Henderson has earned the right to turn it down, if he doesn't want it

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Originally Posted by Todd4State

I think the problem at that time was you not only had the Polk and Raffo stuff but you also had Cohen people, you had people that wanted Steve Smith, you had Brian Shoop people....just a lot of different factions.

Polk is the ultimate "clinging to a coach" situation. We have so many fans that only really watch MSU baseball that they thought that Polk's way was THE ONLY way to play the game. I think we had a lot of fans that tried to make Cohen like Polk- complaining about cussing in the dugout and all of that crap. You had Polk ripping Cohen behind his back too. It was just a really rough time. I honestly don't know how Cohen turned it around other than just sheer will and stubbornness.

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What the story on this?

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Originally Posted by preachermatt83

Good comparison... other than Dabo who has been untra successful after being promoted from interim to HC?

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Phil Fulmer at Tenn in college football.

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Originally Posted by MarketingBully

I agree. If he wins the natty, I?d consider it then. If not, let?s hire the best coach for the job.

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Exactly, strong emphasis on the word consider.

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Originally Posted by HoopsDawg

I really don't get it. Why does winning the national championship change your opinion. Miami made that mistake with Larry Coker. If we go with Henderson, that's fine, but it shouldn't be based on the next week of play.

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Thus season is awesome.... but it's also weird. Yeah, apparently Henderson was the right man to pull this off. But these are not normal circumstances. Even if we win it all there is no evidence to say he can get it done in a normal offseason and season where you recruit, weather the draft, develop players, hire assistants, not screw coeds or staff, stay employed as head coach, meddle, endure ED criticism, and get to CWS that way.

I wonder if there could be some handshake politics here if the university or baseball program is worried about image because of not hiring a guy that wins the CWS. You know the Ole Miss led media will be all over it. Perhaps he should be offered the job but be instructed to turn it down. I believe he should be taken care of with a nice office job with 6 figures and go out as a legend.

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Originally Posted by bostondawg

Would you be saying the same thing if MacNamee didn't manage to take our final strike of the season over the wall in Tallahassee?

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Would Saban be the best if his teams got called for holding, or were not allowed to run out of bounds and back in?

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Originally Posted by Really Clark?

Phil Fulmer at Tenn in college football.

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And neither of those had 8 years of previous head coaching experience proving they were going to suck long term. If Gary had never been a head coach before this year the job would already be his. No one wants a guy who has already proven he can?t get it done long term. He had a lifetime to turn that program around and went to 2 regionals.

If Cohen hires Hendo, I'm gonna hope he turns out like Bill Belichick. Belichick's first HC job in Cleveland didn't end so good but NE gave him a second chance.

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Originally Posted by Jarius

And neither of those had 8 years of previous head coaching experience proving they were going to suck long term. If Gary had never been a head coach before this year the job would already be his. No one wants a guy who has already proven he can?t get it done long term. He had a lifetime to turn that program around and went to 2 regionals.

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To play devils advocate, then NE should have never hired Belichick, USC shouldn?t have hired Pete Carroll, and the vast number of MLB manager retreads that didn?t have great success in their first gig is just too numerous to count. But Tony La Russa is one that coached the White Sox for several years, even won a COY award (sound familiar) and was the interim coach when he was first given the head gig, fired 2-3 years after his COY and hired immediately by the A?s. And look and Joe Torre’s career prior to the Yankees and the fan and media blasted them for hiring Torre...he was pretty good there

Again, I?m not an advocate for Henderson because I don?t believe prior to this run he was a candidate in Cohen?s mind but you can find countless examples, especially in baseball, where it?s the 2nd or 3rd time around where the manager finds greats success

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Originally Posted by preachermatt83

What the story on this?

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Just some posters on the old Genespage complaining about Cohen's language in the dugout.

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Originally Posted by confucius say

This is not college football. Nationally, no one will care. Rick Cleveland and Kellenberger May would write smn negative, but no major traction.

Also, I'd rather get this hire right (even if that's Hindu) than look nice.

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The college baseball coaching community will care.

Word in Omaha is Schloss is telling anyone who will listen that he wanted and still wants our job. Bo Bounds was saying it on OOB this morning. Would be hilarious if we still ended up with him.

