Got all the chew you want though! LolQuote:
Originally Posted by DownwardDawg
Got all the chew you want though! LolQuote:
Originally Posted by DownwardDawg
Absolutely!!!! Endless supply! LolQuote:
Originally Posted by Really Clark?
This August has already surpassed the August 2011 year in high and average. Obviously, the average could still end up lower, but as of now we're above it now.Quote:
Originally Posted by Coach34
Look fellas. All I'm saying is that the high for Wednesday where I'm at is 99?. It's not supposed to get to the triple digits in Wisconsin. That shit just ain't right. Giant snowstorm in Mississippi just ain't right. Ain't anything we can control really, it's up to corps who don't give a ****. So I'm just here to bitch that it's hot and I felt like I was starting up a Mississippi Summer again.
Got me interested in record level temps, so I googled record temps by state. What I found is wiki, so hopefully this is accurate. If it is, I find it interesting that no state's record is in 2023 (assuming it's up to date), and only 4 states are in the 2000s.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/U.S....ature_extremes
Not saying this proves anything, but I do find it interesting that most of the records are quite old.
I figure it'll snow several times in MS this upcoming winter
Not here in Shreve its not. Only 2 days that month were under 100 and that was 98 and 97Quote:
Originally Posted by sleepy dawg
https://climatespy.com/climate/summa...fb/august/2011
2011 was ridiculous.
funny thing about the weather is it always be changing........polar bears are thriving even though al gore said they'd be extinct by 2005
The global community came together.....now that's funny Beardo!!Quote:
Originally Posted by BeardoMSU
you are missing the point. this is global warming its not just records broke in the usa its all over the world! it is ignorant to say its not happening!Quote:
Originally Posted by Coach34
wait til there are a few heavy snow storms somewhere in the world and all a sudden the earth will be dangerously lost in a heap of global cooling. It's like writing a book but changing the characters and then also having to change the title of the book to fit the new criteria.
I think the point most have a problem with is that you have periods of time where you find warming or cooling trends that were as bad or worse. Including worldwide. And when those data points occur in the past that human carbon footprint could not have been the cause, logically you have to ask how much is this completely a natural event cycle.Quote:
Originally Posted by 99jc
But for the ones who are really concerned about it and want possible ways to legitimately try and curb carbon emissions, the answer is not and never will be working from the climate change political playbook. It is not pure science it's an agenda driven scientific theory.
The first and best place to start is education and increasing the income level of impoverished countries. Because at the end of the day, carbon footprint and environmental concerns are first world problems. Third world people are trying to survive and will burn whatever cheap fuel they have and can afford to do so. Get them to better economical and educational levels, that leads them to develop better ways of generating power and heat, etc. Won't happen overnight but multiple studies, including a major think tank multinational UN study, point to this as the actual need for the global community. Climate change didn't even make the Top 100 of global problems but acknowledged that addressing the real problems would have a significant impact on actual human climate / environmental negative use.
I believe it's called "climate change" these days.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tater
1880 is where recorded temperature begins. Some Christians believe the earth is 6000 years old, and most everyone else says millions. Let's just roll with 6000 and 1 million...
143/6000 = .0238
143/1000000 = .000143
These seem like really poor sample sizes to me.
What's the 143? I must have missed it in the thread discussion. And the Earth is about 4.5 billion years old, not one million. That makes your point even better.Quote:
Originally Posted by msstate7
Got it - 143 is the years of climate measurement. Duh. :)
Scientist can tell weather patterns much farther back than that based on sedimentation and other factors.Quote:
Originally Posted by msstate7
How? Well I'm not gonna get into the how because any sufficiently advanced science appears like magic (or bullshit) to people who don't have a clue on it.
What agenda are the people who say "hey maybe we shouldn't kill the earth" driving? What's the worst case scenario if they are in charge? Earth is healthier and they make a bunch of money and we show global cohesion? As opposed to now when oil / fossil fuel based agenda is being driven and we're potentially killing the planet and they are making a bunch of money in control?Quote:
Originally Posted by Really Clark?
