Someone please make me feel ok about basketball going forward

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by maroonmania

Very good chance if Stans had been retained that Gray and Hood would both be scoring for us but we would still have a soap opera or a transfer might still have happened. Point is that we seldom lacked talent with Stans but I'm concerned whether Ray will ever recruit enough sufficient talent to compete at an NCAA tournament level. Guess we will all find out over the next couple of years.

---

Didn't Ray just have a player transfer away from this team in the middle of the season? Didn't Hood transfer? Haven't others been kicked off the team? You don't think that is drama? I will take what we had (elite players with some drama) than what we have now - boring and apathy with no elite players (Sword would be if he could shoot from the outside). Saw in today's newspaper that we had 8400 at game - we had maybe 4000 for KENTUCKY in the middle of a beautiful Saturday. And don't say it is all "lower level" people that buy tickets and don't show up. There were many empty lower level seats, but there were upper level sections with 1 or 2 people in them. And, it was 4000 because KY had 1000! This is not a joke - when I left the game and saw that our girls softball team was playing, I said to my wife that we really should have gone to that game. I don't even like softball and it was a little chilly. Again, I think we will get a little better - we do have no depth. But, we don't have a shooter coming in (my friend watched the guard coming in - 6' and skinny - yea, he will be able to shoot over KY's 6'6" guards). But ever going back to the NCAA tourney is a long shot and making a run with average players is a dream.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Dawg61

Stans wasn't the answer. I'd rather burn through 10 coaches to finally get to the right one then to stay with the wrong one any longer. Stansbury is incapable of even making a Sweet 16. I want to see another Final Four before we all die. That's not asking for too much. I will also say I expect my AD to make better hires than the coaches he fires. Especially when he goes on his own and hires who only he wanted. This isn't Scott Stricklin University.

---

It just seems that we are at best 2 seasons away from being a bubble team.

That is frustrating. I loved MSU basketball. Now Im passing up free tickets against UK. Maybe that is my fault, but following a team that is out of tourney consideration before February is just too frustrating to watch.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by HancockCountyDog

It just seems that we are at best 2 seasons away from being a bubble team.

That is frustrating. I loved MSU basketball. Now Im passing up free tickets against UK. Maybe that is my fault, but following a team that is out of tourney consideration before February is just too frustrating to watch.

---

I'm right there with ya man. I'm not happy about basketball at all.

Ray may be a better hire. Recruiting seems to be the only thing holding him back right now.

Josh Gray didnt come here because when Stands got fired his "love" stopped being delivered. He went to TT and averaged 10 points, 3 assists, and 3 turnovers while shooting 18% from 3. So I ask- is it Ray's fault his "love" stopped being delivered?

Hood was wanting out while Stands was here. Certain fans keep trying to bury that fact.

Blame Ray till you are blue in the face- everybody knows the real reason this program is in the shape it's in. When you have hit bottom, it takes a couple years to recover. He's had that. Next year, we will start seeing some recovering and will be a better basketball team

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Political Hack

Ray may be a better hire. Recruiting seems to be the only thing holding him back right now.

---

When it comes to basketball, recruiting is about 65% of the job.

You can be a great X's and O's guy, but if you are putting lineups like we have right now, it just doesn't matter. Ray seems like a great guy, but its a bottom line business. If I have to wait until the 2015-2016 season to have talent to have a bubble team, that is a problem. Im rooting for the guy, but basketball doesn't require a 4 year turnaround, not if you know how to recruit.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by HancockCountyDog

When it comes to basketball, recruiting is about 65% of the job.

You can be a great X's and O's guy, but if you are putting lineups like we have right now, it just doesn't matter. Ray seems like a great guy, but its a bottom line business. If I have to wait until the 2015-2016 season to have talent to have a bubble team, that is a problem. Im rooting for the guy, but basketball doesn't require a 4 year turnaround, not if you know how to recruit.

---

I guarantee if Ray somehow pulls off the miracle and recruits Malik Newman.... everyone will change their minds about him

Out of curiosity, where did the mantra come from that it only takes 2 years to build an NCAA quality team?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by HancockCountyDog

If I have to wait until the 2015-2016 season to have talent to have a bubble team, that is a problem. Im rooting for the guy, but basketball doesn't require a 4 year turnaround, not if you know how to recruit.

