well enough he could function as a slot receiver and has the vision and physicality to be a great SEC RB. I think a lot of coaches get stuck into the two backs = one must be a traditional blocking back. And it doesn't have to be that way. See the 49ers with Tom Rathman.
I pretty much agree. Kylin is clearly more talented, but not by some huge gap. It needs to be handled situationally. If both are healthy, both should play. For Alabama I'd probably start Aeris, just for his blocking.Quote:
Originally Posted by RiverCityDawg
Nothing wrong with playing 2 RBs, even if they are similar. Look at Georgia. Give both some touches and see who has the hot hand.
Could be at least partially explained by Aeris playing more later in games when defenses are wearing down this year.Quote:
Originally Posted by Really Clark?
Aeris also started in conference games as well. You have weak opponents where they both had big runs...once you get around 50 or so rushes in 9 games it starts evening out. And I suspect if we really chart it out then they both are behind Nick in percentageQuote:
Originally Posted by thf24
come on , he had 1000 yards last year--I guess they came when the defense was tired. They both are quality backs. I'm glad when either one runs the ball. I would like to see Hill in the slot with the Train at RB.Quote:
Originally Posted by thf24
Yeppers....Quote:
Originally Posted by Really Clark?
SECRank, Name, Carries, Yards, YPC, TDs (Vs Conference)
13 Kylin Hill 44-223-5.07-0
20 Aeris Williams 31-148-4.77-0
23 Nick Fitzgerald 103-466-4.52-5
They're both great, no doubt. Just speculating as to why Kylin's average is lower despite obviously having more big play ability.Quote:
Originally Posted by tcdog70
Fair question. I think one reason is there has been so much pressure by everyone to force feed the running backs regardless of the look we're getting from the defense. As the starting running back and guy getting most of the looks, naturally Kylin is going to get more of those force fed or scripted carries. When Aeris gets carries, which isn't often, I think they are typically true run looks.Quote:
Originally Posted by thf24
Actually I think both running backs have high YPCs over 6 because they generally only get the ball when it's a beneficial run look, which isn't often. Naturally, an "always run never pass" approach is going to lead to lower YPC because you don't care what the defense does, your running it anyway. The problem, as we all know, is we haven't been able to consistently take advantage of the pass looks we get most often.
Aries is the complete back and Kylin is a liability on pass blocking.Quote:
Originally Posted by RiverCityDawg