So this is what hell is like

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Originally Posted by RezDog7

I've been taking my daughter to MSU games since she's was 3. She has decided to go to OM because of the experience. Can't blame her honestly.

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After being in that atmosphere yesterday, If I was an unbiased 18 year old there would be ZERO question where I would be going.

Lot of blame on this thread for why we are where we are but it really all goes back to Cohen and whoever thought that was a good idea. Byrne and Strickland had fund raising, game day experience, branding, and everything else going in the right direction. Cohen comes in and all that goes to shit almost overnight. We lose Vic (for whatever the reason....a good program would've swept that under the rug. Mind you I didn't like Vic but he won). He hires Cannizzaro, who had he done a tenth of the research he should've had so many red flags it's almost unjustifiable. Then he blows the Schloss hire and we get Leno because cohen can't keep his mouth shut. There's JoMo who on paper looks good but one look at the dude and you gotta know it's not going to work. He screws up that firing by waiting until after the bowl game (the writing was already on the wall guys). Then we bring in Leach who, despite being an icon, is really not a fit for MSU and if we're being objective doesn't have the best track record for leaving schools in winning situations. Oh yeah, and he 17'd us on NIL.

Cohen finally decided to leave, Leach dies and we hire our next coach without an AD. WTH?

I don't know maybe I just traced it all back to Keenum but I still say Cohen kills MSU athletics.

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Originally Posted by R2Dawg

G5 QB was Leach pick. He ran off Shrader. Leach recruiting is what dug us a hole. Those that preach we must change with the times hold on to Leach who held to 50-70 year old mentality how to manage a roster and 90s version of wishbone.

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Our fan base will be blaming Leach (the only sitting HC we have hired since Jesus was a baby) for the next 20 years.

Leach's recruiting? Vanderbilt is winning with less talent. Please tell me how we have lost to more than 1 team this year that is way less talented? Is that Leach too? Quit using some lousy excuse for this coaching staff. They are ass, our game day atmosphere is ass, our marketing is ass. This is not because of Leach, but let's keep blaming the only actual HC we have had in the past 8 years. That is a good look for us.

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Originally Posted by Randolph Dupree

Lot of blame on this thread for why we are where we are but it really all goes back to Cohen and whoever thought that was a good idea. Byrne and Strickland had fund raising, game day experience, branding, and everything else going in the right direction. Cohen comes in and all that goes to shit almost overnight. We lose Vic (for whatever the reason....a good program would've swept that under the rug. Mind you I didn't like Vic but he won). He hires Cannizzaro, who had he done a tenth of the research he should've had so many red flags it's almost unjustifiable. Then he blows the Schloss hire and we get Leno because cohen can't keep his mouth shut. There's JoMo who on paper looks good but one look at the dude and you gotta know it's not going to work. He screws up that firing by waiting until after the bowl game (the writing was already on the wall guys). Then we bring in Leach who, despite being an icon, is really not a fit for MSU and if we're being objective doesn't have the best track record for leaving schools in winning situations. Oh yeah, and he 17'd us on NIL.

Cohen finally decided to leave, Leach dies and we hire our next coach without an AD. WTH?

I don't know maybe I just traced it all back to Keenum but I still say Cohen kills MSU athletics.

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You nailed it! The athletic department was a mess when Cohen left.

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Originally Posted by MBDawg601

Our fan base will be blaming Leach (the only sitting HC we have hired since Jesus was a baby) for the next 20 years.

Leach's recruiting? Vanderbilt is winning with less talent. Please tell me how we have lost to more than 1 team this year that is way less talented? Is that Leach too? Quit using some lousy excuse for this coaching staff. They are ass, our game day atmosphere is ass, our marketing is ass. This is not because of Leach, but let's keep blaming the only actual HC we have had in the past 8 years. That is a good look for us.

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The fact that we have fans that think a guy who won 9 games in year 3 and had some other big wins for MSU "wasn't really a fit" for MSU sums up one of the biggest problems our fan base has.

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Originally Posted by StarkVegasSteve

You just do not get it. It is about adding to atmosphere and getting the people going. The lights do that, Throw It Up does that, having pump up stuff on the video board instead of honoring the Faculty of the game does that. PEOPLE BEING INVOLVED other than just ringing a damn cowbell does that. It is about giving people a reason to come back regardless of the final scoreboard. We do a shit job of that. I could care less of the song they use is Dreams And Nightmares by Meek Mill(which would be incredible tbh) or if they used Night Moves by Bob Seger. Just get something that gets everyone going and play it EVERY GAME. We had that with Don’t Stop Believing but people bitched and complained about it. Hell that was a tradition and people got into it.

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And the thing is a lot of those things aren't impossible to do at MSU. Some are relatively cheap to do I think.

And you're right about Don't Stop Believing. I didn't want MSU to stop doing that and it's not because I'm a Journey fan or something. It's because it was something fans enjoyed and got into at games.

To your point in another post about buy in for Leach- remember the Bandwagon ad MSU put out? One loss and our fans bitched and complained about that too because we lost a game and now it was "embarrassing". We have to stop complaining about stuff like that because it discourages the athletic department from promoting the program.