I'm not missing anything. I know we have "climate change". The climate has changed for the Earth since the beginning of time. What I dont believe is:Quote:
Originally Posted by 99jc
1. We are as people causing all the climate change
2. Electric cars are the answer when we use oil and gas to make electricity. Upping the amount of electricity we'll need for that is astronomical- so all we will be doing is using oil and gas in a different way.
3. Speaking of electric cars- how about all that strip mining that is necessary to make the batteries? The batteries that are really bad for the environment once they are of no use anymore
4. Nuclear energy is being ignored when it is a cleaner energy source. Not as much money to be made off of it- so it's not pushed by MSM.
5. How funny it is that people with all this "climate change" info have been purchasing beach houses right on the ocean. They surely dont seem to worry about rising oceans affecting their purchases.
It's all a grift. Lawmakers take lobbyist money to pass green energy crap and then invest in the green energy companies. They then sell the stocks at the higher price once the news has blown the story up- and then the company goes belly up. Lawmakers bank that green though. (Pelosi and some others just got blasted for doing this)
Atmospheric isotope data from polar ice-cores, for example. Data going back over 700,000 years. Amazing stuff.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tater
And yet we keep on re-electing these same old baffoons! We all like to bitch but we never seem to do anything about it - why?Quote:
Originally Posted by Coach34
And here's what their estimated data chart looks like...Quote:
Originally Posted by BeardoMSU
https://i.postimg.cc/PJWjPLpg/IMG-3466.jpg
https://www.climate.gov/news-feature...rths-ever-been
When the science is being made to work toward a political ideology, it loses its meaning. And the ones who actually care and have the correct ideas that would work, they don't get a voice at the table. That's what I mean by agenda driven political science. The answer is very complex, the ones who are biggest abusers globally either don't care or can't afford to care. If people want change globally, you have to acknowledge that until those things are addressed, abuse will still take place. I think Hydrogen may be one of the better long term solutions but the technology is not there yet but I believe that it could be a really good answer. The nuclear technology is getting better and some new breakthroughs are making it even cleaner than before. I believe that actually preserving ecosystems will give us better results. I do I believe we are warming, yes. Do I believe that a significant portion of the warming is natural? Yes. Do I believe we have contributed to a percentage increase above normal trend? Yes. How much? The scientists don't agree on that even or can't quantify it because looking back in history shows those events have occurred before that had nothing to do with man. It's a complex issue that honestly will not work with a global answer. It has to be segmented. And again, if you look at the true global problems, climate change is not the most prevalent issue that needs to be addressed on that scale. There are others more pressing with easier answers to those problems and as a byproduct, environmental issues become increasingly more prevalent to those countries over time.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tater
Climate change, hotter than ______ you fill in the blank, records being broken ect ect. All I know the Thursday before 1st game the high is forecasted to be 88degrees and low 67 in Starkville. I?m loving that forecast. I?m ready to strap on the shoulder pads and lace up the cleats let?s play some FOOTBALL
You didn't answer my question. What's the difference that makes us worse in having people who think climate change is a problem in charge versus those who don't.Quote:
Originally Posted by Really Clark?
I did answer the question. The true people who actually have a global view of what are the real problems and what is needed to be done first is who I was speaking of in the first post. Nothing wrong with having a concern for the climate. But on a global scale of issues, climate change is not at the top. Not Top 10 either. It's well down the list of what problems and what answers actually can make the world a better place. Some of those answers are actually achievable quicker as well. A byproduct would address environmental issues sooner than many believe.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tater
I think we have too many from various ideologies who run around with answers that immolate their politics looking for problems to implement their answer. That's completely reverse of how real answers to questions come about.
Show that chart to your 6000 year old Earth friends***Quote:
Originally Posted by msstate7
Yes. And it's BOTH parties doing itQuote:
Originally Posted by Extendedcab
I heard that!Quote:
Originally Posted by Coach34
Lot of poor arguments in here.
1) yes there's money to be made on the "global warming is real" side, but let's not pretend oil companies don't also have an incentive to buy scientists and pretend man made climate change isn't a thing.
