I grew up watching those teams in the 80s and loved watching them play. This year's team is very fun to watch... Well until we have a late lead and we're depending on our bullpenQuote:
Originally Posted by Schultzy
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I grew up watching those teams in the 80s and loved watching them play. This year's team is very fun to watch... Well until we have a late lead and we're depending on our bullpenQuote:
Originally Posted by Schultzy
yes, with a better pen they'd be above .500........they've done that in past years. and then blown it when it counted because their manager doesn't know how to take advantage of matchups.Quote:
Originally Posted by shoeless joe
yes, all managers make questionable decisions, and often get criticized either way. but SOME managers make decisions beyond that, unquestionably stupid moves. and when a manager is that bad, there's always those out there covering for them. He is the BJ Upton of managers, you're only embarrassing yourself by defending him.
and oh, you disagree about using the closer early. so you just have no idea how a bullpen is supposed to be managed. figures. explains everything.
You say I am defending him, when I'm really ONLY defending his actions in regards to the pen...nothing else. And I'm really not defending him as much as I'm being realistic with placing blame. You have your mind made up on what you think and have a response ready without even reading my posts. I disagree a good bit with mstate7 but he typically has an informed, and sometimes emotional, response that brings pertinent information to the discussion. I would enjoy a good back and forth if you could do the same.Quote:
Originally Posted by BoomBoom
As far as how a bullpen is supposed to work:
Successful pens have sevrefal thing in common....defined roles being tops on the list. Also, having guys that can get any hitter out L or R. A situational lefty that can consistently retire righty''s can solidify any pen; a la venters, o'flaherty, or even one of the best the braves ever had at that in remlinger. And of course a solid closer is needed... Closer by committee never works long term. And even with that type set up one thing HAS to happen to ensure long term success: starters have to eat up innings and get outs. If the pen is covering 4 innings a nite then it's eventually going to wear down. I will be interested in your examples of a closer that comes in in the 6th or 7th
And for the thousandth time...I think there are a myriad of things to complain about when it comes to fredi, even his use of pitchers in previous years and post season. But this year the bullpen is not on him. He hasn't walked one hitter or hunt one slider all year...but yet they occurr every inning, it seems, when he goes to the pen for someone other than grilli. And even he had given up more runs than would be prefered.
Cunniff's last 3 appearances...
Vs Arizona = 0.2 ip 0 h 0 bb 0 er 2 k
Vs Pitt = 0.2 ip 0 h 0 bb 0 er 1 k
Vs Pitt = 2.0 ip 0 h 0 bb 0 er 2 k
Maybe this kid is coming on.
I really think we'll see aardsma and moylan get promoted within the week. Who do you think gets sent down/cut?
@DOBrienAJC
#Braves released LH Donnie Veal, who was DFA'd last week
Triple-A #Braves activated newly acquired LH Dana Eveland, and Kelly Johnson begins rehab assignment at Gwinnett tonight.
I don't disagree with anything in your 2nd paragraph. But you went full retard in the 3rd. let's put it this way: managing the lineup and pen for good matchups is not dependent on resultant small sample size results. "it worked out" isn't a defense for bad managing, nor is "they all suck anyway". managing into a bad matchup is bad management, regardless of results. you don't seem to agree with that, and i have no idea why. you sound like a Croom defender saying that if players just made their blocks then the offense would work. bad management makes it HARDER for players to produce.Quote:
Originally Posted by shoeless joe
the "results" argument also ignores confidence and projection. putting players into poor matchups leads to poor results, which can hurt their confidence and cause overall poorer performance. as to projection, either Fredi or the entire team has a weird mix of ignoring recent results based on past performance (see Avilan last year), or ignoring past results and expected talent level for short term good results (often against inferior opposition) (see Cody Martin or Sugar Ray Merrimon). it's weird to be wrong on BOTH sides of that issue at the same time.
also, it's great to have a lefty that can get out righties, or so forth, but just wishing for that doesn't make it so. when you don't have guys that can do that, don't manage as if you have guys that can do that! that aint rocket science, but you seem to object to calling it bad management.
while the sabermetrics would say to occaisionally use a closer in the 6th, very few managers would do it as that part of the order (or the meat of the order if that's not up in the 6th) is guaranteed to come up again. that applies a little in the 7th too, but in some situations (say 2 outs, bases loaded, #1-3 hitter up) it would be preferrable, as the closer could close that inning and pitch the next, then someone else could face the bottom of the order in the 9th. maybe your closer blows the game, or maybe your other guy blows it in a much more favorable situation for him in the 9th. either way, it's the better matchup, which is the entire point of managing.
Nice first pick. Very high upside LHP. Maybe we can get him signed.
Saw this on Braves' board. Not sure if true, but poster usually knows what he's talking about...Quote:
Originally Posted by Really Clark?
Said he only gave his medical and only visited with atlanta. Was either atlanta or he was going to college. Said he's been throwing for weeks and looks great. Up to him when he makes it but thinks he's gonna go quickly. Said his back injury is the only reason he fell to Atl.
Miller pulled with 95 pitches. Hope we don't regret not letting him pitch 8th. Questionable call, but CJ got hit
Here we go...Quote:
Originally Posted by msstate7
Sd with leadoff double on Johnson. This after 1st 2 were on base in 7th. Fredi shunned the bunt and double play.
Padres only plate 1. Need to score hereQuote:
Originally Posted by msstate7
Blown save by grilli. INCREDIBLELY stupid to not bunt in the bottom of the 7th with 1st 2 on and Maybin up. Get that bunt down and ff is up with 2nd and 3rd with 1 out. Fredi is just dumb
I just can't believe fredi did these 2 moves...