MSU did very little under Cohen to support Leach in terms of promotion. The people that showed up were showing up because we actually had a chance to win which was because of Leach. Game atmosphere wise we're doing the exact same things now as we did under Cohen except we have a DJ now- which is a move I like for the record. Which means we have the same atmosphere that we had under Stricklin. And it has gotten very stale. Made even worse because the product on the field is awful.

And the product on the field right now is the root cause for the problems we have. We hire coaches like Kevin Barbay and Coleman Hutzler who are unqualified and we overpay them and lo and behold the product they put out is awful and then it affects recruiting because no one wants to play for them because they are jokes of a coach. The last qualified coach we hired was Leach and the on the field results speak for themselves. MSU should start hiring qualified coaches like the rest of the SEC and see how that works.

What Cohen did as a terrible AD getting us behind in NIL compounded things. MSU's AD has got to stop relying on the head football coach to tell them everything that the program needs. I don't think there is a coach that is going to complain because his school increased the recruiting budget or because they built an IPF. But at MSU "the coach didn't ask for it" is such a lame excuse.

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Originally Posted by Randolph Dupree

Lot of blame on this thread for why we are where we are but it really all goes back to Cohen and whoever thought that was a good idea. Byrne and Strickland had fund raising, game day experience, branding, and everything else going in the right direction. Cohen comes in and all that goes to shit almost overnight. We lose Vic (for whatever the reason....a good program would've swept that under the rug. Mind you I didn't like Vic but he won). He hires Cannizzaro, who had he done a tenth of the research he should've had so many red flags it's almost unjustifiable. Then he blows the Schloss hire and we get Leno because cohen can't keep his mouth shut. There's JoMo who on paper looks good but one look at the dude and you gotta know it's not going to work. He screws up that firing by waiting until after the bowl game (the writing was already on the wall guys). Then we bring in Leach who, despite being an icon, is really not a fit for MSU and if we're being objective doesn't have the best track record for leaving schools in winning situations. Oh yeah, and he 17'd us on NIL.

Cohen finally decided to leave, Leach dies and we hire our next coach without an AD. WTH?

I don't know maybe I just traced it all back to Keenum but I still say Cohen kills MSU athletics.

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I agree that Cohen is the biggest reason for our mess right now. And you can thank the MSU boosters that put him in charge for that. Who are some of the same that promoted Arnett for head coach. Hopefully they enjoyed the access for the 2-10 team that they burned to the ground.

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Originally Posted by MBDawg601

Hiring Leach, who won here with a G5 qb set us back a decade?


Hiring first time head coaches has set us back 10 years. He is the only coach in recent history we have hired that can run a program. Most of the players from Leach have graduated or transferred out.

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Mullen ran a very good program

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Originally Posted by Really Clark?

Mullen ran a very good program

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Mullen was also not the typical wet behind the ears asst. He had watched Urban build 3 very successful programs basically from the ground up. He knew exactly what it would take.

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Originally Posted by StarkVegasSteve

Mullen was also not the typical wet behind the ears asst. He had watched Urban build 3 very successful programs basically from the ground up. He knew exactly what it would take.

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He is literally the only guy we have hired with that profile that worked out. With Lebby TBD.

Felker
Croom
Dan
Moorhead
Arnett

So going that route we have had a 20% success rate so far. And even if Lebby works out we're still hitting at a 33% success rate.

On the other hand Jackie and Leach were both successful here. Heck Bellard was successful too technically in my eyes and on paper he was the worst of those three.

MSU can and absolutely MUST hire coaches with experience going forward. We have to stop being a training ground for coaches because it simply isn't working out well for us and is killing our program more than any other factor.

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Originally Posted by StarkVegasSteve

I never understood how much of a difference the LED lights make until yesterday. I was in Oxford and let me tell you, their stadium atmosphere is MILES ahead of us. Number one, their fans damn nest stood the entire game and were engaged in what was going on. Number 2, the lights. They get everyone going. I mean they had 60-70 year olds dancing to Throw It Up. We have fans that threaten to pull their funding if we play any rap. They would rather hear Friends in Low Places or Redneck Yacht Club. Lastly, they let their fans on the field with time still remaining. We would have had University cops trying to arrest little kids had that been Mississippi State. It is just another way the administration actively tries to take the fun out of things. We have not flooded the field since 04. We should have flooded it AT LEAST 4 times since( 09 Egg Bowl, 13 Egg Bowl, 14 Auburn, 16 A&M) and hell you could throw in 17 LSU as well.

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The sentiment is correct but I think the cause root cause is misplaced. The atmosphere was electric because they are a top team playing a top team with playoff implications on the line. All of the other factors are secondary to that. Take the 14 game against auburn you mentioned. Greatest college football game I?ve ever been to and it was an afternoon kick off so no fancy lights and it even poured rain before half time. No one left and the stadium was rocking. Not because we had fancy lights and videos but because we had a team that had the chance to do something special. Field a team that has a chance to do something special and the atmosphere will return.

I?ll add, I hope we do add LEDs, better sound system, and in game hype but all of that is moot without a team worth showing up to watch.