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Originally Posted by Really Clark?

To play devils advocate, then NE should have never hired Belichick, USC shouldn?t have hired Pete Carroll, and the vast number of MLB manager retreads that didn?t have great success in their first gig is just too numerous to count. But Tony La Russa is one that coached the White Sox for several years, even won a COY award (sound familiar) and was the interim coach when he was first given the head gig, fired 2-3 years after his COY and hired immediately by the A?s.

Again, I?m not an advocate for Henderson because I don?t believe prior to this run he was a candidate in Cohen?s mind but you can find countless examples, especially in baseball, where it?s the 2nd or 3rd time around where the manager finds greats success

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Even Saban failed at Miami.

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Originally Posted by Liverpooldawg

Even Saban failed at Miami.

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8-8 isn’t failing in the NFL. Had he stayed he would have been successful imo. That’s just how he’s wired. He just prefers the college level but trust me his process could work on any level of the sport.

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Originally Posted by shoeless joe

My issue is, in baseball all you can ask is to be in position for a championship. Henderson has shown he can do that...

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Your first sentence is 100000% correct. Your second is the opposite.

The first sentence equates to HOSTING... REGULARLY. Gary Henderson has never hosted a regional.

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Originally Posted by Liverpooldawg

The college baseball coaching community will care.

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They want to keep the sleeping giant down.

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Originally Posted by MarketingBully

8-8 isn’t failing in the NFL. Had he stayed he would have been successful imo. That’s just how he’s wired. He just prefers the college level but trust me his process could work on any level of the sport.

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It would be considered failure for MSU baseball to finish at .500.

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Originally Posted by ChillOutDog

They want to keep the sleeping giant down.

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I'm talking about those that might think about taking the job down the line.

This is a really unusual and difficult situation to be in. The only other Interim coach of any kind taking a team and pushing toward a championship I can think of was in 2012 when Chuck Pagano got leukemia and Bruce Arians took over, goes 9-3 and leads them to the playoffs. He is the only Interim HC in NFL history to be named Coach of the Year.

Interestingly, Arians was a long-time assistant coach with a great rep who had coached in many winning programs, who had had only one shot as a HC (a shitastic run with Temple), and was probably viewed as too old to build a team.
Arians gets hired by Arizona - coming off a 5-11 season - and proceeds to go 10-6, 11-5, & 13-3 with an NFC Championship game loss. He then went 7-8-1 and 8-8 to finish out his run there.

Could Henderson be like Arians? I don't know. I don't know what the solution is.

So the goal is to win the National championship.

Some of you are saying that after decades and decades and decades of trying, we finally win a national championship and our response is going to be to immediately fire the coach and find someone else?

When the press asks why, what will be Cohen's response? "We need someone that can take us to the next level". He'd look like a moron.

We are probably hiring Henderson now and DEFINITELY are if we win it. Not even a question.

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Originally Posted by Really Clark?

To play devils advocate, then NE should have never hired Belichick, USC shouldn?t have hired Pete Carroll, and the vast number of MLB manager retreads that didn?t have great success in their first gig is just too numerous to count. But Tony La Russa is one that coached the White Sox for several years, even won a COY award (sound familiar) and was the interim coach when he was first given the head gig, fired 2-3 years after his COY and hired immediately by the A?s. And look and Joe Torre’s career prior to the Yankees and the fan and media blasted them for hiring Torre...he was pretty good there

Again, I?m not an advocate for Henderson because I don?t believe prior to this run he was a candidate in Cohen?s mind but you can find countless examples, especially in baseball, where it?s the 2nd or 3rd time around where the manager finds greats success

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You can’t find countless examples of a failed head coach turning it around. You can find a few, and you didn’t find a single one at the college baseball level (because you have to recruit and don’t just get handed the Yankees or cardinals roster that anyone could win with). I can find countless in all sports that got fired and were never hired again or were hired again and failed miserably again though. Would you like me to name those? I doubt we have enough bandwidth.

Belichick has the highest winning percentage of the last 10 Browns coaches. Bad example. Terrible franchise.