---

I disagree when the circumstances are like ours was. It was almost like probation when you had all 5 starters leave. Then a couple of signees go elsewhere

Ray comes in late and has to scramble to bring in the leftovers that April. Hard to find a quality signee at that point- recruiter or not.
Then Ray has to boot 2 more players because they cant stop smoking weed
Then we have 2 ACL tears

Ray's 1st season was a throwaway

Now we are an improved team this year that is still undermanned- why? More players from the former regime smoking dope or not playing because they want to redshirt and then transfer to Troy to play for Cunningham.

Bottom line- Ray has taken over a 2 year rebuild and now we should start seeing some real progress the next couple of years

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Intramural All-American

Out of curiosity, where did the mantra come from that it only takes 2 years to build an NCAA quality team?

---

Especially when it took The Recruiter 4 years to build one and he took over a much better situation

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Coach34

I disagree when the circumstances are like ours was. It was almost like probation when you had all 5 starters leave. Then a couple of signees go elsewhere

Ray comes in late and has to scramble to bring in the leftovers that April. Hard to find a quality signee at that point- recruiter or not.
Then Ray has to boot 2 more players because they cant stop smoking weed
Then we have 2 ACL tears

Ray's 1st season was a throwaway

Now we are an improved team this year that is still undermanned- why? More players from the former regime smoking dope or not playing because they want to redshirt and then transfer to Troy to play for Cunningham.

Bottom line- Ray has taken over a 2 year rebuild and now we should start seeing some real progress the next couple of years

---

No former state players are enrolled at Troy. Jalen is most likely going to East Carolina. Depth or not, one of rays signees transferred while he was starting. That is something that is being buried that no one talks about. We are taking too many developmental players. We need difference makers and none are on the way currently.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Coach34

Especially when it took The Recruiter 4 years to build one and he took over a much better situation

---

Heck, Stansbury couldn't get to the tournament his last 3 years, one of which was top 3 talent teams in MSU history, but people are upset because he was let go. Then a lot of these same people were calling for Mullen's head midway through this football season because he hasn't gotten us to "the next level." So people call for Mullen's head but get pissed when stansbury gets fired for basically the exact same reason. Although, in reality, Mullen has improved us whereas Stansbury clearly was not improving.

Our fan base lacks logic.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by RICKRAYMADE

No former state players are enrolled at Troy. Jalen is most likely going to East Carolina.

---

But his plan was to redshirt and then go to Troy. Now if that changes- so be it. But you cant blame Ray for Jalen refusing to play this season.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Coach34

I disagree when the circumstances are like ours was. It was almost like probation when you had all 5 starters leave. Then a couple of signees go elsewhere

Ray comes in late and has to scramble to bring in the leftovers that April. Hard to find a quality signee at that point- recruiter or not.
Then Ray has to boot 2 more players because they cant stop smoking weed
Then we have 2 ACL tears

Ray's 1st season was a throwaway

Now we are an improved team this year that is still undermanned- why? More players from the former regime smoking dope or not playing because they want to redshirt and then transfer to Troy to play for Cunningham.

Bottom line- Ray has taken over a 2 year rebuild and now we should start seeing some real progress the next couple of years

---

When you say progress, what do you mean? A bubble team? An NIT team? .500 in the SEC? 20 wins?

Right now, I see 5-6 SEC wins in a terrible conference where there are probably 3 tourney teams. That is the bigger issue for me. This isn't the SEC in football - this is probably as bad as the SEC has been over the last decade. Its probably a 3 bid league - with 14 teams. That is atrocious. So when you can only win 5-6 games and are now playing 18 SEC games - that is a problem.

The other issue I have is that the guys carrying this team are Stans' signees. Who has Ray signed that is even a solid contributor? I can't think of one, maybe Ready, but overall Sword, Thomas, Roq, and Ware are carrying the team and they are all Stans guys.

The new recruits coming in next year are not impact players, they are solid role players, which is what are team is full of. Solid guys that can be the 3rd or 4th best player on a tourney team. A guy that is a recruiter can land guys that are top 100 recruits. Hell, the cabbie attacker has signed Saiz and Coleby - both are going to be really solid players for the bears the next 3-4 years.