The question is not "who has money in their side", because they both do. The question is "who has the science on their side". I'm not a climate scientist, so all I can do is look to them. And they pretty much all -even climate scientists from small countries with little Govt grant funding- agree man made climate change is a thing.
2) "I don't believe man can change the climate"- why not? If we detonated all our nukes we obviously would. We've hunted various animals to extinction. Our plastic has made its way into almost every living being. Why's it hard to believe pumping billions of tons of carbon out of the ground and burning it would affect the atmosphere?
3) "the earth has been hotter before"- yes, it has. But that's a far slower process where nature has time to adjust- this is over a few decades, totally different for animals and human infrastructure to cope with as it happens. Humanity and most animals will survive, but why go though chaos and exoenses later when we could avoid it with less money spent today?
4) "we just had snowstorms in Texas"- yeah because climate change produced a massive storm that knocked the polar vortex south. Warmer oceans = worse storms = more chaos, even when it comes to cold.
5) "if we did away with gas cars we'd just have to make electricity with coal!"- what if I told you renewable and nuclear exist? Moreover, burning coal to make electricity is way more efficient than burning gas in cars. The coal plant doesn't have to worry about weight, size, or being reliable in a variety of rev ranges- they just design it for efficiency and low pollution. Cars have a lot of other considerations and less control over theor opperating conditions.
6) "I remember one summer when it was hotter than now!"- nobody is saying every year will break all the previous records for everywhere. Freak hot -or cold- seasons have absolutely always been a thing. The difference is that this past 10 year temperature average was hotter than any 10 year average we've lived though, and the next 10 years will be hotter still. That's what matters- the gradual average climb up. But individual records in individual places can still last a while, yes.
7) "those politicians are just using this for their own self interest"- YES! 100% they "never let a good crisis go to waste" as the saying goes... but that doesn't mean there is no crisis. They may be liars and corrupt and untrustworthy... but that doesn't mean literally everything they say on every topic is false. If science aligns with their agenda they'll happily use that science, but the science is still real.
8) "when science is used to support a political ideology it looses its meaning"- it shouldn't, thats a you problem. Science is science, politics is politics. If your most hated politician said "the sky is blue", it's either true or it's not, and youd be a fool to pretend the sky is green just because you dont lile the messenger. NOW, I can agree with what a politician is saying regarding the science but disagree with their political solutions. For example, I do believe in man made climate change but I don't agree with giving Govt the power to micromanage our industry in the name of reducing greenhouse gases. But I don't suddenly not believe scientific evidence just because I don't like the person saying said science.
9) "The media blows this thing into a bigger deal than it really is"- yeah, because all the media cares about is getting your attention, and being overdramatic is how they do that. But being overdramatic doesn't mean there's nothing at all to worry about or fix though.
10) "I remember when I head a climate prediction that didn't come true"- yeah, climate science changes as we get more data and knowledge. Some stuff we used to think we now know is wrong. That doesn't mean there's no truth in what's being said now.
But most of the time those ridiculous predictions aren't the scientists fault. They'll publish a page that says "we fed our model X Y and Z assumptions about what will happen in the future, and it said there's a range of outcomes, with a 1% chance of the worst case Q happening" and it's the media who then goes SCIENTISTS SAY Q WILL HAPPEN!!!!!! Then people like you see Q fail to happen and think all scientists are quacks. They aren't. It's just the media creating clickbait.
11) "we've got waaaay bigger problems than climate change"- ok, and? That doesn't mean we shouldn't fix climate change. Moreover, most of the people who say things like that aren't doing crap to solve those "bigger issues" either. They're typically just looking for an excuse to not do anything, and saying "we've got bigger issues" provides that excuse.
To be clear, I'm not even a doomer. I have no idea how bad climate change will get, because I don't study this and I cant trust the lying media to tell me. I'm just addressing the God awful logic used to pretend all is well
I guess you're comparing them to an ideal where we have people in charge care about actual problems. If Climate Change isn't top 10 to you and you think having focus elsewhere is where we should be then I can respect that opinion. I fully disagree that it's not top 3, but at least we understand each other and can agree to disagree there.Quote:
Originally Posted by Really Clark?