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Originally Posted by DawgFromOxford

The sentiment is correct but I think the cause root cause is misplaced. The atmosphere was electric because they are a top team playing a top team with playoff implications on the line. All of the other factors are secondary to that. Take the 14 game against auburn you mentioned. Greatest college football game I?ve ever been to and it was an afternoon kick off so no fancy lights and it even poured rain before half time. No one left and the stadium was rocking. Not because we had fancy lights and videos but because we had a team that had the chance to do something special. Field a team that has a chance to do something special and the atmosphere will return.

I?ll add, I hope we do add LEDs, better sound system, and in game hype but all of that is moot without a team worth showing up to watch.

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Amen. Put a good product on the field and the atmosphere will take care of itself. Although, there are some things mentioned here that could improve it, winning is the best solution.

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Originally Posted by Really Clark?

Mullen ran a very good program

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We didn't know that going into the hire. We found out later and after other schools figured it out - he was gone. Also, it has been about 8 years since then.

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Originally Posted by MBDawg601

We didn't know that going into the hire. We found out later and after other schools figured it out - he was gone. Also, it has been about 8 years since then.

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Mullen is not recent history? Goodness that's a small timeline if you are making that argument.

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Originally Posted by Really Clark?

Mullen is not recent history? Goodness that's a small timeline if you are making that argument.

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That 8 years seemed pretty long with the coaching issues we have had. I am afraid the next 8 will seem even longer.

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Originally Posted by Bdawg

Amen. Put a good product on the field and the atmosphere will take care of itself. Although, there are some things mentioned here that could improve it, winning is the best solution.

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THIS!! Build it (a winning team) and they will come!!!

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Originally Posted by MBDawg601

Our fan base will be blaming Leach (the only sitting HC we have hired since Jesus was a baby) for the next 20 years.

Leach's recruiting? Vanderbilt is winning with less talent. Please tell me how we have lost to more than 1 team this year that is way less talented? Is that Leach too? Quit using some lousy excuse for this coaching staff. They are ass, our game day atmosphere is ass, our marketing is ass. This is not because of Leach, but let's keep blaming the only actual HC we have had in the past 8 years. That is a good look for us.

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We don't have good players now partly because of Leach recruiting that is fact. We don't have good coaching now because of other stuff.

I didn't start this BS; I've let Leach go but the Leach train can't do it. He had one good year in 3. We sucked for 2 years and there was a lot a real bad football and coaching those years. We won 8 with Leach with an easy schedule. All schedules ain't the same ask OM or MSU this year.

No excuses for this coaching staff; you haven't read any of my posts doesn't look like. Hire a modern day HC and get back with me not a 4 decade old mentality HC and we are doing something then.

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Originally Posted by R2Dawg

We don't have good players now partly because of Leach recruiting that is fact. We don't have good coaching now because of other stuff.

I didn't start this BS; I've let Leach go but the Leach train can't do it. He had one good year in 3. We sucked for 2 years and there was a lot a real bad football and coaching those years. We won 8 with Leach with an easy schedule. All schedules ain't the same ask OM or MSU this year.

No excuses for this coaching staff; you haven't read any of my posts doesn't look like. Hire a modern day HC and get back with me not a 4 decade old mentality HC and we are doing something then.

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If Leach was so bad at recruiting how come the offense is light years better than the defense right now?

Leach let Arnett have a la carte recruiting on defense plus Arnett was able to keep his system in place one full year longer. And guess who recruited most of the guys on defense right now? Arnett.

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Originally Posted by DawgFromOxford

The sentiment is correct but I think the cause root cause is misplaced. The atmosphere was electric because they are a top team playing a top team with playoff implications on the line. All of the other factors are secondary to that. Take the 14 game against auburn you mentioned. Greatest college football game I?ve ever been to and it was an afternoon kick off so no fancy lights and it even poured rain before half time. No one left and the stadium was rocking. Not because we had fancy lights and videos but because we had a team that had the chance to do something special. Field a team that has a chance to do something special and the atmosphere will return.

I?ll add, I hope we do add LEDs, better sound system, and in game hype but all of that is moot without a team worth showing up to watch.

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Bingo. Ole Miss is good because they have good coaches. Arnett is analyst caliber for them and Hutzler is OLB coach caliber.

They didn't just put up some LED's and all of a sudden they win 10 games and the atmosphere is awesome now.

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Originally Posted by Todd4State

The fact that we have fans that think a guy who won 9 games in year 3 and had some other big wins for MSU "wasn't really a fit" for MSU sums up one of the biggest problems our fan base has.

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No one is against a HC winning 9 games or 8 games. What big wins did we really have? OM in 22 is about it. Others were teams that were either 500 teams or had losing records at end of year. LSU in game 1, well we learned LSU sucked that year later and so did we. Yeah if felt good for that day but that was it.

Kinda like the 8-0, we believe year. We had a solid team but we didn't really beat anybody that year but we were also building a program and you could see it.

I ain't brought up Leach since he died. Can we let him RIP and quit blaming fans? This is what is wrong with MSU fan base. They follow a guy not a team, school or program. I came to MSU games when a bunch of HC we had I didn't like because I am an MSU alumni and fan.