If you had told me back when we fired Stans that it was going to be at least 4 years before we were a bubble team - I would have said, **** it - we can be a bubble team now;

It shouldn't be your 4th season as a basketball coach before you sign a player that is an impact freshman. Based on our commit list, it will be 2015-2016 before we have an impact freshman - and that is a hope right now, its not like we have a top 25 player in the country committed.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by HancockCountyDog

The other issue I have is that the guys carrying this team are Stans' signees. Who has Ray signed that is even a solid contributor? I can't think of one, maybe Ready, but overall Sword, Thomas, Roq, and Ware are carrying the team and they are all Stans guys.

The new recruits coming in next year are not impact players, they are solid role players, which is what are team is full of.

If you had told me back when we fired Stans that it was going to be at least 4 years before we were a bubble team - I would have said, **** it - we can be a bubble team now.

---

A) Ray has one recruiting class on the floor- Who in the hell else should be the best players on the team?

B) With who Ray in bringing in next year- along with what we have- we will be a solid basketball team. Houston and Daniels will be solid additions. Ndoye will be good depth. Elijah Staley will be a solid player in the 2nd half of the season for us also.

C) Stands was fired because of team discipline and the shit show around the program- not wins/losses


These types of posts are literally the same ones made during Cohen's 1st 2 years.

I guess Jeff Lebo doesn't have a 'no smoking policy' at East Carolina if Steele is going to ECU

Our best 3 point shooter is Borchert and we are losing him next year. Who will be able to knock down a jump shot or bust a zone for us in year 3 of Rays tenure? We will continue to get zoned to death and score in the 50s until Ray bring in some shooters. it's kinda like watching Crooms teams in football. Even when we won it was ugly because our offense was so bad. As a fan its just not a very entertaining brand of basketball we are putting on the floor

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by HancockCountyDog

When it comes to basketball, recruiting is about 65% of the job.

You can be a great X's and O's guy, but if you are putting lineups like we have right now, it just doesn't matter. Ray seems like a great guy, but its a bottom line business. If I have to wait until the 2015-2016 season to have talent to have a bubble team, that is a problem. Im rooting for the guy, but basketball doesn't require a 4 year turnaround, not if you know how to recruit.

---

I agree but he needs 2-3 years to get it going. He's new to Mississippi, the university, the SEC, etching... that's a lot relationships he needs form in a short amount of time. Those things will happen and hopefully he'll continually improve at managing them. By most accounts the beginning of his tenure wasn't the smoothest transition with a lot of the people he needs to be friendly with, but I think time heals all wounds and we'll get better in the immediate future.

I hate to say it, but I think his sink or swim moment could be based on his ability to pull one specific recruit who shall remain nameless. Win that battle and the program turns. If not, it could be the beginning of the end.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Political Hack

I agree but he needs 2-3 years to get it going. He's new to Mississippi, the university, the SEC, etching... that's a lot relationships he needs form in a short amount of time. Those things will happen and hopefully he'll continually improve at managing them.

---

This can't be stressed enough. Even in basketball, it's going to be difficult to recruit as a newcomer at your first HC job. It was always going to take two or three years, that hasn't changed.

The one thing that does bother me is the idea we were hearing soon after Ray's hire that we were going to minimize involvement with AAU. I'm not sure if that was Ray's or Stricklin's deal, or if it still is or ever was a thing, but if it is, that's got to stop or recruiting isn't going to improve no matter how much Ray builds his infrastructure and reputation.

My issue is that we don't have to be on a 3 year plan to be sniffing the bubble. We can just simply fix it before next year. Davis, Bloodman, Thomas and one other player HAVE TO GO though. Which is more important to Ray? Fielding his shitty team for 4 years or finding another job after 4 years? If he replaces those 4 players with GOOD shooters we will be in the NCAA next year! Look at Memphis's commits. Memphis is ranked right now and they are bringing 3 jucos and 1 high school player in next year. They are adding immediate help. If Ray would just do the same we won't have to find another coach 2 years from now. http://memphis.scout.com/a.z?s=350&p...bb&c=4&yr=2014