Where I'd rather steer the convo is back to the ideal. I know for a fact we don't have anywhere close to ideal leadership for any ideology. Most things done are to serve corporate interests. I can agree that having an ideal group running it is better than a corporate interest group who benefits from green policies and ideologies. But can you agree that a corporate interest group who benefits from green policies and ideologies is better than the trash we have running now? If they're gonna do nothing for us, at least try to tidy up the place.
Your first sentence disqualifies the entire rest of your post. They are "poor arguments" because they aren't your opinion.Quote:
Originally Posted by the_real_MSU_is_us
An argument can be poor if you agree / disagree with it. There's literally a sport of Debate that judges this.Quote:
Originally Posted by DownwardDawg
If you guys were able to visit a deep water production platform in the Gulf of Mexico, you would be amazed at just how "clean" this energy actually is. Very little carbon footprint and the corporations are working hard to make it even cleaner. The fact is that oil and gas will be here and will be the best energy available until your grandchildren long gone.
China is a bigger pollutant and I have a Petroleum Engineering degree from State. I've got a pretty firm grasp on knowing what the boogeyman is. We've regulated a ton in our Oil and Gas industry, those changes weren't willingly made.Quote:
Originally Posted by DownwardDawg
To address the first paragraph, that opinion on where climate change actually ranks on large global issues was taken from studies and namely a large multinational / multi educational study done by extremely smart individuals from various backgrounds at the behest of the UN. I'm drawing a good bit of my opinions from them and their conclusions. First and foremost was educational and economical rise of third world countries was by far the biggest need global and what that actually does at every level, globally, nationally, locally and individually. But I do share that opinion but it wasn't from a place of let me find a study that matches what I believe. If that makes sense.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tater
I don't disagree with what you are saying in the second paragraph in a wide spread sense. I guess the question I keep going back to is who are the biggest environmental abusers? Certain corporations, absolutely! But on a global scale China by far the worse emitter, triple what we do and has increased their emissions by 33% while we have reduced ours by 12% since 2010. In fact it takes the other 4 largest emitters to match China. Where is the answer to that? Extremely complex and no good solution.
To get back on topic though, a good balance of innovation, initiatives, education and partnership between corporations and the people that doesn't harm the lower class financially is the best policy in my opinion. Not a rush to solve a problem that while it exists, is not as big of an issue as it has been politicized to be. Give technology the time to give us sound long term solutions. We need corporations to foot those bills as well so we have to find that partnership and a synergy that works for both and not at the expense of the regular working individuals
No, they're poor arguments because they have massive logical fallacies lol. Again, I don't even have strong convictions on the topic. I think it's clear from the scientists man is contributing to climate change. I can believe that our ecosystem is delicate and a seemingly small change can cause a lot of harm. That's it for my closely held beliefs in the issue. How bad will it get? How much can any given policy help? How does this issue rank overall? How urgent is it? What % of climate change is man made vs natural? I have no real opinion due to lack of research.Quote:
Originally Posted by DownwardDawg
But sure, assume I'm an ideologue after 1 sentence and ignore the rest of the post. That's sound reasoning for sure
Some of the stuff about China is misleading. Yes they pollute the most, but they have a lot of people.Quote:
Originally Posted by Really Clark?
Per capita, isn't America still the #1 greenhouse emitter?
But some of the oil and gas companies are striving to become much cleaner when it comes to carbon emissions. Obviously production is the number one priority, as it should be because this is a business, but the Majors are doing a lot towards cleaning up their carbon emissions and producing cleaner energy.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tater
... because they understand Govt action around climate change is the biggest threat to their business, yes.Quote:
Originally Posted by DownwardDawg
Exxon alone has spent 10s of millions promoting think tanks and scientists that argue against global warming. Just like tobacco companies used to hire scientist to say smoking doesn't cause cancer, so oil companies have for climate change.
Meh..... since I'm in Leadership for one of the worlds largest oil and gas companies, I respectfully disagree and I'm also removing myself from this thread. Y'all carry on.Quote:
Originally Posted by the_real_MSU_is_us