1. Not letting miller go out for 8th
2. Not bunting with Maybin. If you bunt and they walk ff, so what? It's bases loaded with 1 out for markakis.
Miller was cruising. Fredi just thinks Johnson and grilli are lock down. Hey fredi, they aren't! Miller was the best option. Get grilli out there with 2-run lead bc he seems to give up 1 every appearance.
Yeah, I'm pissed at fredi again
I got off the lake just in time to turn on the tv and see grilli throw the ball into center. I then got on here to see what fredi did wrong.Quote:
Originally Posted by msstate7
Based on what you're saying I would be pissed If I was miller. Knowing the struggles of the pen you gotta let your horse do his thing.
Miller had 95 pitches and was rolling. No excuse to pull him for our pen. No excuseQuote:
Originally Posted by shoeless joe
Haha.., you know I'll keep you posted on fredi.Quote:
Originally Posted by shoeless joe
We've given up with Martin in the game. We'll see Kimbrel get the save and bj scored the tying run.
Cody Martin shouldn't be anywhere near an mlb team
Told ya. I've watched this team enough to know. Running Martin in the game should be a firable offenseQuote:
Originally Posted by msstate7
Flow chart Fredi strikes again. The sad thing is how predictable it is. Every season, no matter the personnel, he makes that move. No idea what he is doing.Quote:
Originally Posted by msstate7
10:49 PM
@KevinMcAlpin
Cody Martin posted a 1.54 ERA (2 ER/11.2 IP) w/14 K over his first 10 appearances.
In 11 appearances since, 9.90 ERA (11 ER/10 IP) w/10 K
If hart doesn't have Martin in Gwinnett tomorrow, im losing faith in him or either hart is purposely giving fredi rope to hang himself. Martin vs jup and kemp is just ridiculously stupid. Avilan is better option and to hell with righty lefty
Moylan, aardsma, Ryan Kelly, and David carpenter are all better options than Cody Martin.
I'm willing to give cunniff and masset a few more opportunities, but Martin has to go and he has to go now
Minter had Tommy John surgery
http://www.theeagle.com/aggie_sports...0f18770d9.html
We love us some TJ arms
Strange pick. He was projected in like the 12th round.Quote:
Originally Posted by msstate7
Watching our pen must have put hart in full panic mode.Quote:
Originally Posted by BoomBoom
@mlbbowman
Aardsma is set to become the 17th different reliever the #Braves have used this season. They used 15 relievers last year
Cody Martin gone.
I'll go ahead and get started early today. Fredi is starting Gomes vs shields (rhp). Gomes numbers vs rhp...
.164 avg .197 obp
And then there's Gomes' defense. Give terdo a shot, fredi.
My prediction = 0-4 with 3 k's
David O'Brien ?@DOBrienAJC 47m47 minutes ago
This is a sobering stat: #Braves have lost 7 games when leading after 6 innings. SEVEN.
Top of the 2nd...
Double into left field corner by Padres scores runner from 1st. Gomes took forever to get to ball and then crashed into wall before he got the ball to cut off man. Padres score 1-0. Gomes already coming into play
Another ball hit to left that Gomes can't get to. 3-0
Gomes strikes out on ball that landed 2 foot in front of home plate with runner at 2b. Hey shoeless, come tell me how smart fredi is for doing things like starting Gomes vs a good rhp
Gomes can't get to easy flyball. For those keeping score, that's 3 of the 4 Padres' runs that are directly attributed to Gomes' little league range. Way to be a complete f'n idiot, fredi
Gomes with some redemption. Rbi single to tie it.
Still think gomes' defense is way to questionable to start him esp vs rhp, but he got a big hit. Good for him
Haven't watched a pitch tonite...just got back from our game.Quote:
Originally Posted by msstate7
Keep in mind my "defending", if you want to call it that, of fredi is based on the suckiness of the pen. I have admitted numerous times that his thought process in games is head scratching.
Not once have you seen me clamoring for him to keep his job, I just feel he catches heat for some things that he shouldn't.
You love fredi, don't you? HahaQuote:
Originally Posted by shoeless joe
He catches grief for plenty he deserves too
No doubt.Quote:
Originally Posted by msstate7
I used to, mid 90s thru mid 2000s, watch or listen to every single game and my point of view at that time was a lot like yours. So I respect your passion and opinion. Since I've started my coaching career I don't get to watch near as much as I used to...but it has also allowed me to see things from a different view point. And I guess it is that that causes me to come off as a "coach defender", whether it be fredi or Cohen. I understand that SOMETIMES the obvious play to the fan isn't the rite play for your players in that specific situation. I also understand that when those decisions repeatedly don't work it rests at the foot of the head man. But nobody knows their players like a coach...nobody. And that fact plays big with me.
And as I type your boy comes thru with a missile! Grilli will have a shot a redemption it would appear.
As a coach, I'll let you make it for taking up for your brethren.Quote:
Originally Posted by shoeless joe
I called terdo though, didn't I? Haha
Very nice win. 3.1 scoreless innings from 5 different pitchers. Cunniff came in and got huge out. He's had 4 straight scoreless appearances. I really like cunniff and this he should get a look at the 8th inning.
2.5 out of 1st in east
12:15 AM
@KevinMcAlpin
#Braves offense has scored at least five runs in a single inning eight times this season (most in the NL)
Braxton Davidson (last 10 games)...
.333 avg (11-33) 6 bb 9 k
He's now up to...
.261 avg .402 obp .777 ops 4 hr 8 doubles
Hopefully he's figuring it out