You can certainly argue Henderson has 'earned' the job. He still shouldn't get it, and I can assure you we won't get destroyed if we don't hire him.

Making this decision out of fear of backlash would be the absolute worst way to go about it.

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Originally Posted by shoeless joe

Hendo deserves way more credit than he's getting on here for what he's done with this team. He has made a lot of posters look dumb and quite a few of them are doubling down...very odd and somewhat funny to watch.

Then on the other side of the coin this does feel like a bill Stewart at West Virginia scenario. But I'll lean toward trusting Cohen in the end.

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what he said--big time agree

In the history of college sports has any college program ever fired a coach the year after winning a national title?

90% of you Hendo haters were the very ones whining that we wouldn't win 5 SEC games. Ya'll pointed out all the reasons why we were terrible-- has it ever occurred that maybe you are also wrong on Hendo? 10-1 against top 5 teams in the Nation, should have slapped some sense into you. A piss poor Coach wouldn't have done that. We know what we have with this staff-who knows what another staff might do? But, I will be 100% on board with the JC choice, but I'll bet you negative 17ers will whine either way.

Supposedly, Schloss is going around Omaha saying he's still interested in our opening. Interesting at least.

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Originally Posted by cheewgumm

In the history of college sports has any college program ever fired a coach the year after winning a national title?

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You can't get fired from a job you never had.

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Originally Posted by mparkerfd20

Supposedly, Schloss is going around Omaha saying he's still interested in our opening. Interesting at least.

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Yep. It's definitely interesting.

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Originally Posted by mparkerfd20

Supposedly, Schloss is going around Omaha saying he's still interested in our opening. Interesting at least.

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I can say without a doubt, he will not be our coach.

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Originally Posted by Jarius

You can’t find countless examples of a failed head coach turning it around. You can find a few, and you didn’t find a single one at the college baseball level (because you have to recruit and don’t just get handed the Yankees or cardinals roster that anyone could win with). I can find countless in all sports that got fired and were never hired again or were hired again and failed miserably again though. Would you like me to name those? I doubt we have enough bandwidth.

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I think you don't see it in college baseball because the staffs are far less volatile than in MLB. Also, look at most career trajectories - You play college ball, kick around MiLB or get a cup of coffee in MLB for 5-6 years, so you are almost 30 before beginning your coaching career. Spend 1-2 years as a GA. Then 5-10 as an assistant. Get your first HC gig at a mid-major and spend 5-8 years there. You may then get a gig at a place like Kentucky or Illinois for 5-8 years before landing a "major" job. On a fast track - you are early 40s when you get that major (like Cohen). A good coach will last 8-15 years at the major before a change is made. You could be 52-60 years old having spent a lot of time in the game. Then, look at the options they have. On good terms with the University? Move up to AD like Cohen or Tanner did. Like your lifestyle and location? Get a job as an area scout for an MLB team because you already know all the High Schools and where to look. Have a good rep as an instructor and in player development? Move up to MiLB as a coach or into a MLB scouting department. Or, if you have done well for yourself, you could just retire and go coach high school ball for fun (Dave Perno is coaching high school football in Athens after going to 3 CWS, and is arguably UGA's best coach in the modern era - he's only 50)

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Originally Posted by Jarius

You can?t find countless examples of a failed head coach turning it around. You can find a few, and you didn?t find a single one at the college baseball level (because you have to recruit and don?t just get handed the Yankees or cardinals roster that anyone could win with). I can find countless in all sports that got fired and were never hired again or were hired again and failed miserably again though. Would you like me to name those? I doubt we have enough bandwidth.

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There are a ton in MLB because of the nature, where as college baseball they let a good coach stay with his process for a long time. Andy Lopez comes to mind. Wins at Pepperdine, fired at Florida, wins it again at Arizona

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Originally Posted by Cooterpoot

I can say without a doubt, he will not be our coach.

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I agree with you. He wanted it though, badly it looks like. I always thought it was us that told him no thanks. I've always thought we had out coach as far back as a month ago, and it wasn't Schloss. I won't say who I think it is, but it's not Hendo either.... Although I can see Hendo throwing a kink in the plans.